During the debate on the Committee Stage of the Planning Bill last Wednesday night, 25th June, 1975, Deputy Molloy accused me of being involved with a builder named Farrelly or Farrell and stated that I sent cheques regularly to this man but that after he, Deputy Molloy, had raised the matter in the Dáil on a previous occasion I had changed the bank account from which the cheques were issued. I wish to make it clear that both statements are untrue and without foundation and I ask Deputy Molloy to withdraw his allegation.
Personal Explanation by Minister.
A Cheann Comhairle, I take it you are allowing me to reply. I wish to quote from the Official Report—Volume 276, No. 10—of 12th December, 1974. I quote:
Mr. Molloy: Tell us about the cheque to Farrell.
Mr. Tully: My what?
Mr. Cunningham: Does the Minister not understand plain English?
Mr. Molloy: Your bank draft to Farrell.
Mr. Tully: Sorry, but——
Mr. Cunningham: The Minister's assistance to a building contractor.
Mr. Tully: Would Deputy Molloy repeat statements like this outside this House? I have not issued any cheque——
Mr. Molloy: Think about that one.
Mr. Tully: I have not issued any cheque to any building contractor named Farrell, or to anybody else named Farrell. I did not follow the Deputy's line——
Mr. Molloy: Or anybody else who is a building contractor?
(Interruptions.)
An Ceann Comhairle: Question No. 95.
Mr. Molloy: And the Minister never rezoned land for him?
Mr. Tully: No, I did not.
Mr. Cunningham: Good agricultural land.
Mr. Molloy: Or his agent?
Mr. Tully: No.
Mr. Molloy: Ask Mr. Sharkey, the county manager.
Mr. Tully: I am sorry, a Cheann Comhairle, but——
Mr. Molloy: What about the 35 acres in north County Dublin?
What about Waterford? What about Circular Road in Galway?
A Cheann Comhairle, a builder named Robert Farrelly, Rockfield Road, Kells, County Meath, had an account in the Northern Bank in Kells to which a cheque issued, the amount often as big as £600 or £700 from the account of Deputy Tully, the Minister for Local Government, in a Drogheda bank. This cheque issued every Thursday to Farrelly's account for payment of staff, signed personally by Deputy Tully.
Some time after I raised this matter in the Dáil on 12th December Mr. Farrelly's account was changed. I think it was in April, 1975. The account to which the money was being sent was changed to the Ulster Bank in Athboy, County Meath.
During the course of that question and answer session which I have quoted I made reference to the change in the zoning of land. Mr. Robert Farrelly is a building contractor who builds houses on speculation. Mr. Farrelly was granted permission by Deputy Tully. The area for which the permission was sought and granted had been zoned by Dublin County Council as agricultural. This zoning was ignored in the decision that issued from the Minister. The land in question is at The Naul, County Dublin.
The permission to which I was specifically referring in that question was issued subsequently and Mr. Farrelly was granted permission for houses at Rockfield Road, Kells. At a December meeting of the Meath County Council, Councillor Hynes congratulated the Minister on granting planning permission to Mr. Farrelly and the manager's reaction to that statement was an aghast "Oh no."
Following the Minister's denial of issuing permission to Farrelly I inquired from the Department if planning permission had been applied for and had been decided. I was informed that no decision had issued in that particular case but I have since been informed that the permission issued subsequently, approximately two months later.
The Mr. Farrelly in question is having an official opening of the Rockfield Estate, Kells within the next two weeks. The opening is to be carried out by Deputy Tully. Invitations have already been extended to the purchasers of those houses to attend and to partake of whatever refreshments are being offered.
My allegation is merely that the Minister has an involvement with a builder named Robert Farrelly, Rockfield Road, Kells, County Meath which I deem to be in conflict with the office he holds as Minister for Local Government. In view of his statement today I would ask, through you, a Cheann Comhairle, in order to clear up this matter that the Minister should agree to a police investigation into his bank accounts.
I would be only too glad to have a police investigation into my bank accounts immediately. I have one bank account in the Allied Irish Bank in Balbriggan. I never had nor have I now a bank account in a bank either in Drogheda or in Athboy. There is absolutely no truth whatever in the statement. I assume that Deputy Molloy has been misinformed by somebody who obviously has been doing some investigation but certainly not into my account because I would not be in a position to send £600 or £700 to anybody at the end of each month apart from the fact that I have no bank account there.
I will be prepared to have the matter investigated immediately. I would also ask, Sir, that you would refer the whole matter to the Committee on Procedure and Privileges. The only permission I know of that Deputy Molloy is referring to is, in fact, one in Kells. I know of Robert Farrell in Kells. I am opening a housing scheme for him, Farrell Homes, within the next fortnight. He applied for planning permission to Meath County Council, was refused by the Council, appealed to me or to the Minister for Local Government for permission. Kells Urban Council, consisting of four Fianna Fáil, two Fine Gael, two Labour and one Independent councillors, unanimously passed a resolution which they passed on to me requesting me to give planning permission to Farrell Homes for the estate in Kells. Planning permission was given subsequently. There is nothing wrong with the permission, nothing wrong with any permissions I have given. I stand over them. I do not know anything about the one that Deputy Molloy has referred to but I would be only too glad to have any investigation which is required and, Sir, I would ask that you would have the matter investigated immediately by the Committee on Procedure and Privileges and I would ask that when the decision is brought before the House Deputy Molloy will have the good grace to apologise or, alternatively, will repeat what he said here outside the House, as I asked him last week, and if he does then I shall be glad to deal with him. Thank you.
Another Dr. Ward.
Deputy Crinion rose.
Deputy——
I think Deputy Crinion should be heard, if it is permissible.
Sorry. Deputy Crinion, in a matter of personal explanation of this kind there can be no debate.
All I can say is that I fully back what Deputy Molloy has said. It is well known in Kells that the cheques arrived.
This is not in order.
Disorderly.
May I invite Deputy Crinion to make that statement outside this House?
It is well known in Kells.
May I invite Deputy Crinion to make that statement outside this House? I forgive Deputy Molloy because he does not know but Deputy Crinion does and for mean political motives he has——
It is well known in Kells.
That is a lie and Deputy Crinion is aware of it.
It has been talked about for the last six months.
The Deputy will be talked about for a while.
Order. A charge has been made. I take it that Deputy Molloy is not withdrawing the charge and in the circumstances the only course open to me is to refer the matter to the Committee on Procedure and Privileges.
May I ask——
Not on this matter. This matter is closed.
On a point of order, may I ask you if it is your intention to convene a meeting of the Committee on Procedure and Privileges as a matter of utmost urgency, preferably tonight?
That must rest with the Chair.
We will accept the results of the appeals investigation.
Say it outside the House and you will accept the result of the High Court.
Have the members of the Government a majority on the Committee of Procedure and Privileges? That is very important.
Had you a majority on it at the time of the gun running?
Let us get on with business.