asked the Minister for Industry, Commerce and Energy the imports of oil commodities, crude oil, refined oil, gas oil, petrol and so on, for each quarter of 1977, 1978 and the first quarter of 1979; and the steps if any, being taken to avoid a crisis of supply in future.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Oil Imports and Supplies.
2.
I would refer the Deputy to the appropriate volumes of the Stationery Office publication, Trade Statistics of Ireland, for information about imports of oil into Ireland during 1977 and 1978.
Published figures for all oil imports during the first quarter of 1979 are not available but I am informed by the Central Statistics Office that the imports for January-February 1979 are as follows:
|
Metric Tonnes |
|
|
Crude Oils |
347,847 |
|
Motor Spirit |
91,498 |
|
Gasoline type jet fuel |
40 |
|
Other light oils |
37,708 |
|
Kerosene, including kerosene type jet fuel |
62,898 |
|
other medium oils |
631 |
|
Gas Oil |
184,582 |
|
Fuel oils |
343,301 |
|
Liquified petroleum gas |
31,611 |
While in recent weeks there has been a short-fall in some oil products I do not accept that there is a crisis as such in oil supplies. There have been and still are problems in meeting our full requirements. The information available to me indicates that there have been considerable increases in sales of most oil products, including motor gasoline and gas/diesel oil, in this country in the first quarter of 1979. So far as the future is concerned I would like to assure the Deputy that everything possible will be done to improve the security of our oil supplies.
We are now in the month of May, and would the Minister agree that the fact that the Minister responsible for the supply of oil in the country has not got the relevant figures for the first quarter of 1979 seems indicative of his incompetence in relation to his knowing——
This is not a question, Deputy.
——what is happening? Is he further aware of the continuing lack of certain oil products, specifically petrol, gas oil and in certain cases diesel oil? Is he aware that we are in the middle of the farming season in relation to the requirements of certain oil products and that these are not available? Will he make a statement on this matter?
Neither I nor my Department are responsible for compiling statistics of the imports to this country. The Central Statistics Office have supplied this information in accordance with the normal practice, and it would not be normal for them to have a detailed breakdown of this kind of import for later than the end of February. That applies to all imports and not just to this commodity.
Is the Minister further aware that we are apparently the only country in the EEC currently suffering a lack of certain oil-based products? Does he feel that he should have this information available to him on a monthly basis, perhaps in the first week of each month, and that the fact that he has not the statistics available to him shows that he is not interested in this very vital question?
The Deputy was not present yesterday when we had some 15 questions on the same subject with the answers to the questions he is asking now, and hence this is repetition. I am aware that the Deputy was not here.
I have my own question down and I am quite entitled to ask it.
I am pointing out that repetition would not be in order.
I am well aware of the current stock situation in the country, which is a totally different matter from that to which this question relates, which is a detailed breakdown of imports. The CSO who provide this information have not got it in this detail for after 15 February 1979, and that is normal practice.
Is the Minister aware that the CSO derive this data from returns by Government officials who are responsible for monitoring imports and that the information is available to them currently, and that for him to rely on the published statistics of the CSO means that he must await the arrival of the last imports statistics for any commodity before being published and shows on his part a certain lack of initiative?
The import figures are of much less consequence than the figure of stocks. We are now aware to a high degree of accuracy what stocks are. I suggest that that is what matters.
The Minister was not aware of the fact that the figures were available through Government officials and he has not bothered to inquire.
That is not so. The CSO have the responsibility for compiling import figures in respect of all commodities.
They have these figures——
I am not prepared to give unofficial figures that are not given by the CSO.
I am talking about official figures. There are Government officials from whom the Minister could get the information if he had any initiative in the matter.
They have not got even the emigration figures.
But we held a census last month.
(Interruptions.)
Order, please.
Would the Minister agree that he has responsibility in relation to the overall supply of oil and oil products to the country? Could he explain to the House why the necessary statistics were not available to him in the past few months? Further, would he tell the House why this crisis was allowed to develop?
This is repetition of a whole series of questions from yesterday.
This is a crisis which is not evident in other countries who are members of the EEC.
It is not true to say that this country is the only one that has difficulties in regard to oil supplies. Nearly every country in the world other than producing countries has this difficulty at present.
3.
asked the Minister for Industry, Commerce and Energy if he is aware that a diesel only filling station in County Meath (details supplied) had its supply allocation cut from 6,000 to 3,000 gallons per week; whether this cut reflects the general scale of the present diesel shortage; and the steps it is proposed to take to have this station's requirements filled.
I am not so aware. I am informed by the oil company concerned that they have been supplying the filling station in question only since October 1978 and that it is not correct to say that an allocation or quota of 6,000 gallons of gas/diesel oil per week was made. They also inform me that the average supply to the station in the period 1 October 1978 to 30 April 1979 was approximately 1,700 gallons per week.
Is the Minister aware that sales at this station were affected seriously because of the weather during January and the first half of February which affected the routing of traffic, and that in the latter part of March the station was receiving and selling 6,000 gallons a week, that it retained that level and that that was the amount being allocated to it and sold by it? Is he aware that that amount has now been cut to 3,000 gallons? Why has a cut on that scale been made? Why has any allocation been based on what happened last October, considering the current rate of sales?
The station in question never received the quantities suggested by the Deputy. The maximum amount that it ever received in any one month was 15,300 gallons in the month of March 1979, which is a long way short of the figure of 6,000 gallons a week which the Deputy mentions. In April 1979 it received 12,000 gallons which is well above the average of what its sales were since the company in question began to supply the station in October 1978.
Is the Minister aware that the weather improved so much in February that sales to this company increased sharply between the first and second halves, that the 15,000 figure for the month does not reflect the rate of sale for the latter half of the month, and that it has been cut back by half?
It has not been cut back by half and the present rate of supply to the station is away above the average of what it sought and obtained since October 1978.
Is the Minister aware that it only got going since October and as the weather diverted traffic it was a self-evident proposition? Is the Minister aware that the station was selling 6,000 gallons a week and that it has been cut to 3,000 gallons a week?
I have already told the Deputy that that is not so.
The Minister is not investigating that. Further, he is incorrectly informed.
4.
asked the Minister for Industry, Commerce and Energy if his attention has been drawn to press reports of continuing shortages in petrol supplies in certain parts of the country, and the steps he has taken to remedy these shortages if they exist.
I am aware that there have been press reports about shortages in petrol supplies though such reports have been few in the past week or so. Reports of petrol shortages in some areas still come to hand but investigation of such reports recently has revealed the existence of special factors at local level. In all such instances my Department have taken steps to have the situation remedied.
I should add, however, that in present circumstances it would be unrealistic to expect that oil supplies of all kinds, including petrol, will continue to be in unlimited supply. It should be clear to all by now, having regard to reports by oil companies of shortages of one kind or another, that maximum economy in use of petrol and other kinds of oil is necessary by all of us.
Did the Minister see a report in The Evening Press as recently as last Saturday to the effect that petrol was being sold at a filling station in Drimnagh at £1.20 a gallon, the reason being that the station could not get their ordinary supplies at the usual price, and that the owner of the station was quoted as saying that they had a contract with Shell for a monthly allocation but, like many other stations, they had been running short before their next allocation?
If petrol was sold at a retail level at £1.20 a gallon that is illegal and the proprietor of the station in question would appear to be in breach of the law. I will have the matter investigated if the Deputy will give me his name and address.
I did not put the question down in order to set the Minister on the heels of a man who is selling something which he cannot get at any other price.
The Deputy has done that.
The question of the scarcity is the one in which I am interested. Does the Minister accept, when he finds that this irregularity is going on, that there is a shortage in many filling stations?
Some filling stations in the country, a very small proportion indeed I am glad to say, have less petrol than they might wish to have because of the considerable growth in demand, part of which is engendered by the exceptional economic growth in this country and part of which is engendered by hoarding.
This irregularity is taking place in most parts of this country.
(Interruptions.)
The Minister stated that the Department will take steps to relieve the situation. What steps does the Minister propose to take in these circumstances?
The man in Drimnagh?
Concerning the scarcity of petrol.
When we get a complaint about a difficulty in a certain area my Department take steps to seek to rectify it.
Would the Minister tell the House——
Does the Deputy want to listen to the answer?
I would like to know what steps——
I am trying to tell the Deputy that, if he would sit down and relax. When my Department get a complaint and, incidentally we have had very few in the last fortnight, about difficulty in supply on the part of a user or a retailer, we take the matter up with the company which has habitually being supplying petrol. In the great majority of cases, perhaps 95 per cent of them, my Department have been able to obtain satisfaction for the complainant within 24 hours. That will continue to be the practice. If the Deputy has any specific user of oil in mind I suggest that he give the details of that problem to the relevant section in my Department who I am confident will be able to continue to rectify such difficulties within a short time.
Prosecution is the only answer the Minister has at the moment.
The Deputy's suggestion, apparently, is that I should.
That information was in the papers.
(Interruptions.)
Pretending that Deputy Kelly has just brought it to the Minister's attention is not true and the Minister knows that.
(Interruptions).
The Government are somewhat out of touch if they do not even read the evening papers.
It was on the front page of the Evening Press.
Deputy Deasy wishes to ask a supplementary. We are making very poor progress and I will not allow more supplementaries of a similar type.
What is the percentage cutback in the amount of petrol presently being distributed in comparison with normal distribution quotas?
The amount of petrol sold so far this year is about 109 per cent of what it was last year.
Since the crisis started—that is the question.
Question No. 5.
(Cavan-Monaghan): Did I understand the Minister to say that most petrol filling stations have enough supplies to meet their demands?
Yes.
It will come as a great surprise.
With reference to the petrol station mentioned by Deputy Kelly, I would like the House and Deputy Kelly to know that this filling station——
A question, Deputy.
——is one of the very few filling stations that provide a 24-hour service, and despite the question of a shortage of petrol this filling station remained open for the full 24 hours during this time. I am aware of the notice that appeared in the paper and so on.
Question No. 5.
(Interruptions).
Order, please. Deputy Kelly should have more sense than to get into arguments.
This notice appeared in the paper only last Saturday and only on last Saturday did this increased charge take place.
It did take place?
Question No. 5.
5.
asked the Minister for Industry, Commerce and Energy if any other EEC country possesses a State corporation with a structure and functions on which the proposed National Oil Corporation might be modelled.
6.
asked the Minister for Industry, Commerce and Energy if he will publish a White Paper on oil supply in advance of the legislation proposed in regard to a National Oil Corporation.
With the permission of the Ceann Comhairle, I propose to take Questions Nos. 5 and 6 together.
The structures and functions of State oil organisations in the EEC and elsewhere, have, of course, been considered in relation to the proposed legislation and I have no doubt that the text of the Bill, when published, will contain a number of provisions similar to those in the legislation of other countries.
However, the fundamental considerations as regards structure and functions which I have in mind for the national oil corporation are the energy needs of the Irish economy and, in particular, the security of future oil supplies.
Given that the discussion document "Energy-Ireland", published in July 1978, contained information on oil supply in the context of over-all energy policy I do not propose to publish a White Paper on oil supply at this stage.
I expect to introduce the legislation later this year at which time Deputies will have the opportunity to discuss all aspects of the proposed corporation and the general question of oil supplies.
In view of the fact that the Green Paper to which the Minister referred only contains a small section on energy, would the Minister consider that by now his reflections on this matter might have reached the point where he could tell the House for example whether it is envisaged that this national oil corporation would have any private sector content, or would it be a purely State-created body?
That is a separate question.
I am trying to find out the nature of the thing.
The Deputy might put down a question on those lines.
I did and it was ruled out.
The Deputy can try again.
Has the Minister any clue as to how he envisages this corporation? Will it be something like the ESB or will it be a private sector operation with State participation, or what will it be? Has the Minister any ideas?
The Deputy knows that he may not anticipate legislation.
I have already made it perfectly clear to anybody who is interested that I envisage a State corporation, even the Deputy's question refers to it as that. I do not envisage private sector involvement.
The Minister does not? All right.
I do not rule out the possibility of them co-operating in one way or another with private sector interests if they feel it appropriate.
What exactly will they be doing?
Question No. 7. Deputy Kelly may not question across the floor. We are not going to have a catechism at this time.
(Interruptions).
Will Aran Energy play any role in the Norwegian deal or will Aran Energy be subsumed in it? This is hopeless. We are trying to get serious answers.
Question No. 7.
7.
asked the Minister for Industry, Commerce and Energy the details of any possible oil agreement with Norway for the Supply of oil.
Contacts which have taken place with Norwegian authorities concerning an application by an Irish company for an interest in a petroleum exploration licence offshore Norway have indicated that there appears to be scope for co-operation which could be of interest to Norway and, from the point of view of access to oil supplies, to Ireland. These contacts can best be described as being of a preliminary nature. No discussion of detailed proposals has taken place and it is, therefore, too early to suggest what specific projects or arrangements might emerge.
Will the Minister confirm the presence or absence of fish in this deal?
In the first place no deal was made so the presence or absence of any commodity does not arise.
Is the Minister aware that one of his colleagues, probably in an off-the-cuff interview, referred to a possible deal between fish and oil in the context of Norway.
I am not aware that one of my colleagues made that reference but in the course of our discussions with the Norwegian authorities the question of fish was discussed.
Has the question of fishing boats been discussed in this setting as well?
Yes.
Has that any connection with the running of the BIM boat yards?
No, it has not.
Is the Minister sure he has been informed about that?
Yes.
Question No. 8.
8.
asked the Minister for Industry, Commerce and Energy whether his attention has been drawn to a newspaper report (details supplied) attributing to a "top Government source" the statement that a deal with the Soviet Union, approved by the Soviet Foreign Minister was pending which would guarantee Irish oil supplies from this source and that the existing oil distribution networks would be nationalised; and whether this report is true.
There is no truth in the report.
Question No. 9.
Just a minute, Sir. There is only one question on the Order Paper dealing with that and the Minister has replied to it in six words.
When the Minister says that there is no truth in the report, are we to take it that absolutely nothing has been arranged whether under the approval of the Soviet Foreign Minister or otherwise, in regard to Soviet oil supplies here for a fixed period?
There are existing arrangements between a private Irish firm and Soviet oil authorities, whatever company produces or exports oil from Russia. These are the only arrangements between this country and Russia that I am aware of in regard to oil.
Can the House take it that there is no truth in particular in the suggestion contained in this report that the Minister had used the threat of an exclusive deal with the Russians in order to make the oil companies turn tail two weeks ago?
I have already said that there is no truth in the report. I do not need to go through each line.
Can the Minister explain why a top Government source made such a statement if it was false?
I do not know who the alleged top Government source is. I have made inquiries and I cannot find out.
(Interruptions.)
The Minister will agree that one of the successes of this Government is their Government Information Service. Would the Minister agree that when a report of this sort occurs there should be some denial to the effect that there is no truth in it?
I do not agree at all. If newspapers want to print totally speculative things I and the Government generally should not be expected to go around annoying everyone about it. It would be a full time job.
Would the Minister be interested to know that the journalist who wrote this story subsequently went back to the politician who had passed it to him, at a funeral of one of the Minister's colleagues, and confirmed from him that the substance of what he wrote was true?
I have no idea of what passed at the funeral.
Question No. 9.