asked the Minister for Agriculture and Food the number of successful applicants to date who have been approved by his Department for the scheme for maintaining the national cow herd.
63.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - National Cow Herd.
41.
asked the Minister for Agriculture and Food if increasing beef cow numbers are the national priority of agricultural policy; the present position in relation to the national suckler scheme; and if he will indicate the alternative measures he proposes in order that the necessary increase in numbers can be achieved.
78.
asked the Minister for Agriculture and Food if his Department has been unable to implement the beef cow scheme because of lack of agreement on financing.
I propose to take Questions Nos. 41, 63 and 78 together. Because I believe that the maintenance and expansion of the national cow herd is a matter of major national importance I have proposed a comprehensive beef cow scheme to all interested organisations. It is a new departure and the funds involved come primarily from the parties directly involved rather than from the Exchequer. Important considerations in this approach are the difficult position of the public finances and the EC contraints on national aids.
Discussions and contacts with the various bodies whose agreement is of course essential have been taking place over recent weeks and I hope that it will be possible to finalise the detailed arrangements for the scheme shortly.
Would the Minister accept that the announcement in today's Irish Independent is the third such announcement made by him on this scheme?
I made no such announcement.
I presume the reporter in question did not dream it up.
I want clarification.
The Minister said that discussions had taken place in recent weeks. I want to put it to the Minister that last June he indicated that he was opening discussions with the various bodies and he hoped to announce a scheme when those discussions were completed.
That is correct. One of the things that was very obvious to me when I assumed ministerial responsibility in March was that something like this should have been done five years ago, four years ago, three years ago, two years ago or even last year. It was not done during the past four or five years and there was no attempt to put such a scheme in place. Therefore, I am not going to be blamed for the failure of the previous administration.
From the beginning I sought to bring in an imaginative scheme which would be acceptable to the European Community — and hence the fact that there cannot be national aids — which would involve, by agreement, those who would benefit directly from such a scheme — the banks, the meat industry, the co-ops, the marts and the farmers. Because, by definition, it involves agreement make a voluntary concerned, one cannot make a voluntary scheme compulsory. I would have preferred if the agreement of the parties who will benefit from the farmers' activities had been available before this. I want to repeat that this is long overdue. I am satisfied that as a result of our consultations I have managed to convince, perhaps all of them at this point, of the merits of the scheme, but I cannot say when they will formally notify their agreement. The Government, my colleagues and I have given priority to this scheme and it will be put in place.
It will be evident from our actions in this area that the expansion of the beef cow herd will be promoted under this administration in a way it was not before. The numbers in the beef cow herd fell over the past four years in a dramatic and drastic way. Something should have been done then. I am doing it now and I am not going to accept criticism from the Opposition for doing what they failed to do.
I want to give the Minister some words of encouragement. I regard this problem as the national agricultural priority and I want to see a proper scheme put in place and not press announcements at three monthly intervals with nothing happening.
I want to get some specific information from the Minister. First, the Minister in one of the announcements said that there would be an Exchequer contribution of £1 million. No such provision has been made in the 1988 Estimates. I want the Minister to tell me about the Exchequer contribution. Secondly, in relation to the banks, the Minister said that the thought he had now managed to convince all the parties — and I presume that means the banks. Is he now saying that the banks have agreed to the proposal for the 2 per cent reduction in interest rates? Thirdly, is the Minister saying that the co-ops have agreed to the proposal and is it not a fact that the proposal was put to the co-ops only in the last week or two? Can the Minister say how far he has gone with the scheme and will he confirm that when he next announces the scheme, for the fourth time, that all negotiations will have been completed. Can I take it seriatim through the various people and sources of revenue——
The Deputy should allow me a certain degree of intelligence. I find it difficult to remember all of the elements of each statement which has been made in this House today when I want to reply to them. Regarding the Exchequer involvement, the Deputy on reflection, will consider that it would not be in the interests of anybody if I gave formal indications here and elsewhere as to the extent of that. I am going to leave it at that and if the Deputy does not understand that I do not think that he understands the nature of this scheme.
I understand the situation but I saw it in the Irish Farmers Journal.
I will consult privately with the Deputy or any spokesman on that issue. With regard to the banks and the other interests involved I have put it to the banks that it is in their interests and that they owe it to the farming community and the meat industry as well that they would be involved.
Have they agreed to it?
Yes. There is agreement, but not at the same level from each bank. That is all I am prepared to say at this point. If the Deputy has a criticism to offer on that he should address it to somebody else.
That is passing the buck.
I do not have the right to tell a bank that because of some law in this country that enables a Minister to sequesterate the funds of the bank — even the Minister for Finance and the Central Bank cannot do that——
I am concerned about a scheme being adopted which implied a 2 per cent reduction but which has not been agreed.
The meat industry have indicated their support for the scheme and the figure they are prepared to provide for it. They did have reservations because of the fact that others were not as involved in the scheme as they were. As a consequence of that I have consulted widely with those others, including the dairy, meat and mart sectors, and we are very near a conclusion. It is very easy to criticise something that can only be implemented by agreement. I look forward to the welcome the Deputy will give to what will be a very considerable achievement when it is announced.
I welcomed it a month or six weeks ago. Finally——
Deputy O'Keeffe may not ask a final question.
Let us have the scheme before there is any more publicity.
Your party were very good at it when they were over here.
Please allow us to proceed with the questions.