At the outset I should like to point out that I shall give at least one minute of my time to Deputy Tomás Mac Giolla. I should also mention that Deputy Fergus O'Brien and Deputy Eric Byrne asked me for time as well but, unfortunately, the limited time available to me does not permit be to accede to their requests.
I understand that Deputy Fergus O'Brien has had a meeting with the Minister on this subject. All of that indicates to the House how important the matter is. Unless the Minister can address it immediately it will develop into a very serious one for the Minister and his Government.
The real issue is one of jobs. The Minister's prohibition on the sale of electrical appliances by the ESB through its billing system will mean that at least another 400 and anything up to 1,000 people indirectly employed will be added to the dole queues. The prohibition will also seriously affect thousands of people precluded from purchasing essential electrical goods. The Director of Consumer Affairs and Fair Trade carried out a detailed examination for the Minister's colleague, Deputy O'Malley, on the use by the ESB of its billing system for the sale of electrical appliances. That report found that the ESB are not operating unfairly to the detriment of their competitors and that conclusion was endorsed as recently as 27 January 1992 by the Director's successor, Mr. Fagan.
The move against the retail operations of the ESB has, therefore, come as a bolt from the blue. There has been no public debate on the matter and it appears that the Minister has set himself up as a kind of kangaroo court and has listened to the evidence from only one side without considering the evidence available from the other side of the argument.
The question is whether it is fair or just to abolish a system that gives access to credit to hundreds of thousands of people without disclosure of private circumstances. Five hundred thousand people, about 50 per cent of ESB customers and 30 per cent of all adults in Ireland, do not have bank accounts. Is it fair to abolish a system that gives credit facilities to 150,000 customers? Is it fair to abolish a system that is clearly socially desirable as well as profitable? The billing system has the open support of both statutory social welfare services and health services and voluntary social services such as the St. Vincent de Paul Society and other agencies, who are aghast at the Minister's decision. Those agencies realise the impact that the decision will have on consumers.
Is it fair or just to abolish a system that supports every Irish manufacturer of electrical appliances? The ESB have a policy of supporting Irish industry to secure jobs and so on. In conclusion, I have just two questions. Is the Minister satisfied that he has not breached the Programme for Economic and Social Progress. Is he satisfied that he has not breached EC competition policy?