Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 14 Jun 2023

Vol. 1040 No. 1

Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí - Leaders' Questions

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

I offer a word of sympathy on the loss of the great Dub, Christy Dignam. I send our solidarity to his family. Ní bheidh a leithéid arís ann, gan dabht.

The news overnight of 650 job losses at Tara Mines has left workers, families and the wider community reeling. The suspension of operations at the mine is devastating and a body blow that will affect the entire community. Workers are being laid off without pay in a matter of weeks. They are now worried about how they will make their mortgage payments and what the future will hold. I express our support and solidarity to these workers and their families at this difficult time They include apprentices who are in the middle of their training and need certainty about how that training can continue.

The impact on the wider community and local economy in Navan will be considerable. Everything that can be done must be done to save these jobs and protect the workers at Tara Mines. The Government must engage with management and the parent company to do everything possible to maintain these jobs. Is buille uafásach é dúnadh Mianaigh na Teamhrach d’oibrithe, dá dteaghlaigh agus don mhórphobal san Uaimh. Ní mór gach rud is féidir a dhéanamh chun tarraingt siar ón gcinneadh agus ní mór gach iarracht a dhéanamh chun na poist seo a shábháil.

While no one could have anticipated the sudden and drastic announcement that came overnight, there was an awareness that the mine was under pressure and there were concerns about its future. The Minister, Deputy Coveney, said in a radio interview this morning that this news "is coming out of the blue". Is that really the case? Everyone paying attention knew there was a very serious problem. In fact, my colleague Deputy Guirke wrote to the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, who is responsible for the mining industry, on 11 May. That was more than a month ago. I have the letter here. In it, Deputy Guirke warned about the risk of job losses, stating: "If this risk becomes a reality, that would be a major blow to this region, and certainly merits Government intervention as soon as possible." He went on to request that the Minister meet with Meath Oireachtas representatives, along with representatives of SIPTU and the Boliden Tara Mines. By way of response, Deputy Guirke received an acknowledgement from the Minister's office promising to bring the matter to the Minister's attention, and then nothing further. His warning and call for action were met with silence.

Deputy Guirke's letter was written because at that stage, six weeks ago, conversations were ongoing between the union and management and concerns were very, very high. Was the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, in communication with the company? Was he aware of the very serious pressure on the mine and its precarious position? Did he share that information with the other members of the Government? Six weeks later and with the worst having come to pass, why is it that the Government is only now looking to take action?

The Taoiseach

I join the Deputy in expressing my sadness at the news Christy Dignam has passed. He was a legend, a real, great Dub and somebody who will be sorely missed in this city, across the country and by the wider music community.

I thank the Deputy for raising the important and serious news that 650 staff have, in effect, been put on leave without pay essentially, or temporary redundancy, for the period ahead. Of course, it is not just about the 650 staff in the mine. It is also about subcontractors, supply chain and the wider impact on the economy of Navan and the wider Meath area. My first thoughts are with all those affected, including the directly affected workers, their families and anyone who will be indirectly affected. I give the assurance that the Government is here to help, whether with job search, income support or advice on skills, education and enterprise. All the things the Government does will now click in to ensure the workers have their rights protected and know what their options are.

The Deputy mentioned the apprentices. Enterprise Ireland is working at the moment to transfer them to other firms in order that they can continue with their education and not lose out on any time. That work is already under way. We are very keen to make sure this is a temporary closure and that the mine can be reopened and staff can return to their jobs as soon as possible.

There has been ongoing engagement with the company for quite some time. I visited the mine along with the former Minister of State, Deputy English, and the Minister, Deputy McEntee, when it was flooded many months ago. There were concerns at the time about the future of the mine. I met the people at Tara Mines a few months ago as the then Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment. There have also been engagements involving the Ministers, Deputies Eamon Ryan, Coveney, McEntee and Humphreys. I do not know the exact details and timeline of all those engagements but it is the case that there has been an engagement with the company for several months, relating in particular to increased energy costs.

A significant change in recent weeks is the very significant fall in the price and value of zinc. If a mine produces zinc and the price of zinc falls, that obviously has a consequence. Energy prices have gone up. That is nothing new. Zinc prices have gone down and that is significant. I understand the company made a decision at international level to close the mine on a temporary basis. Neither energy costs nor zinc prices are under the direct control of the company or the Government. There has been ongoing engagement with the company and we want to help. That can involve putting in place an energy scheme. We have energy schemes in place for small businesses and large businesses. In addition, bespoke schemes are available where they are required. However, it is not as simple as that. The price of zinc has gone down on the international market. When the product a company produces falls in value, it has to do the maths. It would appear this company has done the maths and has decided to close the mine temporarily.

Our objective in the immediate term is to make sure the apprentices can continue their apprenticeships in other companies and the 650 people who were laid off get income support and any advice and help they need in terms of alternative employment, education, training and all the things that click in when job losses occur. In the medium term, the objective is to get the mine back open. We are willing to work with the company on doing exactly that. Also, there has been significant engagement with the company on its long-term plans. There are plans for the long term to develop what is called Tara Deep, which is the next phase of the mine. If we can get agreement on that, we can secure the future of the mine for decades ahead. That is the objective.

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

This, then, was not a matter of surprise. The Taoiseach set out what seems to be an extensive range of engagements involving the mine and various Ministers. I am at a loss as to why the Taoiseach is feigning surprise. It was clear to Government that the mine was under significant pressure. As a matter of fact, it has been reported in the media that the company had written to Government on 29 March to warn of the possibility of it ceasing operations. Clearly, the company had done the sums, as the Taoiseach said, but Government had not done the sums or its work. I am at loss to understand why, when the worst has happened, the Government has left it this late to intervene. It strikes me that a Minister or Ministers are asleep at the wheel. Of course, the objective has to be that apprentices get to finish out their apprenticeships and that this closure is temporary. Everything must be done to ensure that that is the case. However, the Government also has to answer the question as to why, when it knew the pressure that this company was under, it is only now that we are seeing action. We also need to know why the Government feigns surprise in a scenario that in fact, as the Taoiseach said, was not surprising at all.

The Taoiseach

It is disappointing that the Deputy is trying to exploit this issue. This is really bad news.

Deputy Paschal Donohoe

Yes.

The Taoiseach

Some 650 jobs have been lost in County Meath. This will impact on thousands of people. It is disappointing that the Deputy is taking this approach to it.

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

It is disappointing that the Government let this happen.

An Ceann Comhairle

Please, Deputy.

The Taoiseach

Let me answer the question. The announcement of the 650 temporary layoffs did come as a surprise. It probably came as a surprise to the management locally as well. They were due to meet the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment, Deputy Coveney, next week. There was no indication that this was going to happen in the way it did, all of a sudden. The fact that the mine was under pressure is no secret. Energy prices have gone up and zinc prices have gone down. Everyone knows that. That has been the case for months. The Government will work with the company-----

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

What did you do?

The Taoiseach

The Government will work with the company to see what we can do to get the mine reopened and Tara Deep advanced in order that we can secure the future of the mine for decades ahead. It is not the case that just by being aware of a problem, the Government can save every job and business in the country. The price of zinc has gone down. It has gone way down. What happens when the price of the good or service you produce goes down? That happens, and-----

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

I am not stupid. I can grasp that.

The Taoiseach

-----the Government cannot-----

Deputy Mary Lou McDonald

The Taoiseach did not do his job again.

The Taoiseach

-----intervene on matters like that.

Deputy Ivana Bacik

On behalf of Labour, I want to begin by joining with others in sending our deepest sympathies to the family and friends of the late Christy Dignam, in particular his wife Kathryn and his family. He will be greatly missed for his immense contribution to Irish music, society and culture. I also want to express my sympathies on behalf of Labour to the family of John Murphy. John was one of two men who suffered severe injuries at a Cork Stryker plant in April and he sadly died last week. Our thoughts are with his family and friends too.

Last night, in an announcement that was a surprise, it is fair to say, and a shock, 650 workers at Tara Mines were informed that they would be laid off temporarily. I express solidarity with all those involved, not just the 650 directly affected but the maybe 2,000 people whose livelihoods we know will be indirectly impacted as a result of what has happened. Management has cited inflation as a factor underpinning this decision. Inflation affects workers too. As Michael Fitzgerald, a SIPTU shop steward for the miners, said, "The cost of living is hurting everyone. It might be hurting the company, but it's hurting us as well." He is right. Management at Tara Mines has been happy to capitalise on the hard work of its employees in Louth and Meath, yet when times get tough, it has socialised its debts and put its workers out to pasture. The Government is presiding over a social welfare system that is not fit to protect workers from the worst impacts of the loss of livelihood. This is because there is no meaningful, modern scheme to support and keep them in work.

This is the latest in the series of layoffs since the Minister, Deputy Coveney, took office in the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment. It has been stated that the layoffs at Twitter sparked a positive change in thinking in Government Buildings on workers' rights. I should hope so, given that workers' rights receive no stand-alone treatment in the programme for Government. We know that more is needed to support workers in these situations. I want to outline two constructive proposals from Labour and SIPTU. I would like to hear the Taoiseach's response to both. The first is the reform of our welfare system, which is out of kilter with those in mainstream Europe. As Adrian Kane of SIPTU stated, the workforce at Tara Mines have the normal outgoings that so many are struggling with in the cost-of-living crisis, including high rents and mortgage payments and grocery, energy and childcare costs. These workers face a huge drop in income when they go on social welfare, as anyone who does the sums will see. In our submission to the public consultation on jobseeker's benefit, Labour called for a welfare system which would index workers' income up to 60% for six months minimum, with a floor beneath which no one can fall. Will the Government implement that proposal as part of the budget? Second, I ask him to answer another call, which Deputy Nash, Senator Marie Sherlock and all of us in Labour have been making, for the introduction of a short-term working scheme modelled on the employee wage subsidy scheme and the German Kurzabeit scheme to protect working people who are laid off and provide State subsidies to pay workers when their employers encounter difficulties. Will the Government introduce these two measures to protect those in the situation that we see the workers in Tara Mines in today, and if so, when?

The Taoiseach

I thank the Deputy for her remarks and her question. What has happened here is not the general impact of inflation, but the cost of energy. The cost of energy for the company has gone up, the value of its product, zinc, has gone down, and the company is now losing a lot of money. As a result of that, it has chosen to close the mine for a temporary period. We will be working very hard with the company to make sure that the apprentices can finish their apprenticeships in other companies, that the staff can be taken back on - because these are temporary redundancies - and the mine can be reopened. That can involve a scheme to help with energy costs, but cannot involve price supports for commodities or zinc. That is not something that the Government can do.

I do not think it is entirely fair to say that the company has entirely socialised this matter. It has been paying 10% employer's PRSI. For every €10 it pays its staff, €1 is paid in employer's PRSI. That is what funds the Social Insurance Fund. That is the money that workers will be getting. It is coming out of the Social Insurance Fund. Most of the money that goes into that fund comes from employer's PRSI.

On the general issue of workers' rights, the Government - just like the previous one - has proven that it is serious about workers' rights. We established a statutory sick pay scheme. I did that myself. It is now the law and people are benefiting from it this year. We have increased the national minimum wage ahead of the rate of inflation nearly every year for the past ten years. We are now moving towards a living wage based on 60% of median income. We have also protected tips and gratuities, for example. Legislation was enacted last year that introduced parental benefit and parental leave. Significant reforms have been made in favour of workers' rights by this Government and by that which preceded it. I am glad we were able to make that progress.

When it comes to the reform of the welfare system, the Minister for Social Protection is developing proposals for what are called pay-related benefits. This is something that I have spoken about before, and something that I strongly support. The left is divided on this, but I appreciate that Labour is in favour of it. This would recognise the fact that somebody who pays more into the PRSI system should get more out if they need it. As a result, if someone becomes unemployed, he or she would not immediately get the basic jobseeker's rate. He or she would get a higher rate because he or should would have been making contributions. That higher rate will be a percentage of a person's income up to a maximum ceiling. The Minister for Social Protection is developing those proposals at the moment, and we wish to press forward with them. Whether it can be in the next budget or not, I cannot say at this stage. There will be an associated cost that will mean higher PRSI contributions. If higher PRSI contributions result in higher benefits, however, then the case is worth making.

Deputy Ivana Bacik

I thank the Taoiseach for the response on pay-related benefits. I share his hope that this will be a short-term temporary layoff for the workers affected. Again, my thoughts are with the workers. The Taoiseach has not answered my question on the proposal for a short-term working scheme. Indeed, is it a proposal that has been put forward across the labour movement. I would like a clear response on that. We have seen it used elsewhere to protect workers in this situation.

I have a further question. The Taoiseach stated that there has been engagement between Tara Mines and the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment for some months now. I have a specific question about the nature of that engagement. Did Tara Mines seek forms of assistance from Government in the past six months, including under the Ukraine enterprise crisis scheme, a scheme that the Taoiseach signed off on last year? We need to know what State supports the company sought and obtained. The company cannot be allowed to pull the plug on its workers.

At the very least, we need a concrete commitment that employees' existing terms and conditions will be retained when they go back to work in what we hope will be a very short time. Has the Government communicated that to the company yet? If not, will it do so?

We need to see a response on the short-term working scheme. We believe that this is the way in which the Government can very much step forward and offer concrete means of support to workers in the awful scenario of what we hope will be only a temporary layoff.

The Taoiseach

I thank the Deputy. We have had schemes of that nature in the past. We had the temporary wage subsidy scheme and the employment wage subsidy scheme. Those schemes were valuable at a particular point during the pandemic. They were also extremely expensive and cost billions of euros. There was a great deal of criticism of companies availing of the schemes at the time. Let us not forget that. This is not something that we rule out doing in the future, but it is not in our immediate plans. Let us not forget that many Members of the opposite benches were very critical of those schemes because, in many cases, profitable companies availed of them. We need to bear that and the fact that they came at a considerable cost to the taxpayer in mind.

I do not know if the company applied for the Ukraine energy crisis scheme. That scheme was established by the Government to help large companies with their energy costs. Companies can get several million euro from the scheme. I do not know if the company applied for that in this case. It is a fair question, and I will check that out. I understand, from what I have been told, that the scale of the losses the company was facing was so enormous that even a scheme like that would not been adequate.

Deputy Catherine Connolly

Baineann mo cheist leis na hoird rialta agus go háirithe leis na cáipéisí atá, faraor, fós i seilbh na n-ord seo. Tá an chosúlacht ar an scéal go bhfuil teipthe go hiomlán ag an Rialtas dul i ngleic leis an dúshlán na cáipéisí seo a chaomhnú agus a chosaint agus, níos tábhachtaí fós, iad a chur ar fáil do lucht acadúla agus don phobal.

My question relates to what appears to be - forgive me if I am wrong - the complete failure of this Government and previous Governments to take action to preserve and protect the records held by various religious organisations in this country. I want to distinguish, as the Government has done, between public and private records. In previous responses to me and other Deputies, the Taoiseach said that the public records in the possession of the State in various Departments will be made available in a central repository on the former site of the Magdalen laundry on Seán McDermott Street in due course. The Taoiseach might provide brief update on that.

My specific question, which is related, is on the records which have been described as private - a description I totally disagree with - and which are held by religious orders. There has been no attempt by the Government to bring in legislation to protect and preserve those records and make them available to the public. In saying that, I am acutely aware of the recent article by Fintan O’Toole about a survivor of the Glin industrial school in Limerick. Significantly, this survivor was born in 1949, the year in which this country became a republic. This man has written a book about that. The issue for me today is on a court case taken by the Christian Brothers against him because he has some records that they want back. It is not that they want to make these records available to the public. Presumably, they want to keep, hide or destroy them. The man in question is on record as saying that he burned previous records on their instructions. The Glin industrial school was sold in 1973. This date is significant because Cherish was set up in that year and the first allowance was brought in for so-called unmarried mothers. We then go forward and look at three apologies given over two centuries in respect of the various institutions and the horrific abuse carried out there. If the apologies are to mean anything, then we have to follow it with action.

One action is the central repository the Government intends to established. I presume the Taoiseach will provide an update on that. The second involves building trust by getting the records from the religious orders. We do not have those records. Recommendation 52 of the Final Report of the Commission of Investigation into Mother and Baby Homes encourages the religious orders to make their data available to the public. I do not want four minutes to be taken up with what the Government is doing in the context of the plan for the central repository. I want the Taoiseach to zone in on the specific question I am asking, namely, what steps, action or legislation are proposed to protect, conserve and make those documents available to the public?

The Taoiseach

I thank the Deputy for asking a very important question. I acknowledge that she has raised this matter before. It was not among the questions I anticipated today, so I will not be able to give a comprehensive answer. I can say, as the Deputy has mentioned already, that when it comes to public records, work is advanced now on developing a central repository to hold those records. When it comes to records that are held privately, for example, by religious institutions, a working group was established to examine all of our options and what can be done with regard to preserving and protecting those records. That working group is due to report to the Government in the near future. it has not reported as yet. Before the end of the week, I can give the Deputy a more detailed response in writing. I appreciate that what I have just said is not the comprehensive response she wants.

Deputy Catherine Connolly

I thank the Taoiseach for answering my question, but this is an issue that this Government and previous Governments have dealt with. The Commission of Investigation into Mother and Baby Homes and Certain Related Matters was set up in 2015. Its report was published in 2021. The Government has to have considered this matter. It was raised by the Minister of State, Deputy Niall Collins, in respect of Limerick and the ongoing case relating to public and private records. It is an obscenity, or in the words of Fintan O’Toole, who I rarely quote, it is “grotesque” to distinguish between public and private records when we supervised and funded all of these schools and institutions. Is the Taoiseach telling me that a steering group has been set up specifically in respect of what are described as the private records held by institutions? Is that what the Taoiseach is telling me? There has been a great deal of confusion between public and private records. We owe it to this man who, at 74, is still struggling and who, in 2023, is being taken to court by the Christian Brothers. It is grotesque that decisions have not been made, actions have not been taken and the appropriate legislation has not been passed to protect, conserve and make these records available. If the Government wants to work hand in hand with us, it must create trust. The Government has gone ahead with a mother and baby institutions redress scheme that excludes over 22,000 people, not to mention those who were boarded out, those who suffered as a result of being of mixed race and so on. I am over time. I apologise for that. Honestly, it is time for straight talking, for creating an environment of trust and for passing on that trust to the survivors.

The Taoiseach

Again, I will be happy to come back to the Deputy later in the week with a more comprehensive response. I appreciate that she has raised this issue before. There is a distinction between public and private records. Public records are owned by the State; they are in our possession. Private records are not owned or in the possession of the State. People have rights in the context of private records. Under existing data protection and privacy legislation, a person has the right, in some circumstances, to access information about himself or herself where that information is held privately. I appreciate that the Deputy is talking about more than that. She is concerned with giving people access to records relating to them and ensuring that those records are not destroyed and are held in a way in which people can access them. That is something I am briefed on, but I have not been briefed on it for several weeks. I know that the working group is due to report quite soon. I will come back to the Deputy with a more comprehensive response by the end of the week.

Deputy Carol Nolan

Writing in The Irish Times this week, Tadhg Daly, the chief executive of Nursing Homes Ireland, NHI, stated his clear view that nursing homes face an existential threat and a crisis that is putting the viability of the entire sector at risk. We know from data collected by NHI that in the past three years, an astonishing 31 private and voluntary nursing homes have closed. This equates to a loss of 915 beds in the sector. In 2022 alone, 18 nursing homes closed and just four new homes opened. Unfortunately, that trend is not slowing down. This situation is not helped by the fact that as a recent comparative analysis has shown, the price per week of a HSE-run nursing home in County Offaly was €1,959, while private nursing home fees were over €900 less, at €1,009. With respect to County Laois, the situation is even more striking. HSE nursing homes there are charging an average of €2,585 in comparison with €1,039 for privately run facilities. The clear demographic trajectory here adds an important context to this debate.

The number of people aged 85 and over increased by 25% between 2016 and 2022. In the next 20 years, this demographic is forecast to double and will be most dependent on the person-centred, round-the-clock care provided by nursing homes. Imagine the astonishment when providers woke to the news at the start of this month that the Government intends to lift the ban on private nursing homes becoming refugee centres. I appreciate, as Philip Ryan noted in the Irish Independent, that operators will first have to provide HIQA with six months' notice of their decision to close and undergo an 18 month cooling-off period to give residents and staff time to make alternative arrangements. Unfortunately, however, when these issues are combined - the threat to the sector and the slew of closures - it becomes absolutely clear that there will be nowhere for our vulnerable elderly people to go. The Taoiseach has said that our older people will not be left in the lurch but what is he basing that on? Is he aware of massive levels of additional capacity that exist in the system? I would like him to tell me where that capacity can be found. Many of our loved ones and perhaps some of us here today may come to need the expert care of the nursing home sector. However, when the viability and the future of the sector is under the kind of pressure it is under today, it may be a need that will go unmet, with all the personal and health consequences that brings.

Nursing Homes Ireland is calling for immediate action to be taken to stem the tide of closures. Will the Taoiseach provide me with his plan on how that can be achieved, especially in the context of the policy change that allows for former nursing homes to be completely taken out of the system and repurposed as refugee accommodation centres?

The Taoiseach

I thank Deputy Nolan for raising this important issue. I acknowledge there are nursing homes under financial pressure and some have closed. At the same time, others are making substantial profits and are opening. New nursing homes are opening as well as nursing homes closing. Last year we had a net gain in the total number of beds in nursing homes and so far this year we are seeing that happen again. More nursing home beds are opening than closing. I acknowledge that some are closing but others are opening.

With respect to using former nursing homes to accommodate refugees or people seeking international protection, IP, we are strictly saying that can only happen after two years. That is to ensure that no nursing home owner makes a decision to close a nursing home in order to turn it into refugee or IP accommodation. I know the Deputy did not say this, but some people are somehow making out that nursing home operators are shutting down with a view to making more money from providing accommodation to refugees or IP applicants. That is not true or fair. It is not a nice conspiracy theory to be putting around the place quite frankly as it is not the case. That is why we require them to be closed for two years, that the person who owns it must essentially have no income from it for two years or even has to dispose of it. No nursing home will close with a view to making a better return from refugee accommodation. We will not allow that to happen.

The overall budget for nursing homes through the fair deal scheme is €1.4 billion per year now, assisting more than 22,000 people. It increased by a further €100 million this year to €223 million. Budget 2023 saw more than €40 million in additional funding for the nursing home support scheme, or fair deal scheme, to provide an uplift in the maximum prices chargeable by private and voluntary nursing homes as negotiated. It is imperative that private and voluntary providers continue to engage in the process set out in the scheme. We are conscious of the financial challenges many of them face. We provided substantial additional funding to private and voluntary nursing homes over the course of the pandemic and in recent years. That includes €149 million through the temporary assistance payment scheme, the provision of personal protective equipment and oxygen costing the State €75 million, and the new temporary inflation payment scheme which was established last year to help private and voluntary nursing homes with increases in energy costs. It covered 75% of the year-on-year increase in costs with a monthly cap of more than €5,000 per nursing home.

Deputy Carol Nolan

I thank the Taoiseach for his response. Not enough new nursing homes are opening to meet the capacity demands that are coming down the tracks. We are all aware that Ireland has an ageing population. That is a fact and a reality we need to plan for and be prepared for. However, people have serious, genuine and well-founded concerns. The fact is that Government policy, the policy decision to lift the ban, has pitted one vulnerable group against another vulnerable group in society, which is wrong. These beds must be safeguarded and I would like to know what measures the Government will put in place to ensure there is capacity in the future. We must plan now to ensure there is capacity to meet an emergency. This is an emergency coming down the tracks. We need an emergency response. We need a pragmatic solution that does not include a dangerous policy that pits one vulnerable group against another vulnerable group.

The Taoiseach

Deputy, I absolutely agree that we should not do that, so please make sure your remarks and the remarks of other people who support you do not do that either. It is not right to create the kind of impression that somehow older people will be turfed out of nursing homes-----

Deputy Carol Nolan

I have not done that. When did I do that? I am asking questions on behalf of my constituents.

The Taoiseach

I will leave it at that.

Deputy Carol Nolan

I have not done that. I asked a genuine honest question.

An Ceann Comhairle

Please Deputy

The Taoiseach

I will answer the Deputy's question here, but nobody in this Chamber is naive to the subtext of what is going on.

Deputy Michael Healy-Rae

You cannot make it up.

An Ceann Comhairle

Allow the Taoiseach to respond.

Deputy Carol Nolan

Can I please know about the plan because my constituents in Laois-Offaly are asking me? I am sure when the Taoiseach visits the constituency he will be asked as well.

An Ceann Comhairle

Will you please allow the Taoiseach to respond?

Deputy Carol Nolan

If he responds directly. I will not sit here listening to nonsense.

The Taoiseach

Some nursing homes are closing. They tend to be smaller nursing homes that would need a lot of investment to continue. New nursing homes are also opening. They tend to be larger and state-of-the-art. Overall the number of beds available in nursing homes is increasing. It increased by 88 last year. It has increased by 161 so far this year. That is what is happening.

Deputy Carol Nolan

Just 61.

The Taoiseach

It was 161 so far this year.