JOINT COMMITTEE ON EUROPEAN UNION AFFAIRS debate -
Thursday, 17 May 2012

Global Development Model: Discussion

Chairman

I am delighted to welcome Mr. Hans Zomer, director of Dóchas, who is accompanied by Ms Helen Keogh, chief executive officer of World Vision Ireland, and Ms Niamh Garvey, policy and advocacy manager, Trócaire. As members are aware, Dóchas - the Irish Association of Non-Governmental Development Organisations - provides a forum for consultation and co-operation among its members and helps them to speak with a single voice on development issues. The purpose of the meeting is to exchange views on how best we can use Ireland's forthcoming Presidency of the European Union from January 2013 and make sure we understand each other's priorities and can help to shape them in considering a global model for development. One of the aspects highlighted by Dóchas in terms of Ireland's Presidency of the European Union is that members of the United Nations are being asked to develop an agreement on new global models for social, political and economic development. During Ireland's Presidency the European Union must develop its negotiating position for the September 2013 UN summit which will examine the global framework to succeed the millennium development goals.

I remind members of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that they should not comment on, criticise or make charges against a person outside the Houses or an official either by name or in such a manner that he or she can be readily identified. By virtue of section 17(2)(l) of the Defamation Act 2009, witnesses are protected by absolute privilege in respect of the evidence they give to the committee. If they are directed by it to cease giving evidence on a particular matter and continue to so do, they are entitled thereafter only to qualified privilege.

Ms Helen Keogh

We are grateful to have the opportunity to address the Joint Committee on European Union Affairs. I do not have to tell members about the importance to citizens of the European Union and the decisions made since we joined the then EEC in 1973. As a former member of the committee which Deputy Bernard Durkan ably led as Chairman, I am well aware of its important role in monitoring EU activities. This role has grown considerably in recent years.

We are all aware that the year ahead is critical in terms of the future of the European Union and, speaking as someone involved in the NGO sector, consideration of development issues. Member states have a number of vital decisions to make in the coming months, many of which will be made in meetings chaired by officials during Ireland's Presidency of the European Union in 2013. It will be a particularly important time for the committee which will have an opportunity to influence the process. It will be a time when there will be a strong focus on the country because it is to be hoped we will be coming out of the financial crisis and recession. Ireland will play a pivotal role when major decisions are being made that will impact not only on people living in Europe but also on the lives of billions around the world. Ireland will hold the Presidency at a crucial time for overseas development. As the committee will take centre stage during that period, we ask its members to use their influence to scrutinise actions taken and play an active part in guiding the EU leadership towards making the right decisions. I hope we will be able to influence them in taking these decisions.

As development NGOs, we have been advocates of a strong European Union. We know the main challenges facing humanity - social inequality, climate change and hunger - cannot be addressed without international co-operation, mutual accountability and joint regulation. We believe - this is true of our work in the developing world - that the European Union is a good example of a model to be used to advance our common interests.

We welcome the Government's commitment to overseas development aid and recognise that it has prioritised development issues in its plans for the Presidency of the European Union. We are aware that plans are being put in place to host a meeting of the European Union's development Ministers at the beginning of the Presidency. Yesterday the Minister of State with responsibility for trade and development, Deputy Joe Costello, made it clear to a gathering at the launch of Concern's 1000 DAYS campaign that development issues would be the focus of Ireland's Presidency in 2013. At the same event the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Eamon Gilmore, pledged that the Government would use the Presidency to further highlight the need to tackle hunger and address the issue of overseas development aid. We very much welcome these remarks. We recognise the Government's plans, as well as the statements of the Minister and the Minister of State, as clear signs that development will be an important component of discussions to be held and decisions made during Ireland's Presidency in 2013.

I refer to the Taoiseach's speech at the Famine commemoration event in which he underlined the moral aspect of the issue and our deep-rooted sense of awareness of hunger throughout the world as a result of our experiences of famine. That resonates a great deal with us.

Importantly, during Ireland's Presidency the European Union must develop its negotiating position for the United Nations summit in September 2013 at which the global framework to succeed the millennium development goals will be decided. That will be a crucial time when we will have the opportunity to review the success of the millennium development goals, analyse the elements that worked and assess those which failed. It is important that we recognise the lack of progress on goals 4 and 5 which called for a reduction in child mortality rates and an improvement to maternal health. Whatever structures replace the millennium development goals after 2015 must prioritise maternal and child health and use a different approach to reduce dramatically the numbers of women and children who die needlessly daily. In this regard, I must plug our own organisation, World Vision. With the backing of Irish Aid, we have embarked on a programme on maternal and child health that we hope will see a reduction of 25% in deaths over a four year period. These are the impacts that can be made with good programmes.

The EU stability pact is on many people's lips, if not everybody's. Parallel negotiations on the EU budget mean that choices about the European Union's role as a global actor are being made. These important discussions are likely to reach their conclusion during the term of the Irish Presidency, beginning next January. We urge the Government to push the development agenda during its Presidency.

We know the European Union is the biggest donor of overseas aid and external policies such as policies on trade and migration and foreign policy have direct implications for many of the world's poorest countries. EU aid has ensured substantial progress has been made in the area of development in recent years. Between 2004 and 2009, it helped to enrol more than 9 million children in primary education, vaccinate more than 5 million against measles and connect more than 31 million people to clean water. These are the programmes that are real and true.

We are pleased to see that, in the context of negotiations on the next seven year budget, the European Commission has proposed to increase the budget for the European Union's external actions. We call on the committee to support us in ensuring the European Union prioritises development throughout and in the final stages of the multi-annual financial framework. Ireland gives great example which I hope is followed by our EU partners in having a policy of non-tied aid.

My colleagues, Mr. Zomer and Ms Garvey, will set out our views on the European Presidency and why we believe it provides such a unique opportunity to increase our influence on some of the processes mentioned.

Mr. Hans Zomer

As Ms Keogh said, a number of crucial decisions will be taken at EU level in the next couple of months. We are calling on the committee to play an active role in making them. When the Minister of State responsible for European affairs, Deputy Lucinda Creighton, first talked about the EU Presidency, she referred to it as an opportunity to manage the European Union's agenda and find ways of advancing policies that will improve the lives of people in Ireland, as well as abroad. The Minister of State responsible for trade and development, Deputy Joe Costello, when addressing the committee, spoke about the review of the Irish Aid programme and the Irish Presidency of the European Union as great opportunities to break down artificial barriers between sustainable development, hunger, climate change, human rights, gender and other priority issues. Both at European and Irish Government level, we are rethinking aid programmes. We want to use existing opportunities to rethink not only our aid programmes but also the models of development that underpin them.

The current global economic and technological crises provide a driver for such a discussion. We have a number of great opportunities for that discussion, particularly in the shape of the millennium development goals summit mentioned by the Chairman. I refer also to the role Ireland will play in its Presidency of the European Council. As the Chairman said, during the Irish Presidency, the European Union will need to develop its mandate for the September 2013 UN summit which will articulate a new recipe for the international fight against global poverty. The current recipe, the millennium development goals, was agreed to in 2000 by the United Nations. Essentially, it provides seven goals for poorer countries and one for richer countries. The challenges we face as a global community require a response from rich and poor countries alike. When the United Nations meets to discuss the framework and priorities for the international fight against poverty, it will need to come up with a recipe that is universal and will bind rich and poor countries alike. Dóchas wants Ireland to come up with a strong and clear vision of what such a recipe should look like. We have the time and assume the Presidency right in the middle of the process.

We want to use the Presidency for a national debate about the priorities to be considered in the fight against poverty. We will be facilitating a discussion with domestic NGOs and anybody interested in taking part in such a discussion. We will be presenting the views that emerge in the process to the Government, in time, I hope, for the Irish Presidency in order that they will inform both the Irish and European contributions at the crucial summit.

In summary, Ireland will play a pivotal role at European level at a time when decisions will be made that will have an impact not only on the millions of people living in Europe but also on the billions with whom we share the planet. There is a great opportunity and a great responsibility and we look forward to working with the committee in taking these on board.

Ms Niamh Garvey

I thank the committee for giving me the opportunity to address it. I wish to focus on the EU budget, the multi-annual financial framework and the goals which will supersede the millennium development goals.

Ms Keogh and Mr. Zomer have outlined two of the major opportunities the Irish Presidency of the European Council offers for Ireland to demonstrate its leadership in the area of international development. During the course of the Presidency a number of other highly significant political processes will be overseen by Ireland that will have significant impacts on poverty reduction, human rights and humanitarian assistance. For example, the European Consensus on Humanitarian Assistance will be reviewed during 2013. As the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Foreign Affairs and Trade had the opportunity to discuss with Commissioner Georgieva in February this year, maintaining a focus on the core humanitarian principles that underpin humanitarian assistance will be vital, given the more recent pressures associated with the politicisation of humanitarian assistance that has been putting the lives of aid workers at risk.

In keeping with the European Union's long-held commitment to ensuring policy coherence for development, to which we committed under the Lisbon treaty and which was emphasised most recently in the Council conclusions of 14 May, the Union's development policy requires a more proactive integration of development objectives with EU policies and external actions. There will be a practical opportunity to do this during 2012 and 2013 as the European Commission renews the renewable energy directive, including the devastating impact the increased demand for bio fuels has been having on food security in developing countries through food price volatility and land grabbing. Other opportunities include building on Ireland's role during its last Presidency of the European Council, during which period it oversaw the introduction of European guidelines on human rights defenders. The upcoming Presidency is an opportunity to further encourage the European Union to promote and protect civil society space in developing countries which is increasingly coming under threat from restrictive laws in many such countries.

Reflecting on Ireland's existing stated commitment to making climate change and hunger, together with human rights, priorities during the Presidency, as referred to by Ms Keogh, Ireland should ensure the European Union enhances its commitment to reducing greenhouse gas emissions to tackle climate change and provides sufficient new and additional financing for developing countries which may require investigating innovative sources of financing, whether from a financial transactions tax, carbon taxes on aviation and shipping or other sources. These are issues on which we will be engaging with the Government before, during and after the Irish Presidency. We strongly encourage the committee to engage by monitoring and encouraging the Government to place poverty eradication and human rights at the heart of its Presidency agenda. As a starting point, we encourage it to write to the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Eamon Gilmore, and the Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Joe Costello, to encourage them to make a set of issues a priority. The first priority is to protect heading 4, development assistance from the European Union budget, and support the Commission's proposals to increase the level of funding from €56 billion to €70 billion. The second priority is to ensure that during the Irish Presidency the European Union will develop a strong position on the post-millennium development goals framework, with rights and sustainability at its heart. The third priority is to champion policy coherence for development within Ireland, as well as at EU level, with an emphasis on the impact on poverty of bio-fuels in the forthcoming review of the European Union directive on renewable energy. The final priority is to maintain Europe's leadership in tackling climate change by increasing the level of ambition of its emission reduction targets and supporting developing countries to adapt to the impact of climate change.

Senator Colm Burke

I thank the delegates for such a comprehensive presentation. I refer to the presentation on the issue of maternal health as someone who has visited a number of countries in which health care is non-existent. One country I have visited is Kenya in which health care is provided. A hospital there lacked a water and an electricity supply, yet it was able to carry out 2,500 operations a year and run a maternity service. However, when I visited it, I was struck by the number of maternal deaths. The problem was not so much the lack of facilities in the hospital but the distance people were obliged to travel to access it and the delay in getting there. While it is a good objective on which to focus, how does Ms Keogh propose setting targets in this regard? Would it be through an education programme, or is this about trying to provide funding for medical centres or a combination of both? While it is an extremely important issue, my question pertains to how one focuses on getting the best results.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan

I congratulate the delegates on their presentations, their logic and research, as well as the obvious common sense behind them. They have presented an interesting scenario. The contribution made by the European Union to overseas development aid has not been generally recognised. The European Union has never received full credit for the tremendous work it has done in the alleviation of hunger and addressing the issues of intolerance and human rights abuses worldwide. While there have been occasions when, for logistical reasons perhaps, it has been hampered in its ambitions, the fact remains the European Union is the biggest single contributor. This is an example for everyone else. While those who wish to criticise the European Union from whatever side of the fence they are on and for whatever reason will continue to so do, the evidence speaks for itself.

I refer to Ireland's role in dealing with the issues mentioned such as economic development aid and the need for solidarity and continuity. There is a need for solidarity, never more so than at present when economic difficulties are being experienced worldwide. It is in the face of such difficulties that there is always a greater danger, owing to competing demands, that people might close up shop, resile from the central core values on which the European Union was founded, re-nationalise and withdraw into themselves. The message provided by the delegates is particularly important in this regard. The committee will take it on board and will do whatever it can at this level to support the external affairs budget of the European Union, as others will.

A very interesting and important point was made about Ireland's role during the European Presidency. Never since Ireland joined the European Union has there been a more important role for an Irish Presidency. Never since the European Union was founded has there been a more critical time for its future development and stabilisation, a recommitment to its original ideals and goals and a return to the identification and realisation of the vision of solidarity, cohesion and collective responsibility set out by the founding fathers of modern Europe. I keep repeating this point, but it does not appear to resonate with everyone. There is no question but that the Government, for whatever reason, will be thrust into a role that will have a long-lasting impact both on this country and the future development of the European Union. Cynics can and regularly do spread their negative gospel, but the Chairman will be glad to learn I do not propose to delve into that matter, as the committee has been discussing it for the past four to six weeks. However, I make the point that whatever emerges and whatever developments take place during the Irish Presidency will affect every member state of the European Union, both within and without the eurozone. The trends established during that period will affect overseas development aid and investment in Ireland and the European Union. Moreover, they will affect the political development and evolution of member states of the European Union to a far greater extent than people are prepared to recognise.

I will conclude by noting that there is evidence throughout the European Union of what I referred to, namely, a withdrawal from its core values by various people who should know better, some of whom promulgate their agenda in the course of the referendum campaign taking place here. That is not in the interests of Ireland or the European Union, as strength emanates from solidarity, cohesion and stability. These are the issues that affect the degree to which we can assert ourselves economically, both as a country and as a member state of the European Union. For those who discern a great agenda to dissect, fragment and break down, the job of the Irish Presidency will be to illustrate the benefits and advantages of doing the opposite.

Deputy Robert Dowds

I apologise for not being present for all the presentations as I was engaged elsewhere. Moreover, I am a visitor to the joint committee rather than a permanent member.

I support the remarks of Deputy Bernard Durkan on the importance of the European Union's positive involvement in the provision of aid and so on in the Third World. However, I will ask two questions. Obviously, there are different degrees of success in the different countries in which aid is provided. To what extent does aid reach those who need it most, or the projects that need it most? There is a view that much of the aid provided can be siphoned off by corrupt governments in Third World countries. In many ways, this view is often promulgated by one or two organisations involved in the direct provision of aid, GOAL being the obvious example.

Second, while I am not familiar with all of the details, there is also a view that can be substantiated that it would be of tremendous advantage to Third World countries were they able to induce the international companies working within their borders to pay a decent level of tax and that this would assist such countries far more than all of the aid they receive. Is there anything the European Union can do to help to achieve such a positive development?

Chairman

I also thank the delegates for their presentations and wish to make a couple of points, the first of which pertains to the millennium development goals and how we will seek to move from them at the United Nations summit due to take place in September next year. I am aware that when we are designing our projects for programme countries and deciding where we should target our support, we have one eye on the impact projects will have in terms of the millennium development goals. I previously worked on the sub-committee on overseas development aid and we regularly invited ambassadors and other embassy staff from the various programme countries to address us. They would go through each of the millennium development goals and say exactly how we were helping to achieve them. Now that they are changing, can the delegates give us some idea of how we can ensure our projects in programme countries will dovetail with whatever replaces the millennium development goals?

A debate is needed on how Ireland's Presidency can help to shape the European Union's development aid policies. What work are the agencies putting into that debate? Given the timescale involved, I would have thought it should take place within the next six months. It will be too late to have it during the Irish Presidency next year. At national level, will there be a debate involving the public directly, or will it be done through the media? How do the agencies intend to engage with the public? Will the delegates comment on whether they see it as being a national debate? Will they link up with their opposite numbers in the United Kingdom, France and elsewhere to raise awareness across the European Union?

The delegates requested the committee to engage with the Taoiseach, the Tánaiste and the Minister of State with responsibility for European Affairs. They will be pleased to know that there was a presentation by the Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Joe Costello, about three weeks ago, after which we wrote to the Minister to make a submission on the Irish White Paper on aid. The Minister of State with responsibility for European Affairs, Deputy Lucinda Creighton, is due to attend the committee in mid-June to discuss the issues which should be prioritised during Ireland's Presidency of the European Union. That is an ongoing process, one that will not be completed in one meeting. There will be a series of meetings on the subject. We will invite the Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade, Deputy Joe Costello, back at some stage in the coming months.

As the delegates are aware, we have been busy dealing with the referendum report. As that is now out of the way, it is back to business as usual. The key item on our agenda concerns the priorities for Ireland's Presidency of the European Union. Since that is our focus, the delegates' visit is timely. In the coming months we intend to put a lot of meat on the bones in terms of the shape the Irish Presidency will take.

Ms Helen Keogh

I thank members of the committee for their positive and constructive reactions. Senator Colm Burke asked about the challenges facing us in dealing with child and maternal health issues. I am glad he has been out in the field and is aware of what can and cannot be done. In all programmes, as part of an holistic approach, we work closely with Irish Aid. The programme to which I referred is predicated on programmes that have been implemented very successfully, particularly in Mali. The approach is scientific, whereby we have targeted over 75,000 pregnant women, with the aim of securing a 25% reduction in the numbers of mothers and babies dying by 2015. We will do this through education, immunisation, breast feeding and nutrition programmes. We referred to Concern's 1000 DAYS plan. As we are not working in little silos, there is mutual understanding of the work that has been done. We are training about 1,500 community health workers who, as well as giving advice, will support women throughout their pregnancy. As was said, the distances that must be travelled to access services are enormous, but the programme is based in villages, communities and people's homes to reduce the necessity to access hospital services. We also support health clinics as part of our health strategy. It is important to note the work being done when questions are asked about the effectiveness of aid.

It is important for the NGO sector to be accountable and demonstrate our work has an impact. As members of Dóchas, that is the focus of what we do, particularly in partnership with Irish Aid. Whether it is on the NGO or direct governmental aid side, sometimes the required level of accountability is extreme. However, we have to account for absolutely everything, which is how it should be.

Deputy Robert Dowds referred to corruption. We do not have to look beyond the borders of our own country to find it. However, we try to ensure our standards are the very best. As the NGO sector deals directly with communities, there are few opportunities for corruption, but one can never say never. Nonetheless, we try to ensure the highest standards are applied. Irish Aid is recognised internationally as having just about the best programmes. There is a very high standard of accountability.

I thank Deputy Bernard Durkan for his remarks and huge support. He rightly says the position of Ireland throughout its Presidency of the European Union will be important. He also referred to its long-term impact.

The Chairman asked particular questions which I will ask Ms Garvey and Mr. Zomer to deal with.

Ms Niamh Garvey

One of the strengths of the millennium development goals framework has been the degree to which it has clear indicators for the majority of them. The challenge is to ensure we are measuring the right things. One of the lessons is that the millennium development goals capture many of the really important things. For example, millennium development goal 1 is to reduce by half the number of people living in absolute poverty. We are on track to reach this goal on a global level, but what is masked is the degree to which the incidence of poverty varies throughout the world. Most progress has been made in China and India; we are seeing far less progress in sub-Saharan Africa. This is mirrored in some of the other goals. For example, there might be an overall change in the numbers of maternal deaths, but within a country level it might be the poorest and most vulnerable people or the richer sections of the population who are seeing the benefits. Therefore, we would like to see the issues of equality and inequality being addressed further in the indicators in a new framework.

Deputy Robert Dowds referred to tax revenue as a significant domestic resource in developing countries. He is absolutely correct. Revenue leaves developing countries on a scale that dwarfs the overall aid budget. Such revenue should be kept in developing countries in order that their citizens can benefit from this important resource. Tax havens and the obscurity of much of the international tax regime exacerbate the problem and allow the leakage of resources from developing countries. The European Union has a significant role to play in trying to improve the overall international tax system to address some of these problems. Two EU directives are currently examining the issue of transparency and accounting in tax revenues with a particular focus on the extractive industries. We see this as an important opportunity that Ireland can support at European level to ensure there is greater transparency in the international tax regime which then prevents such leakage of tax revenues out of developing countries. We would be keen to see Ireland support these directives as they make their way through the European Union.

Mr. Hans Zomer

I thank the committee members for their kind comments.

One of the key messages is that we are talking about a framework to replace the millennium development goals, MDGs, but not before we have actually achieved them. It is important that we all keep the pressure on all the Governments that have signed up to the MDGs to ensure they will be delivered on. In the case of Ireland, the 0.7% target came out with the millennium declaration and it is important we hold that.

The question was asked as to what we can do if decisions on development policy are already taken before Ireland's EU Presidency. It is encouraging the committee has said it will use the next several months to focus exclusively on the priorities of the Irish term for the EU Presidency. Decisions will be taken on the multi-annual financial framework soon. At the Rio summit next month, UN member states will set new targets for a sustainable development programme. Decisions will also be taken with the EU External Action Service which was introduced with the Lisbon treaty. These are the key issues which will be rolling out as we go along. They do not necessarily require an international summit but they are being decided now and will reach their crescendo in the first six months of 2013 during Ireland's EU Presidency.

Ireland needs to ensure Europe takes an active role in shaping a new development agenda which is based on and builds on the MDGs while strengthening them, as Ms Garvey outlined, to reflect the priorities of people living in poverty and the inequality and dimension of poverty related to exclusion, marginalisation and discrimination.

Dóchas is a member of CONCORD, a network of equivalent agencies in all 27 member states. Next week, in Brussels it will meet to discuss what we would like to see replace the MDGs. Dóchas believes this conversation needs to be held domestically too. I do not have particular views on how much of a public discussion there should be. I know it is unlikely to gather great media headlines but it will be an important discussion. Obviously, the economic crisis has promoted a national debate as to what went wrong and what we should do differently. It is just our bit of trying to be part of that and saying we cannot have this discussion in a vacuum. These are global challenges and the way Ireland is shaping its future needs to be done in the context of our role on the international stage.

Chairman

I thank our guests for attending this meeting and sharing their thoughts with us. I hope we will see them back again in the coming months as we start to get prepared for the EU Presidency.

The joint committee went into private session at 1.05 p.m. and adjourned at 1.10 p.m. until 11.30 a.m. on Thursday, 24 May 2012.