I welcome before the joint committee Mr. Chris Bond, Mr. Mick Birmingham and Mr. Gavin Clarke of the USI. Before hearing a short presentation after which there will be some questions, I draw all the witnesses' attention to the fact that members of the committee have absolute privilege but this same privilege does not apply to witnesses appearing before the committee. Members are reminded of the parliamentary practice that members should not comment on, criticise or make charges against a person outside the Houses or of any official, either by name or in such a way as to make him or her identifiable. I invite the witnesses to make a presentation after which I will take some questions.
Bus Services: Discussion with USI.
Mr. Chris Bond
First, I thank members for hearing our presentation. Its purpose is to elucidate a business case for a night bus service in Dublin during week nights. We believe the decision to abolish the Dublin Bus night bus service was premature and that a clear demand exists for forms of after-hours public transport in Dublin. I will take a few minutes to demonstrate an example of a profitable night bus service in a European city of similar size to Dublin, after which my colleague will discuss the impact the lack of a night-time public transport service has on the entertainment industry and how the provision of such a service would boost the economy and create jobs.
We believe the lack of passengers on the former week-night service provided by Dublin Bus was due to the nature of the service and not to a lack of demand for night-time public transport. There were many limitations to the weekday Nitelink service provided by Dublin Bus. To name a few, the service did not coincide with pub and nightclub opening hours and only one pick-up point was available at College Green, which is not located near any of Dublin's entertainment venues. Furthermore, the service only operated in a single direction from the city centre to suburban areas.
A look at another European city similar in size to Dublin will show an example of a profitable weekday night bus service. The documentation provided by USI to the committee highlights that Glasgow, Scotland operates more than 15 weekday night bus routes. The service also allows for multiple pick-up points, which ensures that most city centre entertainment venues have an easy link to public transport. Given that Dublin's entertainment scene is much larger than that of Glasgow, there is potential for a weekday service that my colleague will discuss shortly. Basically, the USI would like the joint committee to discuss a motion calling on Dublin Bus to examine the potential return of a weeknight Nitelink service. If this is not possible, perhaps an alternative company should be given a licence to operate a similar service. My colleague, Mr. Mick Birmingham, will now discuss demand for night-time transport within the entertainment industry.
Mr. Mick Birmingham
First, to introduce myself, I am an entertainment officer and run events in various nightclubs around the city. Consequently, I have first-hand knowledge of the effects of what is happening. The Dublin nightclub industry is quite valuable. It comprises 66 businesses and generates €170 million in revenue. It is important to note that this is not profit, as most businesses are on their knees and struggle to stay afloat and pay their staff. On a weeknight, the clientele of nightclubs tends to be students predominantly and it is these students who allow them to pay their staff. The industry directly employs 1,500 people, as well as those employed indirectly in the service industries it supports, such as food providers, taxis, hairdressers and the other auxiliary services.
It also offers other advantages. In essence, the removal of a cheap way to get home reduces the number of people who go out in the first place. Consequently, more people drink in uncontrolled environments with all the problems this may cause. If I may, I will take a hypothetical example of a typical student who lives in Raheny, wishes to go out to celebrate a friend's birthday or whatever and has a budget of €30. In the absence of a Nitelink service, €15 of his budget straight away will be spent on a taxi. Thereafter, between €5 and €10 more will go on nightclub entry charges.
He will not be able to have a great night out after that.
Mr. Mick Birmingham
Yes. Not only will he not have a great night, he will change his behaviour. Instead of being able to afford a couple of drinks in the club, the student now has a budget of less than a tenner for his drink for the night. As a result, he will go to an off-licence to buy a naggin or shoulder of vodka and will drink it in the space of two or three hours because he cannot bring it into the nightclub. Consequently, people are showing up in nightclubs in a highly intoxicated state, where they pose a danger to themselves and others because of the pace at which they are forced to drink. In addition, the bars in the nightclubs tends to be empty as the average expenditure tends to €5 or less. However, if a bus service can be offered for €5, that student has €20 with which to out. As a result, he can go to a pub or can buy a few drinks in the club, in which case the pace is much slower, which is clearly beneficial.
The main point is that the costs associated with a night bus service are easily identified, namely, the cost of running the buses. However, the benefits are broad and do not simply apply to the person who is going home. Massive benefits accrue in general to having a society that can move around and is mobile at any hour. I refer, for example, to the jobs it can create. I recognise this can be a resource issue and that Dublin Bus might state it has limited resources and needs to do something else. However, on a macro level, we benefit from doing more with less. If one can get people home using a couple of buses rather than hundreds of taxis, less fuel is expended. This has many benefits in respect of how such money then can be reallocated in a beneficial way. I repeat Mr. Bond's point, which is that this decision must be reconsidered to ascertain whether a sustainable model can be found. As the benefits are so great, we should be creative in trying to find a solution.
Why do the witnesses think the service was withdrawn in the first place?
Mr. Mick Birmingham
I imagine that it was unprofitable but I believe that was due to the manner in which it was run.
I am sure that representatives of the Dublin Bus will appear again before the joint committee at some time in the future and members will put this question to them. From the USI's perspective, how could Dublin Bus make a better job of running it?
Before the witnesses respond to that question, I was going to ask them to come up with a model of the kind of service they seek. In other words, can they provide members with a proposal regarding the times at and routes on which they want buses to run?
Mr. Chris Bond
Absolutely.
If possible, the witnesses should provide projected statistics for passenger numbers and should highlight the fact that the USI would be prepared to promote it through the colleges and so on. All such measures would be helpful in our efforts to try to convince someone, be it Bus Éireann, Dublin Bus or the private sector, to provide such a service.
Mr. Chris Bond
We can provide examples of where such a demand exists for a night bus service. For example, our colleagues in UCD Students' Union run their own night bus service on Wednesday and Thursday nights and there have been times when the demand for the night bus has exceeded the supply and people have ended up being turned away from the service. Consequently, we believe there is scope for a company such as Dublin Bus to run its own night bus service.
In response to the Deputy's question, we raised the matter with Dublin Bus and its rationale for getting rid of the service in the first place was that it claimed that the numbers of people who are using the service before it was discontinued had declined to single digits. As we stated in our previous submission, the main reason for this was that the night bus was not running at a time that was convenient for most people using the service.
Are we discussing services at all hours of the morning?
Mr. Chris Bond
We are discussing services that coincide with the standard closing times. The closing time for most night clubs is 2.30 a.m., with which Dublin Bus's weekend Nitelink service tends to coincide. This is quite a popular service.
I am delighted to welcome the delegation. I remember making representations to Dublin Bus, which gave us a spiel on having a clientele of three of four people. The situation varies, in that some cities run efficient nitelink services whereas others close down fairly early. The delegation might be able to bring to our attention those types of model. Dublin Bus and, in Cork and Galway, Bus Éireann have a social responsibility, particularly on PSO routes.
The safety of young people when going home from a busy city centre is an important issue. Dublin Bus should reconsider the matter. The Chairman pointed out how Bus Éireann has contracted people to do a particular job. It is interesting that the delegation mentions that UCD has a potential service. It is something the delegates should consider. It is not good enough to just tell people to forget it. The delegation has made a strong case in its many letters to the committee and we will revert on them fairly strongly.
Alongside student organisations in the UK or the EU generally, has the delegation examined other models to which we should adhere? Some cities' metro services, if they are lucky enough to have a metro, run all night.
Mr. Chris Bond
We used Glasgow as an example because its population size is similar to Dublin's. It would not be valid to compare Dublin with London, which has an extensive night bus service. We chose Glasgow as the most appropriate comparison.
It works effectively in Glasgow.
Mr. Chris Bond
It works extremely effectively. If one takes into account the fact that Glasgow's entertainment industry is much smaller than Dublin's, one could argue that there is even more of a market for night buses in Dublin than there is in Glasgow. It is a question of running the service in the most efficient way possible.
Years ago when I was approximately Mr. Bond's age, Copenhagen seemed to have a night transport system that was mainly bus-based. It was in a different league than anything else I had experienced. The Glasgow comparison is interesting.
Would Mr. Clarke like to say something?
Mr. Gavin Clarke
Coming from one of the colleges based in the extremities of Dublin's suburbs, the student population in Dún Laoghaire finds it difficult to find affordable housing. Some students live closer to the city centre or elsewhere. On nights when they have social activities or stay in college until 11 p.m. or 11.30 p.m to work on projects, it is difficult for them to get transport. The Deansgrange area is isolated. The DART is a bus journey away from it. Since NUI Maynooth, DCU and those of us attending the Institute of Art and Design, Dún Laoghaire, are on the outskirts of Dublin, the entertainment industry would benefit a great deal if those students could be brought into the city centre on week nights.
We will take the matter up with Bus Éireann and the Department and revert to the delegation. I thank out guests for attending and apologise for delaying them for so long. They are always welcome to return in the event they want to make a further case. If our guests contact us again, we will see what we can do at that point.
The joint committee adjourned at 6.05 p.m. until 3.45 p.m. on Wednesday, 7 April 2010.