It is intended that we take Items Nos. 1, 2 and 3.
Order of Business.
I would like to congratulate the Leader of the House for the very orderly way in which business has been organised for the first three meetings of the Seanad this session. I do not want to draw any contrast to former occasions, but from the Independent point of view on the benches over here, I would like to say that the fact that we are having Thursday sittings, that we are debating a report and that we had a late night sitting last night, are matters which I hope will continue and that the Seanad will sit more often.
I have two pleas to make to the Leader of the House. The first is that the Bills that are coming through at the moment are going to the Dáil first which is a pity. During the last session we had, as Senator Honan mentioned yesterday, the Companies Bill and several other Bills which came here first. They were amended substantially and this House treated them with an enormous amount of care. I would ask the Leader to make representations to the Government that all Bills do not go first to the Dáil because, when that happens, it means that they come here and are pushed through with a certain amount of undue haste. Otherwise, I would like to express my great satisfaction with the conduct of business so far, which may surprise the Leader of the House to a certain extent.
I would like to ask two related questions. They are important and considered questions and I believe they require a considered answer. I will be prepared to accept a temporary answer today but not in future with regard to Item No. 39 which states:
That Seanad Éireann expresses concern at the Government's total lack of action in meeting the requirements of last October's judgment in the European Court of Human Rights concerning discrimination against homosexual citizens of Ireland.
The Government are required to introduce legislation. I want to ask the Leader of the Government party in this House to seek an answer from Government in relation to a date on which the Government intend to cease their contempt of the European Court of Human Rights and to introduce the required legislation. I would like to signal the fact that I have no intention of getting them off the hook by introducing any such legislation at this stage.
I wish to raise the question again of the programme of legislation which has been raised by myself and by Senator Manning on two occasions. On the day of the opening of the other House, the Government Whip was able to announce to the nation at large a programme of 11 to 14 Bills which would be introduced in that House between then and Christmas. We have asked unsuccessfully for the last week to get some information from the Leader of the House as to the likely programme of legislation for the next couple of months. It would be useful if the Leader of the House were to admit to us today that he has been unable to get any commitment from Government on this issue so then at least we could address it as a House together rather than having this constant niggling on a daily basis. Do we have any information about the legislation which is planned for this House, or will this be just a continuation of discussion and questions day after day? I put that question very clearly to the Leader and ask for a report from him.
On a related issue, the Leader of the House has in the past given commitments time and time again to have a debate on the problems arising in the Middle East. I am saying this in the most neutral of ways at this stage. I am not talking about taking sides, I am talking about a neutral motion in order to discuss developments in the Middle East.
On a number of occasions we have raised this question of debates on matters relating to different parts of the world. I do not intend opening the debate now. Would the Leaders of the House, first of all, give us some indication when he might take that and secondly, could he also indicate to us what the Government's policy is on a matter of committees, joint committee and committees of this House? Could he indicate if it is possible for this House, of its own initiative, to set up committees on issues on which the Government are not prepared to set up joint committees?
In the light of what Senator O'Toole raised as a matter which would generate all-party concern in the Middle East, I would like to ask the Leader of the House about a debate on another issue — I do not want to be in the least bit disorderly because I doubt if there is much disagreement on this issue — that is the frightening spectacle in Cambodia of the most genocidal régime since Hitler's returning to power there and the need for the international community to do everything possible to prevent that happening. It is an issue which we could appropriately debate on a motion which need not be contentious, though I would have a different view, perhaps, from the Government on it.
I appeal to the Leader to allow us to use this House to have an issue that is increasingly of concern to public opinion debated here. Related to that and also related to Senator O'Toole's general question, could I ask the Leader if there is any possibility in this session of a joint committee on foreign affairs being set up? In the meantime, can I tell Members that it is proposed that the ad hoc committee on foreign affairs, which was set up during the last session, will recommence its deliberations today at 3 p.m. in room G. 24?
A number of items have been raised, in particular the matters raised by Senators Ross, Norris and O'Toole in connection with Government Bills. Government Bills will be introduced in this House in this session. One of the problems since the Dáil returned is that they have been involved in business that went from this House to them. This is creating certain problems but there are Government Bills which will be available to us in the very near future. When I say in the very near future I am not talking about long-term near future, I am talking about short-term near future, possibly next week. Definitely we will have one or two the week after, if not next week.
With regard to item No. 39 I will express to the Government the concern of Senator Norris and will come back to him with the reply.
Regarding a debate on the Middle East, this could be dealt with by way of an all-party agreed motion. If I put down a motion here in connection with the Middle East it might be construed in certain areas that it was being put down for my particular reasons and from my particular viewpoint so it would be better if an all-party agreed motion were to come before the House. I would see no problem in having such a debate initiated within the near future, as soon as agreement can be got on a wording.
As far as committees and joint committees are concerned, it is not my function to make decisions in these matters. That is a function of the Committee on Procedure and Privileges. Those two related matters can be taken up at the Committee on Procedure and Privileges presumably at their next meeting.
With regard to Senator Brendan Ryan's concern about what is happening in Cambodia, I presume that is the matter he could bring forward by way of the first Private Members' motion to come before the House.
As far as a joint committee on foreign affairs is concerned that again is not a matter for me. It would be a joint committee of both Houses and I have no part to play in setting up any joint committee. I will talk to the Minister for Foreign Affairs on this matter again and report back to the House or to the Committee on Procedure and Privileges. From an operational point of view from now on we will sit on Wednesdays and Thursdays. It is intended that, broadly speaking, we will take Government business, Bills and so forth, on Wednesday and will leave Thursdays open for reports and various other items.
It is normal practice for the Order Paper of the House to carry notices of meetings which take place. The Leader of the House has indicated that the matter of committees is a question for the House to decide. Will it be possible in the future, for instance, for the Order Paper to carry notice of the meetings of the ad hoc committee on foreign affairs?
Anything that appears on the Order Paper has to be related to formal committees or formal business of the Houses. I do not think that any ad hoc committee meetings should be inserted. If they were to be included it would mean that anybody could decide to set up an ad hoc committee on any particular subject, have it on the Order Paper, circulate it to whomever they wished it and get the greatest advantage from it. I do not think that would be to the advantage of the House.
Order of Business agreed to.