The Order of Business is No.1, the Mental Health Bill, 1999 – Committee Stage; No. 2, Carer's Leave Bill, 2000 – Second Stage, to be taken no earlier than 2.30 p.m., with the contributions of spokespersons not to exceed 20 minutes and all other Senators not to exceed 15 minutes, and Senators may share time; No. 3, motion 24, to be taken from 6 p.m. to 8 p.m., and business, if not previously concluded, will resume thereafter. Business will be interrupted from 1.30 p.m. to 2.30 p.m.
Order of Business.
I thank the Leader for taking the advice I gave him yesterday regarding the taking of Report Stage of the Mental Health Bill. It is not good legislative practice to compress the taking of legislation like that. If the Carer's Leave Bill is not completed before 6 p.m., is it intended to take it after 8 p.m.?
Yes.
A debate was requested yesterday in regard to President Bush's visit. He will visit Sweden tomorrow which, as we know, is the home of environmentally conscious people. It is appropriate that Ireland's voice is raised there both in regard to the issue of global warming, which he seems to deny, and the 1972 nuclear missile treaty, which is moribund, according to Mr. Bush, but which has through the years worked well, including during the Cold War period, to prevent the escalation of nuclear arms. Will the Leader ask the Minister for Foreign Affairs to make it known to Mr. Bush personally and through the EU leaders that tinkering with the 1972 anti-nuclear treaty could be very dangerous?
An issue raised yesterday, which is very much in the public domain today, is the National Roads Authority and the seeking of partnership with private enterprise. I have no objection to such a partnership but if it is to be done, it should be debated in both Houses before any decision is made. My view on the National Roads Authority is very clear. No group should be above democratic accountability, and it is. Therefore, I ask the Leader to consider having a debate on that issue. A substantial amount of revenue is raised from car tax, most of which does not go back into roads. Non-designated tax may be appropriate for the Government but when in the region of 90% of taxation is not going back into roads, we have to ask questions. Will the Leader agree to such a debate?
I thank the Leader for agreeing to restrict the Mental Health Bill to Committee Stage today, which is very much appreciated. In terms of dealing with the issues I raised yesterday and which were raised this morning – the Kyoto Protocol and disarmament – we should ask the Minister for Foreign Affairs to come in and explain the Government's position on them. We learned many years ago that there is no point having hugely confrontational attitudes between east and west – it does not work. What needs to be explained to President Bush is that decisions on Kyoto and nuclear disarmament are issues which required huge compromise and a lot of movement. Many people were unhappy with final outcomes but everybody took the decision for the greater global interest. I ask the Minister for Foreign Affairs to come to the House and allow debate to take place on this matter. The position of the American President should be inched forward so that he has an understanding not only of the issues, which he does, but of the fact that he cannot take decisions in the interests of America only. These are global matters which concern everybody on the globe. That is the message that has to be conveyed to him and with that he has to agree.
I would like a debate on education, particularly in terms of funding. A commitment was given to have such a debate and I would like to see it on the agenda in the next two weeks, otherwise I may need to table amendments to the Order of Business. Funding for school buildings, disadvantaged areas, in particular, and special education is an issue of huge importance about which we are getting many demands from people. I would like these issues to be discussed here. Every Member of the House has solid, practical and progressive views on this from which the Minister could take advice. I accept that wisdom does not lie on one side of the House. Members have something to say on this and we should have the opportunity to do so.
I agree with the previous speakers in relation to taking every opportunity when President Bush is in Europe to highlight the global issues of concern, the environmental issue and the issue we raised yesterday, the death penalty, where the American experience is not akin to the one in Europe. The Minister for Foreign Affairs should come into the House to enable us to discuss this matter. Now that we have a seat on the Security Council we should be exerting and asserting a role in that capacity. We have a better opportunity of being heard abroad because we have been respected by 186 countries who voted for us to have a voice at the Security Council.
I welcome the Cabinet decision yesterday to establish a national forum in relation to referenda and the Treaty of Nice. It is a little like putting the cart before the horse but nevertheless it is welcome. I am concerned as to what its composition will be. I call for a wider debate on this issue in the House because we are distancing ourselves from Europe. There is not a perception that citizens here or this Parliament has any connection with the European experience. This is the opportunity for us to discuss how we, as a Parliament, relate to the European Parliament and the European institutions. It is an opportunity to have a wide-ranging discussion on decision making domestically in terms of our subsidiarity position and in Europe and on the treaties that are being negotiated. This Parliament and this House, in particular, should have a full discussion on the issue.
The all-Ireland report on mortality rates is being launched today North and South of the Border. I call for a debate on that as it reveals an alarming statistic. Those who live in deprived areas tend to have a much higher mortality rate than those who live in higher occupational areas. While one may say that is a given, one of the good points about the Nice treaty was that it made provision for a biennial audit whereby each country would have to provide an anti-poverty audit of the measures it was taking to tackle poverty. This issue has a strong connection with that aspect of the Nice treaty. I call for a debate on the report.
I ask the Leader to arrange a debate on banking. While we dealt with legislation in that area yesterday, this is a broader issue. It concerns the recent decision of many of our commercial banks to close branches in towns, villages and even in some suburbs of our cities and their refusal to discuss the matter with local organisations. That flies in the face of the efforts of local development organisations and Government policy on decentralisation and the work of Departments and agencies. We should investigate the possibility of how we can advance the cause of post offices and credit unions so that we can provide an alternative to commercial banks and support their efforts. In doing so, we would be supporting the efforts of local development organisations and Government policy. A debate on this matter would be opportune and appropriate.
I agree with the pertinent comments made by my acting Leader, Senator Coogan. I would like to recognise the great good Kerry Co-op proposes to do for many in the agri cultural community, particularly in the Golden Vale. I refer to the proposal—
Just because Kerry Co-op—
Has Senator Coghlan a question for the Leader?
(Interruptions.)
Order, please. I ask Senator Coghlan to address the Chair. Has he a question for the Leader?
I am sure the Leader recognises the importance of our food industry.
This is not appropriate.
The Chair will decide what is and what is not appropriate. Has Senator Coghlan a question for the Leader?
I appreciate the protection afforded by the Chair on this matter. The Leader will recognise the importance of the future of our food industry. In the national interest, I wish that company's efforts every success.
In my absence yesterday there was much talk about Europe when that great soothsayer and fellow countyman of mine raised the issue. A more important wake up call relates to the euro—
Has the Senator a question for the Leader of the House? He certainly did not have a question for him on the first matter.
There was legislation on the matter yesterday.
I did. I was asking for a debate on the food industry and its future. This issue should serve as a timely wake up call. The Government did not do enough in regard—
Is this just in Killarney?
In here we talk nationally.
(Interruptions.)
The Order of Business is being abused by the Senator.
As the Chair will be aware, I would hate to do that. I ask the Leader for a debate to alert people and businesses in particular to the changes they must put in place in regard to the euro changeover.
It is a pity Senator Coghlan was not here yesterday to make those points during the debate.
I regret very much not being here. I agree with Senator Finneran's request for a debate on banking, its social input and all the other ramifications.
I propose the House should take due cognisance of the decision by the Government yesterday, particularly by the Minister of State, Deputy Hanafin, in regard to increased payments to foster parents. I ask the Leader for a debate on the background to the need for fostering. Lack of education, lack of discipline in homes and lack of parental care is a big problem. While I applaud what is being done in the area of fostering, it is about time we looked at the background to the need for fostering.
I read an article by Mr. Horovitz in the Middle East in today's edition of The Irish Times which states that Mr. George Tenet, the head of the CIA, has given the Palestinians a “take it or leave it” ultimatum or else they will go back into full war. The Israelis have decided they will “take it” and the Palestinians are saying “do not take it or leave it”.
Has the Senator a question for the Leader of the House?
The history of the CIA is not good. If there is an early debate on the Middle East, I ask the Leader for a discussion on the "take it or leave it" attitude of the CIA in relation to a conflict in the Middle East for which the CIA has absolutely no responsibility.
Looking at the legislative agenda in Britain, I realise the new Government is copying a great deal of the legislation we have introduced. I am referring in particular to the success of our Criminal Assets Bureau which that Government now intends to copy and introduce. They also intend to devolve authority down the line.
There was a lot of flag flying and bells and whistles when we announced the strategic management initiative approximately six years ago. It was to be a long programme which began very well. It may well be successful. I ask the Leader to bring to this House the Minister responsible, who may be the Taoiseach, to tell us how it has achieved its standards. This relates to devolving authority down the line.
I ask the Leader for a debate on aviation for which we asked some time ago. I am reminded of a report yesterday of a near miss last year at Heathrow Airport when approximately 400 people were almost involved in a crash because of authority being devolved down the line to those involved at air traffic control. We should debate that issue before an accident occurs. Perhaps there is no problem and everything is in control. However, I would like the Minister to come to this House and put our minds at rest.
I support Senator Costello's request for a debate on the health report being published today. That will give us an opportunity for a fundamental debate on health issues. There is a clear correlation between income and social class and health status. A debate would give us the opportunity to discuss whether it would be better to try taking people out of poverty in order to improve their health than to build more hospitals and increase the number of beds.
Can we have an early debate on education, including particularly learning disability? Other speakers have also mentioned the need for early intervention in relation to children from deprived backgrounds. We must emphasise how important it is that children get opportunities from the earliest stage. I ask the Leader to facilitate a debate on this issue as soon as possible, particularly since there is a focus on education at the moment with exams taking place.
I reinforce the point that an early debate on education is very important. It should encompass the success story or otherwise of Breaking the Cycle and also the transition from primary into second level and from second to third level. It should be discussed particularly in the light of the Combat Poverty report.
I congratulate the Government for setting up the national forum in relation to the outcome of the Nice treaty referendum. We should have a full debate on that to show our concern and to help clear misinformation. The national forum should be allowed do its work before we have the debate.
It is important also that we have a discussion on the operation of the banks in the light of the euro change. The banks should not dictate the social structure of the country. The role of post offices and the social system within the infrastructure of small villages and towns should be included in that discussion.
Will the Leader ensure that the Minister for the Environment and Local Government comes into the House to discuss the role of the National Roads Authority, particularly in the light of public and private partnerships and the imposition of tolls, and also the lack of appropriate compensation to farmers and ordinary citizens discommoded by bypasses and the construction of motorways?
I ask also for debate on car insurance. This morning we received an excellent document from Macra na Feirme on car insurance and provisional drivers. Macra asks the Government to impose price controls on the cost of insurance for young drivers. We should have a debate on that before the summer recess.
I ask the Leader to call on the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform to review existing legislation on the implementation and enforcement of crowd control at major sporting events in view of the serious incident that took place on the terraces of Páirc Uí Chaoimh last Sunday. We were fortu nate that there was no serious injury or fatality arising from the inefficient and blatantly careless crowd management there. It is urgent that the Minister should review the legislation and bring forward new legislation if necessary.
Mr. Ryan
I support the call for debate on Europe. It should not be on the referendum per se. I have met a large number of people who voted “Yes” but if somebody tries to foist a second referendum on them without a proper debate they will vote “No”. We need to be careful with this issue. The debate should be wide ranging. All communication between this country and the EU was excluded from the Freedom of Information Act because it is regarded as international relations. We cannot insist on its being international relations and then claim it is a European Union. There is no reason why most of what the Government says to the EU should not be covered by the Freedom of Information Act.
The fact that European directives do not apply to the Commission itself is very convenient as it can make its own rules. That Commissioners still have duty-free privileges is one of a succession of issues of secrecy and accountability. If we do not move away from the belief that consultation is unnecessary, the European project will collapse. Such an eventuality was obvious from the Amsterdam treaty and I am surprised nobody noticed at that time.
I support Senator Finneran's call for a discussion on rural services, including banks and post offices. I suggest we invite the Minister of State, Deputy Ó Cuív, to speak to the House as he is responsible for rural and western development and has put proposals to Cabinet in relation to dealing with certain specific needs. We should consider setting aside Government time to listen to the Minister of State's proposals.
Senator Costello mentioned the Cabinet decision in relation to the Nice treaty. The most glaring aspect of the discussions on the treaty was the disinformation and lack of information in relation to the EU. While I respect the privileges enjoyed by the House, I ask that we provide information to the public on Europe. Many people suffer from a shortage of information regarding events in Brussels and this needs to be addressed seriously.
I support Senator Finneran's call for a debate on banking. I particularly refer to AIB's rationalisation policy which has already resulted in the closure of two branches in County Limerick, including that in Kilfinnane, a town which no longer has a banking facility. If banks do not want to provide such basic services to customers, post offices and credit unions should be equipped to do so. I find it difficult to reconcile AIB's sponsorship of the Better Ireland awards which recognise the efforts of communities with the bank's closure of branches. I would welcome a debate on this matter at the earliest opportunity.
I support the call by Senator Chambers for this House to play a role in bridging the information gulf between the EU and the public. I am aware that the Leader of the House is a strong proponent of this idea and perhaps this is an opportune time to look at how such a role can best be played.
I refer also to Senator Coogan's call for a debate on the National Roads Authority's plans to introduce many new tolls. It is not correct to say that only 10% of funding from motor taxation goes back into roads.
The figure is 17%.
This matter is not being debated now and these points can be made during the debate that has been sought.
If I am allowed to finish I will explain the point to which I was coming. This Minister has channelled motor taxation funding into local government. There has never been as much money for roads as in recent years.
When the Leader is organising a debate on this matter, I ask him to broaden it to include the entire national development plan. I am concerned about this topic as in my local area I have seen a two year delay while consultants considered which route to recommend. Given our serious infrastructural deficits and the need for significant investment as early as possible, such delays are incommensurate with the requirements of the transport industry. If the debate is on the national development plan as a whole, issues like tolls can be discussed too.
I support the call for a debate on education. I remind the Leader that I have sought a debate on two specific educational matters for months. The first of these is the highly respected Cromien report on the reform of the Department of Education and Science. The other is the NCCA report on the restructuring of the leaving certificate. These two reports are highly significant and advocate long overdue and badly needed reform of key areas of the education system. It is almost a scandal that the reports are gathering dust and that we cannot debate them with a view to action concerning their recommendations. I ask the Leader not to allow this session to finish without having made provision for a full-scale debate on both of these highly important reports.
I support the call for a debate on banking. For a long time we in this House have been trying to get the message across to the banks that the way they are doing their business is not good enough. Similarly, I support Senator Jackman's call for a debate on car insurance.
On the taxi industry, it is appalling that there is a possibility that a taxi cab which I might pick up in Dublin late in the evening might be driven by somebody who is believed by the Garda Síochána to be involved in criminal activity. We need to examine seriously the criteria by which taxi licences are allocated. What is happening is an absolute disgrace. We should have a debate in this House as soon as possible, and I look forward to contributing on same.
I support Senator Coogan's call for a debate on the National Roads Authority. I have asked for such a debate a number of times during this session. I agree with Senator Walsh. However, I do not agree with Senator Coogan's comments on the Minister for the Environment and Local Government and motor taxation. My reason for calling for this debate is totally different from Senator Coogan's. It is on the basis of the very small input by the National Roads Authority into our national secondary roads. I ask for a review of the possibility of bringing the national secondary roads back within the ambit of the Department of the Environment and Local Government, based on the Minister's performance in the current Dáil. Perhaps then we would have a proper upgrading of our national secondary roads.
Senator Coogan inquired about the Carer's Leave Bill. If this is not concluded before 6 p.m. it will resume after 8 p.m. Senators Coogan, O'Toole and Costello expressed a desire to invite the Minister for Foreign Affairs to the House to discuss many issues which were highlighted this morning. I can have this done, as I said yesterday on the Order of Business.
Senators Coogan, Jackman, Walsh and Bonner called for a debate on the National Roads Authority and I have agreed to an all-day debate. Senator Walsh suggested that the national development plan be coupled with it. I will certainly consider that and hope we will be able to have the debate before the summer recess.
Senators Costello and Hayes called for a debate on health. There will be no difficulty in allocating time to such a debate. Senators O'Toole, Costello, Keogh, Ormonde and Quill called for a debate on education. Senators Quill and Ormonde referred particularly to the two reports. I will allow time for this in the coming weeks. Senator Costello welcomed the Government's decision yesterday to establish a national forum following the referendum result last week. I will pass his views on to the Taoiseach.
Senators Finneran, Coghlan, Chambers, Cregan and Cox called for an urgent debate on banking. I considered this during the Order of Business and I will be proposing that the House have a debate next week in Fianna Fáil's Private Members' time from 6 p.m. to 8 p.m. If a sufficient number of Members are interested – it appears from the Order of Business this morning that this is the case – the debate can be extended by one hour. If the party whose turn it is the fol lowing week wishes, it can also take it. It is very serious that banks are closing branches and rationalising at a time of economic buoyancy. However, it may provide a window of opportunity for post offices and credit unions.
Many magnificent buildings are occupied by banking institutions in the towns and cities. Perhaps they could pass on their goodwill to the communities that have supported them by offering these to the credit unions and post offices to continue business. However, no doubt this will not happen and the commitment of the communities that have served them long and hard will possibly not be rewarded. As legislators we must give Members the opportunity to express their views in the presence of the Minister. I intend to start that debate during Private Members' business at 6 p.m. next Wednesday.
Senator Coghlan called for a debate on the food industry. I can have time allocated for this. Senator Lanigan complimented the Minister of State at the Department of Health and Children, Deputy Hanafin, on the allocations for fostering and called for a debate on this issue. I can allow time for this. Many families have played a very important social role in fostering over the past decades. They have done an excellent job and I am delighted to note the increased allocations announced by the Minister of State.
Senator Lanigan also called for a debate on the Middle East. The House recently debated this issue but I can review the possibility of holding another debate before the start of the summer recess. Senator Quinn referred to the British Government availing of the progressive legislation we have introduced across all Departments. We have no objection to that. I understand an all-party committee under the chairmanship of Senator Roche is dealing with the matter he highlighted.
Senator Jackman and Senator Cox called for a debate on the motor insurance industry, while Senator Cox expressed strong views on those persons deemed suitable for taxi licences in Dublin. I can have time allowed for this. Senator Liam Fitzgerald expressed concern about crowd control, especially in the context of the appearance and success of the Limerick hurling team last Sunday. I will pass on his views to the Minister.
Order of Business agreed to.