The Order of Business is No. 1, Betting (Amendment) Bill 2013 - Report and Final Stages, to be taken at 1.15 p.m.; and No. 2, Private Members' business, Adoption (Identity and Information) Bill 2014 - Committee and Remaining Stages, to be taken at 4 p.m and conclude not later than 6 p.m.
Order of Business
We are due to take the Betting (Amendment) Bill 2013 today. In that context, I do not know whether the Leader has received an indication regarding whether the Minister is going to provide an update on the gambling control Bill, which was supposed to be introduced in conjunction with the former. Last week the Minister gave a commitment to seek an update on the current status of the gambling control Bill. These two items of legislation should have been dealt with together, but that has not proved to be the case. I know that the Leader shares my concerns about this matter.
What is the position on the education (admission to school) Bill? This Bill was originally scheduled to be published in 2014 but the Government legislation programme indicates that it is due for publication this year. Only the heads of the Bill have been published. The former Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Ruairí Quinn, was intent on bringing about some degree of standardisation with regard to school enrolment policies and in terms of what constitutes a catchment area. I agree with what the previous Minister was trying to do because it is very important. This week, thousands of children in Dublin and, I am sure, throughout the remainder of the country will receive letters refusing them entry to primary schools for a variety of reasons. Parents find it increasingly frustrating that schools' enrolment policies differ from each other. For example, a child might be higher up the ladder in terms of eligibility for enrolment in one school and lower down in respect of another. In addition, schools can arbitrarily redraw their catchment areas in any given year. A school can decide to expand its catchment area when it wants to increase pupil numbers and retain teaching posts but reduce it when the requirement is to keep numbers static. It is impossible for parents and children to manage in such circumstances. The education (admission to school) Bill was promised almost three years ago. It would facilitate an important reform in the area of education. I accept that she may have done so, but I certainly have not heard the Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Jan O'Sullivan, mention it once. I am of the view that there is an opportunity for her to introduce the Bill in order that the Second Stage debate might proceed. I ask the Leader to use his good offices to discover what is the current status of the Bill.
I am sure colleagues will join me in offering best wishes to the two prison officers who were so brutally wounded yesterday during an escape by a prisoner they had accompanied to Tallaght hospital. There has been a good deal of commentary in respect of this particularly heinous attack, which is the subject of an ongoing Garda operation. Yesterday, a number of colleagues raised the issue of crime. The Joint Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality is due to begin its hearings on gangland crime at 2.30 p.m. If colleagues have an interest in that matter or in ways in which the Government and legislators can take action, then perhaps they might consider attending.
I welcome the passage through the Seanad last night of the Gender Recognition Bill after lengthy but very constructive Committee Stage and Report Stage debates, to which many colleagues contributed. I highlight the importance of the Government's introducing the Bill in the Seanad. In fact, the Government put forward some significant amendments on foot of the debates which took place here. I refer, in particular, to the amendment which will ensure the legislation is reviewed two years after its enactment. It is clear that any changes identified during that review will be made. The Bill is progressive and it is long overdue, and we can be pleased that the Seanad had quite an impact on it.
I welcome the announcement by the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government, Deputy Alan Kelly, in respect of a €300 million housing investment programme which will be jointly supported by the European Investment Bank and the Housing Finance Agency. I am sure Senator Aideeb Hayden will have more to say on this matter. This is the first ever support provided in respect of housing in Ireland by the European Investment Bank. This is an extremely welcome and major investment which will facilitate the construction of an additional 2,000 social housing units in the next three years.
I express my deep concern and alarm at the fact that two prison officers were seriously injured yesterday when accompanying a prisoner - apparently he is a diabetic - to hospital. There are serious questions to be asked in respect of this matter. How did the criminal in question, who escaped and who some years ago was serving 22 life sentences in England before absconding, arrive in Ireland in the first instance? Where did he get the knife he used in his escape? Did he bring it with him from the prison? If the answer is in the affirmative, then serious questions arise. How is it that Irish taxpayers are paying for this man to be imprisoned in this jurisdiction? I would be quite happy if he were returned to Britain serve his life sentences at Her Majesty's pleasure. Why was an armed garda not tasked with accompanying this very dangerous prisoner to hospital? Two prisoner officers were obliged to undergo surgery after he attacked them and another was seriously traumatised. What would be the position if a member of staff at the hospital had been badly injured? That could easily have happened. There are major questions to be asked about how this particular prisoner managed to escape and why no armed protection was provided for the prison officers who accompanied him to hospital. I propose an amendment to the Order of Business that the Minister for Justice and Equality come before the House to make a statement on the matter.
For logistical reasons and because the prisoner is still at large, there are the operational difficulties in this regard, but she could make a statement to assuage the fears in this House and among the public. There is deep concern, not alone throughout Dublin but throughout the country, that such a dangerous criminal is at large.
It may not be facilitated in the other House, but I also ask the Leader whether the Assaults on Emergency Workers Bill 2012, which was geared towards protecting prison officers, firemen, etc., and which was introduced in the other House by Deputy Niall Collins, could be looked at again by the Government. The Bill included measures to protect prison officers, firemen and front-line service staff. It is an important issue. It is so urgent that the Minister should come in here today, even for 30 minutes, to make a statement on this incident.
There is no doubt that changes need to be made to put city centre land and zoned and serviced land in other towns and cities throughout the State to better use. I very much welcome the reference by the Minister for Finance, Deputy Michael Noonan, in his budget speech to zoned and serviced land. In fact, following that, he has launched a public consultation on the potential of taxation measures to encourage the development of zoned and serviced land. In that regard, interested parties are invited to submit their views on the potential of taxation. The measure is designed to encourage the development of land. People should be aware that the consultation will run for 12 weeks, from 16 February until 8 May, this year. We face much dereliction all over the place. In the interests of many sectors, particularly housing within cities, it needs to happen.
There was mention of the living city initiative. Those Senators who are from Dublin would know more about that than I would. If we are to provide for renewal and regeneration, a scheme, - similar to the wonderful scheme introduced by a previous Fianna Fáil-Labour Party Government, which enjoyed cross-party support - with proper rationale and for a limited period, and not left open-ended, would be put to proper use by those who own zoned and serviced land. The sooner that is tackled, the better. Primarily, I want to advertise the fact that there is a public consultation period and that interested parties should avail of it. I hope that, as a result of it, a good scheme will evolve.
I support Senator Denis O'Donovan's amendment to the Order of Business. It is essential that the Minister come to the House. I do not think she has said anything about it - certainly, there is nothing that I can find on the record. The prisoner concerned arrived in this country in 2012 after escaping from prison across the water in England, where he was serving 22 life sentences. We have been left with him. The Government has not protected the public from him. There is a lack of resources in the Irish Prison Service and the Garda, and the Government has let this man free and loose on the people of Ireland. That is what has happened and the people are angry about it. On that basis, I support Senator Denis O'Donovan's amendment. This is a serious public order issue. It is a serious issue which affects the health, safety and welfare of the people of Ireland. This man is on the loose and the Government has put him on the loose. The Minister should tell us what she is doing to get him back into jail and back across the water where he belongs in the worse jail in England.
Like my colleague, Senator Ivana Bacik, I welcome the announcement of the availability of €300 million, co-funded by the European Investment Bank and the Housing Finance Agency, to the voluntary housing sector for the delivery of approximately 2,000 additional units. We all will be aware of the difficult situation we are in, with almost 90,000 households on the housing waiting list. It is something the Government inherited. I am not trying to say it was entirely the previous Government's problem; of course, it was not. We faced a major international financial crisis. We are turning the corner on that crisis and it is good to see - particularly for the voluntary housing association sector, which has had difficulty in accessing finance - that it will be an important pillar in the social housing strategy. The voluntary housing association sector, notably organisations such as Clúid, which was involved in this announcement today, is active in the local community. My colleague, Senator Paul Coghlan, would be happy to know that this announcement was made in Killarney Court which is in Dublin but named after his town of origin. It is good news and I believe it will be welcomed by both sides of the House. It is one step on the way towards the recovery of social housing in this country.
Yesterday, I raised the issue of the assault on the integrity and sovereignty of this country by a major tobacco company. The company has now been joined, believe it or not, by IBEC and the US Chamber of Commerce in threatening the Government of this country on legislation that passed through this House which mandates plain packaging for cigarettes. I am merely putting down another marker that I hope this will stiffen the Government's resolve. To use American parlance directed at the US Chamber of Commerce and IBEC, "Butt out, guys." It is the right of the Parliament of this country to pass legislation that we believe is in the best interests of the health of the nation, and to suggest there will be some loss of tax revenue as a result completely ignores the significant amounts spent on the health service as a consequence of smokers suffering and, sadly, dying of lung cancer. I am keeping it on the agenda. I hope the Leader will continue to convey the stiff resolve of this House, as reflected last year in the passage of the Bill, to ensure that the Bill goes through the lower House.
I also propose an amendment to the Order of Business: that the Minister for Children and Youth Affairs, Deputy James Reilly, come before the House to explain the Government's policy on child care costs. Yesterday, we heard from over 2,000 volunteers and others employed on miserly wages in the child care sector from all parts, including my part, of the country. I declare an interest in that I am chairperson in a voluntary capacity of the County Leitrim Childcare Committee and I am, in a sense, at the coalface of what is going on in child care in my county. I do not profess to be an expert in it, but I know that what they were out there complaining about yesterday is a valid and legitimate cause. It is extraordinary that people who have gone through the education system and attained qualifications up to third level are being paid €10 an hour, which is just above the minimum wage. I thank the Cathaoirleach for his indulgence. There is a desperate need for increased investment in child care in this country. We spend approximately 0.2% of GDP on this area, when the OECD average is 0.7%. That figure applies right across European countries, although the spend of some of those countries is much higher than that. We also have the highest child care costs, with the United States, which is an unenviable position for this country to be in. The child care costs imposed on hard-pressed parents in this country are 40% higher than average. Many such parents have had to leave the workforce because they cannot afford child care, which is also not in the best interests of society in general, apart altogether from the economy. For that and other reasons, it is vital that the Minister come before the House today to outline what the Government will do in response to the legitimate issues that were raised by the rally yesterday.
I agree with my colleague, Senator Paschal Mooney, about IBEC and the US Chamber of Commerce. My message to IBEC is clear. We are spending €260 million a week on health care. That budget will continue to increase because of the requirement for us to deal with the issues that arise as a result of people smoking. If they want to increase taxation, let them come out and state that they are in agreement with the raising of taxation on the business sector to pay for our abandonment of the plain packaging policy for cigarettes. We have taken the correct decision on this, and if we must face court challenges on it, let us do so. IBEC should not be putting out a view that is not in the best interests of Irish people.
I refer to the issue of taxation on land which is lying idle and which has infrastructure. It is fine to talk about taxation, but one of our biggest current problems in the housing market is the lack of finance for the building sector. There is a significant problem.
I had experience of it when acting for someone. We looked to the banks for finance, but they told us that they were unprepared to entertain anything involving the building industry. We can apply all of the taxation we like on land that is lying idle, but until finance is made available to the industry to start the process of building in order that we might meet our housing targets each year, we will go nowhere. We should start to examine this issue and hold a debate on determining the best way forward. We will address social housing, but we must also consider how to finance the building of houses in the private sector.
I support the call for a debate on child care and will gladly second the amendment to the Order of Business if it has not already been seconded. Yesterday, there was a protest on the matter outside Leinster House. A number of issues are at play. Child care provision is a major issue for many families and the lack of State-provided child care services means that a large number of low-paid people are not getting the support they need, presenting a barrier to many women returning to the labour market. According to the report of the Think-tank for Action on Social Change, TASC, that was published on Monday, 30% of a family's income is spent on child care. That is a large amount of disposable income. It is becoming a major issue and is one of the reasons for income and economic inequality in the State, given the fact that we do not invest in public services or child care. It was not that long ago that the Tánaiste and Minister for Social Protection stated that she would hold off on cutting the income disregard for the one-parent family allowance until there had been proper investment in community child care. The cuts went ahead, but the investment in child care did not. Many people working in the child care sector are in receipt of low pay. In the Leader's city of Waterford, people who were working full time at a child care centre for €250 per week were asked to take a 5% pay cut because of cutbacks. This is the reality for many low-paid workers in the sector. They do the courses, many have degrees and they take up jobs to provide a good and necessary service, but they are on low pay. A range of issues need to be considered.
I wish to raise some good news for the west, particularly rural Ireland. This week, the Minister for Health, Deputy Leo Varadkar, announced a €5.4 million increase in the national ambulance service's budget to help address service gaps in the area. Provision has been made for 50 paramedic posts in the west, some of whom will be used to staff ambulance stations at Tuam and Mulranny, while others will assist in the move from on-call to on-duty rostering. The Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Jan O'Sullivan, announced new arrangements to support rural schools, including some smaller schools in County Galway, via better teacher retention thresholds. Both announcements are positive news for rural Ireland. As our economy improves, it is imperative that serious consideration be given to the value of developing rural communities.
I did not expect to be called so quickly. I support the argument on rural development presented at the tail end of Senator Hildegarde Naughton's contribution. We are in the latter part of the Government's term of office and cannot expect miracles at this late stage, but the concept of rural and regional affairs is worthy of more detailed consideration. Some time ago, I suggested to the Leader that we try to hold a debate on regional Ireland from the perspective of industry, planning and housing. The future of rural Ireland would also form part of the debate.
The proposed development of social housing was mentioned. I welcome it and spoke on the subject last week. It is essential that we have a well devised and well crafted plan for social housing. It is also important that the House hold the debate on housing policy for which a number of us asked last week. While every additional social housing unit is not just necessary but welcome, we must be careful about the design, style and concept of social housing. We do not want to repeat some of the mistakes made in the 1960s and 1970s when our approach to social housing caused a great deal of social difficulty, including the unfortunate near ghettoisation of certain communities. The investment announced for social housing must be welcomed, but we need to debate and make suggestions on how to proceed with a social housing plan for our people. In conjunction with the Minister for the Environment, Community and Local Government, the Leader might attempt to arrange a debate at their earliest convenience.
I join colleagues in welcoming yesterday's positive announcement by the Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Jan O'Sullivan, on assisting smaller primary schools throughout the country. It means a great deal to the parents and students of those schools, which saw themselves as being under threat in recent times. In my area, St. Teresa's primary school in Killure near Ballinasloe will remain a two-teacher school for the 2015-16 school year. The school at Laurencetown, Ballinasloe, will remain a three-teacher school. I also welcome the decision to change the threshold to 15 pupils for schools that are more than 5 km from a school of similar patronage. This will help the Church of Ireland school at Aughrim, Ballinasloe, and is good news for everyone involved. This proves that the Government is listening to Oireachtas Members who have referred to the need to ensure the fabric of life in rural Ireland is maintained. The recent appointment of a Minister of State with responsibility for rejuvenating rural development is to be welcomed. I join Senator Paul Bradford in calling for a full and frank debate on how to ensure that the quality of life in rural Ireland is enhanced in the years ahead.
I join other Senators, particularly Senator Paschal Mooney, regarding the plain packaging issue. There is no more appropriate day than Ash Wednesday on which to speak of the introduction of plain packaging. I agree with Senator Colm Burke's point about IBEC and the cost added by smoking-related illnesses to the €260 million per week that we spend on health care. It beggars belief and is deplorable that IBEC and the American Chamber of Commerce would support a global cigarette company in this way.
It is disgraceful.
I hope we will challenge the court actions head on and without fear.
These are only delaying tactics.
Yes. It is unsavoury and inappropriate, to say the least.
On a more minor issue, I was glad to read this morning that on-street chuggers - charity muggers, those people who collect for charities by using inventive measures, to put it mildly, to ask people on the street for direct debits - will be subject to new regulations under which they will be required to hold permits. Permits are required on the streets of Dublin for far less, including busking. Where a person is handing over banking details to someone on the street, it is appropriate that the transaction be regulated to some extent. Charities would welcome this, as would I, given the fact that I called for it approximately two years ago.
Senator Darragh O'Brien referred to the gambling control Bill. We will await the Minister's comments on same.
We were initially told that the Bill would be introduced last year, but I now understand it will not be published before the summer. I agree with the Senator that it was initially intended that the Betting (Amendment) Bill and the gambling control Bill would be run fairly closely together. Unfortunately, however, that is not the case. We will await the Minister's pronouncement on the matter when dealing with the Betting (Amendment) Bill later today. As regards the education (admission to schools) Bill, I will try to ascertain the current position and revert to the Senator.
Senators Ivana Bacik, Denis O'Donovan and Thomas Byrne extended good wishes to the prison officers who were seriously injured yesterday by a very dangerous person. As we know, that person had been convicted of many offences in the United Kingdom. I agree with Senator Denis O'Donovan that a thorough investigation should take place. My understanding is that it is an ongoing Garda operation and, consequently, it would not be appropriate for the Minister for Justice and Equality to attend the House to discuss the matter at this stage. What occurred yesterday highlights for us the work of the Irish Prison Service which goes unnoticed by many. Prison staff do tremendous work which is very dangerous. We should be grateful to the men and women concerned who work in difficult circumstances. I agree that quite a number of questions need to be answered, including why it was decided that no armed guard would accompany this dangerous man. Such questions will form part of the ongoing Garda investigation. It is to be hoped this man will be apprehended in the coming weeks. He has many sentences yet to serve in the United Kingdom, where he also escaped from a prison. That highlights the danger he poses. I agree that, if possible, the sentences should be served in the other jurisdiction.
Senator Paul Coghlan referred to proposed tax measures to encourage the use of zoned and serviced land and derelict sites. As he pointed out, there will be a public consultation process on this issue for the next 12 weeks. He also mentioned the living city initiative, which was discussed during the debate on the Finance Bill. At the time the Minister said he expected the initiative to be in place by February. They were awaiting the go-ahead from the European Union for the incentive and I hope that is still the position. The initiative would be of tremendous benefit in Dublin and other cities included in the scheme.
Senator Aideen Hayden welcomed the €300 million from the European Investment Bank and the Housing Finance Agency for the voluntary housing sector. The sector needed such an injection of cash which will go towards the cost of building 2,000 extra homes. It is good news for all concerned in the sector. Senator Paul Bradford also raised the question of housing. I have invited the Minister of State, Deputy Paudie Coffey, to attend the House to discuss the housing strategy. I hope that will happen in the next couple of weeks.
Senators Paschal Mooney and Catherine Noone referred to the perceived support of the tobacco industry by IBEC and the American Chamber of Commerce. It is Government policy that plain packaging will come into play. The Government is intent on not bowing to pressure from the American Chamber of Commerce, IBEC or anybody else. As was pointed out yesterday, this House voted unanimously in favour of the introduction of plain packaging of tobacco products. We will have legal threats from the sector, but the Government intends to proceed as planned.
Senators Paschal Mooney and David Cullinane raised the question of child care workers. There is definitely a need for greater investment in this sector. As I said yesterday, quite a number of professionals have spent three or four years in college, yet the pay scales are very low for such qualified individuals. I am sure that is one of the areas the Low Pay Commission will be investigating. We might be able to get the Minister for Children and Youth Affairs, Deputy James Reilly, to attend the House for a debate on the child care sector. Many Members would appreciate the opportunity to have such a discussion.
Senator Hildegarde Naughton referred to increased funding for the National Ambulance Service, particularly in the west. This will be welcomed by everyone living in a rural area. In addition, the Senator, with Senator Michael Mullins, sought support for small rural schools, an issue that has been raised in the House on many occasions. I am glad that the Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Jan O'Sullivan, has listened to these concerns and acted on suggestions made by many Senators and Members of the other House.
Senator Sean D. Bradford raised the question of rural and regional affairs. The Minister of State, Deputy Ann Phelan, has attended the House for a debate on the CEDRA report, but perhaps we might invite her back for a debate on rural and regional affairs. As there are many good news stories which need to be told, I will invite her back again.
Senator Catherine Noone mentioned regulations with regard to what are called charity muggers. The regulation of all such activities is necessary and will be welcomed by all concerned.
Senator Darragh O'Brien mentioned the education (admission to schools) Bill, the drafting of which is well advanced. A further provision for inclusion in the Bill was recently prepared for Cabinet approval. The Bill will be published by the end of the summer.
Senator Denis O'Donovan has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business: "That a debate with the Minister for Justice and Equality on the circumstances surrounding the escape of a prisoner from custody during a visit to Tallaght hospital be taken today." Is the amendment being pressed?
Amendment put:
The Seanad divided: Tá, 16; Níl, 24.
Tá
- Byrne, Thomas.
- Craughwell, Gerard P.
- Cullinane, David.
- Daly, Mark.
- Heffernan, James.
- Leyden, Terry.
- Mooney, Paschal.
- Mullen, Rónán.
- Ó Clochartaigh, Trevor.
- Ó Murchú, Labhrás.
- O'Brien, Darragh.
- O'Donovan, Denis.
- O'Sullivan, Ned.
- Quinn, Feargal.
- Reilly, Kathryn.
- Wilson, Diarmuid.
Níl
- Bacik, Ivana.
- Bradford, Paul.
- Brennan, Terry.
- Burke, Colm.
- Coghlan, Eamonn.
- Coghlan, Paul.
- Comiskey, Michael.
- Conway, Martin.
- Cummins, Maurice.
- D'Arcy, Jim.
- Gilroy, John.
- Hayden, Aideen.
- Healy Eames, Fidelma.
- Henry, Imelda.
- Kelly, John.
- Moloney, Marie.
- Mulcahy, Tony.
- Mullins, Michael.
- Naughton, Hildegarde.
- Noone, Catherine.
- O'Neill, Pat.
- van Turnhout, Jillian.
- Whelan, John.
- Zappone, Katherine.
Tellers: Tá, Senators Ned O'Sullivan and Diarmuid Wilson; Níl, Senators Paul Coghlan and Aideen Hayden.
Amendment declared lost.
Senator Paschal Mooney has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business, “That a debate with the Minister for Children and Youth Affairs on Government policy on child care costs be taken today.” Is the amendment being pressed?
I hope that, because of the importance of this issue, there will be support from both sides of the House.
Amendment put:
The Seanad divided: Tá, 18; Níl, 22.
Tá
- Bradford, Paul.
- Byrne, Thomas.
- Craughwell, Gerard P.
- Cullinane, David.
- Daly, Mark.
- Healy Eames, Fidelma.
- Heffernan, James.
- Leyden, Terry.
- Mooney, Paschal.
- Mullen, Rónán.
- Ó Clochartaigh, Trevor.
- Ó Murchú, Labhrás.
- O'Brien, Darragh.
- O'Donovan, Denis.
- O'Sullivan, Ned.
- Quinn, Feargal.
- Reilly, Kathryn.
- Wilson, Diarmuid.
Níl
- Bacik, Ivana.
- Brennan, Terry.
- Burke, Colm.
- Coghlan, Eamonn.
- Coghlan, Paul.
- Comiskey, Michael.
- Conway, Martin.
- Cummins, Maurice.
- D'Arcy, Jim.
- Gilroy, John.
- Hayden, Aideen.
- Henry, Imelda.
- Kelly, John.
- Moloney, Marie.
- Mulcahy, Tony.
- Mullins, Michael.
- Naughton, Hildegarde.
- Noone, Catherine.
- O'Neill, Pat.
- van Turnhout, Jillian.
- Whelan, John.
- Zappone, Katherine.
Tellers: Tá, Senators Ned O'Sullivan and Diarmuid Wilson; Níl, Senators Paul Coghlan and Aideen Hayden.
Amendment declared lost.
Question put: "That the Order of Business be agreed to."
The Seanad divided: Tá, 27; Níl, 12.
Tá
- Bacik, Ivana.
- Bradford, Paul.
- Brennan, Terry.
- Burke, Colm.
- Coghlan, Eamonn.
- Coghlan, Paul.
- Comiskey, Michael.
- Conway, Martin.
- Cummins, Maurice.
- D'Arcy, Jim.
- Gilroy, John.
- Hayden, Aideen.
- Heffernan, James.
- Henry, Imelda.
- Higgins, Lorraine.
- Kelly, John.
- Landy, Denis.
- Moloney, Marie.
- Mulcahy, Tony.
- Mullen, Rónán.
- Mullins, Michael.
- Naughton, Hildegarde.
- Noone, Catherine.
- O'Neill, Pat.
- Quinn, Feargal.
- van Turnhout, Jillian.
- Zappone, Katherine.
Níl
- Byrne, Thomas.
- Craughwell, Gerard P.
- Cullinane, David.
- Daly, Mark.
- Leyden, Terry.
- Mooney, Paschal.
- Ó Clochartaigh, Trevor.
- Ó Murchú, Labhrás.
- O'Brien, Darragh.
- O'Donovan, Denis.
- Reilly, Kathryn.
- Wilson, Diarmuid.
Tellers: Tá, Senators Paul Coghlan and Aideen Hayden; Níl, Senators Paschal Mooney and Diarmuid Wilson.
Question declared carried.
Sitting suspended at 1.10 p.m. and resumed at 1.15 p.m.