Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 5 Jul 1938

Vol. 72 No. 3

Committee on Finance. - Vote 19—Tariff Commission.

Mr. MacEntee

I move:—

Go ndeontar suim ná raghaidh thar £3,640 chun slánuithe na suime is gá chun íoctha an Mhuirir a thiocfaidh chun bheith iníoctha i rith na bliana dar críoch an 31adh lá de Mhárta, 1939, chun Tuarastail agus Costaisí Choimisiún na nDleacht (Uimh. 40 de 1926 agus Uimh. 31 de 1930), agus Choimisiún na Marcanna Earraí Ceannaíochta (Uimh. 48 de 1931).

That a sum not exceeding £3,640 be granted to complete the sum necessary to defray the Charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of March, 1939, for the Salaries and Expenses of the Tariff Commission (No. 40 of 1926 and No. 31 of 1930), and of the Merchandise Marks Commission (No. 48 of 1931).

Mr. Brennan

What is the function of the Tariff Commission at the present time? Can the Minister tell us what is the function of the Commission?

Mr. MacEntee

The Tariff Commission was established in pursuance of Section 2 of the Tariff Commission Act, 1926. Under it, the Minister may, if he thinks fit, refer to the Commission, for consideration and report, any application made to him by persons substantially representative of the persons engaged, or proposing to engage in the production of goods of any particular class or description for the imposition, modification, abolition or renewal of a Customs duty on the importation of such goods. It was, and still remains, the function of the Tariff Commission, to undertake these inquiries. In addition to that, the Commission officiates under Section 2 of the Merchandise Marks Act of 1931.

The function of the Commission, under that section, is to consider and report to the Executive Council on applications received by an Executive Minister, and referred by him to the Commission for Orders under the Act restricting the sale or exposure, and/or the importation of goods of particular classes of descriptions, unless such goods bear an indication of origin, and references to the Commission by the Executive Council on the question of the desirability of making such Orders in respect of particular goods. The Commission is at the moment investigating the question of whether it would be desirable to make, in respect of building materials and appliances, (a) an order prohibiting the sale or exposure for sale, of imported goods of that class or description unless such goods bear at the time of such sale or exposure an indication of origin; (b) an order prohibiting the importation of goods of the class unless such goods bear an indication of origin at the time of importation or (c) both such orders.

In addition to that of course, the Commission has been used from time to time to undertake a number of important investigations, notably into the question of marketing of fresh fruit and vegetables and other matters of that sort. The Chairman of the Commission is Chairman of the Dairy Disposals Board. The fact is that it has been found desirable to retain the Commission so that we might have a body of servants who might not be fully engaged in Departmental work, by which investigations of this sort would be undertaken from time to time.

Mr. Brennan

I am in entire agreement with the Minister in regard to the desirability of having such a body but I should like to know if their opinions have been sought in the case of all tariffs imposed on various articles by the present Government. We are definitely of the opinion that tariffs have been imposed by the present Government which ought never have been imposed. We should also like to know whether advice has been sought in regard to the various licences and quotas now in operation. If this is a body composed of experts, we should like to know if their advice is sought because it does not seem to us that any serious thought has been given to the tariffs imposed on various articles at the present time.

Mr. MacEntee

The position is that there has not been, if you like, a reference made to them in regard to most of the articles in respect to which tariffs have been granted. Some of these matters have, however, been referred to the Tariff Commission for their report and recommendation. The Deputy is aware of the fact that that has been the position for the last six years, that, in fact, it would not have been possible to have carried out the industrial policy of the Government if every tariff, largely of an experimental nature, had been referred to the Tariff Commission for recommendation and report. That was one of the main features of our policy which differentiated the Government from the Opposition. I am not going to discuss the relative merits of the respective procedures, but our predecessors, when they were in power, before they imposed a tariff, thought it well to refer the matter for investigation to the Tariff Commission. They thought that a good way of dealing with it. Other people may think it too slow and that it would get you nowhere, that it merely means that the industrial development of the nation is going, to progress at a snail's pace. Our policy has been that where Departmental examination shows that if a tariff is granted there is a possibility of establishing a successful industry here, we are prepared to grant that tariff, to see how it works. I say that that is the most practical policy if we are to get anywhere in this generation and that it has more to recommend it than any other.

Mr. Brennan

I do not agree with the Minister. In the Tariff Commission, we have a number of gentlemen who have made a practice of examining matters in detail and they should be at least brought into consultation by the Departmental chiefs whenever a tariff is being considered. Of course, it was evident, and I am rather relieved to know it, that they have not been responsible for very many of the tariffs imposed by the Government on articles coming into this country. While we may not refer every matter to them for detailed consideration, they at least ought to be brought into consultation by the Government. After all, they have a particular standing on this question of tariffs and their opinions ought to weigh very heavily. I do not at all agree that it would mean the slowing up of activities. The Minister may be quite right in his contention that the Departmental Committee could not submit every matter for detailed investigation, but the opinion of the members of this commission ought to be sought on these matters. I do not think it is any justification for the expenditure on this commission to come in here and say that we are using them on rare occasions.

Mr. MacEntee

Oh, no.

Mr. Brennan

The Minister said that certain matters had been referred to them.

Mr. MacEntee

I have not said "on rare occasions."

Mr. Brennan

In fact, the Minister gave me the impression that they were being used but that had they been used on many occasions, industrial activity would be slowed down to a snail's pace. I am reading into that that they are occasionally being used. I think their opinion should be sought on every matter that relates to tariffs.

Mr. MacEntee

I am afraid that would reduce the progress which has been made in industrial development to an infinitesimal rate. It is not true to say that these gentlemen's services are availed of only on rare occasions. As a matter of fact, some of the inquiries which they have conducted are of a very difficult and complicated nature. I can say that we are satisfied that the chairman of that commission taking into consideration his other duties — and this is true of the other members also — is carrying as much as any human being possibly could.

Mr. Brennan

I believe that.

Vote put and agreed to.