I have pleasure in moving that Deputy Daniel Morrissey be elected Leas-Cheann Comhairle. Deputy Morrissey has been a member of this House for 17 years and, during that period, for four years he held the position of Leas-Cheann Comhairle to the entire satisfaction of the members of the House; and I think, having regard to his experience, he is qualified to hold the position. I have pleasure in proposing him.
Election of Leas-Cheann Comhairle.
Some Deputy might formally second the motion.
I formally second the motion.
A Chinn Comhairle, I regret that we must oppose this motion. My objection to it can be stated, I think, in a few words. I think that so long as we have in the House experienced members who have a knowledge of Irish and who could, if required, conduct the business of the Chair through Irish, we ought not to elect one without Irish to the Chair.
With regard to the objection raised to Deputy Morrissey's nomination, I think it answers itself by virtue of the fact that the particular appointment in question was held with very distinct success by Deputy Dan Morrissey for a considerable number of years. He filled that position, and filled it to the satisfaction of every individual Deputy and every Party in this House, without exception. The fact that he was not proficient in the Irish language was never found to be a disability. I am prepared to admit that it would be desirable if the occupant of the Chair was an all-round proficient linguist. It could be argued that it would be highly desirable that the occupant of a Speaker's Chair in any Parliament would also have a knowledge of French.
If this objection is raised in the interests of the Irish language, and of furthering and fostering the Irish language, I would submit that it is raised without due consideration. If the Irish language is to be commercialised in this particular way, it should be commercialised from top to bottom: the point should not only be raised when it is a question of a big Opposition Party filling a vacancy that has been previously held by a member of that Party, but should also be raised when it is a question of filling a Government Ministry or of filling a post such as that of the Attorney-General. When it is only trotted out of the stable as a pretext, to place an obstacle in the way of the Opposition, or to defeat an Opposition nominee, and when it is not used when it is a case of filling Ministries or filling high Government offices, then— with all due respect—I, for one, doubt the sincerity behind the particular point raised.
If the Irish language is to be furthered in this country it can only be furthered by the help of all, and particularly with the goodwill of those who suffer under the disability of not being masters of the language. The fact that some are masters of the language and others are not is a question, in most cases, of a geographical accident of birth; and a premium should not be placed on such an accident nor should disabilities be placed on those who had the misfortune to be born elsewhere. This country had a very, very troubled history in the lifetime of everybody here, and perhaps the country would never have a Parliament of its own or have any such thing as compulsory Irish—and would still be under the rule of the British—if the best men in this country did not neglect their studies—including their Irish studies— in order to step into the gap of danger.
It may well be that you are placing a premium on the quitters by placing these penalties in the way of others. Unless such a rule applies all round— and this Parliament and this country is an outstanding example of the fact that it does not apply all round—I believe it is unjust to apply it in this particular case.
Sir, I wish to question the Taoiseach's sincerity in this opposition. It is nearly time that we faced realities in the matter of Irish, and particularly in the matter of the use of the Irish language in administrative posts, if we are going to do what is alleged we all want to do, that is, restore the Irish language as the natural, national language of the people of this country. The Taoiseach opposes Deputy Morrissey's appointment here on the grounds, as he alleges, that he has not a knowledge of Irish. It has already been pointed out that Deputy Morrissey presided over this Assembly for four years and gave complete satisfaction in regard to every aspect of the discharge of his duties.
The Taoiseach is concerned with a knowledge of Irish in the case of people who preside over our Parliamentary discussions. I wonder how can the Taoiseach face this House here and oppose this appointment on the grounds of Irish when we consider what happened when it was proposed —when the new Seanad was set up— to place as the Cathaoirleach of the Seanad a man who was entirely non-Party, who had an incomparable knowledge of the Irish language and who as far as the language movement itself was concerned, was a monumental and institutional figure in the eyes of the whole country. It was boasted particularly by the Government Party that the Seanad was going to be a non-Party institution. His nomination was opposed, and a Party person was put into the Chair in the Seanad, who has not a competent knowledge of Irish, who is not competent to carry out business in Irish that arises from time to time.
I hold that he has.
I would ask Deputies who hold that, to consult members of their own Party who were interested in the language and who were in the Seanad at that particular time. I would ask members of the Fianna Fáil Party to consult the records of the Seanad and see to what extent, when points of Order were made in Irish in the Seanad, the present Chairman was able to understand what they were about.
I do not think that criticism of the Cathaoirleach of the Seanad should be made in this House.
I am criticising the Party opposite, led by the Taoiseach, and I am criticising the actions of that Party in relation to the appointment of the Cathaoirleach of the Seanad—and in relation to their opposition to the appointment that is being proposed here now. If Irish is going to be restored either as the spoken language of this country or if it is going to get a natural or reasonable position in the administration of this country, something else should be done. We cannot do it by any Party in this State acting in the way in which the Fianna Fáil Party acted in relation to the Seanad appointment on one occasion and in relation to this appointment now.
I would like to question the Taoiseach on what he has done, or what his Ministers have done, to see that in those parts of the country where Irish is the natural language Irish is being restored in any way to its proper position in the administrative work of the country. In March, 1929, acting as Minister for Local Government and Public Health, I considered what could be done in four counties—in Donegal, Galway, Kerry and, I think, Cork—to see that Irish was introduced, through the local bodies there and that in their relations with the Department of Local Government and Public Health Irish was introduced as a language of communication between the Department and those bodies. After fully reviewing the matter I decided to take Donegal and Galway, and I addressed a communication to the county councils and to the boards of health in those two counties, suggesting that, from the beginning of 1935, all official communications between those bodies and the Department of Local Government and Public Health should be through the Irish language. The matter was discussed by the various bodies.
Some members of the Galway County Council, including one who is now a member of the Fianna Fáil Party, thought the Minister for Local Government at that time was going too slow. He proposed that, as 1932 was the 15th centenary of the coming of St. Patrick to Ireland, it would be an appropriate date for the Galway County Council to begin doing what the Minister for Local Government at that time suggested. By the casting vote of the chairman of the council, who subsequently became a member of the Fianna Fáil Party and sat in this House, the Galway County Council decided that the Minister for Local Government at that time was going too slow in the matter, and that from the beginning of 1932, the 15th centenary of the coming of St. Patrick to Ireland, the Galway County Council should do what the Minister for Local Government at that time was suggesting—conduct all their business through the medium of Irish.
Seven years have passed since 1932, and four years have passed since 1935, the date which I considered reasonable. During that period, a Fianna Fáil Government has been in power. The Minister for Local Government during that period is the person whom the Taoiseach, on the last occasion on which he opposed Deputy Morrissey's nomination for the Vice-Chair, was put up to speak against the nomination. But not a single tap has been done to get either of the two premier public bodies in Donegal or Galway to see that their correspondence with the Local Government Department was carried out through the medium of Irish. In the light of the utter neglect to see that, where it was possible, the Irish language was used for administrative purposes, the action of the Taoiseach here to-day is utterly impossible to understand. The only interpretation to be put upon it is that the action has been taken for Party purposes, just like the action that was taken in connection with the election of Chairman of the Seanad.
Again, the Minister for Local Government has been for the last seven years in charge of the Department responsible for the administration of the Gaeltacht Order. How many public appointments have been made in the Gaeltacht, subject to the Gaeltacht Order, during the last seven years in which the persons appointed subject to the conditions of the Gaeltacht Order have satisfied the conditions of the Gaeltacht Order, that they are able to discharge all their duties through the medium of the Irish language; how many cases have there been where persons have been allowed to evade and who have not complied with the Order as to the conditions for appointments in these districts?
There is too much work to be done if the Irish language is going to be saved, if the Irish language is even going to be used to any reasonable extent in public affairs, by those who have the language. I charge the present Ministry with utterly neglecting both their duties and their opportunities as to what can be done and should be done and must be done if the Irish language is to be saved. I charge them with neglecting their opportunities and their responsibility; and I charge them, in opposing this motion here to-day, with simply carrying on a bluff and a sham; simply degrading the position of the Irish language in the eyes of the country as a whole, and making it impossible for people to concentrate in a complete and fully co-operative way on the work which is absolutely necessary if the Irish language is to be saved.
The Taoiseach has given reasons why, in the opinion of the Government, it is not possible for them to support this motion. I want, however, on behalf of this Party, to say that our opposition to the motion is based on entirely different grounds, but it is unnecessary and, perhaps, not desirable that these grounds should be entered into in detail at this stage. I, therefore, want to emphasise that our opposition to the motion is not based on the grounds indicated by the Taoiseach and, at the same time, to say that we are opposed to this motion.
Why?
Question put.
The Dáil divided: Tá, 28; Níl, 60.
Tá
- Belton, Patrick.
- Brasier, Brooke.
- Broderick, William J.
- Browne, Patrick.
- Burke, Patrick.
- Burke, Thomas.
- Byrne, Alfred (Junior).
- Coburn, James.
- Coogan, Patrick.
- Cosgrave, William T.
- Doyle, Peadar S.
- Fitzgerald-Kenney, James.
- Giles, Patrick.
- Gorey, Denis J.
- Hughes, James.
- Keating, John.
- Lynch, Finian.
- MacEoin, Seán.
- McGovern, Patrick.
- McMenamin, Daniel.
- Mulcahy, Richard.
- Nally, Martin.
- O'Higgins, Thomas F.
- O'Neill, Eamonn.
- O'Sullivan, John M.
- Redmond, Bridget M.
- Reidy, James.
- Ryan, Jeremiah.
Níl
- Aiken, Frank.
- Allen, Denis.
- Bartley, Gerald.
- Beegan, Patrick.
- Boland, Gerald.
- Breathnach, Cormac.
- Briscoe, Robert.
- Buckley, Seán.
- Carty, Frank.
- Corish, Richard.
- Corry, Martin J.
- Crowley, Tadhg.
- Derrig, Thomas.
- De Valera, Eamon.
- Everett, James.
- Flinn, Hugo V.
- Flynn, Stephen.
- Fogarty, Andrew.
- Friel, John.
- Fuller, Stephen.
- Gorry, Patrick J.
- Munnelly, John.
- Norton, William.
- O Briain, Donnchadh.
- O'Grady, Seán.
- O'Loghlen, Peter J.
- O'Reilly, Matthew.
- O'Rourke, Daniel.
- O'Sullivan, Ted.
- Pattison, James P.
- Harris, Thomas.
- Hickey, James.
- Hogan, Daniel.
- Humphreys, Francis.
- Hurley, Jeremiah.
- Kelly, James P.
- Kelly, Thomas.
- Kennedy, Michael J.
- Kissane, Eamon.
- Lemass, Seán F.
- Little, Patrick J.
- Loughman, Francis.
- Lynch, James B.
- McDevitt, Henry A.
- McEllistrim, Thomas.
- MacEntee, Seán.
- Maguire, Ben.
- Meaney, Cornelius.
- Moore, Séamus.
- Morrissey, Michael.
- Mullen, Thomas.
- Rice, Brigid M.
- Ryan, James.
- Ryan, Martin.
- Ryan, Robert.
- Sheridan, Michael.
- Traynor, Oscar.
- Victory, James.
- Walsh, Laurence J.
- Ward, Conn.
Tellers Tá: Deputies Doyle and Nally; Níl: Deputies Little and Smith.
Motion declared lost.