Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 26 Mar 1942

Vol. 86 No. 3

Committee on Finance. - Vote 54—Gaeltacht Services.

Mr. Little

I move:—

Go ndeontar suim ná raghaidh thar £24,958 chun slánuithe na suime is gá chun íoctha an Mhuirir a thiocfaidh chun bheith iníoctha i rith na bliana dar críoch an 31adh lá de Mhárta, 1943, chun Tuarastail agus Costaisí i dtaobh Seirbhísí na Gaeltachta, ar a n-áirmhtear Deontaisí um Thógáil tithe.

That a sum not exceeding £24,958 be granted to complete the sum necessary to defray the Charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending the 31st day of March, 1943, for Salaries and Expenses in connection with Gaeltacht Services, including Housing Grants.

Rúnaí Páirliminte don Aire Tailte (Seán Ó Gráda)

Tá laghdú £28,510 ar an meastachán so i gcompráid le meastachán na bliana roimhe seo. Chífear, ámhthach, go mbaineann méadú £775 le taobh an chaiteachais de, agus gurab é an méadú £29,285 a meastar do Leithreasaí-i-gCabhair fé ndear laghdú bheith ar an méid glan a bhéas ag teastáil d'obair na bliana so rómhainn.

Is féidir caiteachas na bliana do roinnt idir na cúig seirbhísí seo leanas —an Ceann-Oifig, na Tionnscail Tuaithe agus an Taisc-Ionad, na Tionnscail Mara, Seirbhísí Ilghnéitheacha agus Teach-Sholáthar. Sa Cheann-Oifig tá méadú £676 ar an gcaiteachas, ach ní miste a thabhairt fé ndeara go mbaineann tuairim is £5,770 den chaiteachas le fuirinn atá tugtha ar iasacht do Rannaí eile Stáit, méid is móide £1,270 ar a gcóir i gheadh don rud chéanna anuraidh.

I geás na dTionnscal Tuaithe agus an Taise-Ionaid tá méadú £12,149; agus i gcás na dTionnscal Mara tá méadú £7,162. Tá laghdú £80 ar an méid a cóirítear do Sheirbhísí Ilghnéitheacha agus tá laghdú £19,132 ar an gcóiriú do Theach-Sholáthar.

Ag tagairt don mheastachán ina mhír agus ina mhír, níl aon rud le rá agam i dtaobh na Mírcheann A go C ach an rud adubhart cheana maidir leis an méid den bhfuirinn atá ar iasacht fé láthair ag Rannaí eile Stáit. Tuigfear gur laghduíodh go mór an fhuireann atá ag obair sa bhFó-Roinn, d'fhonn fuireann do chur ar fáil do sheirbhísí tábhachtacha eile a bhaineas leis an aimsir éigeandála so, ach tá orainn costas tuarastail na fóirne sin d'íoc ón Vóta so.

Tá méadú £11,057 ar na Mírchinn D (1) go D (9). Tá £16,500 breise á chóiriú againn fé D (6). Baineann sé sin le ceannach abhar do na tionnscail fighteacháin. Más féidir na habhair sin d'fháil, ceaptar go mbeidh an cóiriú méaduithe sin ag teastáil ag féachaint don árdú atá tagaithe ar phraghas na n-abhar. Táimíd ag déanamh gach is féidir chun na habhair seo agus abhair don Tionnscal Bréagán do chur ar fáil, agus tá áthas orm a rá gur éirigh go maith linn go dtí seo obair do choimeád leis na hoibritheoirí ins na tionnscail sin, gidh nach gan duadh a deineadh é.

Tá méadú £1,180 ar a gcóirítear fé Mhírcheann D (8) don Tionnscal Bréagán. Baineann an chuid is mó den mhéadú sin le costaisí breise maidir le hiomchar agus abhair phacála. Tá laghdú £1,100 ar an méid atáimíd ag cóiriú fé Mhírcheann D (5), toisc nach foláir dúinn fé láthair déanamh chomh maith agus is féidir é leis na meaisíní atá againn cheana.

Tá laghdú £5,100 ar an gcóiriú fé D (9) don Tionnscal Sníomhacháin. Ag féachaint don deacracht a bhaineas le maisínreadh agus abhair tógála d'fháil fé láthair, socruíodh nár mhiste féachaint chuige ar dtúis go mbéadh áis chun comhachta ar fáil sara raghfaí amach ar an meaisínreadh sníomhadóireachta do cheannach. Maidir le gléas comhachta, tá socruithe déanta, nó geall le bheith déanta, agus beifear ag cur chun na hoibre tógála agus deisiucháin gan ró-mhoill. Sé fé ndear laghdú bheith ar an gcóiriú i mbliana ná gur socruíodh ar scéim chiorruithe maidir le meaisínreadh agus oibreacha tógála, d'fhonn gurbh fhusa-de abhair d'fháil agus gur chinnte-dhe go mbeifí in ann scéim ionoibrithe do bhunú.

Tá méadú £4,542 ar an gcóiriú fé Mhírcheann E (3) do na Tionnscail Ceilpe agus Feamna. Sé fé ndear sin ná go bhfuilimíd ag déanamh soláthair i mbliana chun 1,000 tonna Ceilpe agus 3,500 tonna Feamna do cheannach, in ionad 800 tonna Ceilpe agus 2,000 tonna Feamna anuraidh, agus go mbeifear ag tabhairt praghsanna níos fearr ar an gCeilp agus ar an bhFeamain. Beidh £1 an tonna de bhreis ar phraghas na Ceilpe i mbliana, agus táthar ag súil le barra mhór dá réir. Tá an Cheilp á ceannach le haghaidh leasuithe talmhan agus ceannófar pé méid di a déanfar. Tá cúrsaí an Tionnscail Feamna ag dul chun cinn go maith freisin, agus leis na praghsanna méaduithe beidh roinnt mhaith airgid ag dul do na bailitheoirí.

Tá méadú £2,550 ar an gcóiriú fé E (4) don Tionnscal Cairrgíne. Sé fé ndear sin ná glaodhach níos fearr bheith ar an gcairrgín bidh agus gur mó a bhfad an praghas a bhéas le n-íoc as an gcairrgín agus as abhair pacála. Tuigfear ná baineann an cóiriú atá sa Mheastachán ach leis an gcairrgín bidh atá fé riaradh na Roinne, agus gur lucht gnótha a cheannuigheann an chairrgín a húsáidtear chun cúrsaí eile tráchtála. Is féidir a rá go bhfuil margadh sár-mhaith le fáil fé láthair do gach cairrgín a bailightear agus a sábháltar i gceart.

Tá méadú £1,092 ar an gcóiriú fés na Mírchinn F (1) go F (3) don Taisc-Ionad. Baineann an méadú sin ar fad nach mór leis an gcostas bhreise nárbh fholáir a chóiriú do chúrsaí iomchair agus abhar pacála.

Níl aon rud le rá agam maidir leis an gcóiriú atá á dhéanamh fé Mhírcheann G do Sheirbhísí Ilghnéitheacha ach a rá ná fuil sna méideanna ar leith ach comharthaí.

Tá laghdú £19,132 ar an gcóiriú fé na Mírchinn H (1) go H (4) do Theach-Sholáthar. Toisc chomh deacair is tá sé anois abhair tógála d'fháil, ní féidir linn bheith ag brath air go dtiocfaidh níos mó ná £16,000 le bheith iníoctha i mbliana fé Achtanna na dTithe (Gaeltacht). Níl annsin ach rud éigin níos lugha ná a leath dár cóirigheadh anuraidh ach theasbáin obair na bliana go raibh an cóiriú a deineadh ró-mhór ar fad. De bharr an laghduithe sin, táimíd ag cóiriú do laghdú ar an bhfuirinn suirbhéireachta agus maoirseachta, agus do laghdú dá réir ar an gcostas taisdil. Níl sa chóiriú fé H (4) ach comhartha, toisc gan aon tairgsint do bheith fé bhráid fé láthair chun tithe nua do chur ar fáil do Mhúinteoirí sa bhFíor-Ghaeltacht.

Maidir leis an airgead a meastar a baileofar i mbliana tá méadú £21,100 ar an gcóiriú fé Mhírcheann I (1) do fháltaisí ó dhíolacháin na dTionnscal Tuaithe. Meastar go mbeidh na díolacháin i mbliana tuairim is £176,000 i gcompráid le £155,000 don bhliain roimhe. Tá £47,270 á soláthar i gcóir pá oibre i mbliana i gcompráid le £40,700 anuraidh. Seo leanas an pá oibre a híocadh le roinnt bhlian anuas:—

£9,802 sa bhliain 1935-36,

£12,768 sa bhliain 1936-37,

£14,680 sa bhliain 1937-38,

£18,766 sa bhliain 1938-39,

£26,391 sa bhliain 1939-40,

£39,076 sa bhliain 1940-41, agus

£42,500 sa bhliain 1941-42.

Ní gá ach tagairt do na figiúirí sin chun a theasbáint cad é mar bhreis atá tagaithe ar obair na dtionnscal tuaithe seo. Tá súil agam go mbeimíd in ann leanúint di, ach ní foláir a thuigsint go bhfuil sé ag éirighe ana-dheacair abhair dhéantóireachta d'fháil do na tionnscail seo.

Tá méadú £5,540 ar na fáltaisí a meastar a gheobhfar fé Mhírcheann I (2) ós na Tionnscail Ceilpe agus Feamna. Tá margaí cinnte fachta againn don Cheilp agus don bhFeamain agus tabharfar fé ndeara go bhfuilimíd ag súil go slánochaidh na fáltaisí airgid uatha an méid a bhéas á chaitheamh ortha fé Mhírcheann E (3).

Tá méadú £2,600 ar na fáltaisí a meastar a gheobhfar fé Mhírcheann I (3) ó dhíolacháin na cairrgíne. Ní miste dhom a rá arís ná baineann na díolacháin sin ach leis an geairrgín a dheineann an Roinn a phiocadh agus a phacáil chun í dhíol mar chairrgín a bhéadh oiriúnach do chúrsaí bidh. Tabharfar fé ndeara go bhfuilimíd ag súil go slánochaidh na fáltaisí airgid ón Chairrgín an méid a bhéas á chaitheamh uirthi fé Mhírcheann E (4).

Taobh amuigh de chúrsaí Teachsholáthair níor tháinig aon lagú ar na seirbhísí atá fé chúram na Fó-Roinne. Ní foláir dúinn bheith go fíor-bhuidheach dá bharr sin, ag féachaint dos na deacrachtaí a bhaineas le gach sórt gnótha i saoghal an lae indiú.

Ní dóigh liom gur gá dhom a thuille a rá fén Meastachán so.

Mr. McMenamin

There are only two heads under this Vote on which I wish to say anything. On one of them I have not very much to say. The first and most important one, as far as the volume of work of the Department is concerned, is that of the Gaeltacht tweeds. The Parliamentary Secretary has been kind enough to give us the figures in this matter, and they are certainly illuminating. In 1935-36, £9,802 was paid in wages; in 1936-37, £12,768; in 1937-38, £14,680; in 1938-39, £18,766; in 1939-40, £26,391; in 1940-41, £39,076; and in 1941-42, £42,500.

I happened to make a speech here a few years ago, having convinced myself, by what I saw and what I knew, that this industry was being killed throughout the country and throughout my own county, owing to the quality of the goods being put on the market. The roof of this building almost fell in when I made that speech. I said then what I repeat to-day—and what I will repeat again if necessity arises—that these are goods that depend on quality and quality only. I am glad to say that these figures vindicate what I then said. I am also proud to say that I am delighted with the quality of the stuff turned out. The Department may not be aware of it, but the work and style in that direction compare favourably with the very best work turned out by weavers throughout Donegal.

I was particularly struck by a display that was shown in the Industries window in St. Stephen's Green recently. My wife went down and saw it and was telling me that it belonged to a Mr. McNelis of Ardara. I looked at the display in the window, and then went inside. The lady in charge was a lady whom I had met before, but she did not know me. I was really charmed with the quality and design of the material. It was beautiful stuff. Its whole texture was beautiful. First, on account of the design, and also on account of the rich finish that you find only in good cloth. The Department has done a great service, in connection with this industry, in raising the standard of quality of the Gaeltacht tweeds. These tweeds are certainly now of a very high standard, and I hope that, by some means or other, the services of those in the Department who were responsible for this great improvement will be shown some appreciation. Probably there were only a couple of officers concerned, and perhaps they took a risk in making purchases. It is even possible that they risked their jobs, because people in Government Departments cannot do business in the same way as people in ordinary business life. Very often the officers at the head of a Department do not know how to do business, and if officers beneath them happen to strike a bargain which, in their view, was sound and good business at the time, they may get it across the knuckles if there should be a collapse after this war. In business matters, you must take the long view, and I must say that the officers concerned, whoever they were, have done very well, particularly as they are only civil servants and, by that very fact, were probably taking a risk, I should imagine, in striking out to make such a considerable provision.

Now, with regard to the question of supplies, the matter of imports is one that, I suppose, is bound to come up in this connection, and I suppose it has often been said that I am always censuring somebody or everybody, but I only censure where there is cause for it. Now, I have been pressing this matter of a spinning factory in Kilcar for four or five years, since it was first mooted, and I find that there is a paragraph here in the Parliamentary Secretary's statement in that connection. He says:—

"Having regard to the present difficulty in getting machinery and building materials it has been arranged that it would be desirable to secure first the power requirements before the final arrangements for the purchase of the spinning machinery was made."

Now, there is plenty of power in Donegal; there is an unlimited quantity of bog there, and turf. The Convoy Woollen Mills is a first-class industry, and its products are equal to those produced in any place in the world, and they have been using turf last winter. Yet, in this case we are waiting for power, although the bogs and the turf have been there for centuries. I suppose we have reached the stage now where, although we have the bogs and the turf, when it is wanted, we cannot get the machinery. We are only fiddling and tinkering with this matter here in these Estimates, and, if my memory is correct, that has been going on for the last four or five years. It would certainly be a tragedy, seeing the high standard of design and quality that these goods have reached during the last few years, if anything should happen now to retard the progress that has been made. The factory concerned is only a small one, and it should not be very difficult to provide what is necessary. In America, such a job as this, I suppose, would be started in the morning and finished the same night. Even in Derry, I have seen whole streets of houses growing up like mushrooms in a very short time. Yet here we are looking for fuel, and apparently we had to ponder for two or three years in connection with this matter of fuel in Donegal, and now, having slept on it for all those years, I suppose we cannot get the machinery. A brilliant piece of work! That is all I shall say about it.

Some six or seven years ago I asked the Parliamentary Secretary to abolish this cursed dole system that did so much, as has been proved, to demoralise the manhood of this country, and particularly those hardy warriors along the coast of this country who earn their livelihoods from the sea in different forms. I asked him to give them £5 a ton for kelp in order to make men of them morally and physically, and so that they would not have to run once a week, some seven, eight or ten miles, to a barrack to sign their names, some of them for sixpence a week. I am not quite sure when it was, but it must have been about six or seven years ago that I asked the Parliamentary Secretary to give these men £5 a ton for kelp, and to store it, and I think that I indicated to the House at the time that the day might come—and perhaps it is not far distant—when circumstances would arise when they would be glad to call upon this kelp for vital use as fertiliser for this country, and for other purposes. Of course, votes had to be got; the manly men, the fine peasantry, had to be destroyed for political purposes, and as a result you could put into a donkey cart all the kelp that was burned during those years in any particular district.

I think Deputies have learned something during the last week regarding the properties of kelp as a fertiliser. I knew, a prominent agriculturist in County Antrim to come to Burtonport some years ago, and to pay £12 and even £14 a ton for kelp to be used as a fertiliser in the production of flax. Having followed the progress of that man at agricultural shows, I found that he took first prize for flax. Whether that was due to the application of kelp as a fertiliser I do not know, but he did not go to Donegal to buy kelp, and pay the freight on it, without knowing what he was doing. He was a practical farmer. The example was good enough for me. It inspired a speech I made here five or six years ago, in the course of which I made certain suggestions to the Department. Assuming that £5 or £6 a ton had been paid for kelp since I previously spoke on this Vote, and if it had been kept and stored, even after paying interest, on the money as well as those who saved the crop, look at the happy position this country would be in to-day, now that we are thrown back on our own resources and the livelihood of our people depends on supplies of fertilisers being available for the production of crops.

About the same period I urged the Parliamentary Secretary to push other lines, including the sale of carrigeen for domestic and commercial use. I was amazed recently to read a report in a newspaper of a lecture in which a professor in University College. Cork or Dublin, dealt with the virtues and feeding qualities of seaweed for cattle, horses and pigs. I rubbed my eyes to make sure I was reading something that happened in 1942. I am not a professor, and I know nothing about scientinc research. This seaweed is collected off the rocks by youngsters and is used for feeding purposes, particularly to young cattle. When a small quantity of it is mixed with boiled turnips, such feeding results in a great improvement in the condition and the coats of animals. The kelp and carrageen industries were, more or less, allowed to die at a time when they might have enabled many people to earn money, or at least enjoy frugal comfort, and not be beggars from any Department. Now we are trying to get them back to the saving of kelp, and offering £6 a ton as an inducement.

Inquests never bring dead men back to life. I am drawing the Parliamentary Secretary's attention to these matters in order to show how the Department has missed opportunities entrusted to it. There is no use in waving the green flag or talking of preserving the Gaeltacht when the whole tendency of the Department seems to be towards killing the Gaeltacht. However, I hope the Department, owing to war circumstances, will now be able to do something for the Gaeltacht. The Gaeltacht cannot be resuscitated without leadership. That is why I am speaking very firmly about the present position. Anything I say is not said in a spirit of rancour or bitterness. I bear no rancour or bitterness when I know that people have the courage to do their jobs. If they are not fit to do so they should immediately tender their resignations to the Government, and God knows I have often thought that the Parliamentary Secretary should have done that.

Micheál Óg MacPháidín

Chidhim go bhfuil laghdú mór ar an Mheastacháin seo ón bhliain anuiridh agus is iongantach liom sin. Freastalann an Roinn seo—Scirbhísí na Gaedhealtachta—do na daoine is boichte sa tír—an seantreibh Ghaedhealach atá na gcomhnaidhe fá chladaigh an iarthair. Ar ndóigh, i mbhlian mar so thar bhliain ar bith eile, nuair atámuid istigh i lár an chogaidh níor chóir go laghdóchaidhe an Meastachán seo. Le ceart a dhéanamh, ba chóir é a mhéadú. 'Siad na figiuirí a bhí sa Mheastachán anuiridh £88,468 agus i mbliana, tá siad anuas go £59,958—triocha míle punt gairid. Cruthuigheann sin an neamhshuim atá ag an Rialtas i muinntir na Gaedhealtachta. Admhuighim go bhfuil an fó-Roinn ag déanamh obair mhaith thall 's i bhfus san Ghaeltacht acht ní thig linn a rádh go bhfuil an Ghaeltacht i gcoitcheann ag gnothachtál as obair na Roinne. Ní thig mórán a dhéanamh le Meastachán beag mar seo. Mar sin féin, níl na daoine ag fáil an buntáiste céadna as airgead na Roinne as gheibhthidhe as an airgead a chaitheadh sean-Bhórd na gCeanntar gCúmhang.

Níl an iascaireacht no obair na fairrge chomh mhaith as bhí faoi'n sean-Bhórd. Níl obair an talaimh san Ghaedhealtacht stiurtha chomh maith as bhí sé faoi'n Bord sin. Dá mbéadh an Bórd sin i dtreis anois, ní bhéadh an gháir dhearg againn fá ghanntanas síl, preátaí agus coirce atá anois ag teacht as gach ceann den Ghaeltacht.

Níl iongantas go bhfuil an Ghaeltacht ag dul in éag agus na mílte ag imtheacht as gach bhliain. Ní shílim go bhfuil an leigheas ceart againn go fóill ar an aicead atá ag bánú na Gaedhealtachta. B'fhéidir go gcuirfeadh an cogadh cor sa scéal. Má chuireadh stad leis an imirce 'un an Oileain Uir, tá imirce eile againn anois agus ní chun leas na Gaedhealtacht é. Acht is cruaidh an t-iománaidhe an t-ocras. Sé mo bharamhail féin dá mbéadh tuilleadh tionnscail beaga aca a chuideochadh leis an fheirmeoireacht chuirfidhe stad leis an imirce. Ní chuirfidh oibreacha fóirthine stad leis a choidhche.

Tá tionnscail amháin a fhóireas go h-an—mhaith do'n Ghaeltacht—sin tionnscail na h-olna. Tá an Roinn ag déanamh obair mhaith do'n tionnscail seo agus tionnscal na cniotála agus na mbréagán. Tá na céadta fir agus mná ag obair ionnta ó Dhún na nGall go Ciarraidhe ach ní leor sin.

Sé mo bharamhail nach bhfuilmid ag déanamh oiread do thionnscal na h-olna sa Ghaeltacht agus is féidir a dhéanamh. Tá na cnuic agus na sléibhte againn do na mílte caorach agus thig olann na gcaorach seo a dheisiú anois chomh maith le meríno no olann Austráil. Acht tá na mílte tonna di ag imtheacht as an tír gach bliain. Níl a dhith orrainn ach na muilte sníomhacháin, na tuirnóirí agus na figheadoirí le gach cineal éadaigh a dhéanamh.

Seo bun-adhbhar atá go fairsing sa bhaile againn agus ba chóir go ndéanfaidhe úsaid níos fearr de. Is maith an scéal go bhfuil an Roinn ag tógáil muilinn sníomhachain i dTír Chonaill. Tá an muileann seo faoi chaibideal le trí no ceathair de bhlianta acht tá sé teacht 'un tosaigh ar nós na seilide— go mall righin. Tá Bórd na nOibreach ag bogadh fá dheireadh. Beidh éileamh i gcomhnaidhe ar dhéantúis olna—báinín, cniotáil agus a leitheidí. Bhí an tionnscal seo dúthchasach san Gaedhcaltacht ariamh anall. Mhol an Piarsach é féin dúinn gur mhaith an rud leanamhaint dóibh in cibé ait a rabh bun ortha. Mhol sé iad a fheabhsú agus a leathnú amach agus cuidiú leis na daoine bochta seo a gcuid carraidhe a chur 'un margaidhe.

Tá Seirbhísí na Gaeltachta ag déanamh a ndichill an tionnscal seo a chur 'un cinn. Tá súil agam go n-éireochaidh go maith leo san bhliain atá amach rómhainn gidh doilear donn na néalta.

G. MacPhartholáin

Tá rud amháin ba mhaith liom a chur os cóir an Rúnaí Páirliminte—ní bhaineann sé díreach leis an Roinn—cás na muileann meilte —scéim atá á stiúrú ag an Roinn Talmhaidheachta. Tá fhios agam nach bhfuil cúram na ceiste sin ar Roinn an Rúnaí Páirliminte. Tá sé deacair do na feirmeoirí buntáiste a bhaint as an scéim sin ach dá mbeadh na muilinn seo scaipithe ar fud na Gaeltachta is mó an maitheas a dhéanfadh sé fá láthair do leas na Gaeltachta ná rud ar bith eile. Tá fhios agam go bhfuil feabhas mór curtha ar chúrsaí na cniotála. Thug an Teachta MacPháidín moladh don Roinn dá bharr sin ach is truagh liom nach ndearna an Teachta McMenamin an rud céanna—moladh a thabhairt nuair a bhí sé tuilte agus cáineadh nuair a bhí cúis le cáineadh. Tá moladh mór tuilte ag an Roinn mar gheall ar an airgead atá á scaipeadh i mease na gcailíní ins na scoileanna cniotála. Tá méadú air ó £9,000 go dtí os cionn £40,000.

Dubhairt an Teachta McMenamin go mba cheart don Roinn ceilp a cheannacht sna blianta roimh an gcogadh nuair nach raibh margadh ag an Roinn ie n-a aghaidh. Ní dóigh liom go mba cheart é sin a dhéanamh nuair nach raibh aon mhargadh ag an Roinn di. Tá fhios agam go ndearnadh cuid mhaith ceilpe san Iarthar do storáil isteach i gcathair na Gaillimhe agus gur lobh sí. Ba cheart don Teachta McMenamin tagairt don taobh sin don scéal. Tá an Roinn ag tabhairt luach maith ar an gceilp anois. Dá mbeadh an Roinn ag caitheamh airgid ar cheilp agus an cheilp ag lobhadh bheadh scéal eile ag lucht cáinte an Riaghaltais.

Tá ceist eile: Rinne mé tagairt di cheana, ceist na muilte meilte. Ní dóigh liom go bhfuil rud ar bith a dhéanfadh leas níos tábhachtaighe don Ghaeltacht ná an scéim sin. Tá ceann i gConamara, thiar i gCill Chiaráin, agus spreag sí na daoine le cruithneacht agus coirce a fhás thiar annsin. Tá áiteacha eile ar fud Conamara atá i ndon na rudaí sin a fhás níos fearr ná an ceanntar sin ach níl aon mhuileann ann. Ba mhaith liom-sa go mbeadh có-oibriú idir an Roinn seo agus an Roinn Talmhaidheachta, fhaid is a bhéas an cogadh ar siubhal, i dtreo is go mbainfear níos mó buntáistí as an scéim. Tá muileann i gConamara, muileann príobháideach, ach tá na daoine ag clamhsán faoi na táillí chaithfidh siad íoc sa muileann sin. Tá mé fhéin sánta dá mbeadh níos mó arbhair ag na daoine nach mbeadh a leath-oiread clamhsáin o na ceanntair san an t-am seo den bhliain. Molaim don Rúnaí Páirliminte, más féidir leis an scéim seo do chur chun cinn, go ndéanfaidh sé a dhícheall agus tá fhios agam go ndéanfaidh.

Mr. Hickey

The Parliamentary Secretary spoke about boilers. Is there not electrical power available for the factories?

Mr. O'Grady

No. Ní ceart don Teachta MacPháidín a rá go bhfuil laghdú ar an Meastachán. B'fhéidir go bhfuil ceart teicnice san abairt sin ach níl laghdú ins an méid a caithtear ins an nGhaeltacht. Tá méadú mór air. Sa bhlian 1934-35 do chaitheamar £75,654 ar oibreacha áirithe agus sa bhliain seo chughainn caithfear ar na hoibreacha céanna £169,295, sé sin níos mó ná a dhá oiread. Sin méadú mór, gan trácht ar laghdú. I dtaobh an rud a dubhairt an Teachta Mac Phártholáin mar gheall ar mhuilinn meilte, sin scéal atá fá chúram an Roinn Talmhaidheachta agus ní féidir linne aon rud a dhéanamh i dtaobh na ceiste sin ach é chur os cóir an Aire Talmhaidheachta.

Deputy McMenamin led the House to believe that we were unaware of the existence of turf in Donegal. We are well aware of the existence of turf in Donegal, but what the Deputy seems to have overlooked is that turf without machinery will not produce power. Unless you have boilers you cannot use turf for the production of power. That is the position. There is no use in purchasing machinery for this spinning mill without first having the wherewithal to produce the power. Arrangements have been made for the purchase of boilers. We are confident we will be able to get the necessary-machinery. We would be in a nice position if we found we could not got machinery.

Mr. McMenamin

Have you the machinery purchased?

Mr. O'Grady

No. We have arranged first of all to purchase the boilers and we have been negotiating for the purchase of the necessary machinery. Had we purchased the machinery first we might have been unable to get the boilers because it is extremely difficult to get boilers either in this country or elsewhere. Incidentally I wish to inform Deputy Hickey that we propose to use turf in these operations. Being the natural source of power in districts like Donegal, where bogs are plentiful, turf can be secured and there is no possibility of a shortage of supplies. Electricity would provide the power but it is far removed from Kilcar. As a glance at the map would show, Kilcar is very far from Ardnacrusha or the Pigeon House.

Mr. Hickey

That is what I wanted to know.

Mr. O'Grady

I do not know if Bundoran is connected, but until the time comes when we are able to harness the River Erne at Ballyshannon which, I hope, will be in the near future, I am afraid there is little hope of getting electrical power in Donegal. Meanwhile we cannot wait for that happy day, and will have to go ahead and endeavour to get this spinning mill going. For some time past we have been endeavouring to make the necessary arrangements. It is quite true, as one Deputy stated, that industrial concerns might in a far shorter time have been able to erect a spinning mill, but they might not be able to erect one overnight, as Deputy McMenamin seems to think the Americans could. I have no doubt that any of the senior members of my staff, if engaged in business outside, and operating their own money, would be free to make the necessary purchases in advance, but in Government Departments it is necessary to proceed cautiously. Deputy McMenamin and other Deputies might be very glad of the opportunity to criticise if we had purchased something in advance, and found later, owing to the war situation, that it would be necessary to get the wherewithal.

Mr. McMenamin

As far as this Department is concerned it was given an open cheque. It is not fair to make a statement of that kind.

Mr. O'Grady

I think the officers of the Department are to be congratulated on their foresight. It is easy at this stage for Deputy McMenamin to tell us about this war, but it was not so easy to do that in the Gaeltacht three or four years ago, when the officers of my Department had the foresight and the intelligence to anticipate a scarcity of supplies. The Deputy is now aware of what our plans were and that we took the necessary steps to enable us to provide work for many people in Deputy MacFadden's constituency and throughout the Gaeltacht generally. The result is that, far from being held up for want of supplies, our sales have increased enormously year by year. I have given the figures, and if Deputies have forgotten them, they can be seen by reference to the Official Debates. I think that was a creditable performance under the circumstances.

Even the smartest of men out to do business in similar lines throughout the country, who are not hampered and hamstrung by regulations, have been found wanting during these terrible times. Personally I can be proud of the operations of my Department. Adverse criticism has not been so bad this year as on previous occasions when we were told the stuff was rotten and was torn. That is not the way to improve conditions in the Gaeltacht. Deputy McMenamin admits that there has been a vast improvement since we had the tearing incident in the Dáil. I can assure the Deputy that as far as tweeds are concerned there could not be any improvement in the quality of the materials turned out in the Gaeltacht for the past four or five years. There will be no improvement for the next few years because improvement is impossible. The articles produced are so good, as I pointed out previously, that they could not be excelled by tweeds turned out in any place. Nobody can deny that. The quality is the same to-day as it was at the time of the tearing incident, some years ago, no better and no worse. Designs have been improved. We have expert designers who know their job and are doing well. As a result we could expand our business at the present time. We do not think it wise to do so or to increase sales when perhaps in six months we would be short of materials. We have to a certain extent rationed our customers since it was apparent that people who could not get goods elsewhere were coming to our Department. If we were willing to sell we could get cash in advance for the entire output of our factories for months. There are men prepared to agree to that, but we could not sell in that way, because it would be unfair to our customers, and we would be giving a monopoly to one or two firms. We have to treat everybody fairly. That is what we are endeavouring to do.

In conclusion I appeal now, as I appealed on previous occasions when this Vote was before the House, to Deputies to endeavour once and for all, after 20 years of home government, to remember that it is time for us in matters of national importance to forget politics. If anyone has a helpful suggestion to put forward, one that will add to the numbers that can be employed in the Gaeltacht anywhere, the officers of my Department will be glad to hear it. Deputies should not seek opportunities for captious criticism, of shortcomings. We welcome criticism but we like to receive suggestions as to how best to improve conditions and to help to secure greater results than have been obtained in the Gaeltacht. That cannot be done in a hurry. We are operating in very barren districts. As I pointed out on another occasion when I replied lo criticisms, we cannot go ahead with our work as people in commercial houses can. We are far removed from centres of distribution.

We have to send raw materials to the Gaeltacht, and to pay the carriage, and also to pay the carriage on the goods coming back. There are 101 other ways in which we are seriously handicapped as a result of our remoteness from centres of distribution. That is apparent to everybody, more especially to those concerned in industries that have been established in this State. It is only under extreme pressure that industrialists can be got to leave the environs of Dublin, Drogheda or other favourably situated sites, because businessmen realise that if an industry is situate in a central position it will mean a lowering of productive costs in the future. We cannot do that. Our job is to try to bring industries to the Gaeltacht, and the officers of my Department have been doing that with a certain measure of success, having regard to the difficulties of the situation in which everyone finds himself at the present time, and cut off as we are from the sources of supply in different parts of the world. It is hoped that when we get this mill in Donegal going we will be able to produce from our own wool all our own yarns—that we will be able to produce a 100 per cent. Irish article. I hope to see that day.

I am glad that an enterprising firm in the south—and I want to take this opportunity of paying tribute to that firm for its enterprise—has rid us of the fallacy that Irish wool could not be used exclusively for the manufacture of tweeds, etc. We were told at one time that we could not grow wheat in this country, and that if we grew it, it would produce black bread. I have that statement here. There was just as much truth in that statement as there was in the statement that Irish wool could not be used exclusively for the making of an Irish garment. I saw very suitable Irish garments made from Irish wool in my childhood. I saw an overcoat made in my own home, the wool coming off the sheep's back and, after passing through the weaver's hands and going to the tailor where it was turned, out a finished garment, being worn by a member of the household. I suppose Irish wool will not make that very fine cloth that some of the English mills turn out. Nevertheless, it will make a warm, useful and comfortable wearing cloth that would certainly be more enduring than any foreign-produced cloth.

I do not think there is any other point that I have to deal with. I want to assure Deputies that, so far as it is possible for the officers of my Department, they will continue to do the good work they have been doing. I hope we will be able to obtain the necessary supplies, not only for tweeds and knitwear, but also for the toys the new baby of the Gaeltacht industries, a baby that has grown to be a fairly substantial giant in the course of a few years, and one that is now giving a considerable amount of employment in the Mayo Gaeltacht. It has not, of course, been all plain sailing with the Department. We have had, perhaps, to take risks in order to try to provide supplies for our workers.

We have even sent our representatives across the Channel to obtain the necessary supplies of yarns to enable us to keep our operators working. Supplies, as Deputies know, are becoming exhausted. The only danger that I fear is that, before we have our spinning plant going, we may run short of supplies. I hope that will not happen. We are doing everything that is humanly possibly to prevent the closing down of any of our factories or industries until such time as we have our own machinery and plant in full working order.

Mr. MacFadden

Can the Parliamentary Secretary give any information as to when the spinning mill in Donegal will be in production?

Mr. O'Grady

All that I can give is the opinion of a non-expert, of one who would not know the slightest thing about it. I have to depend on the advice of the officers of my Department. From what I can gather from them it will take at least 12 months before the reconstructed building will be ready, with the machinery, boilers and spinning plant installed.

Mr. McMenamin

How many tons of kelp do you hope to get this year?

Mr. O'Grady

We have made arrangements for the purchase of 1,000 tons this year, or for more if it is forthcoming.

Mr. McMenamin

Are you doing anything in the line of publicity to try to get a bigger quantity?

Mr. O'Grady

We have a special officer in charge on the coast for that purpose. He is in touch with all the kelp producers. We have no reason to doubt that, owing to the very satisfactory price that is now being offered, we will we able to get the necessary quantity.

Mr. McMenamin

Have favourable reports to that effect been received by the Department?

Mr. O'Grady

Yes.

Mr. Hickey

Did I understand the Parliamentary Secretary to say that if the necessary machinery was available the Department could use 100 per cent. Irish wool?

Mr. O'Grady

Yes. A firm from Cork City will be able to do that for us.

Mr. Hickey

I am very pleased to hear that, and further that a Cork firm is engaged in the enterprise. I regret, however, to say that during the last 12 months 140 tons of wool were exported from Cork. I am glad to hear that we could use all the wool we produce if we had the necessary machinery.

Am I to understand that development in that direction is being hindered through lack of money: that if the Department had enough money at its disposal the necessary development could be carried out?

Mr. O'Grady

No, it is not a question of money. I want to say, in conclusion for the information of Deputy McMenamin and others who are interested, that the price for kelp this year will be £6 10s. per ton and not £6 as was previously stated. It is desirable, I think, that the kelp gatherers all over the country should be made aware of that.

Vote put and agreed to.

Progress reported; the Committee to sit again on the 15th April, 1942.

The Dáil adjourned at 8.45 p.m. to Wednesday, 15th April, 1942 at 3 p.m.