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Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 17 Oct 1945

Vol. 98 No. 3

Censorship of Publications Bill — Second Stage.

I move that the Bill be now read a Second Time. The purpose of this Bill is to effect certain changes in the machinery of censorship which experience of the working of the 1929 Act has shown to be desirable. Under the 1929 Act prohibition Orders in respect of books and periodicals are made by the Minister for Justice on the advice of the Censorship of Publications Board. The Act does not provide for any appeal against such Orders, but it does provide that the Minister, after consultation with the Board, may revoke or vary a prohibition Order.

Experience has shown that this procedure is unsatisfactory. The Minister is the person authorised to make prohibition Orders, but it is impossible for him to read all the books, and even when he does read a book, and doubts whether it should be prohibited, he is naturally reluctant to oppose his personal judgment to the considered opinion of a number of persons specially selected for their qualifications for this particular task. Secondly experience has shown that some form of appeal against prohibition Orders is very desirable. Under the 1929 Act it is of course open to the Minister to revoke a prohibition Order but this procedure is not satisfactory, as it makes the Minister a Court of Appeal from his own Orders.

This Bill provides for two important changes in the procedure. It provides that the Censorship of Publications Board will be empowered to make prohibition Orders themselves, and it provides for the establishment of an Appeal Board, to which appeals may be taken against prohibition Orders made by the Censorship Board. The Bill proposes that the Appeal Board should consist of three members, and that the Chairman should be a Judge of the Supreme Court, High Court or Circuit Court, or a barrister or solicitor of seven years' standing.

The Bill provides for some other slight alterations in the law. Most of these are consequential on the two main amendments to which I have referred, and I do not think it is necessary for me to go into them in detail at this stage. A large portion of the text of the Bill is merely a re-statement of the existing law. It was thought better to repeal all Part II. of the 1929 Act, and to re-enact it with the desired amendments, rather than to have a shorter amending Bill of a "patchwork" character.

I take the opportunity to express my appreciation of the work done by the board. On one side — periodical publications — there has been, I think, complete success, and no complaints; and it should be remembered that the main reason for setting up the board was to check the import of undesirable newspapers and other periodicals. On the other side — books — there have been some complaints, but very few, when it is remembered that nearly 2,000 books have been prohibited. In one sense, it hardly seems worth while to interfere with a system which has worked so well, but I think that there is a good case for some form of appeal, and that however rarely the right of appeal may be exercised the mere existence of that right will provide an answer to such criticisms as have been made. In any case, a change is necessary as regards the Minister's position. I have long felt that that position was unsatisfactory and unreal, and ought not to be allowed to continue.

The Minister has not given us any indication, in his statement introducing the Bill, as to the probable cost of administering the new board and the Appeal Board. In a country like ours, which is already heavily over-taxed, we, on these benches, do not approve of any additions to the already heavy army of civil servants that we have in this country. Whilst, undoubtedly, it was a defect of the 1929 Act that the Minister was, in himself, the appeal authority and, if he chose to exercise his power, could revoke an Order, nevertheless we feel that some simpler system might be adopted when introducing extra machinery or extra civil servants for the enforcement of the censorship regulations.

I should like to know from the Minister, later on, what is the present cost of enforcing the censorship of publications and what is likely to be the additional cost of the new machinery. Looking at Section 5 of the Bill, it strikes me that the powers given to an officer of customs and excise to detain books should also be extended to detaining periodicals. It seems to me that the section refers only to books. The importation of prohibited periodicals is dealt with in Section 18, but it is not clear that, under Section 5, the power of detention applies to prohibited periodicals as well as to books, since Section 5 refers only to books.

As to the powers of the police: in sub-section (2) of Section 17 there seems to be a slight typographical error. The sub-section says that a search warrant shall be expressed and shall operate to authorise an officer of the Gárda Síochána, "not below the rank of Superintendent, accompanied by such other member of the Gárda Síochána as such officer shall think proper...." In the old Act the word was "members" instead of "member". However, I think that that is only a typographical error, and I am only directing attention to it at the moment. Otherwise, Sir, I do not think there is any comment to be made by us.

I think the Minister is to be congratulated on making this improvement in the machinery of censorship, which has been asked for by numerous individuals and bodies from time to time, but even though we join in congratulating him for making this improvement, I do not think there will be acceptance of the general principle of censorship. I do not think that any of us like this principle of censorship in itself. It is always a very difficult problem to deal with, both from the point of view of providing adequate machinery, so that it may be of real use, and of preventing the evils with which it proposes to deal. Men and women who are healthy in body and mind do not require protection against the sort of thing that is proposed in this principle of censorship, and this Bill seems to be like many other Bills that are introduced in this House — merely a remedial Bill, confined to keeping down the abuses instead of getting at the root causes of these abuses. Men and women, for instance, who are normally healthy are able to throw off the germs of any disease which may affect them, and the same applies here. With regard to the type of people with whom we are concerned in this Bill, it would seem that we are contented with leaving as a breeding ground the very type of thing that we are trying to deal with under this measure. While we waste time in dealing with the effects instead of getting at the root causes, I think we ought to realise that a great deal of this machinery will not be effective except to the extent of confining the abuses to some extent. It has also its bad side in that it may tend to spread this evil in many cases. However, I think we should congratulate the Minister in this endeavour to meet some of the wider effects of this evil and to heal some of the sore spots connected with this matter of censorship.

There are one or two other points the Minister might deal with before the Committee Stage, so that, if necessary, we will have an opportunity of knowing what he has in mind. Deputy Coogan referred to Section 5 and to the powers given to an officer of customs and excise to detain books, and contrasted that with the provision in Section 9. I feel that the power given to customs officers will create difficulties, as I understand that the question of detaining books, as far as that comes under clause (b) of Section 7, would be a simple proposition, because it would be indicative of the type of book referred to. When it is a question of a customs officer detaining books under clause (a) of Section 7, a whole lot of difficulties arise, and later in sub-section (6) of Section 16 he is required to exhibit a list of prohibited publications. If anybody wants to look over the list of 2,000 books provided for inspection, or to read each one of them, it would be a very difficult proposition. In that clause I think it might be sufficient to require the customs officer to take into consideration books coming under clause (b) of Section 7. It is mainly books coming under clause (b) that the section intends to deal with.

Provision is made in Section 8 for appeals to the Appeal Board. The appeal may be made by the author or by five members of the Oireachtas, but it seems that if the author decides to appeal, no appeal may be made by members of the Oireachtas. As books may be written by persons very far away, who are not familiar with local conditions, I think it should be possible for members of the Oireachtas to appeal, even in addition to the author, because of their local knowledge, and of better opportunities of estimating the effects of the release of a book for general consumption. From the point of view of the reading public, if an author in, say, New Zealand, South America or the East Indies formulated an appeal without any knowledge of local conditions, by that very fact there is a denial of what is more important, the right of citizens, especially members of the Oireachtas, having an appeal considered as public representatives. I take it that as far as the present Bill proposes to continue prohibition Orders made under the Act of 1929, it also provides for an appeal under the provisions of the existing Act against these Orders. However, that does not appear to be clear in the Bill. Finally, I think that in Section 2 the Minister is given certain powers to terminate membership of the present board, on the ground that that person has become unfit. That should be more clearly defined, and should say whether for physical or mental unfitness. Generally, I think the Bill is to be welcomed. As far as I know, from those interested in the matter, the Appeal Board is looked forward to as, possibly, removing certain sources of discontent, and it is hoped that it will work in a smooth way and meet the requirements of all parties.

Mr. Boland

On the last point raised by Deputy Larkin about removing a member of the board because a person is not fit to continue membership, that part is taken from the existing Act. Deputy Coogan wanted to know what the cost would be. The present cost of censorship is about £1,000 a year and we do not expect any appreciable increase in the cost. We do not know how many appeals there will be but as far as we can see, we do not anticipate anything like a big increase in cost. As to periodicals, there is the difference between a periodical and a book that a periodical is generally circulated immediately, coming out weekly or monthly, and if it were held up the circulation might be seriously interfered with. For this reason the Bill does not authorise the customs authorities to detain periodicals for examination. It provides that periodicals can be prohibited only on complaints being made by members of the public.

It is not confined to one issue of a periodical?

Mr. Boland

No, a number of issues of that kind. As I mentioned in my opening statement, that particular part of the censorship machinery has worked well. I do not think there have been any complaints. Everybody who knows the position before the Censorship Act came into force will agree that there has been a big change. I understand that some of the newspapers that came here, the weekly and the Sunday newspapers, have now Irish editions, because of the working of the Act, and, from that point of view, it has been a complete success. I believe it is the same as regards books. There may have been a few cases to which objection was taken. I always had a personal objection to banning a book which I had not read. I think anybody who went into the matter seriously, even though he had full confidence in the board, would agree with me in this. At the same time I did not feel like putting my opinion against the opinion of the board and accordingly I generally accepted their recommendations. As I pointed out, there was a kind of appeal to the Minister to revoke a prohibition Order, but it was like appealing against himself.

I hope that the new scheme will work. Like everything done by human beings, it is only by trial and experiment that we can arrive at anything like an approach to a perfect system. With reference to Deputy Larkin's point about authors and public representatives having the right to appeal, I do not think there is anything in that. I am satisfied that when there is an appeal, either by an author or by public representatives, the Appeal Board will treat each case on its merits. Naturally, a board that is fair and competent will go into the merits of each case. I do not think there is any point there.

Question put and agreed to.
Committee Stage ordered for Wednesday, 24th October.
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