asked the Minister for Defence if he will state whether consideration has been given to the importance of (a) keeping in this country a reserve pool of ex-Air Corps pilots who would be available in an emergency; (b) encouraging young men who are thinking of becoming pilots by giving an assurance that there will be a place for them in our commercial air lines when they complete their normal four years' period in the Air Corps; and, if so, whether he will further state if any arrangement has been, or is likely to be, made between his Department and Aer Lingus whereby time-expired pilots will be absorbed into the company.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Absorption of Ex-Air Corps Pilots.
(a) The importance of having a reserve of suitably qualified pilots for the Air Corps who would be available in an emergency is fully appreciated, and the matter is regularly under review.
(b) No assurance can be given to prospective pilots that there will be a place for them in our commercial air lines on completion of their Army service. The commercial air companies can be expected to engage only such personnel as are required to fill vacancies and whom they regard as suitable to their particular requirements.
All pilots at present in the Air Corps hold permanent commissions and no arrangements exist or are contemplated for the absorption of such pilots in Aer Lingus when they retire. There is continuous liaison and co-operation between my Department and Aer Lingus on matters of common concern.
I wonder is the Minister aware that the majority of the pilots in Aer Lingus were formerly in the Royal Air Force, and are liable to be called back by Britain in case of emergency? Is he further aware that not so long ago Royal Air Force pilots with less experience and training than Army Air Corps pilots here were taken on by Aer Lingus as additional pilots and had to be sent for further training back to England before they qualified?
I am not aware of the correctness of the statement made by the Deputy.
That is my information.
I am not challenging it. What I am aware of is the number of ex-Irish Air Force men employed by Aer Lingus. Of the ex-officer pilots, there are three with Aer Lingus and three on air traffic control; of the exregular pilots there are two with Aer Lingus; of the ex-sergeant pilots there are three, and that makes a total of 11. In administrative posts you have four ex-officers with Aer Lingus and five on traffic control, and of ex-sergeant pilots you have one. That makes a total of 21 of our ex-Air Corps pilots.
I am talking about men actually employed as pilots. Is the Minister aware that many of our ex-Army pilots had to go abroad to get employment, while ex-R.A.F. pilots were able to come over here and get employment from one of our commercial air lines, although they had not the experience that some of our ex-Army Air Corps pilots had?
I think the Deputy is aware, or should be aware, that there is an International Air Traffic Agreement with regard to the basic minimum qualifications required for certain posts as pilots. All the people who passed through our air force had not, up to the date of discharge, complied with these conditions, but they are in the position that, after a short course of post-Army training, they could get employment. I have no evidence so far that, of the ex-Army men so qualified, there has been any discrimination against them. I am aware of the fact that a number of our ex-Army flying people who wanted an immediate engagement were not able to get it in this country, but got it abroad. Under the international agreement they were not qualified for employment as pilots here, but every facility was given to them to get the qualifications.
Is the Minister aware that ex-R.A.F. pilots with a less extensive training than our ex-Army pilots were taken on by Aer Lingus and then sent over to England to get further training, and that, while that was going on, our ex-Army pilots had to go abroad? Could they not have been taken on and sent over to England and given that training and so be engaged by Aer Lingus?
I am not aware of that. If that information is given to me in a detailed way I will have it inquired into. The commercial line referred to by the Deputy does not come under my Department, but I guarantee to have the matter inquired into.
Is the Minister aware that there were half a dozen pilots, ex-air force pilots, discharged by Irish air lines since the present Government came in who are now holding office as principal pilots and as test pilots in K.L.M., a Dutch company?
I gave a reasonable reply to Deputy McQuillan because he has not been for 16 years a Minister and I could excuse him for addressing a query to the wrong Minister, but I cannot find any apologia or alibi for the ignorance of the Deputy opposite.
You are finding an alibi for the mess you made of things.
Question 13.