asked the Minister for Justice if he will state (1) the number of persons taken into custody by the Gardaí and brought to College Street Garda Station on the night of 15th June, 1959; and (2) what charges are being brought by the Gardaí against these persons.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Dublin Arrests.
The number of persons brought in custody to the Garda station was fourteen. Only two have been charged, one with assault and obstruction of a member of the Garda Síochána, the other with obstruction of a member of the Garda Síochána and conduct calculated to lead to a breach of the peace.
Is the Minister aware that some of these people were provoked by the Guards by pushing these people against other Guards and that these Guards treated the civilians as if they had attacked the Guards? Was that made known to the Minister?
There is no foundation whatever for the statement the Deputy has made. This was an organised group of people——
On a point of order. May I suggest that if people are on charge it is not appropriate for the Minister for Justice——
They have been tried. One person has been found guilty. In the other the individual was remanded by the District Justice to see how he would conduct himself for the time being.
Will the Minister allow me? If people are on charge, matters in connection with which they are charged should not be raised here.
Why put it on the Order Paper so, Sir?
Are these people on charge? If there are people on charge——
This has nothing to do with the charges, Sir.
It surely has something to do with the charges. If there are people on charge this question should not be pursued. Anything that would prejudice the hearing of the case should not be raised here.
What I am going to ask will not prejudice the hearing of the case.
Are they on charge? What does the Minister say?
I tried to give an explanation which was ruled out of order.
Are they on charge?
I have made a statement. When questioned by the Chair, I cannot proceed.
The only thing the Chair questioned was whether the people are on charge.
The position as I know it is that one of these persons was charged and found guilty. The other was remanded by the District Justice for the purpose merely of seeing how he would conduct himself in the interval. Whether he is technically still on charge is a matter of debate. Can I proceed any further on that? My only interest naturally was in the charge the Deputy made against the Gardaí.
The matter should be left for the courts.
What I wanted to say to the Minister now would not have anything to do with the people who are charged.
Surely if it has not anything to do with the people who are charged it is not relevant?
It will be relevant. I want to ask——
Nothing should be said here, under the protection of the House, which would be likely to interfere with the course of justice.
What I have to say, Sir, will not.
What you said so far had a lot to do with it.
The Minister for Agriculture.
If a Guard interfered to establish order at a Fine Gael meeting would he be sent to a bog station? The Minister for Defence would know where to send him.