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Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 24 Feb 1960

Vol. 179 No. 5

Committee on Finance. - Military Service Pensions (Amendment) Bill, 1960—Committee and Final Stages.

Section 1 agreed to.
SECTION 2.

I move amendment No. 1:—

In page 2, to delete subsection (2) and substitute the following new subsection:

"(2) The Minister may nominate a judge of the Circuit Court or a practising barrister of at least ten years' standing to examine the records of the investigation by the Referce of an application to which this section applies and, upon such examination, the judge or barrister, if satisfied that the Referee made an error in setting out his findings in his report on the application, may, with the concurrence of two of the members of the Advisory Committee who assisted the Referee in the investigation, correct the error and the report as so corrected shall be regarded as the report of the Referee on the application."

I am accepting, in principle, the amendment which Deputy MacEoin suggests. I thought I had explained to the satisfaction of any reasonable person that, far from interfering with the Referee's decision, I was actually taking steps to implement the findings of the Referee, and this section, as originally drafted, was merely intended to do that.

These mistakes were discovered and reported to me by the officers of my Department in the normal course of their duties. It is true that I could have washed my hands at that stage and said the Referee reported in a negative manner in those two cases and there was nothing more to be said. I thought that would not be fair to the people concerned, and that I should do something to rectify what were obviously clerical errors. I originally considered doing what Deputy MacEoin suggests, but I decided it was an unnecessarily cumbersome way to rectify clerical errors. I decided the way proposed in this Bill in the first instance was the best way to deal with the matter. However, if it will make Deputy MacEoin any happier, I am now prepared to do it in the way he suggests.

The subsection which I propose, differs from the amendment proposed by Deputy MacEoin, in the following respects. Instead of the words "barrister-at-law of at least five years' standing" used in Deputy MacEoin's amendment, I am using the expression "practising barrister of at least 10 years' standing". Those are the words used in Section 5 of the Military Service Pensions Act, 1934, and are, therefore, more appropriate. That was the Act which originally set up the Referee. In any case the qualifications for a man in order to become a Circuit Court judge are that he is a "practasing barrister of at least 10 years' standing." It would not be proper for us to start to equate a Circuit Court judge and a barrister of five years' standing.

I am using the expression "nominate" instead of "appoint" and there is a re-phrasing of the original subsection as a result of the proposed change, but I think the effect of the amendment is what Deputy MacEoin wants.

I wish to thank the Minister for accepting my point of view and, being a reasonable type of person—notwithstanding the suggestion in the Minister's remarks that I am not—my reasonableness in this matter is intended to save the Minister and his successors from embarrassment. If I were unreasonable, the best thing I could do would be to leave the measure as it stands, and then we would have the Minister where many people would like to have him. In my sweet reasonableness I am trying to assist the Minister rather than anything else.

The Minister gave us to understand that the Referee came to a decision but that owing to illness or other reason—it was a rather mixed situation—his decision was not properly recorded, by reason of a clerical error, but one is bound to ask oneself how this could happen. How could this error occur? Why was the Minister nominating or appointing himself as referee for these two cases?

By doing so the Minister was creating trouble for himself and for his successors, so long as the Military Service Pensions Act is in operation. If I were unreasonable, I would suggest that not only should he examine these two cases, but every other case where he was satisfied there was an error of judgment in not granting a pension when it should have been granted. As a matter of fact, the Minister should ask the Government to reconsider the whole question.

I agree the Minister's amendment is better than mine and will achieve the end I had in view. The only difference is the question of five years' or ten years' standing. I did not have any particular point of view in setting out five years. I only intended to make it easier for the Minister. I shall not move my amendment in view of the Minister's amendment.

Amendment agreed to.
Amendment No. 2 not moved.
Section 2, as amended, agreed to.
Section 3 agreed to.
Title agreed to.
Bill reported with amendment.
Agreed to take remaining Stages today.
Bill received for final consideration and passed.

This Bill is certified by the Ceann Comhairle to be a Money Bill within the meaning of Article 22 of the Constitution.

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