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Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 19 May 1960

Vol. 181 No. 12

Supplementary Estimate. - Vote 47—Industry and Commerce.

Tairgim:—

Go ndeonófar suim nach mó ná £1,647,000 chun slánaithe na suime is gá chun íoctha an mhuirir a thiocfaidh chun bheith iníoctha i rith na bliana dar críoch an 31ú lá de Mhárta, 1961, le haghaidh Tuarastail agus Costais Oifig an Aire Tionscail agus Tráchtála, lena n-áirítear Seirbhísí áirithe atá faoi riaradh na hOifige sin, agus chun Ildeontais-i-gCabhair a íoc.

I Meastacháin 1959/60 rinneadh soláthar do na seirbhísí a bhí faoi riaradh na Roinne Tionscail agus Tráchtála i sé cinn de Vótaí (Uimhreacha 50, 51, 52, 53, 54 agus 66). Tar éis roinnt áirithe de na seirbhísí sin a aistriú go dtí an Roinn Iompair agus Cumhachta, b'éigean an leagan amach a athrú, agus sa bhliain reatha déantar an soláthar le haghaidh na seirbhísí atá fágtha faoin Roinn Tionscail agus Tráchtála in aon Mheastachán amháin—Uimhir 47, Tionscal agus Tráchtáil. Mar áis comparáide tá ráiteas curtha isteach ar leathanach 231 leis an Meastachán le haghaidh Tionscal agus Tráchtáil agus léirítear sa ráiteas sin na Fo-Mhírchinn do 1960/61 agus, na Vótai agus na Fo-Mhírchinn chomhréireacha do 1959/60.

I Leabhar na Meastachán, déantar glan-Mheastachán £2,471,000 a sholáthar don bhliain 1960/61 i gcomórtas le suim £2,458,263 a deonaíodh i 1959/ 60 (agus áirítear sa tsuim sin dhá Mheastachán Fhorlíontacha le haghaidh £275,010). Is ionann sin agus £12,737 i gcomparáid leis an tsuim a deonaíodh anuraidh. Ach ar an 22ú lá de Mhárta, 1960, nuair a bhí Leabhar na Meastachán foilsithe agus curtha timpeall deonaíodh suim bhreise £404,000 le Mheastachán Forlíontach, ionas go raibh £2,862,263 sa tsuim iomlán a deonaíodh le haghaidh 1959/60. Sa Mheastachán Forlíontach rinneadh £300,000 a sholáthar do Ghabháltais Chruach na hÉireann (níl aon soláthar don tseirbhís sin i 1960/ 61) agus £104,000 d'Oibreacha Innealtóireachta Dhún Dealgan. (£10 atá á sholáthar i 1960/61, faoi fho-mhircheann O.)

Mar sin, is é an chaoi ina bhfuil an scéal faoi láthair, go bhfuil an Meastachán £2,471,000 le haghaidh 1960/ 61 £391,253 a deonaíodh i 1959/60.

Is iad na príomh-nithe ar ar tháinig ardú i 1960/61 an soláthar le haghaidh Saotharlanna Breise, £20,000 (fo-mhírcheann H2); Cuartaíocht, £30,000 (fomhirchinn J1, J2 agus J3); Deontas-i-gCabhair do Chóras Tráchtála, £41,000 (fo-mhírcheann K1); Deontais faoin Acht um Dheontais Tionscail, 1959, £275,000 (fo-mhírcheann M2), agus Cabhair Theicniúil, £86,500 (fo-mhírcheann P). Tá £32,192 d'ardú ann faoi fho-mhírchinn eile i dtreo go bhfuil £484,690 d'ardú ann ar fad.

Is iad na príomh-nithe inar tharla laghdú i 1960/61 deontais faoin Acht um Limistéirí Neamhfhorbhartha 1952, £275,000 (fo-mhírcheann M1) agus £104,000 d'Oibreacha Innealtóireachta Dhún Deálgan (fo-mhírcheann O). Níl aon soláthar deanta chun Airleacain Iasachtaí Trádála (£113,000 i 1959/60) a aisíoc ná le haghaidh Gabháltais Chruach na hÉireann (£300,000 i 1959/60).

Is ionann agus £2,223 na laghduithe eile i dtreo gur £794,223 de laghdú atá ann san iomlán. Caithfear £81,732 a chur leis an tsuim sin, mar gheall ar Ardú sna Leithreasaí-i-gCabhair. Is ionann sin agus laghdú sa ghlan-deontas, rud a bheir laghdú iomlán de £875,955.

I have circulated a translation of the figures I have just given in Irish which, broadly speaking, are a comparison between the expenditure on the Vote for Industry and Commerce this year and last, due regard being had to the transfer of sections which are now administered by the Department of Transport and Power. Therefore, it is not my intention to give these figures to the House again in English, but to proceed with the rest of my opening statement.

I am glad to be able to report that industrial production has shown a marked recovery. For the year 1959, the provisional index of the volume of production (to base 1953=100) of manufacturing industries was 112.1 compared with 104.4 in 1958. For all industries and services (including building, etc.) covered by the Census of Industrial Production, the provisional volume index was 106.9 for 1959, as compared with 98.7 for 1958.

The average number of persons engaged in manufacturing industries is provisionally estimated at 146,100 in 1959 compared with 142,400 in 1958.

There has been a further reduction in the total unemployment figures as compared with recent years. At the end of April, 1960, the number on the live register was 58,880 compared with 67,120 at the end of April, 1959.

In the year ended 31st March, 1960, 86 firms came to notice as having commenced production or as having extended their range of production. Industrial proposals before the Department and the Industrial Development Authority numbered some 180 on 31st March, 1960.

During the year, An Foras Tionscal approved grants amounting to £1,054,830 for projects located in the undeveloped areas, bringing the total grants approved for such projects to £3,023,412. Of this amount, grants totalling £1,835,310 were paid to 31st March, 1960, leaving outstanding commitments of £1,188,102. The total capital investment involved in the approved projects amounts to about £7.25 million and it is expected that employment will be given to about 5,500 persons.

Fifty-two projects assisted by An Foras Tionscal are in production in the undeveloped areas and, in addition, there are eighteen other projects for which assistance has been promised and which are in varying stages of development. Among the projects which have recently gone into production and those recently approved but not yet in production are a substantial number which are related mainly to export trade.

The reduction of £275,000 in the Estimates provision for the current year should not be interpreted as an indication that the tempo of industrial development in the undeveloped areas is slowing down. Last year, owing to the exceptionally fine weather, conditions for building work were very good and it was possible to make better progress than was expected on certain projects, with the result that payments actually made in the year were higher than was originally estimated and a Supplementary Estimate of £275,000 was necessary. The Estimate provision for this year is the same as that originally provided last year.

The Industrial Grants Act which became law in August, 1959, made certain changes in the grant arrangements for projects outside the undeveloped areas and transferred responsibility for such grants from the Industrial Development Authority to An Foras Tionscal. Since August, grants amounting to £783,000 involving a total capital expenditure of £3.25 million have been approved for ten projects. Practically all these projects are related to exports and they should form a worth-while contribution to the export potential. In addition, there are 12 projects which were assisted under the Industrial Grants Act, 1956. These represent a total capital investment of £2,000,000. It is estimated that these 22 projects will provide employment for 3,200 persons.

I need refer only briefly to the Petroleum and other Minerals Development Act, 1960, which was enacted recently. Ambassador Irish Oil Limited have now been granted a licence under the Act which, when certain other requirements are fulfilled, will enable them to explore for petroleum over the whole State.

The affairs of St. Patrick's Copper Mines Ltd., Avoca, were discussed some months ago when approval was given to the raising of a further State guaranteed loan. The Company continues to employ about 500 workers.

Exploration work for copper at Allihies, Co. Cork, has been encouraging but the mine has not yet been brought to the production stage.

The first stage of the Technical Assistance project of coal exploration in the Leinster coalfield has been carried out satisfactorily and has achieved its primary purpose of obtaining exact information about the thickness of certain coal seams. The second stage of the Leinster coalfield project and the exploration of the Connacht coalfield are now under way. This scheme is financed by an E.C.A. grant from Counterpart Funds. It was undertaken in the hope that it would reveal new deposits of coal and enable our home production to be increased substantially. It is too early to say whether these hopes will be realised.

A scheme of Technical Assistance grants for private exploration of minerals in accordance with the White Paper Programme for Economic Expansion was initiated last November. Grants of up to one-half of the cost may be given where there are likely to be commercially workable deposits of minerals in an area and their development is desirable in the national interest.

The Government have approved development plans of Irish Steel Holdings Ltd., which will increase the output and efficiency of the mills and extend its range of products; and have decided that the project should be wholly financed by share capital to be subscribed by the Minister for Finance. The estimated cost of the developments is of the order of £3½ millions and the legislation necessary to enable the company to proceed with their plans for the expansion and development of the industry is in course of preparation.

It was not possible to enact the legislation before 31st March and as the company by that date had to make payments of £300,000 in respect of initial instalments to suppliers of new plant and in respect of some other items a supplementary estimate for £300,000 was passed on 22nd March, 1960, to enable payments to be made to the company in respect of shares to be taken up by the Minister for Finance. Contract documents for the supply of the plant were signed on 14th April, 1960.

Legislation was enacted during the year 1959 to provide for the revival of the grass meal project in the Bangor Erris area. The new company—Min Fhéir (1959) Teoranta—with share capital of £200,000 to be subscribed by the Minister for Finance, has been incorporated and preliminary contracts have been signed for the acquisition of the necessary acreage of land near Geesala, a total of 1,939 acres.

The past year was marked by a general round of wage increases—the seventh in the series since the end of the war. The round of wage increases gave rise to a number of industrial disputes and it is satisfying to note that workers and employers continued to recognise the value of the Labour Court for the settlement of those disputes in which private negotiation failed to find a solution. The success of the court is reflected in the fact that the wage adjustments were completed with the minimum of industrial strife.

Each year, the Labour Court makes a report to the Government and the report is laid on the Table of the House for the information of Deputies. The court has not yet presented its report for 1959, but I might, perhaps, anticipate the report by making a comment on what has become known as the seventh round of wage increases.

The most noteworthy feature of the recent wage increases was the fact that for the first time since the war the increases were not related to the consumer price index—which had in fact remained steady for the first half of 1959 and had fallen three points by mid-August—but were aimed, it was stated, at securing an improvement in the standard of living of the workers. Whether the relatively stable position of the cost of living can now be maintained is somewhat doubtful, having regard to the effect of the wage increases on production costs.

There has, it is true, been an improvement in the level of production, coupled with a certain limited expansion in the national income, and it was reasonable to expect that the workers would want to share in these improvements. It is, however, illusory to think that these increases can be completely absorbed by the economy without any effect on industrial costs and prices. The possible effect of a rise in the prices of our goods on the level of our exports and on the balance of payments situation is a matter for some concern.

If we are to protect ourselves against the adverse results of an increase in the prices of our goods and services, it is essential that we should intensify the drive for increased productivity. This problem of productivity has already been the subject of quite a lot of discussion, and I think it is now generally accepted by both employers and workers that a more efficient use of our resources could bring benefit to all sections of the community—through a greater supply of goods at lower prices, through higher real earnings, and through improvement in living standards and working conditions. The problems arising in connection with measures to increase productivity are, as I see them, mainly twofold—technical and human.

So far as technical problems are concerned, I am sure that Irish managers recognise the advantages to be obtained by making use of the most up-to-date information and advice available both here and abroad and I have every confidence in their ability to take advantage of the most modern techniques. In appropriate cases, my Department is prepared to make grants out of Technical Assistance funds towards the cost of engaging consultants or experts to advise industrial firms on problems of reorganisation, work study, and so on, with a view to increasing productive efficiency.

The human problems of productivity are, I think, much more complex and they present a very real challenge to both management and labour. One of the principal difficulties is the apprehension which may arise on the part of workers that the introduction of new machines and improved techniques may threaten the security of their jobs. These fears are in many cases quite understandable, particularly where the worker is not adequately informed about the aims and intentions of the management.

The introduction of new machines and new techniques will nearly always entail some changes in the organisation of the firm and in the pattern of work. While it may be possible, by careful planning, to avoid redundancy, the redistribution of jobs and the changes in traditional working methods are upsetting to workers and may meet with some resistance. Progressive management recognises that the way to overcome these problems is to ensure that the representatives of the workers are fully informed in advance of the purpose of the reorganisation and that they are given an opportunity of voicing their fears and apprehensions. A factor which would naturally influence the workers in their attitude towards such changes would be, of course, the extent to which they could expect to share in the benefits of any increased output.

Problems of this kind are not, of course, peculiar to this country. Indeed, they are probably the most pressing problems now engaging the attention of industrial experts in the international field. This country, through its association with the European Productivity Agency and the International Labour Organisation, is providing the means whereby both management and labour can keep in touch with the most up-to-date thinking in these matters. The Irish National Productivity Committee, which is specially concerned with these problems, will no doubt continue to act as a centralising and co-ordinating agency and I am sure that their own studies will be of great assistance and guidance to Irish employers and workers in finding solutions to the many practical problems that arise in connection with measures to attain increased productivity.

A practical and very commendable example of this was the seminar on "port productivity" which was recently held in Greystones under the auspices of the Committee, and which it is hoped will prove a considerable help towards arriving at a satisfactory settlement of the problems which have held up the introduction of more productive methods of working at Dublin port.

As indicated in the White Paper, Programme for Economic Expansion, the Technical Assistance arrangements, under which grants are made out of State funds towards the cost of schemes designed to improve industrial efficiency, are being continued. The estimate—Subhead P—contains an appropriate provision.

Reports received indicate that industrial firms which have availed themselves of expert advice in overhauling their productive organisation have in general found the results highly satisfactory. Grants towards the cost of such schemes are made on the basis of one-third of the cost.

Enough time has now elapsed for the effects of Government policy on economic expansion, as outlined in the White Paper, to begin to be felt. Various measures designed to encourage and aid private enterprise to develop and expand production have been enacted. The considerable increase in the volume of production of manufacturing industries during the year, and a 40% increase in exports of manufactured goods over the 1958 figure, provide heartening evidence that our industries are responding to the challenge of our times. It is to be hoped that they will redouble their efforts and that the expansion which is now under way will generate the confidence from which will spring further and bigger extensions in the volume and range of production.

Our future economic prosperity depends in very large measure on the extent to which we can expand and develop export production. Indeed, the needs of our economic situation demand that every firm here, large or small, should seek export outlets for its products. All firms should strive towards achieving the highest possible level of efficiency so as to compete successfully in markets abroad. It is heartening to record that a significant number of our industries are exporting their products on an increasing scale. The example of those progressive firms should provide a stimulus to many other concerns that have not so far seriously investigated the export possibilities in their sphere of activity. The reward is there to be won but it requires energy and effort.

In the British market, our goods have special advantages, the continuance of which is assured under the Trade Agreement signed on 13th April last. These advantages derive from the free entry which the Trade Agreements guarantee for the vast bulk of our exports to Britain.

This right of free entry to Britain will be gradually acquired over the next ten years by Brtain's partners in E.F.T.A., or in any wider European trade group that may emerge from the various discussions which have been proceeding in Europe over the past few years. Irish manufacturers are therefore put on notice that the advantage which they have over their European competitors in the British market will be progressively reduced and will be entirely removed by 1970 at the latest.

There is no reason why we should be intimidated by the prospect of greater competition in the British market. The record of the success in that market of a number of our exporters in the face of strong internal competition gives every ground for confidence in the ability of our industries generally to face the challenge of the future.

The situation demands that our manufacturers should lose no time in developing exports to Britain. Valuable facilities are available to them; they can call on the services of Córas Tráchtála, they have the advantage of proximity to the market, close commercial, banking and the many other associations which go to make up the special trade relationship affirmed in the recent Agreement. I trust that these favourable conditions will be availed of in good time. The potentialities of the British market for our industrial goods and processed foodstuffs are enormous. Our exports of these goods to Britain have been rising, but Deputies will have seen a recent statement by the General Manager of Córas Tráchtála that we have hardly begun to scratch the surface of that market.

There are indications that associations representative of manufacturers and exporters are fully alive to the situation. There are encouraging trends in the export statistics. I am confident that Irish industry will make the effort necessary to build up exports to Britain while the favourable conditions exist. Success in the British market will give them the training, the experience and economic strength to develop the potentialities of other markets as well.

Deputies are, no doubt, already aware of the efforts which have been made through the Industrial Development Authority to secure foreign industrial investment in this country. The Authority have pursued their campaign to achieve this purpose by visits to Continental countries and the U.S.A., by the appointment of representatives in Europe and the U.S.A. by the publication and distribution of attractive brochures and through advertising campaigns. I am happy to say that their efforts have been increasingly successful.

During 1959 some 13 factories in which there was foreign participation commenced production and about 20 other factories are either in course of construction or planned. These factories are located in various parts of the country and, in many cases, they will not only provide much-needed local employment but will assist in our balance of international payments position through exports. Indeed a notable feature of recent development has been the extent to which new factories are primarily oriented to export markets.

The achievement in 1959 was better than in 1958 and there is at present every indication that the results in 1960 will outstrip those of 1959. The recent announcement of two major projects for Galway, one for the manufacture of oil heaters by a large French company and the second for mechanical handling equipment promoted by a German concern are particularly welcome.

The Authority, through their representative in the United States, have continued the campaign directed to American industrialists. This campaign has resulted in the setting up of seven factories by American interests here while a further four factories are under construction. Discussions are proceeding with some 40 other American concerns and the prospects of establishing further industries as a result of these discussions are promising. The announcement a few day ago of a major project in the electronics field for Shannon Free Airport by an important American concern will, it is hoped, increase the interest of other large American corporations in the country as a whole. An advertising campaign conducted in a selected number of United States newspapers and periodicals continued during the year and a programme of advertising for the coming year has also been arranged.

The Authority appointed a travelling European representative during the past year and while he has visited other countries, his efforts have mainly been directed to Germany whose industrialists are showing a keen interest in this country as a base for industrial expansion. An advertising campaign in the German Press links general advertising with local advertising to coincide with the representative's visit to the various cities in Germany.

There are strong indications of growing interest in other European countries and in Great Britain in industrial possibilities in Ireland. In order to take full advantage of this situation the appointment of two additional travelling representatives, one for Great Britain and a second to share the work of the present representative in Europe, is being considered.

In co-operation with the Shannon Free Airport Development Company who have a particular interest in attracting suitable industries to Shannon, the Authority set up an information Centre in Birmingham, for about ten days early this month. The Centre was opened by the Irish Ambassador in the presence of local businessmen and representatives of the Press. The inquiries received were such that it was decided to retain the representative of the Authority in Birmingham for a further period. The growing interest of British industrialists in the possibilities of expansion in this country is evidenced by the publication of a special supplement on this country by an influential British financial newspaper.

The results so far achieved in attracting foreign investment have been very satisfactory but what is most heartening is the evidence of an upward trend which seems likely to continue for some time to come. It would seem that the sustained and widespread publicity abroad is bearing fruit in increasing measure. Deputies may be interested to know that investment in Irish factories has flowed from a very wide variety of countries, including Great Britain, Germany, the U.S.A., Canada, the Netherlands, France, Sweden, Belgium, Norway, Italy, and Switzerland.

As Deputies are already aware, I have arranged for the widespread issue through the post of a series of leaflets urging the public to "Buy Irish." The first of these was issued to approximately 600,000 addresses in the course of the week commencing on 30th November, 1959.

I realise how little might be achieved by an occasional official exhortation of this sort, if it were not supported by the various bodies and organisations that are in a position to influence public opinion. The Government can give the necessary encourgement and stress the importance of this matter from the national point of view, but the success of their efforts depends on the co-operation of all the citizens. For this reason, I am glad to be able to say that many voluntary organisations, the Press, business associations, firms and individuals throughout the country have expressed their warm support for the idea behind the campaign.

Another leaflet is now being issued, and I hope and trust that all organisations, all business interests, all leaders of public opinion and all citizens will play their part in making a practical and effective contribution to the success of the "Buy Irish" drive. I take this opportunity of expressing my deep appreciation of the support already given by the public press and by numerous organisations and public bodies throughout the whole country.

As a result of negotiations which took place during 1959 with the British and Commonwealth life insurance offices, and agreement was reached under which these offices undertook to increase substantially the proportion of their funds attributable to Irish business which is invested in this country. It is intended that they should achieve collectively, over a period of 10 years, a total investment of 66? per cent. of the funds they hold to cover their liabilities to Irish policyholders. This will mean a doubling of the present total investment and is estimated to secure new investment of the order of £2 million a year.

Exports in 1959 came to £130.7 million which was remarkably little short of the 1958 figure, considering the reduction in exports of cattle, butter and bacon. Substantial increases in exports of beef, ores and metals, machinery and electrical goods, vehicles, textiles, clothing and footwear, petroleum products, leather and other items combined to counteract the very considerable reductions I have mentioned.

The increase in the adverse trade balance on visible items over that of 1958 was brought about almost entirely by an increase in imports, the decline in total exports being relatively small, as I have said. The consequences of the bad harvest of 1958 continued to make imports of abnormal quantities of grain necessary and increased imports of machinery, petroleum, cocoa and other commodities were also contributing factors in the increase in total imports.

Questions have been asked from time to time about sugar and in particular about the situation arising from the limitation of beet contracts by Comhluch Siúicre Éireann Teo. Broadly, the position is that we can now produce more sugar than we need and the question of securing a profitable outlet for an exportable surplus arises. The matter is engaging my attention and when I am in a position to make a statement in regard to it I shall do so. Meanwhile, the House may be assured that all appropriate means will be used to secure as good a market as possible for Irish sugar and for goods in which it is used as an ingredient.

Córas Tráchtála has now been given statutory permanence and provision is made for a further extension of the Board's activities in accordance with the Government's policy of intensifying export promotion activity. The work of the organisation was discussed by the Dáil in July last when the Export Promotion Bill was under consideration. In addition to the activities which I mentioned during that debate, the subhead in this year's Estimate includes provision for Technical Assistance Grants to exporters for export market research, design for export, and packaging for export.

The Oireachtas recently enacted the Apprenticeship Act, 1959, the ultimate object of which is to raise the level of skill of Irish workers. This Act provided for the establishment of the new central apprenticeship authority—An Cheard Chomhairle—comprising representatives of employers, workers and educational interests, under a chairman who is also the Director of Apprenticeship.

It is scarcely necessary for me to stress how important it is for our young workers that they should have every opportunity of attaining a high degree of proficiency in their selected trades. It is only by attaining such proficiency, that they will be able to contribute adequately to our economic expansion and to command a sufficient level of income to enable them to live and work in Ireland with a reasonable standard of comfort.

It is equally important for the nation that our workers should be well trained. The continued expansion of our economy is dependent to a great extent on our ability to increase our exports. The quality of our products, and the manner in which they are offered for sale are important factors in finding export markets and we will not be able to compete with other countries in this field unless our workers are at least as proficient as theirs.

The legislation under which An Chomhairle was established was considered at some length, before its enactment, by a committee representing employers and workers. It also had the support of all Parties in the Oireachtas. While it would be unwise to expect any immediate or spectacular results, I am hopeful that the cooperative attitude shown by all concerned towards this new legislation and towards the establishment of An Chomhairle will enable that body to make a significant contribution to the national welfare.

Legislation to amend the Industrial Research and Standards Acts is at present being prepared. It will, among other things, provide for an increase in the statutory maximum grant to the Institute to meet increased costs arising from the provision of three new laboratories which are nearing completion, and the opportunity is being taken to provide for the revision of certain features of the organisation of the Institute.

The new legislation which was enacted at the end of 1959 in relation to restrictive trade practices is designed to aid the Fair Trade Commission in their investigation of such practices and will, it is hoped, assist greatly in the elimination of those practices which are found to be harmful to the public interest. Deputies have had ample opportunity to discuss the various aspects of this legislation during its passage through the House and it is not necessary for me to devote any more time to the matter to-day.

The coming year should be one of significant progress for the tourist industry. In Ireland, as in other European countries, shortage of hotel accommodation has threatened to become the chief barrier to the development of tourist traffic and, in recognition of that fact, the Government decided at the beginning of this year to introduce certain additional incentives for the extension and improvement of hotel accommodation.

A new scheme of grants for the improvement, as distinct from the expansion, of existing hotels has been brought into operation by Bord Fáilte Éireann, under which grants amounting to 20 per cent. of the total cost will be available for such works as the installation of hot and cold water, central heating, adaptation of existing bedrooms as bed/bath units, provision of additional bathroom and toilet accommodation, and the carrying out of structural alterations.

In addition to these new grants, provision has been made in this year's Finance Bill for an annual depreciation allowance of 10 per cent. in respect of capital expenditure incurred on the construction of new hotel buildings and the extension of existing buildings. The new allowance will operate from the commencement of the present financial year and will apply to expenditure incurred on or after the 1st January, 1960.

The initial reaction of the industry has been such that there is every reason to hope that the new incentives will achieve the desired effect and that within the next two or three years there will be a substantial addition to the volume of top grade accommodation as well as a considerable improvement in the standard of accommodation in our hotels generally. These developments should enable us to increase our share of the growing tourist market.

The scheme of grants for development of major tourist resorts is now under way and considerable progress is expected to be made during the coming twelve months. A sum of £85,000 is being provided for the purpose in this period. As there will, naturally, be a great deal of preliminary consultation and planning to be carried out by the local interests concerned, peak expenditure under the scheme will not be reached for another year or so. The grants, which are administered by Bord Fáilte, relate to works forming part of a co-ordinated plan of development substantially financed by a local development group or local authority.

In the field of company law revision, following on the report of the Company Law Reform Committee, substantial progress has been made with the examination of the Committee's recommendations and of the other points which arise for decision in this field. I am not yet in a position to say when it will be possible for me to introduce amending legislation, but the preparation of a Bill is being pressed forward as rapidly as possible.

A departmental review of the law of copyright, which is contained in the Industrial and Commercial Property (Protection) Acts 1927 and 1958, has been proceeding over the past year. Observations on the matter have been received from a number of organised bodies and have been considered. Consultation with other Departments concerned is now proceeding so that the final proposals can be considered by the Government.

Amendments to the laws relating to patents and trade marks, contained in the same Acts, are also required to meet certain changes in the international convention on these matters to which the country is a party, and also to keep in line with the international trend in these subjects. I hope to make arrangements soon for this work to be put in hands so that the necessary amendments to the law may be determined.

I move:

That the Estimate be referred back for reconsideration.

The increase in industrial production and income last year is welcome. It is, however, much lower and slower than the average European increase and it occurred in favourable economic circumstances. It must also be considered in the light of the numbers employed and it is significant that despite the reduction in the number on the unemployment register, according to the statistics published just prior to the Budget, there are 51,000 fewer people employed now than were employed three years ago. In the course of his Budget Statement, the Minister for Finance expressed the view that although the number of unemployed had shown a reduction, emigration was probably higher in 1959 than in 1958.

While it is satisfactory that an improvement in industrial production and exports occurred last year, what we are anxious to find out is the position which will arise when the new trading arrangements come into operation, starting with the first reduction in tariffs in July, 1960. As I understand it, it is proposed to have a further reduction in December, 1961. Has any estimate been made of the probable effect on our industries and the possible consequences on employment as well as the risks that will attend our exports? Do the proposed tariff reductions in any way affect the preferential terms we enjoy under Commonwealth preference and under the Trade Agreements with Britain? As I understand it, we shall now have to compete on the basis of a tariff reduction with other countries exporting to Britain and, as the Minister remarked in the course of his speech, there is every prospect that this will mean keener competition. Although on many occasions we have successfully surmounted competition up to the present in getting exports into the British market, industrialists will now have to meet competition from a wider field. Industrialists here have had a difficult task when account is taken of the relatively small home market. They must depend to a considerable extent on the export trade.

Is it expected that the proposed reduction in tariffs will be a real reduction in all cases for those countries in which it operates? We have had experience in the past of implementing trade liberalisation measures in name as well as in fact. The same cannot be said of some of the other member countries of the O.E.E.C., who, while they accepted liberalisation in principle, failed to implement it in practice, by using discriminatory administrative and other devices to circumvent the decisions of the O.E.E.C. to which they had agreed. We should ensure that nothing like that will be allowed to occur without proper punitive measures being adopted.

Can the Minister say at this stage what is the Government view as to the future trading arrangements in Europe? What is our policy on these matters? Is it a fact that at present the discussions are suspended? Can the Minister say if the Government are taking any decision on what attitude to adopt with regard to the problem of the Six and the Seven? Do we intend to remain as one of the Five on the fringe of these decisions or do the Government take the view which was expressed some time ago by the French Foreign Minister, M. Couve de Murville, that the problem of the Six and Seven has lost some of its urgency?

Economic problems are influenced to a great extent by political considerations and so must be viewed from a political, as well as a commercial angle. Have the Government any views on what occurred at the recent Commonwealth Conference concerning this question? What progress has been made with the proposed remodelling of the O.E.E.C.? Do we agree with the proposed idea of a wider trading group embracing the existing members of the O.E.E.C. and including the United States and Canada, as well as other European countries which are prepared to join?

It is indeed satisfactory that the proposals which were enshrined in the tax reliefs granted in the Finance (No. 2) Act, 1956, have had such a beneficial and satisfactory effect on exports. We have always taken the view that no matter how insistent the exhortations, the urgings or the warnings may be, or how effective Ministerial influence on these matters may seem to be, when compared with practical inducements, they are of very little value. It was in recognition of that fact that the tax reliefs granted under the Finance (No. 2) Act, 1956, were introduced. We, as a Government, recognised that some practical stimulus should be provided which would encourage exports. Exports have shown that industrialists were either attracted by the possibility of increased profits, or compelled by reason of competition, to improve their methods or techniques and, in the last analysis, the most effective incentive was the prospect of greater gain and a bigger profit.

It is, therefore, human and natural to expect that the attractions which were enshrined in those tax reliefs, undoubtedly, had and are having a beneficial effect. I am glad the improvement and extension of these tax reliefs are being carried on by the Government. The increase in exports is, to a very considerable extent, due to the improved facilities provided in that measure. The fact that industrialists get tax remissions in respect of exports is, undoubtedly, an incentive which encourages people to seek new markets in the knowledge that the risks and the effort that work entails will bear fruit. If they succeed in securing these markets and greater business, and widening their trading arrangements, then the tax reliefs which flow will redound to the benefit of the manufacturer or the exporter.

It is, therefore, satisfactory to note that the incentives which were started at that time have been continued and improved.

I am glad the Government have recognised the value of our trade with Britain. It has been the traditional policy of this Party to recognise the value of that market as our biggest market and that whatever political differences may exist between the two countries should not in any way prevent the potentialities of that market being developed to the full. The recent trade agreement amending the earlier agreements continues that preferential situation. Trade now between the two countries amounts to over £200,000,000 per annum. That is a very considerable volume of trade and it undoubtedly benefits both countries to a very great extent. It is, therefore, important that we should not allow anything to prevent the full development of that trade and of the potential within it.

I was particularly interested in the Minister's reference to sugar because that is a matter which affects the export trade. One export which is of considerable value and which has grown and is growing each year is the export of chocolate and chocolate crumb. I mention that, recognising that the present position in so far as the manufacturers are concerned is not entirely satisfactory. I know the Minister and his predecessors have endeavoured to have that matter remedied but the fact that success has not yet been achieved is no reason why further efforts should not be made towards getting commodities with a sugar content freed from the levy which they have to bear in Britain. It is, I know, a problem which has been the subject of discussions between the Department of Industry and Commerce and the Board of Trade in Britain over a number of years.

It is undoubtedly unfair and contrary to the terms of our Trade Agreement to have a levy of that sort imposed on commodities with a sugar content exported to Britain. The chocolate crumb industry is most valuable from every angle. We provide a commodity of the highest quality from materials almost entirely produced here. The milk is drawn from many parts of the country. The influence of the industry is not confined, therefore, to a particular area or locality.

We pay tribute to the value of the dispersal of industry to employment. While the production of milk, in that sense, is not commonly regarded as an industry, the end product in respect of chocolate and chocolate crumb has the advantage that the producers are spread over many parts of the country and the benefits flow to farmers and workers throughout different areas. I should like, therefore, to urge the importance of pressing for the removal of this levy on commodities with the sugar base.

The manufacturers have shown most commendable enterprise and initiative in securing a market for this commodity. Its quality is second to none. The fact that they have built up an export trade in Britain and elsewhere, but particularly in Britain where they compete on less than favourable terms, is a tribute to their ingenuity and to the spirit which characterises their work and efforts.

The development of the tourist industry has attracted interest in this country and elsewhere. I urge the Minister and his Department to encourage through Bord Fáilte or any other organisation an increase in the growth of conferences during the off-season. For quite some time now, this country has become notable as a centre for conferences many of which are held in tourist areas. Many are held when tourists normally do not visit the country. While, of necessity, some are held during the summer and holiday season a number are held during the off-season or at the commencement or the end of the normal tourist season.

It is difficult to exaggerate the effect of a large conference. If a conference is held in Dublin, Dún Laoghaire, Bray, Killarney, or some other tourist resort, the fact that a large number of delegates congregate—in some cases as many as a thousand attend a conference—means business not only to the hotels and guest houses but indirectly to shopkeepers and traders in the locality.

Over and above the immediate benefits from a conference there is always the likelihood, in fact the certainty, that somebody who comes here on a business trip or as a delegate— or a group of delegates to a conference or gathering—will at a later stage re-visit our country as a tourist. If the needs of people who attend these conferences are satisfied in respect of accommodation and catering, we send away a satisfied customer. If such a person came here specifically on a business undertaking, limited in the period of time he could spend here, probably limited in the amount of money he could spend here, whether the stay was long or short if he was impressed by the standard of services provided, by the friendliness of the welcome, by the efficiency with which undertakings are carried on here, then, when he returns to his country, he will act as an unofficial ambassador or agent for further visits.

The tourist trade is very valuable from many angles. Over a great number of years we have sought different methods of developing it— some successful and some not so successful. It is often a matter of speculation whether the money spent on publicity, promotion, and so on, is bringing a commensurate return. It is not always possible to measure in strictly monetary terms the actual return in respect of these promotional activities. On the other hand, when conferences are held no effort should be spared to make them a success. In so far as the country generally is concerned, the advantage of endeavouring to have the conference held during the off-season means that we extend, maybe in a particular place, maybe in a number of places at the same time, the actual tourist season.

I was interested to hear the Minister give some facts about the grants in respect of hotel accommodation and also in respect of resort development for tourist areas. It is generally recognised that the grants in respect of accommodation are appreciated and that many hoteliers and guest house owners have availed of them and provided increased and more up-to-date accommodation. It has always struck me that one of the deterrents to a far greater expansion and improvement in hotel accommodation is the fear of revaluation.

No matter what direct grants or what reliefs may be given in respect of the provision of better bedroom accommodation or other facilities, the fact that a hotel is liable to be revalued has a deterring effect. It has had a deterring effect on shopkeepers and traders in respect of improving their premises. While this may not strictly be a matter for the Minister's Department, it is, in respect of grants under his Department, appropriate to it for the reason that some consideration should be given, in consultation between the Department of Industry and Commerce, Bord Fáilte and the Valuation Office, to cases in which revaluation occurs. If a person wants merely to modernise a place or to carry out minor repairs or improvements, he should not be deterred by fear of a possible revaluation. I suggest that that should be the subject of discussion between the Department and Bord Fáilte, probably in collaboration with the Valuation Office.

One of the features of the past year is the rise, in recent months particularly, in the cost of living. I note the Minister's remarks in connection with wage increases. While wage increases over the past year—the seventh round —have embraced a very wide range of employees or workers, they are of little value if followed immediately by a rise in prices. Price stability should be the aim of employers, employees and the Department.

It is significant that for the past three years—this is the third year running—there has been a fall in the import price level. Despite that fall, the cost of living, after being stable for a period, has again shown signs of increasing particularly, as I say, in respect of articles which are regarded as being within the cost of living index, or the consumer price index, and more especially the essentials of life. I am not one of those who ever had great faith in the effectiveness of price control. In the long run, supply and demand and the play of economic factors will determine the price level, but it is extraordinary that for the third year running there has been a fall in the import price level and that we have had such a substantial increase in the price of essential commodities, particularly bread and butter.

The fact that wage increases have been granted has undoubtedly had an effect elsewhere. In many cases the same sections who have been obliged to pay more for bread and butter have also had to pay more for bus fares and, in some cases, more for health charges. Surely it is in the national interest that there should be an overall policy to deal with this problem of wage increases and price increases in certain commodities. Some effort should be made to ensure that, in so far as the consumers generally are concerned, prices and wage changes should only take effect where it is proved that there is a definite case for a justifiable increase in salaries and wages, or the price of particular commodities.

I believe that we have here the peculiar circumstance that despite a fall in the import price level we have to some extent a domestic price inflation, certainly in respect of these essential commodities. The fact that that situation has developed is a contributing factor in continuing some of the problems that exist here. It will undoubtedly react, to a considerable extent, on the prospects of industrial price levels and on the prospect of securing a footing on export markets. One of the effects of this has been that for many people it is harder to live. While many sections have secured wage and salary increases, for others prices have increased without any conmensurate increase in their emoluments.

I was interested in the announcement regarding the proposed Shannon Estuary scheme. I am anxious to know is this a different scheme to that proposed to the Minister's predecessor. As I understood it, some time ago the previous Minister was not enthusiastic about, if he did not actually reject, a proposal made to him in this regard. Quite recently an announcement was made that a new company had acquired a great deal of property at the Shannon Estuary and that a proposal had been made which would be developed over a period. I should like to hear details of that scheme from the Minister and what the proposals envisage compared with the scheme discussed with his predecessor some time ago.

First, I should like to ask the Minister a few questions. He told us in the course of his speech that a licence had been issued to the company which was permitted to explore the possibility of oil deposits in this country and he indicated that, subject to the completion of some other formalities, the way would be clear for the commencement of the work. Can the Minister give us any indication at this stage as to when the company is likely to start operations; whether it is likely to start in a particular area in the first instance or whether it is going to carry on simultaneous geophysical operations in different parts of the country? I should also like to know whether it is the company to which the prospecting licence has been given which will do the work of prospecting or whether there are any proposals whereby the work will be done by some other company which so far has not appeared in the picture.

The Minister also referred to our mineral development here and indicated that the affairs of the St. Patrick Copper Mining Company had been discussed in the Dáil some time ago. That is true but I should like the Minister to say what, in his view, are the prospects of the continued profitable activities of the company in Avoca. The market price for copper is now above the level at which they indicated, in the first instance, about 1955 or 1956, that they believed they could make the winning of copper in Avoca an economic proposition. Is that view still held?

The Minister also indicated that certain mining activities were still being carried on in Allihies but so far the activities there have not been put on a commercial basis. Would the Minister indicate whether any decision is likely to be taken in the immediate future not merely in regard to the mining prospects for minerals in Allihies but to bring development to the stage where the minerals will be made marketable and a company formed for the purpose of winning copper for export to foreign markets? I should further like to know if there are any other mining groups operating in other parts of the country and if so where. Is there any evidence generally that new groups are anxious to get a licence to prospect for minerals in different parts of the country in view of the new facilities available to mining companies from the standpoint of special tax concessions?

The Minister referred to industrial production. He said he was glad to be able to report that industrial production had shown a marked recovery in 1959, as compared with 1958. That is true, there has been an improvement in 1959 as compared with 1958. While I welcome any and every improvement in industrial production, as Deputies on all sides must, nevertheless I want to repeat that I think quite a relatively small percentage increase in industrial production appears to have some mesmerising effect upon us and we seem to think that a small percentage increase is something about which we are entitled to be elated for a long period. It should operate only in such a way as to encourage us to recognise the vast distance we still have to travel to bring industrial production to a level that will afford increased employment and an improved standard of living.

While we talk about 1959 showing an improvement over 1958, let us have the sober reflection that if you take the figures published in the Grey Book issued by the Central Statistics Office, you find that the index number as to the volume of production in 1959 is stated to be 106.9 but if you look at the figure for 1955, you find that it is 107.8. In 1954, it was 105. If you take 1959 and say that it is your last recorded achievement, you find that the figure for all industries and services is 106.9 but in 1955, it was 107.8. It is true that there was a drop in production in the meantime, but if you stand on 1959 and look back over the vista of the previous five years, you find that, in fact, for all industries and services, our production in 1959 was less than it was five years ago.

While we can rejoice that the 1959 figures are above those for 1958, it must be a constant reminder to us that we are far from being out of the wood so long as the rate of progress shows that our volume of production is less than it was five years ago. I do not want to attribute responsibility to anybody for that or to blame anybody for it. We are all grievously affected by terrific happenings outside this country over which we have very little control but that is very little consolation to any of us. What we have to do is harness the whole endeavours of the nation to a realisation of the enormous amount of work that has yet to be done if we are to pull ourselves up from what we are today, probably the least developed country in Western Europe.

When we go to the Common Market, we cannot stand the pace they set. When we go to the European Free Trade Association, we find that these people are well ahead of us not only from the standpoint of volume of production but also from the standpoint of tempo of production. We are bracketed with the undeveloped five which have to be constantly championed by these commercial giants because we have not reached the stage of industrial manhood and we must seek their pity and sympathy in order to help us to develop ourselves. We have to try to grow out of that position as quickly as we can. It is not a position which arouses any great envy nor is it likely to get us much sympathy from countries in whose outlook and make-up sympathy is a very tiny ingredient indeed.

It is not sufficient for a Minister, a Party or a Government, or even for a people, to say that our production is up over last year. What we have to do is to tell our people how much more it must go up if we are to maintain the standard of living of today, much less to secure the substantial improvement which is evident in other countries in the free world in consequence of their improved methods of production and expansion in their industrial output.

This brings me to the portion of the Minister's speech in which he makes reference to the possibility of increasing our exports to Great Britain. I agree with every word he said. Here we have beside us a country with a population of nearly 55,000,000 people, with the lowest rate of unemployment in Europe, speaking the same language as ourselves, with a common banking system operating between the two countries, with commercial practices and methods understood in both countries, a country in which we are welcome and yet our greatest difficulty has been to get into that market which is less than 60 miles distant from our shores.

We have a right under the Trade Agreement of 1938 and the other trade agreements which followed it to send practically all our industrial goods into Great Britain free of duty, with no levy and no duty. No other country in the world enjoys in relation to a neighbour the size of Great Britain the enormous industrial advantages which we enjoy of having the right to export our industrial products free of duty into such a valuable market. We are the greatest industrial mugs in the world if we do not realise that what we should be doing today is not looking to the far ends of the world for exports of a non-economically remunerative character, with doubtful prospects of payment for the goods, but gearing up our whole machinery here for the purpose of sending goods into the British market. There is an abundance of money there; we are welcome there; we can get into it duty free; and it is no distance from us. There is nothing to prevent our exporting into that market, if we have the necessary energy, initiative and determination to get into it.

Our costs of production are probably less than those in Britain. We have an abundance of intelligent labour which is easy to train; we have tax concessions in the fact that we have no income tax on profits made in the export market; and we have the right to sell in the British market in competition with British producers if we only get out and try to secure that market.

While we have in this country very many excellent industrialists, people who are restless in their search for new markets, people who are anxious to push the sale of their goods wherever they can and many of whom have created substantial exports to the British and other markets, there is still a substantial number of people who feel that they are all right on the home market, who are quite satisfied with their present volume of production and who allow inertia and laziness to cloud their minds when it comes to expanding their production for sale in the export market. It must be the task not only of the Government but of all Parties, public men and institutions concerned with extending the entire economy, never to cease reiterating that it is vital for the development of our economic life that we should retain our place in Europe as a developed nation, that we should expand our economy to such an extent that any and every opportunity of finding export markets for our products will be availed of.

In respect of tariffed industries, particularly, I do not think it is unreasonable for the Government and the people to say: "You got a tariff for the purpose of helping you against foreign competition, particularly of an unreasonable kind. You have enjoyed that for a period of years. Your infancy is over; your adolescence has passed by and you have grown to industrial manhood. We now expect you to show us in a concrete way what you propose to do if you have not already started to find an export market for your products."

The whole country will, I am sure, support a demand of that kind, that these people who have got substantial tariffs should be trustees for the nation of our ability to survive and it is not therefore unreasonable as part of that trusteeship to expect them to endeavour to sell their goods on a competitive market instead of being satisfied to shelter behind high tariffs and sell their goods in the easiest market in the world, the home market, where they are protected from the wintry blasts of external competition.

I hope the Minister, when replying to this debate, will emphasise in a more definite way than he did by the delicate and elegant language of his opening speech, that the country expects industrialists to try to rise to the occasion, not merely in the national interest but in the interest of their survival. I have said in this House on many occasions during the past few years that the growth of the Common Market plus the Free Trade Area held out a menacing challenge to this country. I did not say and I do not believe that the challenge is a mortal one from our point of view but it could be a mortal challenge. We can do either of two things in regard to that challenge; we can either go down before it in sheer laziness and ineptitude or we can do some re-thinking and try to plan how best we can ward off the most dangerous barbs which are likely to come from an economically integrated Europe flanked by a Free Trade Area or what may be even worse still, the effects of two rival trading groups in Europe, of mammoth proportions compared with us, which may again prove as big a menace to us as the original concept of a common market.

I am wondering what the Government has in mind about these two trading groups. I appreciate the difficulty in coming to a decision, particularly in a changing situation and especially when you cannot come to that decision on your own, where you must have close regard to what is done by Britain in view of our interchange of trade and our industrial relations with her. It is quite clear there is no value to us in going into the Common Market. Nobody has ever attempted to say that association with the Common Market and with these relative industrial giants who comprise it will be beneficial. Nobody can say either that there is any advantage offering from the association with the European Free Trade Association, otherwise known as the Outer Seven, because they buy virtually nothing from us of an industrial character. If we were in the Outer Seven and reduced our tariffs by ten per cent. per annum, which I think is the percentage envisaged, by 1970 we would be in a group which would be entitled to send all its products into this country and sell them without the slightest impediment from the point of view of protective tariffs.

I wonder what anybody, for example in the paper-manufacturing trade, would think of the prospects of being able to stand up against Swedish paper exports to this country in a situation in which there were no tariffs against Swedish paper imports. Many of our other industries would go to the wall because of sheer inability, as they stand now, to face competition of that kind.

We still have some time in which to plan and the very fact that some of our industrialists can get a foothold in the British market and even find markets overseas is evidence that we require a technique, a spirit of adventure and a determination to succeed if we are to establish ourselves satisfactorily and in a rewarding way in these export markets.

The Minister is entitled to remind industrialists, not those with initiative and enterprise but those who are doing nothing to find an export market of the necessity for finding markets for their exports and that that is an obligation on them in view of the protection which the nation as an institution and the public as consumers have bestowed on those industries since they first came into operation.

I want to come back and ask the Minister if he can tell us what is the latest Government reasoning or outlook on our position vis-á-vis the European Free Trade Area or vis-á-vis the Common Market. The Free Trade Area has its first tariff reduction next July and the Common Market has its second tariff reduction next July, unless the reduction is postponed to a later date. In the meantime we are outside undecided and our next door neighbour is a member of one of these groups.

While we have excellent opportunities for our exports to the British market, because there are no tariffs on our industrial exports, we have to remember that ten years hence every country associated with Britain in the Free Trade Area will also be entitled to send their goods into the British market with no tariff against those goods. Therefore, by 1970, in respect of our exports to Britain, we shall be in precisely the same position as all the members in the Outer Seven so far as the British market is concerned, on the assumption—and I think it is a reasonable one—that all the members of the Outer Seven will lower their tariffs by 10 per cent each year.

The year 1970 seems to be a crucial one for us. We have ten years in which to face up to the challenge which 1970 will not only throw out but which will arise, perhaps, to a less painful extent, in all the years between now and 1970. The Minister will render a very valuable public service—indeed, this whole House will render a very valuable public service —if his voice is raised, if necessary, in a rather alarming way, to show the necessity for our people availing of the time which is still there to equip themselves not merely to make competitive exports to the British and other markets but to build up in these other countries that personal friendship, that commercial understanding and that knowledge of one another which is so necessary if trade relations are to be preserved. Very frequently they are preserved between one firm and another merely by the personal contacts and good fellowship which exist between the exporter and the importer.

I was glad to hear the Minister refer to the extent to which foreign investment is likely to be available here. I remember in 1955, when I made a speech in Germany pointing out the advantages to German industrialists and others of coming into the Irish market and producing goods here for export, there was an unholy cry raised by a substantial number of people who are now converted to the idea of having foreign capital and technical know-how invested in this country.

Hear, hear!

Every half-baked sea-green incorruptible in the country got up on his hind legs to say that this meant the end of our independence. One has only to look at the Dáil Reports to see how shallow human minds can be when the performances of 1955 are looked at through the broader and wider spectacles and more intelligent minds of 1960.

Everybody now believes that it is desirable to have foreign investment here. Every country in the world is on the rampage to try to get foreign investment. Everybody wants foreign investment, as a means by which other people can put their money into your industries to develop your industries, to provide employment for your people which you are unable to do yourself and to give you wealth by establishing in your country wealth-producing processes and wealth-producing machinery. There were some green-eyed people in 1955 who thought that was national apostacy. Now the Minister for Industry and Commerce—I am glad to congratulate him—says it is a highly desirable thing to do.

The Deputy is surely forgetting the 1952 Undeveloped Areas Act in which this concept is fully realised?

If one looks at the debates on the Undeveloped Areas Act, the extent to which the subject of foreign investment figured in the speech at that time will be seen.

That whole idea was behind it.

The whole idea was to get people to establish industries down there. I told the Industrial Development Authority to go to Sweden first and then Belgium, Holland, Italy, America and any place where they could find industrialists who would establish industries here. I believe it is better for an Irishman to be working in a factory here financed by foreign investment than working in a factory in a country with an outlook dissimilar in many respects from the one it is desirable to maintain for him.

We are all agreed now that foreign investment is something which is highly desirable. In 1955, it was rank apostacy. Now we are all converted to the idea that it is really what we want to get. There are outside industrialists with plenty of money and technical know-how and with the resources which will enable them to export to the foreign markets. That, we now believe, is the method by which we can best expand our economy and develop our industries. Every one of the countries in the Common Market and the European Free Trade Association has done that and nobody did it with more perfection than the Dutch people themselves. We are now engaged in trying to induce the Dutch to benefit substantially by that enlightened outlook. We are now engaged in advising them to come over and share with us some of the technical resources they have in abundance, hoping to offer them the advantages of being able to trade from Ireland with countries with which we have exceptionally favourable trading relations and we provide substantial benefits and bounties for those who produce and export. I hope we shall continue that policy. I think it is a sound intelligent policy.

One of the great difficulties here— the Minister knows this as well as I do; the I.D.A. knows it as well and so does Foras Tionscal—frequently has been not the getting of the money to establish an industry but the getting of reliable people who know how to run the industry and how to engage in the industrial processes. So long as we can get the technical know-how from anywhere to produce here, not in competition with our Irish industrialists, goods which are not produced here and to find foreign markets for these goods it cannot but pay substantial dividends for the benefit of the whole nation.

I should like to ask the Minister what is the present position in respect of the export of certain textiles to Britain. The position is that where the article undergoes a certain degree of processing here, say 50 per cent., it can be permitted to be exported free of duty into Britain. Where the article contains a synthetic element, then its export into Britain free of duty is not permitted. I think that has been carried to absurd extremes.

I came across a case of people who were exporting ladies' shoes to England. The shoes were excellent. The firm in question had a substantial order for them. To embellish the shoes, they put on a little bow on the front. The bow was made of man-made fibre and, although the shoes were free of duty, the little bow was dutiable. Because the little bow, which was not worth twopence, was dutiable, the pair of shoes, costing nearly £2, was dutiable. That operates as well, I understand, even where a man-made fibre is used for no other purpose than sewing or where it represents an insignificant fragment of the end product. I have no doubt that representations on this matter have been made to the British Board of Trade. I should like to inquire from the Minister what is the latest position in that respect? Is there any indication that there will be an early and satisfactory conclusion to whatever negotiations are under way at the moment?

The Minister referred to a fall in unemployment this year as compared with last year. There, again, I think we are inclined to be mesmerised by figures and to take consolation out of something which, on closer examination, is found to be a source of disconsolation rather than consolation. There is no doubt in the world that emigration last year was heavier than in previous years. I have no doubt, as a result of the letters which have reached me and as a result of what I hear about other constituencies, that there was a very considerable volume of emigration in 1959. I do not think there can be any doubt about it. Deputies who refuse to confirm it, in their own experience, must be living in the clouds.

I shall come back again to the Grey Book, which is neither my production nor my Bible. In Table 16, on page 27, this book shows the unemployment position down through the years. Table 16 gives the estimated number of persons at work in the main branches of non-agricultural economic activity in the years 1951 to 1959. Whatever flaws there may be over a period of a decade, they must be as common to one year as to another. In 1959, the total at work in non-agricultural economic activity was 692,000. In 1955, it was 726,000. If you take the Grey Book as your Bible, you find that there were 726,000 engaged in non-agricultural economic activity in 1955 and the number had fallen to 692,000 in 1959. If we take the number at work, we can see at once that the fall in unemployment to which the Minister referred is not due to the fact that more people are working; these figures are a refutation of that statement. The fall, therefore, can be due to one cause only—mass emigration.

I saw in the papers the other day where the Bishop of Cork, the Minister's constituency, was appalled at the exodus not of individuals but of whole families from his diocese. He referred to areas with which he is familiar, to parishes in which he knows the population, and he gave particulars of the fall in population in these parishes and of the number of houses where the key was turned in the door and the entire family had gone. He confessed himself as startled with the situation created by this mass exodus from that one area alone. That diocese has, of course, no monopoly as far as its contribution to the export of human beings from this country is concerned. Every other constituency can tell the same tale. While looking at the position with one eye, one can, perhaps, find consolation because of a statistical drop in the number of unemployed but when one comes to find out where they have gone, one finds that they are not employed here.

Hear, hear!

The Grey Book published by the Taoiseach's Department says they are not employed in Ireland. The mistake we are making is in imagining that those who leave the labour exchange go into jobs here. Too many of them have gone to jobs in Britain. Too many of them have emigrated to the Western Hemisphere. We have to ask ourselves now: what is the national policy in relation to this matter? Shall we go on trying to get jobs for our people in order to keep them here? I understood that was the old Sinn Féin policy, the policy of continuing the concept of Ireland as a motherland. Or shall we sit back and give up the struggle? Shall we admit we have been beaten in the struggle over the past 40 years? Shall we give it up now? Does anybody suggest that, instead of trying to provide more work, we should settle down now to a concept of Ireland with a population of less than 2,500,000 people, and no unemployment because there will always be a certainty of sufficient jobs for a small population; there are always jobs to be done, jobs which can neither be suppressed nor ignored. What is the Government's policy? Is it to keep our people in jobs in Ireland? Is it to rest satisfied with the continued emigration of our people, hoping apparently to reach a stage in which so many will have gone that there will be enough jobs for the survivors, and perhaps a better standard of living as well? I merely ask on this Estimate of the Minister responsible for the principal activities in the economic field what is the Government's policy in this respect? What concept have they? Are they satisfied with continued emigration and a resultant fall in unemployment at home, confident, as they must be, that these people have got jobs not in Ireland, but in Britain and elsewhere throughout the world?

I should like to indicate my approval of one aspect of the Minister's speech. The Minister referred to increased production. He is perfectly right in saying that we shall get increased production only by an enlightened management, on the one hand, and by an understanding on the part of the workers of what increased production means, on the other. One thing you must do, so far as the workers are concerned: you must demonstrate to them that increased production will not mean that they will be idle all the sooner. They must be shown that increased production will not mean idleness and the labour exchange. They must have it demonstrated to them that increased production is not merely of value to the employer but also of benefit to the nation, to the worker, and to the consumer.

The sooner we can get all sections to recognise the vital necessity for collaboration in the field of increased industrial production, because it means a bigger and better slice of the cake for all, the sooner we shall approach the fundamental solution to this problem. Again, this is something which has to be said every day in the week. It will fall on stony ground in many instances, but it is the only dependable way in which we can get an intelligent approach to the problem of increased production, which, properly devised, will make not only for increased wealth but for a better standard of living for the workers and a better life for the consumer.

I move to report progress.

Progress reported; Committee to sit again.
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