asked the Minister for Agriculture what is the new basis of grading of Grade A pigs; and what effect this will have on the price received by producers, bearing in mind the averages of pigs presented to factories over the past year.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Grading of Pigs.
21.
As announced early last month, the changes in the Grade A bacon pig standard will be as follows:—
From 9th April, 1962.
The maximum fat measurements at shoulder, mid-back and loin are each being reduced from 2" (approximately 50¾ millimetres) in the case of the shoulder to 49 millimetres (approximately 1 15/16th inches), and from 1 3/16th inches (approximately 30 millimetres) in the case of the loin and mid-back to 29 millimetres (approximately 1? inches).
From 1st October, 1962.
The maximum fat measurement at the shoulder will be further reduced from 49 millimetres to 48 millimetres.
From 7th January, 1963.
A minimum carcase length requirement of 775 millimetres will be introduced. There is no minimum length requirement for Grade A at present.
From 2nd September, 1963.
The minimum carcase length requirement will be increased from 775 millimetres to 780 millimetres.
The effect which these changes will have on the price received by pig producers will depend on the steps taken by the producers to adapt feeding and breeding practices so as to market their pigs in conformity with the revised standards. About 57 per cent. of the pigs graded at bacon factories in 1961 were of Grade A, an additional 14 per cent. being of Grade A Special. It is not, of course, possible to say what percentage of pigs would have graded A according to the new standards if those standards had been effective during the past year.
Is it correct to say that these alterations in grading specifications will operate to reduce the average price paid for what are now Grade A and Grade A 1 pigs by anything from 10/- to 15/- per cwt?
I have told the Deputy it is not possible to say what effect the change proposed would have had if applied to the pigs that have passed through the bacon factories for the past twelve months. However, this change has not been effected to impose any hardship whatever on the producer but because of the suggestion that the type of bacon which we were presenting in the British market had the effect, especially at periods of glut, of depressing the market further. These steps are being taken because they are believed to be necessary in order to safeguard our bacon position there.
However excellent the intention of the Minister for Agriculture may be, does the Minister not know as well as I know that the net end result for the producer in this country will be a reduction of something between 10/- and 15/- per cwt. in the average price for pigs, and is that not a very grave step to take?
I know nothing of the kind but I do know that from 1955, when grading was first introduced, the percentage of Grade A pigs received at bacon factories was 54 per cent in 1955; in 1956 it rose to 62 per cent.; in 1957 to 67 per cent.
The Minister does not need to tell me of these achievements. I was responsible for them.
In 1958 it was 71 per cent.; in 1959, 67 per cent.; in 1960, 68 per cent., including 11 per cent. A specials; in 1961, 71 per cent., including 14 per cent. A specials. When that method of grading was introduced, the producers were able so to order their business as to bring about the changes that are reflected in these percentages, and it was visualised at all times that further steps would be required along this line so as to put our bacon in a competitive position in the British market. All those people who have close association with the problems that are there agree that this process is necessary. The changes that are proposed have been made in the mildest form possible having regard to the fact, of course, that some inconvenience and, perhaps, some loss will be experienced by producers. However, I cannot say, nor could the Deputy say, with any degree of accuracy what that might amount to in shillings or pence.
Is it not manifest that the introduction of grading and the gradual encouragement of the people to co-operate produced dramatic results and that a further step was taken by the present Minister when he introduced Grade A1 with a premium? Does he imagine that by adopting an entirely different method now, which I suggest to him is a repudiation of the undertaking given not to reduce the price of pigs without six months' notice to the producers, he will get results comparable with those achieved by the steps taken by myself and by himself? I suggest to him that the result of trying to sneak in by the back door a reduction in the average price of pigs in violation of a guarantee which I gave and he confirmed, not to reduce prices without six months' notice, will be nothing but bitter resentment among the farming community.
I have examined this proposal from that aspect, too, and I have satisfied myself completely that what I am proposing does not in any way interfere with the assurance given to the producers. That is one side. On the other side, I am bound as Minister, in consultation with my officials and advisers and those who are experienced in the trade and as a result of our contacts with the British at an official level, to take such steps as gradually and as carefully as I can to ensure that the market will be there for us and for the producer. It is in their interests that these steps are being taken.
Could the Minister not apply these——
I cannot allow this to develop into a debate.
I wish to ask one final question. Could the Minister not apply these higher grade specifications for the time being to Grade A1 giving six months' notice that at the end of six months these specifications may spread beyond grade A1?
The Minister could, of course, sit back, allow this problem to roll along——
I am not asking the Minister to sit back. I am asking him to apply this to the premium grade.
——and not face up to the responsibility that a Minister has. As Minister, I am naturally in possession of the facts of the case. I can assure the House that every interest concerned in this has been given an opportunity to discuss the matter in the greatest detail and it is in order to meet everybody to the fullest extent consistent with the discharge of my responsibilities that I have levelled this process out as delicately as I possibly could. While doing that and while anxious to break the fall, I had a responsibility here and this is an effort to discharge it.
Does the Minister not agree——
I cannot allow this to develop into a debate. There have already been half a dozen questions.
I am asking only one supplementary.
What is that?
It is the sum total that I am thinking of.
Does the Minister not agree it is unfair to introduce these standards before we have the breeding stock in the country that will give the length of carcass required?
If we were to wait to make changes until everything was laid on so that nobody would feel the effects of it, we would wait a very long time.
We did not wait very long to bring in grading in the first place and we did is successfully.