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Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 27 Apr 1967

Vol. 228 No. 3

Committee on Finance. - Resolution No. 4—General (Resumed).

Debate resumed on the following motion:
That it is expedient to amend the law relating to customs and inland revenue (including excise) and to make further provision in connection with finance.
—(Minister for Finance).

Before Question Time, I was praising the merger of Erin Foods and Heinz Foods in the interests of the Irish farmer. I referred to the price of fertilisers. I should like the Minister to have a good look at the present method of distribution of grants to farmers. I should like a thorough investigation as to whether the money really finds its way into the farmer's pocket or whether, between the Department and the farmer's gate, a large amount of it is absorbed in keeping Department men from the point of view of a time process, travelling expenses, and so on. I hope the Minister will look into this. I know it is his intention to have a good look at all methods of distribution regarding grants and other benefits at present available to the farming community.

We welcome, again, the announcement about post-primary education. This was no idle boast on the part of the Minister for Education. It is now about to be put into practice. I appeal to those schools which have not yet entered the scheme to do so as quickly as possible. I appeal to parents who will be circularised by such schools as to whether or not they wish to participate in the free education scheme not to hesitate to give their consent. I have no doubt that this scheme will be a success but, like many other schemes, it needs the full support of the Irish people to make it the overwhelming success which I am sure each and every Member of the House wishes it to be.

I trust that those schools which have not yet co-operated with the Minister will not delay and possibly, by doing so, hold up the implementation of the scheme some few weeks or maybe months. I should be very glad if, by the end of May, the Minister could announce that this scheme is on its way for implementation in September next. Approximately 56 per cent of the schools in the city of Dublin are prepared to participate in the scheme. Although some have already opted out, those who are considering it should give a quick decision so that the scheme may be put into effect without further delay.

I welcome the increase in the pensions for public servants—gardaí, teachers and other people who gave very loyal service to this country and who, down the years, were somewhat unrecognised by virtue of the fact that we treated them as civil servants. I am very pleased that particular attention is being paid to these people in this Budget.

I was more than surprised at the low level of discussion in this debate. I was more than surprised to see members of the Fine Gael Party and the Labour Party taking the Budget debate as an opportunity to cast aspersions on Government Ministers, and to cast a slight on the Government. We are not intolerant of all criticism on this side of the House; we are prepared to accept criticism, but let it be constructive criticism. Let Fine Gael and the Labour Party, commonly known as the Opposition, offer something constructive, and let them not have within themselves a general feeling that everything the Government do is wrong. I do not suggest for one minute that nobody at some time or another makes a mistake; the thing is that if you make a mistake you must be prepared to rectify it. The Fine Gael Party should remember this and try to offer something constructive during the debate. They should not be persistently dragging it out just for the sake of speaking, or just for the sake of giving maltreatment to Government Ministers or to the Government as a whole.

Each year, and this year is no exception, this debate is availed of by Deputies to take stock of Government policy and of the general national situation. Apparently some Fianna Fáil Deputies feel that our treatment of the Government, of the Fianna Fáil Party, and of Ministers who apparently wish to be wrapped in cotton wool, has been unduly severe. I want to assure the Deputy who has just concluded that, despite his protestations, we on this side of the House will continue to point out their mistakes with vigour and energy, to demand from Ministers the highest standards of probity, and to demand from the Government the implementation of policies designed to achieve social justice.

A few days ago I saw a Fianna Fáil university magazine which was reprinted in some of the daily papers. It contained an expression of views by the Taoiseach as to where the Fianna Fáil Party stand politically. He expressed the view that they stand left of centre. Reading the Taoiseach's views, I was reminded of a statement made by the previous Taoiseach, Deputy Lemass—I think it was in 1963—when he said the time had come for the Fianna Fáil Party to take a definite step to the left. He had no sooner said that than the Government announced a pay-pause which was interpreted by the trade union movement as a new wage freeze.

Following the announcement of this wage freeze which caused dismay to the trade union movement in whose direction the Fianna Fáil Party had taken a certain step, there was a disowning of this document by the Government. The wage freeze was followed by the introduction of the turnover tax. We had this Fianna Fáil Party who had taken a sudden step to the left proceeding to tax the food of the people, and the ordinary things which every working man has to buy to keep body and soul together. I am sure a debate went on as to whether or not Fianna Fáil took a sudden turn to the left three years ago. If the experience of the past three years indicates what a turn to the left means in Fianna Fáil terms, the left had better watch out and so had everyone else.

This article to which I have referred also contained the views of Deputy Lemass. He is now a former Taoiseach. He is still a Member of the House. He is now so much wiser, and he disagrees with the Taoiseach. He does not think Fianna Fáil are left of centre. Oh, no. He says Fianna Fáil are middle of the road, so where are they? This is the Party which comprise the Government of the country today. The present Taoiseach thinks they are left of centre, and the former Taoiseach thinks they are middle of the road. Someone must decide for them. I would recommend that they might leave the decision to the members of Taca and see what view Taca take——

We are on the left-hand side of the Ceann Comhairle.

——as to whether or not Fianna Fáil are left of centre. The time will come when the Minister will temporarily occupy a seat on this side of the House and that will be the limbo before he leaves the House altogether. Taca may have a view as to what political philosophy now permeates the Fianna Fáil Party. I am suggesting there is none. I am suggesting that in relation to principle and political philosophy, the Fianna Fáil Party know just one thing, that is, to stay in office so long as they can, whether left, centre or right. No wonder the Taoiseach has one view and the former Taoiseach has another. No wonder the hardheaded ambitious politicians of the Fianna Fáil Party make a ready appeal to the percentage man in our community who is anxious to join a secret organisation for his own material advantage, and has enough money to pay £100 per year for six years to do so.

I should like to reiterate the abhorrence which has been expressed by decent-minded Deputies in this House with regard to the formation of this secret sign-giving organisation which is intended to cause further division amongst our people, and which is intended to create further little sources of political advantage in our community to puff up unimportant people as people of influence merely because they have £100 per year to pay to the Fianna Fáil Party for the benefit of getting Taca membership badges. I should like to say to the Minister for Finance who is apparently a prime mover behind this organisation that he has demonstrated the true colours of Fianna Fáil. He will live to rue the day that Taca first ticked because he will find that for every Taca tick there are a whole lot of other people who have enough responsibility and courage to stand on their own feet and not be beholden to any political party for their welfare. Fianna Fáil—left of centre. Fianna Fáil maintained in office, if the ambition of the Minister for Finance can contrive it, by the money of the few rich people and only concerned with achieving that end.

What about your champagne parties during the Presidential election?

There were no champagne parties.

There were in my constituency, at £100 a go.

I do not believe the Minister knows what he is talking about.

Deputy Belton ran them.

I was very glad during the Presidential election to go around and drink tea in many poor houses.

Indeed you did. You ran champagne parties and bunfights anywhere you were let.

I suggest that the Minister should try not to be cheap.

You brought politics to a new low ebb.

If I were in Fianna Fáil, I would forget about the Presidential election.

In any event the problems of philosophy and——

We know where you get your funds.

——these are problems for the Fianna Fáil Party——

I know where you get your funds.

I know where you went after the last Presidential election looking for funds.

Is the Minister making that as a personal remark?

The Fine Gael Party.

I would recommend the Minister to conduct himself.

I am not afraid of the Deputy. He need not threaten me.

When I start to threaten the Minister, he will die of fright.

He is doing that at the moment.

You are trying to wrap yourselves in a white sheet but you will not get away with it.

Whatever the difficulties of the Taoiseach and the former Taoiseach in trying to interpret the political principles of the Minister for Finance and other members of the Fianna Fáil Party, that is their problem.

I always distrust a man who parades his virtue.

Vilification in the O'Higgins tradition.

In regard to the——

We are proud of it.

Proud of your vilification and slander.

I should like to remind the Minister for Finance that I was in this House before him and I will be in it after he has left it, and I will not be shut up by him.

And the Deputy will not make charges of corruption without my answering them.

I have not made such a charge.

You have. That is all you are good for, the lot of you.

I recommend the Minister to remain there and perhaps he will hear something.

I will remain.

Incompetence —I make that charge to start with— incompetence by the Government in relation to their management of our affairs. The Minister for Finance recently took up this office. Before that, he was Minister for Agriculture and he left a wash in his wake.

What did you leave behind in 1956? You bankrupted the country.

I would ask the House to allow Deputy O'Higgins to make his statement without interruption.

I apologise.

He left turbulence behind him as Minister for Agriculture. Before that, he had been Minister for Justice. We all know the mistakes that were made then. He is now Minister for Finance. He is taking over an economy which has suffered harshly in the past two or three years at the hands of the Fianna Fáil Government. Three years ago this team of Ministers were so irresponsible in regard to the trust they had in the people that they allowed inflation to tear the heart from our economy. They were so concerned with having slush money poured around the place that they paid no attention to the damage which was likely to be caused to the savings and investments of our people and the money our people needed to earn: 1964—slush money and wild inflation, permitted and directed by the Fianna Fáil Party as the Government. They were only concerned at that time, as they always are, with achieving a situation in which they could win an election and remain in office. I call that incompetence. I call it a callous disregard for their responsibility to the people. They succeeded in winning an election in 1965 and we have had the two years since.

What does the Minister for Finance think of the Budget introduced in 1965? What does he think of the Budget introduced last year when it was pointed out from these benches that our economy was in such a deflated condition that it required an urgent shot in the arm? Instead of that, we had a March and a June Budget designed to cause a further depressing of our economy and create further unemployment. Of course, the Minister disowns all that in his Budget Statement. In effect, he says that mistakes were made last year. Of course they were, but it is not the members of this Government who have to pay for those mistakes but the unfortunate workers who lose their jobs or the unfortunate people who have felt hardship in the past 12 months. Mistakes were made by the Government last year when they adopted a wrong budgetary policy just because they were not capable of realising what the economy needed.

This year the OECD Economic Survey pointed to the need for a drastic change in budgetary policy and indicated that the economy needed an urgent relaxing of existing restraints if the economy was to be got going again. So we have the new Minister and the new Budget. He has received a lot of praise from his Party for this Budget. When this debate started, I indicated that it was a Budget formed and fashioned by public opinion, and I repeat that. I do not believe the Minister had much choice as to what he would do. He had to provide something for the farmers; he had to provide something for social welfare recipients, especially following the doubtful gimmick of a notional 5/-increase last year. These things he had to do, but above all, in accordance with the OECD advice, he had to do something to get our economy expanding again. To the extent that what he had to do was done, we welcome certain measures in the Budget but we should remind the Minister, the Government and the House, that by reason of the mistakes and incompetence shown over the past few years, there are very serious problems now facing the country.

The Second Programme for Economic Expansion—how often was it talked of by Fianna Fáil Party members a few years ago? It was to be a blueprint for prosperity. It represented the collective wisdom of the Fianna Fáil Party. Where is it now, this Programme which was to provide some 85,000 new jobs. This is the end of the third year of that Programme and there are 14,000 fewer people working in Ireland today than when it started. We are now 50,000 short of the target and we are still supposed to look with admiration on Ministers talking economic theories and referring to the Report on Full Employment from the NIEC as if that were something cogent of achievement in our circumstances. We are slipping back; fewer people are at work each year. We are not advancing towards the achievement of any goal or any aim simply because of the inefficiency and incompetence of the Government, failure by the Government to observe the discipline necessary to achieve their own programme.

At the start of the Programme, the credit necessary to provide for worthwhile investment was dissipated. Inflation was allowed to attack the very foundations of this Programme and from inflation we slipped back into depression and the economy has gone backwards instead of forward. Employment is off target by 50,000. Our growth rate target according to the Programme was a 4.6 increase per year. It was 2.5 in 1965 and 1.1 in the year just concluded. The best we can hope to achieve in the coming year is a little over three per cent. Again, it is clear that the targets have disappeared as achievable aims and we are drifting along, hoping that things will get better with responsibility for direction in the hands of a group of Ministers who have no policy and, I believe, no political philosophy except to stay in office.

The Minister for Finance is hot under the collar. He thinks I am being unduly hard on him and on members of Fianna Fáil but I am not hard enough——

I do not mind his criticism of our policy or our competence but I will not take these charges of corruption. These I resent. Criticise my competence and policy as much as you like but I do not think you can expect me to sit and listen to these other charges.

I am attacking the forming of an organisation called Taca which I regard as reprehensible in our circumstances. If the Minister thinks that represents a charge of corruption, it is the hat he has made and he can wear it. Any political Party that is driven to the extreme of getting people interested in business to join a silent and secret organisation——

It is neither.

——and to pay money down for the doing of it, to parade themselves as fellows of influence, is reprehensible, in my opinion.

It is neither silent nor secret.

If the Minister regards that as corruption, it is his hat and he can wear it.

The Deputy used the word first.

The Minister used it.

I did not use the word first.

If the Minister looks at the record, he will find that he is in error. The employment and growth rate targets in our economy have disappeared as achievable aims. In the case of agriculture, Fianna Fáil Deputies are so thankful to the Minister for providing £5 million more for agriculture. I despair of that mentality. We have no agricultural policy whatever. The Government regard agriculture as something likely to give them a pain in the head and, like anybody who gets a pain in the head, they provide an aspirin or aspro from time to time to quiet it down. But where is the plan for agriculture? I do not believe there is any evidence of fresh, worthwhile thinking in the Fianna Fáil Party in regard to agriculture. Money is provided from time to time; schemes are introduced designed to get over a particular difficulty, a particular area of annoyance, such as the heifer scheme and so on. They are not part of any long-term plan. There has been no effort to devise an adequate investment plan for agriculture, to work out the proper place for our primary industry in the expected growth of our economy in the years ahead.

In relation to agriculture, this Budget is merely a repetition of what we have had so many times before: dole out some money to agriculture that will keep them quiet and we shall carry on until next year. Look at the record: over the past five years when every other country in the world, no matter what government or policy they followed, had increasing outputs and a rise in gross national product our output in the same period rose by only one per cent. That seems to be indicative of a Government who must be blamed because they have the responsibility, a Government who have just washed their hands of agriculture and left it there.

I do not want to talk about difficulties and dissensions in relation to agriculture. They are frequently symtomatic of an inner malaise, but I do call for some urgent thinking in relation to a proper balanced agricultural policy. Mistakes have been made and it is appalling to reflect on a situation in which there has been a break down of communication between the Government and those serving our major industries. I hope that will taper off and disappear because I am certain that this country cannot afford its continuance.

In relation to agriculture, it is well to remind the Minister and Deputies that there has been in this debate and the Budget Statement the usual reference to Europe. Does any member of the Government have any real comprehension of what Europe may mean to this country? If things go well, we may be in Europe in the next 24 to 30 months. From time to time there has been the usual ministerial speech about preparing. It is about time the Government started to prepare. If we go into Europe, it can be a Klondyke for Irish agriculture, provided the necessary steps are taken here and now, provided we know the kind of goods we should be selling and how we should sell them and provided farmers and the Government co-operate one with the other in working towards a proper export drive in the European market.

Of course, none of that is taking place. Individual Ministers are sitting on their dignity and many other people are behaving as if they had no knowledge of what this country requires. The result is dissension instead of preparation. The Government have a direct responsibility as trustees for the country to ensure that this situation ends as quickly as possible.

On the Second Programme for Economic Expansion, I do not know whether it will be officially buried or not. We got an indication some months ago from the Taoiseach that the Programme was ill, that its demise was expected soon and that a new Programme would take its place. When shall we have that new programme? It is perfectly clear that new targets must be started and that we must have a revised and attenuated series of targets if aims are to be attainable. I wonder when will we get that. If we do get it may I suggest to the Minister that in future, when these various reports come out at Budget time from his Department, from the NIEC and so on, they will contain a statement of progress each year towards the achievement of whatever new targets are put before us? If that is done, if the people can be convinced that the mistakes made so clearly and obviously during the last two or three years will not be repeated, if people can be convinced that whatever new Programme is announced is understood by the Government—that at least the Government are prepared to exercise the discipline necessary to achieve the targets—then progress can be made, I believe. But if we continue as we have up to the last three years, with Government decisions changing from month to month, with different financial policies being followed at different periods, with the Government giving the wrong lead and the wrong example, then I do not believe we can make progress.

As I pointed out before, it is interesting to note that the only target that has been reached in the Second Programme for Economic Expansion, the only target that has been covered has been that of taxation and the taxation level now is some seven per cent higher than was envisaged in the Programme for 1970. Is not that indicative of something very seriously wrong?

Apart from any criticism of progress under the Second Programme, there are many other things that require to be said and that should be said. We appear to be coming back into a cost of living problem. That should be appreciated in relation to the 5/- increase that Fianna Fáil Deputies are so proud about in relation to social welfare benefits. In fact, there has not been an increase for social welfare recipients since the Budget of 1965. We had an illusory 5/- last year and when all these unfortunate people stretched out their hands to grasp it they found it was not there.

During those two years there has been an increase of 16 per cent in the cost of living, a very marked and steep rise. I cannot say that what is being done this year for old age pensioners and other welfare recipients is anything more than simple justice, anything more than an effort to provide a reality in terms of money. I want to say a word about housing. Again, I hope no one will get hot under the collar.

Not on policy.

There has been talk from one member of the Government, the Minister for Local Government, about speculation in relation to land. I do not know what is behind all this, who is supposed to be codded by pious expressions on the one hand when, in fact, speculation is rife not only around the city but throughout rural Ireland. If a Fianna Fáil Minister is to be taken seriously about the speculator who buys land for development let him have a full examination. In my view it represents a matter of grave public concern. I recommend that there be a full investigation and a full disclosure because there is this to be said: we have a bottleneck now around Dublin city and around other parts of the country where there are centres of population because of serious Government neglect of drainage and the provision of amenities in the last decade or so. Money was not provided to develop land in the areas clearly mapped out for a growth in population. The result of that lack of attention, that inefficiency and that lack of planning, has been that now in the areas capable of development, where there are drainage and facilities, there is a Dutch auction with regard to the provision of lands suitable for development. Therefore, when the Minister for Local Government talked about clamping down on the speculators, he is talking about closing the stable door after the horse has gone.

So far as I know, in most places the land available for development has already been bought out. Those who bought it are selling it now in some places at £1,000 an acre for private building. I do not know whether that is advisable or not. One Deputy defended it here. Maybe it is defensible, but if it is, what is the purpose of the Minister for Local Government talking as if this were something he was going to end? Double talk gets no one anywhere.

I recommend to the Fianna Fáil Party, if they want to be taken seriously in this regard, that they put the full facts before all of us. Where is the development going to take place? What kind of plans are there to be to provide urgently and quickly the necessary amenities to allow building to progress in an orderly way without fancy profits being made by those fortunate enough to buy land well in advance of the need?

I notice with interest that in Britain they are establishing a Land Commission to deal with this problem. The new Land Commission regards its statutory duty to be to provide and make available developed lands for houses, to have a pool of developed land to prevent the large profits and the exorbitant demands because of the price of sites. We need something similar to that here. We certainly need a situation in which the Government take the people into their confidence and clearly indicate what help and assistance will be provided to get suitably developed lands available for future building.

Some of the things which are not in this Budget have already been pointed out. A number of Deputies mentioned the glaring omission this year in relation to a revision with regard to the implementation of a health policy. Just for the record, I think it should be said that certainly since 1961, if not longer, but so far as the records of this House are concerned, since 1961 we on these benches have persistently and consistently demanded the introduction of a health policy which would eliminate the defects of what we have at present.

Our demands were fobbed off by the establishment of a Select Committee which sat and doodled for close on three years achieving nothing except what was the real desire it should achieve—to silence the people on health. Then we had, just two years ago, the fandango of Deputy O'Malley, who danced in here as Minister for Health, waving a White Paper on Health before Deputies, promising much and telling us that his new health scheme, which contained about half of what we demanded, would be introduced by last November. It did not matter that in neither of the Budgets of last year was any provision made for health.

Even so we were to believe from Deputy O'Malley that somehow instant money would provide instant services for the people of this country by last November. I do not know what has happened to it. November is now part of our history and Deputy O'Malley, as Minister for Health, is also part of our history. Deputy Flanagan is now Minister for Health and the Minister for Finance holds the purse strings.

There is no provision in this Budget for a new health programme. There is nothing at all in it. We are going to carry on as we did in every year since 1961 with the creeping Victorian system of medicine we have had for almost 100 years. We are going to carry on with medical cards and the situation in which a person has to prove poverty in order to get urgent medical attention. We are going to carry on as the limping, poor relation of Europe with no money for health.

The money could not be provided last year because the Minister for Finance was facing a deficit. We all thought this year, with the Minister being able to announce a Budget surplus, that there would be provision for health. No—it has to be postponed: some other time, some other day. Again, I doubt the sincerity of those who act in this way. If there were a political philosophy in the Fianna Fáil Party, if they knew where they stood and had plans, those things would have been achieved long ago, but no. So far as this Government are concerned, it is apparent that what is boiling hard is the thing that is going to be dealt with.

That may change from time to time. If there had been a grave subject of controversy this year about health, then provision would have been made for health in this Budget. The people accepted the White Paper as indicating a promise and a commitment and are quite happy about it. They do not seem to realise that health is again forgotten. I think that is a tragedy and I have no doubt that it will be rectified in due course.

There is one matter in relation to health which I think should be recorded here. Perhaps the Minister can tell us, if he is still not hot under the collar when replying, what has happened to the freezing of rates. Last year the then Minister for Health, Deputy O'Malley, announced to Seanad Éireann that he had the Government's authority to say that he was going to freeze the impact of health services on the rates and that this was a necessary step he was taking just to carry over the short period before the implementation of his new health scheme. That is gone this year. Apparently that was a commitment that was only valid so long as Deputy O'Malley continued to be Minister for Health. I do not think that is right. If there were any semblance of a plan and real policy behind this Government, that kind of thing would not happen. But there it is. Whatever was said last year, the freeze is now off and in most cases the sky is the limit.

I think it right to say that Deputy O'Malley, now Minister for Education, is at least being consistent. He started off as Minister for Education having again read Fine Gael policy. As he did as Minister for Health, so he does as Minister for Education. I only hope that this time, as Minister for Education, he will see these things happen. I would like to wish very well his proposal which is our proposal, with regard to the future of University College, Dublin, and Trinity College. I think it is the only logical step to take and I believe that goodwill undoubtedly exists for the future which will be constructive and useful for both centres of learning.

Now, Sir, I have charged the Government with incompetence, incompetence because of the events of the past three years. It is not necessary to go back further than that. I charge them with a lack of policy. I do so because their policy and their programme was supposed to be the Second Programme which has now been completely torn asunder and forgotten and has been replaced by nothing—incompetence, without a policy. They have been staggering along from crisis to crisis, producing gimmick after gimmick, endeavouring to paper over a variety of different crises, and all the time the economy has been suffering and more and more people are going out of work. We are getting poorer month by month and we cease to measure up to what will be required of us in competition with other countries in Europe. Europe remains still a distant vision, but whether distant or close, it is certain that we are not being prepared for it. Apart altogether from the official speeches made from time to time by different Government Ministers, in practice, nothing is being done.

Our great agricultural industry is at sixes and sevens, with no one knowing what precisely should be done and nobody knowing how to do it, with the Minister not speaking to the farmers and the farmers not speaking to the Minister. All this is bad. It adds up to a very serious position for the country. Then, we have developments in our public life—this Taca organisation and the rest of it. What can that mean except further to unsettle people, except further to convince people that this is a political group in office who are concerned only for their political future, without a policy, without a programme, depending on silent, secret organisations to maintain them in office. I think that is bad, and I think the Fianna Fáil Party, and the Minister in particular, would be doing a great service to proper standards in politics if he disbanded that organisation and did it quickly. If he does not do it, he will find it has been a grave mistake.

However, our duty as an Opposition is to carry on, to produce our policies, to endeavour to get them understood and to take satisfaction from the fact that occasionally some of the things we advocate are adopted and carried out by the Government. But we will continue to be an effective Opposition and continue to be a vigorous Opposition, whatever difficulties we may have to contend with from time to time. Without the services available to the Government, we will carry on. I believe there is now a growing awareness in the country that a change of Government, a change of men and a change of ideas is urgently needed, if this country is to take advantage of the opportunities which Europe will bring, we hope, in the next 24 months. That cannot be achieved immediately. I believe the local elections will indicate that desire, but it will be achieved sooner or later, and when that is done, I believe this country will really start to advance.

It has become increasingly clear to me, at any rate, while Deputy T.F. O'Higgins was speaking, that his main emotion is one of jealousy and in many respects, I am not surprised. One of his colleagues met me immediately after the Budget speech and he was looking rather sad. I said to him: "What do you think of it," and his reaction was "How the hell can we in Fine Gael win a local election with a Budget like that?" I think this has been a disappointing Budget from the point of view of the Opposition because it was almost impossible to criticise it and that must be very frustrating. This has led to a Budget debate which in my ten short years of experience has beaten all records for sheer boredom and irrelevancy.

I know it has been the custom of the Chair at all times to allow a wide scope in the debate on the Budget, but this year the Budget itself was the subject which received least attention in the speeches of the Opposition. They were so obviously annoyed that speeches from the Government side of the House tended to be more relevant. It is easy, of course, to throw out criticism and it is obviously just as easy, as Deputy T.F. O'Higgins has demonstrated, to throw out abuse and to introduce subjects like the formation of a group called Taca. My mind is perfectly clear that his main criticism is that some of our supporters thought of it before he thought of it. That, again, must be rather annoying but, to allege that there is something improper, something secret, something sinister about supporters of Fianna Fáil agreeing to subscribe regularly is just nonsense, that is, unless we are to assume that anyone who supports Fine Gael is simply a loyal and well-informed Party member, whereas anyone who shows any prejudice in favour of Fianna Fáil is a dirty political hack. This is the sort of childish nonsense I would have thought we would have outgrown. One's opponents are not certainly Party hacks and the whole tone of Deputy T.F. O'Higgins's speech during the past threequarters of an hour or so has been a desperate endeavour to prove that everything is going badly and that we are in a unique position of depression and despair. That is typical of Fine Gael speeches, and always has been, but, as usual, it is in direct defiance of the facts.

Deputy T.F. O'Higgins has tried to persuade us that everyone is progressing rapidly except ourselves, everyone, that is, except the United States of America, which is having considerable financial difficulties and employment problems, the whole six Members of the Common Market, considerable areas of Scandinavia, the EFTA members, including the United Kingdom. We have not got any direct comparison between ourselves and the Soviet Union or Red China, but the general trend of economic conditions at the moment is that we are slowly emerging from a period of economic stringency, for reasons which are not always immediately obvious, but we are not out on our own. Everybody has been having this.

Deputy T.F. O'Higgins says that instead of the economy making progress, we are slipping back and, in the next sentence, he went on to comment on the fact that our rate of growth was not sufficiently large. You cannot be slipping back if you still have a rate of growth at all, and I would be the first to admit that our rate of growth is not anything like what we would like it to be but Deputy T.F. O'Higgins and some of his colleagues should try to face the facts and realise that it is not in the public interest to try to delude people into believing the situation is worse than it is. In actual fact, the situation is under control, in so far as it is within the power of a national Government these days to control anything. We are living in a very closely inter-related community of nations and, while we may make decisions of our own, the results of these decisions must, of necessity, be greatly affected by the policies of other countries.

Another evidence of Deputy T.F. O'Higgins's failure to keep to facts was his comment about the financial provision for the Department of Health. As far as I remember his comment was: "No money has been provided for Health".

I said, "for the new health scheme".

No, the actual words of the Deputy were: "No money has in fact been provided for Health". If we go back to the year 1961, we find £9 million were provided and, in successive years, this amount has risen as follows: £10 million, £11 million, £14 million, practically £16 million, practically £19 million, last year, and Estimates for this year are practically £21 million. And Deputy T.F. O'Higgins blandly says: "No money has been provided for Health." To my mind, £21 million is a fair amount.

Deputy T.F. O'Higgins's comments on the health services generally could not have been justified, had he paid any attention to the evidence which was given before the Special Committee on the Health Services, of which both he and I were members. In fact, that Committee did receive ample evidence that, basically speaking, there was little necessity for improvement of the health services. There were some points on which improvements could be made, and in fact many of those improvements have been made already, or are in course of being made. But that Committee, while it did not produce a final Report, was of tremendous value, in that it produced an enormous amount of evidence, almost all of which was in support of the health services scheme as it stands today.

The Deputy is utterly wrong.

I know that was not what Deputy T.F. O'Higgins wanted it to find. I know that is why Opposition Deputies did their best to wreck the Committee, but the fact remains that even though there was widespread supplication of members of the public, either as individuals or as bodies, to come before that Committee and give evidence, the great weight of evidence given was in support of the system as we know it.

I would recommend the Deputy to ask for its publication.

I would be the first to admit that it is embarrassing but it is true.

Publish the evidence and we shall see.

I have read the evidence as has Deputy T.F. O'Higgins, and nothing would be less acceptable to him that it should be published.

I ask for its publication, if the Deputy is so sure.

It is most gratifying to hear Deputy O'Higgins ask me to publish it. I have not got the funds to do so myself. It is a matter for the direction of the House, rather than of one Member.

Just to make one further point about Deputy T.F. O'Higgins and his comments—he was, as usual, very upset because he was accusing Fianna Fáil of stealing Fine Gael policies and putting them into effect. It can not be stated too often that there is a basic difference between an Opposition Party and a Party in power. A Party in power can produce a policy only when it has the determination and the means to put that policy into effect. A Party in Opposition can—and Fine Gael have proved that they can and have—produce policies by the hundred abandoning those which appear embarrassing at any time and inventing new ones. It is always easy to produce policies when you have not got the agonising responsibility of implementing them. If you produce enough policies—and God knows, Fine Gael have produced plenty—on the law of averages, you must come up with a good idea once or twice—they cannot be that stupid; I do not think they are really—but you cannot then say that all the good ideas come from Fine Gael. They do not, and, if they did, Fine Gael would be on this side of the House, a situation which does not seem likely to arise in the foreseeable future.

To get back to the Budget, first of all, I should like to comment on the general frame of the Budget speech itself. It was novel in its presentation; it was very clear; it was produced in a methodical way and in language understandable to the ordinary man in the street. There has been a tendency in such matters previously to speak in a jargon which the ordinary man can never understand. This was straight, honest-to-goodness stuff. It was produced in a way which anyone who really made the effort could—and, I think, did—understand.

Deputy Dillon in his criticism made some references to the practice which he deprecated of allowing civil servants to become members of councils and so on, like NIEC, to sign those reports and thereby to identify themselves and lose their anonymity. I know in past years it has always been the practice that these senior officers of the Revenue Commissioners and the Department of Finance have tended to be faceless men. I do not see any advantage in that at all. I know from my reading it has been freely discussed in the United Kingdom that certain leading officers of the Treasury in London have been responsible for certain actions. This is something we have got to face.

An increasing responsibility for Government rests now on the permanent Civil Service. They are advisers at a very high level, and in many cases they may be actually taking decisions. Whether we like it or not, we have got to live with it. If we are going to have people in that capacity, I would much rather know who they were. In that way we could get to know them, get to understand their minds and thereby be more constructive in our criticism of their decisions and advice. I think we can in this way achieve rationalisation between that part of the Executive furnished by the Civil Service and that part of the Executive furnished through election procedures.

In his speech the Minister referred to restraint in our wage rates and in our spending at this time. To call this an election Budget, when it contains an appeal and, in fact, a direction for restraint in spending, is just nonsense. This is a down-to-earth, factual statement. The Minister was perfectly right in pointing out that our ability to export, in particular to the United Kingdom, had been greatly handicapped last year by reason of rising costs here. That was a very necessary warning. We have got to put the facts clearly before the people, as, in fact, we always try to do.

You have this business of chasing the additional £1 a week, £5 a month, £50 a year, whatever it may be. Even if it is only sixpence an hour, there is a 40-hour week and you are back to the £1 a week again. Many of these wage increases can be quite illusory when rising prices make their value somewhat less. I find the ordinary man in the street has at last realised that. We have got to get this across to everybody, not just a few, that increasing wealth in this country can only be achieved by increasing production at a highly economic rate. That is the way we get more money to spend. But just raising wage rates is not the solution.

The Minister in his speech paid very proper attention to the increasing needs of education, and I think this is something which has received widespread support. Here, again, the Minister for Education has made it clear— I think we should continue to make it clear to people—that education, like health, cannot be provided free of charge. Somebody is going to pay for it. It is right that those better able to pay, should pay, either by way of direct charge or by way of taxation. We must not allow ourselves to get into the feeling that the community as a whole can get more and more for less and less. The hard facts of life just do not make that possible. Consequently, we have had to have tax increases. They are small enough, but they are there and we have got to accept them.

This so-called election Budget has made small but very well justified concessions in respect of medical expenses, dependent relatives, child allowance and sur-tax earned income relief. This last is the one which has come in for most criticism: simply because there are very few people affected by it. So the mass of the people prefer to court popularity by saying "Do not give any relief to the sur-tax payers. Soak the beggers more and more." That may appear to be a popular approach, but, thank heavens, our people are becoming sufficiently mature to know that that does not make sense. In fact, we need more people in this country liable to sur-tax. If we had more people liable to sur-tax we would have more employment. These are the people who are providing the initiative in the private sector, who are helping with the increase in employment, who are giving employment in their own right and who are subscribing very largely towards the overall cost of State services. It is crazy that we should have a sur-tax system which should make it cheaper for people with incomes of £3,500 and £4,000 a year to live in England than to live here.

In this connection there is just one other point I should like to mention which was not dealt with in the Minister's speech, the question of death duties. I hope the Minister will keep under review this whole question because I believe the present policy is bad business. I have known several cases. I have one in mind in my own constituency where a very elderly man, who came from Northern Ireland to the Republic because he found it more congenial, was eventually forced to emigrate to the Bahamas where he could die more cheaply than he could here. He was a loss to the country. While he stayed here he was paying income tax and sur-tax and giving employment. If we had cut out death duties altogether, or reduced them very considerably, he would have stayed here and contributed that way also. In fact, what happened was that we killed the goose that might have laid the golden egg and he is gone. It would attract more money into the country if this system of estate duty were drastically revised.

There is the matter of the increase in social welfare payments which was decried by Deputy O'Higgins. There, again, I found it in heart to sympathise with him. It must be maddening for him to know, as he does, that every year a Fianna Fáil Government has increased social welfare benefits. It must be maddening to know that, particularly when he thinks of the record of his own Party in that regard. However, it becomes a little bit boring when he comes up with the same crack again: "Why was it not more?" There is only one reason and that is there was no more to give. If we wanted to have an election Budget we could have put the country further in debt and given everyone 10/- a week increase. What would have been the reaction then? —screams from the Opposition that we were buying votes. The really annoying thing for them was that we were seen to be doing the right thing and not to be buying votes.

The Minister, in his very comprehensive speech, dealt with a tremendous number of matters. I do not want to deal with them all, but I should like to commend him for his very personal approach to all aspects of national policy. I am particularly glad that he has clarified still further the matter of Part VII of the Finance Act, 1965. This was something which should never have been introduced. It was a mistake from the start. It was made while the present Taoiseach was Minister for Finance. It was something on which he was doubtful himself, but he was the first Minister that I have ever known to approach such a complex bit of legislation in this way. He said: "I know this is something which should be done in some way. I am not certain that this is the right way to do it. Let us try it and if it does not work out I shall introduce amending legislation which will be retrospective." Deputy Lynch, as Minister for Finance, did that in the Budgets he introduced and did, in fact, rectify matters retrospectively. That, to my mind, is a man's approach to a very difficult matter. Part VII of the Finance Act, 1965, would have been a disaster if it had ever actually gone into effect, but my information is that no final assessments have ever been made under that part for the simple reason that it was unworkable. I am delighted, therefore, that the Minister for Finance has decided that he will extensively recast this legislation.

The purpose of this legislation is ostensibly to tax profiteering and speculation in land. I react immediately against people who use words like "speculation" and "profiteering". It is so easy to throw names around. It it so easy to accuse people of profiteering or speculating, and it is impossible to define what speculation really is. A profiteering speculator is usually a man who is making more money than I am —just as easy as that. Anyone who is making more money than I am is bad and wicked and should be suppressed or taxed out of existence,

That is not the way to approach it. It must be approached on the basis of making land available for housing at a reasonable price. To say that anybody who buys land at any stage is bound to make a stack of money is not true. A speculator is essentially a man who takes risks. It would be just as logical to say that a person who puts money on a horse is bound to make money. Many Members of this House have found to the contrary. The speculator is a man who takes risks, and if he makes a profit it may be profiteering in that his profit is excessive, but he may make a loss as well. There is already adequate power in the hands of the Revenue to tax the income of anyone who is engaged in the buying and selling of land as a venture of trade. There is a propaganda element involved in this piece of legislation. I think the Minister at the time was wrongly advised, and it is excellent that that mistake is going to be rectified.

In particular, I am glad the Minister has decided to produce two Finance Bills, one to cover the actual Budgetary Resolutions and the second one to deal with tax provisions to reform income tax law. There is a tremendous amount of reform still necessary. The Minister and his Department and the Revenue Commissioners have done a wonderful job in the production of the Income Tax Act of 1967 which provides a complete codification of tax law. That in itself is a step forward, but I think it is only one step. When we look at this enormous piece of legislation we must appreciate that something should be done to substitute this by some form of taxation which is more readily understandable.

It is intolerable that one has to employ not only chartered accountants but senior counsel to advise one as to what one's liability may or may not be under the income tax laws of 1967. That has been the situation for years. This is only the first step. We must go a good bit further and amend it very drastically so as to produce a general form of taxation, preferably, to my mind, indirect taxation on expenditure rather than taxation on income. Taxation on income tends to reduce the incentive to earn more, whereas taxation on expenditure encourages saving. We are already moving along that road, and we could move further and faster.

The Minister also dealt with the very difficult but very important matter of the decimalisation of our currency. It looks at the moment as if British Government policy is tending towards the decimalisation of the £ as a unit. Why they have done that goodness alone knows, because there is an increasing body of public opinion in the United Kingdom which is very much against it, and justifiably so, because the smallest item in that currency would be worth 2.4d. which is ludicrous. Then one gets down to a half cent system. The whole purpose of the system is to decimalise, and one does not want half cents in it. The American cent system is obviously better, though this takes you down to, I think, the smallest unit of 1.2d, and there are many things in relation to which halfpennies are still valuable. In the case of tea, sugar, bread, a half-penny is very often an essential unit.

True for you: the half point of stout.

This intervention by the Parliamentary Secretary to the Taoiseach is most offensive. I hope I will have an opportunity of discussing this matter later. As I was saying, we have to get a balanced approach and obviously there is a great deal to be said for the Minister's suggestion of a 2/- cent system because, looking at the position in Europe, most European countries deal in a standard unit of currency of approximately 2/- in value —francs, Deutschmarks, and so on. It would be far better if we had a similar system. If necessary, we should adopt the florin, even though the United Kingdom goes on to the £, because we could easily tie that in with the proposed British system; our florin would be one-tenth of the British £ and there would be no difficulty. In fact, there would be a tremendous advantage in that our coinage could be maintained very largely. It would not mean a number of very strange coins. We could even have notes: the 10/-note would be a five florin note and the £ a ten florin note.

We should have further discussion on this. I, for one, would welcome the intervention of members of the public and public bodies because this is a matter in relation to which we could easily walk ourselves into something and discover the dangers too late. There is still a chance, I think, that Britain will adopt the 10/- unit. I would also say, without very much hesitation, that if we take the bit between our teeth and say we are going on with the florin, the 2/- system, we might easily swing the United Kingdom over with us. We could, at least, give Britain the excuse because there are some big bodies, vested interests, which have plumped for the £ unit, but an increasing number are becoming most unhappy about it. If we come out with the 2/- unit, it would not, I think, do us any harm and it might easily lead to a revision of the whole situation elsewhere. On the face of it, the florin is a much more workmanlike unit of currency.

In general, this Budget is a realistic and encouraging one. It shows that the Minister has taken a very deep personal interest in every word of his speech. The speech was, in fact, his speech. It demonstrates what I have always known: he is a man of great ability in matters of finance, a man of great originality and a man with the courage of his convictions. I have known this for many years and these qualities will, in my opinion, prove of inestimable value. This is the Minister's first effort and he has done extremely well. There must have been a temptation to make flashy decisions. There must have been a temptation to say that he was really going to get things moving. But he resisted the temptation and produced a Budget which proves that he is a statesman and a man of vision, a man who is looking ahead with real excitement but a man who is not going to lose his head in the process.

It has been said that this Budget is deliberately designed to make sure that Fianna Fáil remain in power. That is far from the truth because we could so easily have made this a more popular Budget, had that been our aim. The Minister did not do that. The policy of Fianna Fáil has always been to frame a Budget which will work, a Budget which will show equal concern for all members of the community and which will play its part in redistributing the national wealth fairly as between all classes. Anyone who hopes to satisfy everybody is engaging in the rather useless exercise of crying for the moon. We do not work on that basis. Yet we are making progress.

I have the greatest confidence in the Minister. His first Budget is an excellent one. He has, of course, been fortunate in that a very good foundation was laid for him by his predecessor, the Taoiseach, but nevertheless I think the Minister has taken full advantage of all the opportunities given to him and, in doing so, has done really well. He has produced a Budget which is essentially sound. If he continues, and I believe he will, to work along the same lines, we will not produce miracles overnight, but we will continue the reflation of the economy at a sound and steady rate. As a businessman, I do not like slumps. I am almost equally frightened by a boom. There is something unhealthy about a boom. I do not like to see trade fluctuating rapidly up and down. The recent credit squeeze resulted in a certain slowing down of the economy, but nothing really disastrous happened, and now we are gradually reflating the economy and moving forward faster.

We are moving in the right direction. All the figures show that. The external assets of the banks are rising. The prospects for the tourist season are excellent. There will be a substantial increase in farmers' incomes this year if they concentrate on production rather than on efforts which tend towards disintegration of the whole agricultural industry. Industrial production is rising and, with the abolition of the British import surcharge, our chances of breaking into the British market will be greatly increased. What can be done is being done. Everything is not just gorgeous but everything is, at least, moving steadily forward. We have a lot for which to be thankful. I reject the efforts of Deputy O'Higgins, and his like, to spread alarm and despondency everywhere. They do this kind of thing out of sheer jealousy. They accuse us of clinging to power. They are inspired by nothing but jealousy because we are here and they are over there. This is where we shall stay because we have the support of the people; that is where Fine Gael will stay because they have not got that support.

One cannot but be impressed by the vast difference in the speeches made this year from the Opposition benches and those made last year from those same benches after the rather severe Budget the Fianna Fáil Government found it necessary to introduce to keep the economy on the right track. It has always been the policy of Fianna Fáil and this has been stated time and again on these benches and on public platforms, to do the right thing for the people at the right time, irrespective of whether it is popular or unpopular. If one accepts the tremendous responsibility of Government, then one must have the courage of one's convictions. One must be prepared to take an unpopular stand in the best interests of the community.

Last year the Opposition speakers felt that this was a glorious opportunity for them to attack the Government and to attack the economy which was not making the progress which had been projected in the Second Programme for Economic Expansion. Because these target figures—and they were only target figures—were not being achieved they tried to decry the efforts of this Government. One must always take into consideration the many external factors which bear upon our economy. This was carefully stated in the Second Programme and it was always warned in regard to the projections that were made in that Programme that those who were committed to carrying out that Programme could and would find themselves in a position where factors over which they had no influence could intervene. We saw what happened. We saw the difficult situation which arose in England, the difficulty which arose in the world because of international shortage of liquidity, this being mostly due to the large foreign aid programmes of the great states. These things could not be foreseen. Other governments had to face their difficulties. We only had to face repercussions as they hit us in this country.

The Government last year, when Deputy Lynch introduced the Budget, took the courageous step and made the moves which we said at that time would correct the faults which had been seen to appear. Now that these faults have been corrected, now that a vast improvement has come about in our economy and now when the country is ready to move forward again, what do we get from the Opposition benches? We get speeches about last year's Budget. This, in itself, I feel is sufficient indication to the ordinary people that the Opposition in this Parliament do not really know what they are here for. They do not seem to have any specific policy. They do not seem to seek to guide the people along any particular path of progress. There is and has been a purely destructive effort from the Opposition towards the constructive efforts of the Government. However, we are not greatly influenced by the utterances that come from the benches opposite us. We know our goal; we know our aim. We know the path is a difficult one but we wish to stay on that path and improve the lot of the people. I feel that one should qualify the speeches that come from the Opposition and one should point out that they themselves have been astounded at the tremendous improvement which has come about in our economy. They should honestly acknowledge that. In some instances they did, but the general pattern has been purely destructive.

We in the west of Ireland like to call this Budget the West of Ireland Budget. People have tried to state that in the past the Government were not showing sufficient interest in the special problems which existed in the west of Ireland. Indeed, it has been stated by Members of the Opposition and by other people not entirely in favour of this Government that the Government were not aware of the problems which existed in the west of Ireland. I can only say to those people that they must think that we Deputies who come from the west of Ireland and who are Members of the Government Party are a lot of dummies if we cannot ensure that our people are properly looked after in regard to the division of the wealth of this country.

There are tremendous resources of wealth in the West which to my mind have been completely untapped. I sometimes experience a great feeling of dismay when I hear and read speeches under the heading "Save the West". We in the West wish to develop the West. We know the potential that is in it. We know the great wealth that is there in the land and in its natural amenities. We wish to see these things properly utilised and properly developed in such a way that more and more of our people will be able to find good employment in the west of Ireland and to supplement the excellent employment given there at present.

This Government, since 1932, have striven to improve the way of life in rural Ireland, and particularly in the West. The success of that programme can be seen by any person who wishes to travel the roads in my constituency. One cannot but be greatly impressed by the tremendous amount of new housing in my constituency and, indeed, in every other constituency in the west of Ireland. It has been the great commitment of our Government to see that the people in rural areas were properly housed. Other aspects of development and Government endeavour have been the improvement of roads, the provision of rural electrification, the provision of employment in the west of Ireland and the bestowal of vast financial aid upon the agricultural community in the west of Ireland and indeed throughout Ireland generally.

I am of the firm opinion that the special problems which face us are not problems which can be wholly solved by Government action. The solution of many difficulties and problems that exist in my part of the country is in the hands of the people who live there. The big thing that is lacking is local leadership. I would advocate that a strong determined effort be made to develop the co-operative system in the west of Ireland. It is plainly obvious to anybody that any capital investment in our biggest industry, agriculture, should be of a wholly productive nature. It is a great waste of hard-earned money to see farm machinery being purchased by small farmers who have not and never will have sufficient work to justify the purchasing of this expensive machinery.

The Government should have a special responsibility in this matter and should ensure that where capital investment is being made in farm machinery, the people wishing to buy should be able to prove that they have the work to justify the purchase of the machinery and will be able to make maximum use of it while it is in their possession and, where they cannot, that arrangements will be made for three or four neighbours to come together and use the one machine. There is money tied up in farm machinery in the west of Ireland which could, if employed in a different manner, employ more people, produce more goods and give greater amenities in other spheres if the money were there and left available.

This is a sad reflection on a policy which has been allowed to continue of people being freely allowed to purchase this expensive machinery where they did not have the work for it. The co-operative system has been proved in this country time and time again but it has succeeded only where there were capable men at the head of the co-op. Ever since the time of Paddy the Cope in Donegal, the Irish people have understood that the solution to many of our problems lay in this co-operative movement. If some effort could be made to educate leaders who would go into the rural community and organise the people there into forming a viable co-operative unit and that all their efforts would be concentrated into a productive unit, the outdated and old-fashioned methods which exist at the moment could be gradually erased from the Irish agricultural scene and efficiency introduced, we could produce much more at a much less cost, have a much greater return and give much more employment eventually.

When one considers that the small farmer in the West is the producer and the merchandiser, one can see the problem that faces him. He must sow the seed, cultivate it and carry it through various stages of bad weather and attacks from different types of diseases. The same is true of his cattle. He must rear the young calves and bring them to the stage where they are a finished product and can be sold at a fair.

The outmoded practice of Irish fairs is an ailment in the Irish agricultural scene. Let us face it. The people involved in agriculture who hold the greatest wealth are the middle-men, the cattle jobbers and the cattle buyers who lurk in the doorways in the dark at two or three a.m. on fair days waiting to make a clever purchase from an innocent Irish farmer. The Government should attack these practices and organise a proper marketing system for the agricultural product. The farmer should be relieved of his responsibility to produce his product and to bring it to selling point. There is no other business in the world that I know of where the producer is expected to see his product right through from the very beginning to the consumption line. Vast techniques are involved in the merchandising of other consumption goods. With the adoption of more modern methods—a greater rationalisation of our marketing systems—we could probably bring great benefit and increased wealth to the small farmers in rural Ireland.

As far as the special difficulties involved in that area are concerned, it is important to remember that economic progress will not be desired in any community where the people themselves do not realise that progress is possible. Father McDyer, who has been given some praise in this country, is a man with a mission. He is doing a job of work in which a lot more of us could involve ourselves and which local leaders and local communities throughout the country should take up. As I see it, his main mission is to try to create among the people of rural Ireland a confidence in themselves and in their own ability and to instil some type of leadership in them so that they can make greater use of the resources which are at present available to them. He has a hard job.

So long as the expression "Save the West" is attached to the efforts of Father McDyer and the other good people who have interested themselves in our problems, I do not think they will ever make any progress. When one hears the expression "Save the West", one feels one is being associated with something of decay. That creates and instils a feeling of lassitude and promotes a lackadaisical attitude. It creates the kind of feeling that rather than have a slow death let us hurry on and pass peacefully away when, in actual fact, what is needed is to instil a greater pride in our resources and in our ability and a greater awareness of the wealth at our doorsteps.

It can be seen, no matter where you go in the West. Compare the industrious farmer with others in the neighbourhood and you will see that one man can make a tremendous living out of it and rear a family in a happy environment and can provide them with a good social standing and a good education while, side by side, you will have the man with the same resources who is unable to make any progress and who is merely struggling. These are the people whom we must help. We must show them that they have the solution to their problems in their own hands.

I understand that, in 1957, there were something like six agricultural advisers in County Galway. Now, there are 22. I feel that there should be an agricultural adviser in every parish in rural Ireland.

Hear, hear. That was Deputy James Dillon's plan.

I do not care whose plan it is. Any plan which will assist and develop this country is good and should be adopted. I feel that far too much is being left to the Parish Priest and, indeed, to the three men one looks to in any parish in Ireland—the Parish Priest, the local Sergeant and the national teacher. My colleague beside me has said "TD" but there is not one in every parish. The tremendous amount of leadership these people have shown should be recognised. However, they are privileged people in our communities and stand a little above the ordinary resident in a rural town or a rural area. If the leadership is to be 100 per cent successful, I feel it must come from the people themselves.

It is opportune to mention at this stage that the junior chambers of commerce throughout the west of Ireland have offered their assistance to Father McDyer in his campaign. They will spend their time each week in training people in leadership in the villages and towns in the west of Ireland. This is praiseworthy work and the whole country will wish them well in their efforts.

Deputy Kitt and myself have made constant representations to the Minister for Finance in the past year in regard to the necessity—which I think was realised although I think the pressure was needed—to increase the pensions of State servants. I am particularly grateful to the Minister for what he has done in this regard.

There is still one great blot on our community and that is the position in which a widow with young children finds herself after losing her husband who had held a good job and who was not a contributor to our social welfare scheme. There is no greater tragedy in this country than to meet and see the difficulties facing a young woman who finds herself in that position. Because of the size of her husband's salary who was in what is termed "a good job"— now, over £1,200; then, over £800—he would not be a contributor to the social welfare scheme. These people never dreamed that tragedy would ever come to their door. Every Deputy has met such cases and has felt completely hopeless in not being able to help. Sometimes, with a new house, there are weekly or monthly payments to be made on a loan. It is absolutely impossible to exist on the widow's non-contributory pension. I discussed this matter with the previous Minister for Social Welfare who informed me that that matter is under constant consideration in that Department. I had hoped for a possible announcement in the Budget of relief or benefit for such unfortunate people. If it is not there this year, it may come. I advocate it very strongly. I urge the establishment of a national widows' pension fund to which it should be obligatory for every married man to subscribe who is not subscribing to the social welfare fund.

We are particularly grateful to the Minister in his excellent Budget for one single item which has been of vast benefit to, I can safely say, 90 per cent of the farmers in my constituency, that is, the derating of agricultural land. Even though this item may not have meant very much in income to the Government, or to the local county councils, it was still a very big burden on those small farmers, particularly in my constituency because of the poor quality of the land in some areas. The abolition of employment orders is another improvement in the giving of assistance to these people, the less well off section of the community.

The greatest incentive and encouragement given to the people in the West is the very strong commitment in this Budget towards the development of tourism and the assistance which is now being made available to the smaller man in the tourist trade, to the farmhouse holidays and guesthouses. I do not know for how long these grants will be made available but they are available this year, and I hope and expect that they will be available for a number of years. In the Gaeltacht and in my constituency a grant is available for the extension of a guesthouse of up to 70 per cent of the total capital cost. I knew, and anyone who studied the tourist trade knew, that was absolutely essential to meet the rising demand for accommodation.

One of the greatest successes we have had in the past number of years was the fantastic growth in our tourist trade, aided and assisted by the Department of Transport and Power, and very ably assisted by the present Minister. No one in this country has done more for tourism than Deputy Childers. Despite his tremendous successes, over the past two years I have heard constant harping and criticism of him by Front Bench members of the Fine Gael Party who were nothing but jealous of his ability and the success of the efforts which he has put into those Departments over which he was given responsibility.

There is another aspect of our life in Ireland to which I feel some attention should be directed, that is, the ever-increasing number of supermarkets which seem to pop up all over the country.

Why did you not ban a foreign one coming in?

This new aspect of the Irish retail trade carries many dangers for the retail business of the country.

Why did you not ban them from coming in?

I would suggest very strongly that the Government should not wait too long and, if necessary, they should introduce legislation to control the retail trade in our country. For many years retailers have helped our people in rural Ireland in difficult times and often waited over 12 months for payment.

This is vote catching.

If they are to be ousted now after performing such a tremendous social benefit, we cannot but be accused of being ungrateful. I know that in our Constitution we have the power to see that business is not swallowed up by big operators. I suggest that there may come a time when our Constitution may be contravened if something is not done about this matter. If one considers the helter skelter in the retail trade today, and if one looks at the overall position one can see that this trade which provided good solid employment for our people in which they could get married happily, rear their families, give them an education and be highly respected in the community, is now purely a handout affair in which the employment content is confined to young girls. This will greatly affect the employment potential in the country.

You are the Party in power. Why do you not stop it?

This is something which deserves the attention of the Government. In the Report on Full Employment, it is interesting to note that the gross national product in 1965 was comprised, as to 22 per cent, of agriculture, 33 per cent, industry, and 46 per cent, services. The projection of that committee was that the gross national product in 1980 would reach something like this : agriculture 12 per cent, industry 44 per cent, and services would stay more or less the same at 44 per cent. This is a very striking statement and it emphasises very strongly that the future employment potential depends largely on industry. It is estimated that to reach full employment on this projection 240,000 new jobs would need to be provided by 1980——

This is like the 100,000 new jobs you promised.

——and that 70 per cent of the jobs would have to be provided through industry. That is a staggering proposal and it will mean that a large amount of our capital resources will have to be invested in industry, in providing buildings and machinery. This investment which will have to be stepped up from its present rate will necessitate waiting a number of years before the fruits will begin to show. When one hears the Opposition Parties shouting for more money for this and more money for that, one wonders do they consider how the capital available to the Government should be distributed if we are to create a developing economy.

The introduction of industrial estates is a good move. This has got off the ground fairly quickly. I understand that an estate is under construction in Waterford, and in Galway, we are laying the services for one at the moment. I hope these estates will be 100 per cent successful and that the lessons learned from them will be used in other areas. I hope we can entice people who own large sums of money and have them invested abroad to bring back that money and invest it here to promote industrial and other productive enterprises which will give good employment for our people.

The Government have contributed to the vast growth which has taken place in Galway city. In the past ten years, 27 industries have been State-aided. On behalf of the people of Galway, it is not unfair for me to state publicly the thanks of the people of that city for the development which has taken place there and which was initiated largely through the efforts of the Government.

Progress reported; Committee to sit again.
The Dáil adjourned at 5 p.m. until 3 p.m. on Tuesday, 2nd May, 1967.
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