asked the Minister for Health the position of old age pensioners who have to enter the county home as regards the allowance given as pocket money to them whether they are contributory or noncontributory pensioners.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - County Home Old Age Pensioners.
7.
A person who is receiving institutional assistance in a county home may be required, out of so much of his income in money as exceeds one pound a week, to contribute such amount as the health authority consider appropriate towards the cost of his maintenance. In assessing the amount of income for this purpose a health authority must make allowance for payments such as rent, rates, land annuities and other similar expenses of the patient.
Would the Minister not think that it would be a bit hard on old age pensioners who have to live on £3 7s 6d a week to have money taken from them for their keep?
It is only reasonable if they are in a country home. The local authorities vary in their attitude towards this. Some local authorities allow 30/-; some 22s 6d; some 25/-; and some 27s 6d. They do make allowances for permanent overhead costs which these pensioners have. I have not had complaints about this.
Is this not a pitiful comment on the brave new world the Minister's Government are creating, that these pensioners are asked to pay this maintenance allowance from the meagre allowance they have? Would the Minister not agree that the amount derived from this source is infinitesimal in comparison with the cost of putting up county homes, that the sum realised in this pickpocket fashion must be very small and when one thinks of the necessaries of life for these people, tobacco and so on, it is disgraceful to apply such a test in 1969?
We cannot have a speech on this question.
Would the Minister not make a distinction in county homes as between those who are there for residential care and those who are there for medical treatment? An old age pensioner who would be entitled to a medical card should be free when he goes into a county home but merely because he goes there these deductions are made whereas if he went to a district hospital there would be no charge.
One could discuss this matter at great length. As the person is being maintained entirely in the county home the observations of Deputy O'Leary are not relevant. He is being maintained entirely and is not having to pay out of the £3 7s 6d he is earning towards his establishment which he would have to do to some extent if he were living privately. It seems to me that that is reasonable under present circumstances but, as I said, the county councils vary in their attitude. I understand that there is nothing to prevent them under the Institutional Assistance Regulations of 1965 from adding to that sum; in some cases they do that and I would not discourage them.
As the Minister says, we could discuss this matter in depth. Surely we——
We cannot have a debate on this question.
(Interruptions).
I know these people do not count very much.