asked the Minister for External Affairs the occasion and the reason for the last suspension of Ireland's application to join the EEC.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Membership of EEC.
12.
The Deputy presumably has in mind the suspension of action on the applications for membership of Ireland, Denmark and Norway in January, 1963, following the breakdown in the negotiations between the EEC and Britain.
Could I ask the Minister if it is a fact that we took a decision at the time to go it alone, that is, outside the Common Market, for this reason?
No. The Deputy is under a misconception. The decision was reached by the EEC countries, because of the French attitude at the time, to suspend negotiations with Ireland, Britain and Norway.
I think I misunderstood the Minister. Did he say 1863?
No, 1963.
I thought he meant 1863. From the attitude of the two main parties in this House on the matter you would think it was 100 years ago.
That is rather a heavy point.
Is the Minister certain that negotiations with this country were suspended by the Council of Ministers of the Six? I wonder whether this is correct or whether we did not, of our own accord, decide not to proceed with our application in the circumstances.
Because of the attitude of the Six and the intimation from them that there was no point in proceeding with the negotiations by reason of the French attitude.
They did not suspend the negotiations with us. We decided not to proceed. We must be very clear about this.
It is six of one and half a dozen of the other—because the EEC countries themselves decided that there was no point in pursuing the negotiations by reason of the French attitude.
Is the Minister suggesting that the EEC view was that if Britain did not join we would not be permitted to join? That is not my recollection of the position.
No, I did not say that. I said that in view of the French attitude at the time the negotiations were suspended by agreement. The EEC countries decided that there was no point in proceeding with the negotiations because of the French attitude and we decided to suspend negotiations.
Not the French attitude, the British attitude.
In view of the fact that the Minister is substituting for the Minister for External Affairs I shall not press the matter any further, but I think it is important that the Minister should not inadvertently cause confusion on this point. If the negotiations with Britain do not succeed that does not mean we cannot proceed with our negotiations.
Is this kind of long speech in order at Question Time?
I am calling Question No. 13.
I want to make this quite clear, because what Deputy FitzGerald has raised is important.
If this discussion can be called important——
Now who is out of order?
I am absolutely in order?
At all stages since we originated our application for membership of the EEC we have left it open for us to proceed for membership irrespective of the British attitude. We have maintained that attitude right through and that is still the position.
(Interruptions.)
We cannot debate this question all evening.
Can I take it that, if we do proceed independently as suggested by the Minister for External Affairs, Dr. Hillery, recently, we can retain our trading links, for what they are worth, with the British and with the Six Counties of Northern Ireland?
This is a hypothetical situation that will have to be met when it arises.
Presumably we have considered it.
Of course, but you have to wait for the occasion to arise. There is no point in engaging in discussions here in advance of the situation arising.
Before the Minister for External Affairs made the decision surely he considered the implications. Can we retain our trading links with Britain and the Six Counties?
There was no decision made. I want to make it clear that what I said to Deputy FitzGerald is the position. There was no decision made by the Minister for External Affairs. In this matter we applied on our own for membership of the EEC. That was always our position; that is still our position and we are keeping all our options open.
You are still talking about it.
(Interruptions.)