asked the Minister for Education the estimated cost of extending the higher education grant scheme to students holding a matriculation or leaving certificate in third level institutions other than universities and teacher training colleges (a) on the basis of limiting it to courses of three or more years duration and (b) on the basis of applying it to all such students.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Higher Education Grants.
37.
It is not possible from available statistics to provide figures of student numbers on which the estimates sought could be based. As I indicated in the House recently, I do not propose at present to extend the higher education grants scheme.
How can the Minister produce an estimate of £7 million on Question No.33 if he cannot produce any estimate on Question No. 37?
I pointed out that I do not propose to extend the higher education grants scheme.
The question here is not whether he intends to do it but what would be the cost of it. The Minister was able to give an estimate of the cost of the USI scheme, a figure of £7 million. Here we have a part of the USI scheme. How can he give an estimate of the whole and not produce an estimate of the part? That is a contradication in terms.
The figure I gave in relation to the USI scheme is a rough estimate of the cost.
We will take a rough estimate for Question No. 37.
It was much easier to make a rough estimate of total costs than it would be to make an estimate on the basis of the type of question put down by the Deputy.
How can you give a rough estimate of the whole if you cannot give a rough estimate of the part?
It is much easier to make a rough estimate of the whole.
You know the total number of students in higher education.
Is the Minister suggesting that he does not know the total number of students attending courses of three or more years duration? Has he not even got that fact?
I did not see that there was any purpose in looking for that type of information when I did not intend to extend the higher education grants scheme.
The Minister is refusing to answer a question about the cost of something because he does not intend to do it.
38.
asked the Minister for Education (a) the number of students holding maximum grants while living at home and the number holding maximum grants living away from home, under the higher education, grant scheme; (b) the total number of students holding such grants under each heading and (c) the average amount of such grants under each heading.
In the academic year 1970-71 the number of students holding maximum grants under the higher education grants scheme while living at home was 701 and the number holding maximum grants while living away from home was 2,194. The total number of students holding grants under each heading was 1,001 students living at home and 2,561 students living away from home. The average amount of grant was £152 for students living at home and £281 for students living away from home.
In addition to the grants, a direct payment amounting to £46,399 was paid by my Department to the universities so as to hold the fees for grant holders in the academic year 1970-71 at the level which obtained in the year 1969-70.
39.
asked the Minister for Education the number of students holding higher education grants in (a) each faculty in each university college, by year, (b) in each of the teacher training colleges, by year, and (c) in each of the other third-level institutions covered by the scheme.
The information sought by the Deputy is set out in the form of a tabular statement which, with your permission, a Cheann Comhairle, I will have circulated with the Official Report. Higher education grants are not tenable in the teacher training colleges.
Following is the statement:
Number of Students holding Higher Education Grants
University College, Dublin
|
Faculty |
Academic Years |
||
|
1968/69 |
1969/70 |
1970/71 |
|
|
Arts |
226 |
343 |
503 |
|
Commerce |
64 |
177 |
211 |
|
Science |
101 |
188 |
241 |
|
Engineering |
106 |
162 |
233 |
|
Medicine |
34 |
65 |
82 |
|
Agriculture |
15 |
28 |
38 |
|
Law |
6 |
11 |
16 |
|
Dentistry |
5 |
8 |
8 |
|
Architecture |
9 |
22 |
34 |
|
Social Science |
11 |
50 |
84 |
|
Veterinary Medicine |
18 |
32 |
53 |
|
Music |
— |
3 |
1 |
|
Pharmacy |
— |
3 |
3 |
|
TOTAL |
595 |
1,092 |
1,507 |
University College, Cork
|
Faculty |
Academic Years |
||
|
1968/69 |
1969/70 |
1970/71 |
|
|
Arts |
120 |
280 |
424 |
|
Commerce |
35 |
75 |
131 |
|
Science |
30 |
80 |
120 |
|
Social Science |
3 |
7 |
18 |
|
Dairy Science |
2 |
3 |
3 |
|
Engineering |
42 |
93 |
139 |
|
Medicine |
20 |
60 |
65 |
|
Law |
4 |
4 |
12 |
|
Dentistry |
4 |
8 |
12 |
|
Agriculture |
4 |
15 |
19 |
|
Music |
1 |
3 |
7 |
|
Veterinary |
— |
— |
3 |
|
TOTAL |
265 |
628 |
953 |
University College, Galway
|
Faculty |
Academic Years |
||
|
1968/69 |
1969/70 |
1970/71 |
|
|
Arts |
76 |
190 |
332 |
|
Commerce |
7 |
40 |
83 |
|
Science |
39 |
76 |
109 |
|
Engineering |
13 |
34 |
69 |
|
Medicine |
20 |
56 |
88 |
|
Agriculture |
4 |
20 |
30 |
|
Dentistry |
1 |
2 |
3 |
|
TOTAL |
160 |
418 |
714 |
Trinity College, Dublin
|
Faculty |
Academic Years |
||
|
1968/69 |
1969/70 |
1970/71 |
|
|
Arts |
27 |
75 |
120 |
|
Commerce |
8 |
17 |
26 |
|
Science |
13 |
17 |
49 |
|
Engineering |
10 |
20 |
34 |
|
Medicine |
3 |
13 |
20 |
|
Social Science |
1 |
1 |
3 |
|
Dentistry |
1 |
— |
— |
|
Veterinary |
— |
1 |
5 |
|
Law |
— |
1 |
2 |
|
Architecture |
— |
1 |
— |
|
TOTAL |
63 |
146 |
259 |
St. Patrick's College, Maynooth
|
Faculty |
Academic Years |
||
|
1968/69 |
1969/70 |
1970/71 |
|
|
Arts |
23 |
43 |
87 |
|
Science |
3 |
11 |
20 |
|
TOTAL |
26 |
54 |
107 |
College of Technology, Bolton Street, Dublin
|
Faculty |
Academic Years |
||
|
1968/69 |
1969/70 |
1970/71 |
|
|
Architecture |
2 |
2 |
5 |
|
Quantity Surveying |
1 |
1 |
— |
|
Environmental Economics |
1 |
1 |
— |
|
Engineering |
— |
1 |
6 |
|
TOTAL |
4 |
5 |
11 |
College of chnology, Kevin Street, Dublin
|
Faculty |
Academic Years |
||
|
1968/69 |
1969/70 |
1970/71 |
|
|
Engineering |
2 |
2 |
2 |
College of Surgeons, Dublin
|
Faculty |
Academic Years |
||
|
1968/69 |
1969/70 |
1970/71 |
|
|
Medicine |
3 |
2 |
5 |
National College of Art
|
Faculty |
Academic Years |
||
|
1968/69 |
1969/70 |
1970/71 |
|
|
Art |
1 |
1 |
— |
New University of Ulster, Coleraine
|
Faculty |
Academic Years |
||
|
1968/69 |
1969/70 |
1970/71 |
|
|
Arts |
— |
— |
3 |
|
Social Science |
— |
— |
1 |
|
TOTAL |
— |
— |
4 |
Does the Minister not realise that money has been depreciating in value every year recently by 10 per cent? Is the really dealing with these unfortunate students in the way people deal with others who cannot answer for themselves? Is that what the Government are doing? The Government are a cowardly lot.
The Deputy is aware of the fact that the students I am most concerned with are those who are on grants, those who have reached a certain level in their examinations and who are not capable of providing for themselves. I have made extra money available in relation to them. I have also made extra money available in relation to the higher fee faculties.
Would the Minister agree that the amount available per student is unchanged and that in the period in question the cost of living has risen by 27 per cent?
Of course, it has. The Minister may say what he likes but if a worth-while trade union attacks the Government the Government give in like a lot of geese of sheep. They will not give in to people who are not in a position to deal with them.
The Minister can say that very many worth-while innovations in the educational field were brought in by this Government, including the grants made available to students in universities.
Brought in by a previous Minister and now being eroded by this Minister.