asked the Minister for Labour the number of children with the Group Certificate who applied for apprenticeships in 1971; and the number who were successful.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Apprenticeship Applicants.
25.
The information requested by the Deputy in the first part of his question is not available as approaches about apprentice vacancies are normally made directly to employers by young persons or their parents.
The number of young persons with the prescribed Day Group Certificate qualifications registered as apprentices by AnCO in the period 1st January, 1971, to 31st October, 1971, was 500.
Why is it not possible to have details? Do we not have placement officers in the employment exchanges? Is it not the purpose of placement officers to arrange apprenticeships?
Apprenticeships are registered through AnCO.
But in the first instance is the person not sent to the placement officer at the employment exchange? I have been sending people there on instructions from AnCO.
Yes, but I only have a record of those who are registered and the figure is 500. Many apprentices go direct to the firm to which they are apprenticed.
Has the Minister any figures of those who have been unable to obtain apprenticeships even though they have a group certificate?
I would have the number of persons who applied but have not succeeded.
Has the Minister got that figure with him?
Not here, I am not a walking encyclopaedia.
This is an important matter, it is not a laughing matter. There are too many children with the group certificate who have not been able to obtain apprenticeships.
They are regulated by the trade unions.
They are regulated by AnCO.
Not at all.
Yes, they are.
Deputy Dowling is betraying appalling ignorance. They are not regulated by the trade unions.
They are so.
Deputy Dowling is not as wrong as Deputies might think.
The Minister is concurring with this. The Minister cannot have it both ways——
If the Deputy asks a question he should allow me to answer it. The number of persons apprenticed are very often limited by the trade unions.
In what industries?
A considerable number of children have not been able to obtain apprenticeships.
In almost every industry, with the possible exception of the printing industry, all apprenticeship intake is decided on a general basis by the National Apprenticeship Authority composed of employer, labour, trade union and educational representatives. The trade unions no longer decide the actual intake of apprenticeships into each industry.
Surely the so-called trade union officials know there is a ratio between tradesmen and apprentices which have been laid down by the trade unions concerned?
Surely a member of the Fianna Fáil Trade Union Committee should know better than that?
Such ignorance.
Surely we cannot have more apprentices than tradesmen?
(Interruptions.)
On a point of order is it in order for backbenchers to answer on behalf of Ministers?
It is becoming necessary.
The Minister for Labour should be able to give an answer to the House: is AnCO responsible for it? The Minister should not listen to his backbencher who has given him wrong information.
The Deputy does not know what he is talking about.
I know more about it than the Deputy.
When that dialogue ceases I will answer the question.
I have diagnosed the trouble, the Minister does not know his job.
I can give figures of the apprenticeships arranged and known to AnCO but I do not have figures of the number of persons who failed to get apprenticeships.
I am telling the Minister the number is considerable. I would like to have exact figures.
I do not accept that.