Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 15 Jan 1975

Vol. 277 No. 2

Financial Resolutions. - Financial Resolution No. 5: Customs and Excise—Table Waters.

Minister for Finance (Mr. R. Ryan)

I move:

(1) That in this Resolution "the Order of 1972" means the Imposition of Duties (No. 200) (Customs and Excise Duties and Form of Tariff) Order, 1972 (S.I. No. 220 of 1972).

(2) That the duty of customs imposed by paragraph 5 of the Order of 1972 on—

(a) the goods of tariff heading number 22.02 and of tariff code numbers 2201-227, 2207-321, 2207-474 and 2207-689 in the Schedule to the Order of 1972, and

(b) the goods of tariff heading number 20.07 in the Schedule to the Order of 1972 which are prepared for consumption as a beverage without dilution.

shall be varied, as on and from the 16th day of January, 1975, by the addition of the sum of £0.0257 to each of the rates of such duty chargeable immediately before that date.

(3) That the duty of excise imposed by section 4 of the Finance (New Duties) Act, 1916, as varied by section 14 of the Finance Act, 1966 (No. 17 of 1966), and paragraph 20 of the Imposition of Duties (No. 187) (Customs and Excise Duties and Form of Tariff) Order, 1970 (S.I. No. 268 of 1970), shall be further varied, as on and from the 16th day of January, 1975, by the addition of the sum of £0.0257 to the rate of duty chargeable immediately before that date.

(4) It is hereby declared that it is expedient in the public interest that this Resolution shall have statutory effect under the provisions of the Provisional Collection of Taxes Act, 1927 (No. 7 of 1927).

Mr. Haughey

I have a recollection that small mineral water firms enjoyed special concessions. Is that special concessionary position being maintained?

Mr. R. Ryan

Yes.

Mr. Haughey

Is the Minister making the concession proportionate to the increased rate of duty?

Mr. R. Ryan

I am not altering the rebate. I am maintaining it.

Mr. Haughey

To that extent the position of the small local mineral water manufacturer will be proportionately worsened.

Mr. R. Ryan

No. Circumstances have changed considerably since the original rebate was granted. The small concerns are fewer in number, if indeed they exist at all. I pointed out that consumption since the duty was last increased has risen by 136 per cent. The smaller firms have largely disappeared.

Mr. G. Collins

What effect will this increase have on the average sized bottle of lemonade or coca cola which children buy?

Mr. R. Ryan

That depends on the size of the bottle. It is approximately 2½p a gallon and I am told there may be as many as 16 to 24 bottles in a gallon.

Mr. T.J. Fitzpatrick

(Dublin Central): What is the duty at the moment on a gallon?

Mr. R. Ryan

The excise duty content on the half pint bottle is at present 0.46p.

Mr. T.J. Fitzpatrick

(Dublin Central): Will that go up?

Mr. R. Ryan

The proposed increased rate is from 0.46p to 0.62p the half pint. Table waters are sold in bottles containing 1/3rd of a pint and the duty would be 0.42p

Mr. MacSharry

It is 0.19p of an increase on the bottle so.

Mr. R. Ryan

Deputies will have to increase their children's pocket money.

Mr. Brennan

I am surprised the pioneers who talk so vehemently about the evils of strong drink are not opposing this. This is a disgrace. This is the only cheap drink the children have. We oppose it strongly.

Mr. Lemass

In view of the fact that mineral waters are a high profit item in retail outlets, will he ensure through the Minister for Industry and Commerce that no price increase will be granted?

Mr. Cunningham

He will not.

Mr. R. Ryan

I sympathise with what Deputy Lemass is saying because some of these items are sold for as much as 15p in public bars. When you consider that the duty element is less than ½p, you have some idea that the quantity of profit moving towards the retailer, the manufacturer and the distributor is quite significant. In relation to what Deputy Brennan said I should like to remark—and I am sure he is not unaware of it—that one of the principal elements in the consumption of these items is as mixers for alcoholic drinks.

Mr. Brennan

Thinners.

Mr. R. Ryan

That is a new name for them. I understood that it was only soda water that had an effect as a thinner and that everything else was inclined to be a fattener.

Mr. Lemass

Is the Minister aware that in England all licensed premises have soda water available in syphons and that this facility is denied by Irish manufacturers?

Mr. R. Ryan

I noticed in America recently that they deliver these items by hose.

Mr. Brennan

The Minister is not correct in saying that they are used mainly as mixers because they are sold in grocery shops, confectionery shops and unlicensed premises throughout the country.

Mr. R. Ryan

A fair amount of them are used as mixers too.

Question put.

The Dáil divided: Tá, 67; Níl, 62.

Tá

• Barry, Peter.
• Barry, Richard.
• Begley, Michael.
• Belton, Luke.
• Bermingham, Joseph.
• Bruton, John.
• Burke, Dick.
• Burke, Joan T.
• Burke, Liam.
• Byrne, Hugh.
• Cluskey, Frank.
• Collins, Edward.
• Conlan, John F.
• Coogan, Fintan.
• Cooney, Patrick M.
• Corish, Brendan.
• Cosgrave, Liam.
• Coughlan, Stephen.
• Creed, Donal.
• Crotty, Kieran.
• Cruise-O'Brien, Conor.
• Desmond, Barry.
• Desmond, Eileen.
• Dockrell, Henry P.
• Dockrell, Maurice.
• Donegan, Patrick S.
• Donnellan, John.
• Dunne, Thomas.
• Enright, Thomas.
• Esmonde, John G.
• Finn, Martin.
• Fitzpatrick, Tom (Cavan).
• Flanagan, Oliver J.
• Gilhawley, Eugene.
• Governey, Desmond.
• Griffin, Brendan.
• Harte, Patrick D.
• Hegarty, Patrick.
• Jones, Denis F.
• Kavanagh, Liam.
• Keating, Justin.
• Kelly, John.
• Kenny, Henry.
• Kyne, Thomas A.
• L'Estrange, Gerald.
• Lynch, Gerard.
• McDonald, Charles B.
• McLaughlin, Joseph.
• McMahon, Larry.
• Malone, Patrick.
• Murphy, Michael P.
• O'Brien, Fergus.
• O'Connell, John.
• O'Donnell, Tom.
• O'Leary, Michael.
• O'Sullivan, John L.
• Pattison, Seamus.
• Reynolds, Patrick J.
• Ryan, John J.
• Spring, Dan.
• Staunton, Myles.
• Taylor, Frank.
• Thornley, David.
• Timmins, Godfrey.
• Toal, Brendan.
• Tully, James.
• White, James.

Níl

• Allen, Lorcan.
• Andrews, David.
• Barrett, Sylvester.
• Blaney, Neil T.
• Brady, Philip A.
• Brennan, Joseph.
• Breslin, Cormac.
• Briscoe, Ben.
• Brosnan, Seán.
• Browne, Seán.
• Brugha, Ruairí.
• Burke, Raphael P.
• Callanan, John.
• Calleary, Seán.
• Carter, Frank.
• Colley, George.
• Collins, Gerard.
• Connolly, Gerard.
• Crinion, Brendan.
• Cronin, Jerry.
• Leonard, James.
• Loughnane, William.
• Lynch, Celia.
• Lynch, Jack.
• McEllistrim, Thomas.
• MacSharry, Ray.
• Meaney, Tom.
• Molloy, Robert.
• Moore, Seán.
• Murphy, Ciarán.
• Nolan, Thomas.
• Crowley, Flor.
• Cunningham, Liam.
• Daly, Brendan.
• Davern, Noel.
• Dowling, Joe.
• Fahey, Jackie.
• Farrell, Joseph.
• Faulkner, Pádraig.
• Fitzgerald, Gene.
• Fitzpatrick, Tom (Dublin Central).
• French, Seán.
• Gallagher, Denis.
• Gibbons, Hugh.
• Gogan, Richard P.
• Haughey, Charles.
• Healy, Augustine A.
• Hussey, Thomas.
• Kenneally, William.
• Lalor, Patrick J.
• Lemass, Noel T.
• Noonan, Michael.
• O'Connor, Timothy.
• O'Kennedy, Michael.
• O'Leary, John.
• O'Malley, Desmond.
• Power, Patrick.
• Timmons, Eugene.
• Tunney, Jim.
• Walsh, Seán.
• Wilson, John P.
• Wyse, Pearse.

Tellers: Tá, Deputies Kelly and B. Desmond: Níl, Deputies Lalor and Browne.

Question declared carried.