asked the Minister for Industry and Commerce the number of research vessels being used by his Department for marine research.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Marine Research.
15.
There are currently no research vessels directly available to my Department for marine research.
In view of the importance of this type of development should it not be a matter of urgency that boats for the purpose of research in this field be either purchased or rented?
Again, I must refer the Deputy to the text of the question in which he asked the number of research vessels being used by my Department. I do not know whether it would be desirable that the Department of Industry and Commerce should ever assume general responsibility for the whole area of science. The universities and the Department of Agriculture and Fisheries are much more natural users of vessels. The Deputy is aware that in the Fisheries division there is the Cú Feasa and I understand there is approval for two further vessels. Also, in UCG there are three research vessels so when I say there are none available to my Department I do not mean there is none in the country. I cannot give a firm answer at the moment on the question of the vessels that were recommended by the NSC-OECD studies but I am seeking to implement the first part of that recommendation as an addition to the four vessels already in use.
I am aware that in regard to fisheries there are boats that are obsolete so that they are not capable of doing the work they were intended for. In relation to the proposed 200 miles limit and the valuable resources the imposition of such a limit would entail, is it not absolutely necessary that we gear ourselves to finding out what is to be gained from the vast area to be explored?
Essentially, this is a matter for another Minister.
By way of general reply I can tell the Deputy that the money spent in this area is increasing rapidly. I agree with the sentiment in the Deputy's supplementary but we are starting from a very low baseline and are expanding rapidly.
16.
asked the Minister for Industry and Commerce the facilities available to his Department by way of laboratories, field stations, data processing and so on, for the purpose of marine research development.
There are currently no facilities directly available to my Department for marine research purposes. However, the Marine Science Advisory Committee of the National Science Council which functions within my area of responsibility maintains contact with the whole range of institutions which have such facilities available.
May I take it from the replies to both the last questions that we have not as much as got down to the basics of research in relation to this whole area of coast which will now be coming within the nation's control?
First, nothing in my answer suggested that and, secondly, it is directly contrary to the facts. I have here a list which runs into four foolscap pages of the different institutions engaged in marine research and development in Ireland. These are numerous and are attached to the universities and the different agencies of State. To suggest that there is no interest or no expansion in this field is a travesty of the facts.
Is it not true that the agencies the Minister is referring to are dealing specifically with fishing? Will he not agree that we must tackle the area of exploration in relation to oil and gas and not leave all this work to foreigners?
The Deputy is expanding on the subject matter of the question.
How many of the NSC recommendations have been implemented or are in the course of implementation?
I have regard for the Deputy's concern in this area but his supplementary is an indication of his irresponsibility in relation to finding out the facts and of his misleading attitude, whether consciously or otherwise, when he asks if the research is not merely in relation to fisheries. Since he makes that inference it is only correct that I should record the different sections of marine research and development in Ireland. They are oceanography, meteorology, environmental studies, botanic studies, zoological studies, fishery science as separate from botany and zoology, mariculture, geology, geophysics, petroleum studies and data processing. To suggest that the effort is sufficient is untrue but I have been able to take some initiatives and we are moving consistently on the OECD recommendations. I am not suggesting that there is nearly enough effort but we must not distort the suggestion by saying that no effort is being made or that we are unaware of our responsibilities or that there are major areas in which there is no work being carried out. The work is not sufficiently funded or staffed but it is good and serious research and I do not want it diminished in value in this House.
Deputy Gallagher rose.
We have dwelt for some time on this question and I note that a couple of other Deputies are offering, too, so I shall allow one short supplementary from each.
It is the Minister who is misleading the House. It is not true that those involved in this research are working on a shoestring without any worthwhile assistance from the State, that they are crying out for help which they are not being given?
The Chair is anxious to bring in Deputies Tunney and Molloy.
The Deputy is further misleading the House when he says that these people are working on a shoestring without any assistance from the State. What he says is not true and it would be easy for him to ascertain the facts.
In deference to the Minister's wishes can he tell the House the numbers of staff and the financial provisions in respect of the research in question so that we may know what is the exact position?
I would be very happy to do that but it did not arise on the question I was asked. However, if the Deputy will put down a question to that effect I shall be delighted to answer him but I cannot pluck facts like these out of the air in reply to supplementaries.
The Deputy was accepting the Minister's assertion that already there is worthwhile work being undertaken in this field.
Is the Deputy suggesting otherwise?
It is normal procedure here that we do not accept, without qualification, the word of anyone.
Is this leading to argument?
Can the Minister confirm what he has said by telling us (a) the number of people involved and (b) the financial provision for this work?
Will the Deputy please put down a question to that effect rather than expect me to produce those facts from the air? He will then have an answer he can depend on rather than to be given what are my opinions.
Is the Minister aware that the Department of Oceanography in University College, Galway, do not own a sea-going vessel from which they can carry out their ocean research, the training of students in oceanography and other activities such a department should be involved in? If the Minister is so aware would he agree to assist that department of the university from his departmental funds and because of his special responsibility for science, as he informed the House earlier?
The question asks me to outline the facilities available to my Department in regard to certain areas of marine research. I will happily answer questions if Deputies ask them of me but I cannot provide serious answers of detail if Deputies do not put down proper questions.
Arising from the Minister's reply——
I have allowed a series of supplementary questions and we must have some finality. I will allow a brief final supplementary from Deputy Lalor.
Why does the Minister ask us to put down further questions when he refuses to reply to the question on the Order Paper? We have asked for details and the Minister told us that he had three or four pages of material but he has not given us the information sought. The Chair is letting him get away with it.
The Deputy ought not to make any reflection on the Chair; the Chair is doing its best to act impartially and uphold the dignity and prestige of the House.
I accept that but why did the Chair not see to it that a reply was given to the question?
The Chair has no control over Ministers' replies and the Deputy knows that.
What is the purpose of a question then?
It is not the job of the Chair to tell the Deputy how he should word a question.
Am I to be lectured by the Minister for Industry and Commerce?
This is leading to disorder.
It is leading to disorder because this Minister, and his colleagues, are not made give the proper replies to questions.
Again I must ask the Deputy not to reflect on the Chair.
The Minister was asked for details.
The Chair has no responsibility whatsoever over such matters.
The Deputy should learn his trade.
I refuse to learn the trade from a dodgy Minister for Industry and Commerce.
This is wasting precious time at Question Time.