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Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 1 Feb 1979

Vol. 311 No. 2

White Paper “Programme for National Development 1978-1981.”: Motion (Resumed).

Debate resumed on the following motion:
That Dáil Éireann approves the targets for economic and social development and the supporting policies set out in the Government's White PaperProgramme for National Development 1978-1981.
—(The Taoiseach).

Over the next eight to ten years the Government face the greatest challenge of any Government for many years, that is, the challenge of providing employment for the increasing number of young people seeking it. It has been estimated by NESC that by 1986, if present trends of economic growth continue, we will only create one-third of the jobs that will be necessary to provide employment. Assuming we create between 80,000 and 100,000 jobs between now and 1986, it will only be one-third of our requirements. It is an immense challenge and it is against that background that the policies and pronouncements of the Government must be judged. I believe that the policies pursued have been ill-timed and will result in the dissipation of our natural resources in order to achieve short-term gains which will not result in the creation of permanent jobs.

It can be clearly demonstrated that an increase in economic growth will not create jobs if the resources from that increase are not used in a judicious way to increase and multiply within the country. Unfortunately the macro-economic policies of the Government of excessive demand stimulation at a time of increasing propensity to import are such that valuable Irish resources are being used to create jobs not in Ireland but in France, Germany and other countries who are sending their exports into our markets. Economic growth alone is not enough. To demonstrate that one can compare the performance of the Irish economy with that of the German economy over the past ten years and see what exactly has happened on the ground in those two economies.

Some people might be surprised to learn that Ireland had a faster annual growth rate in production over the last ten years than Germany had. What has happened as a result of that? The annual rate of growth over the last ten years in the German economy has been 3½ per cent and the annual rate of growth in the Irish economy in the same period has been 3¾ per cent. We did better than they did. The key question to which every Government must address themselves is, how are the fruits of that economic growth, created by the work of the Irish people, being used? Are they being used in such a way as to generate more growth or in such a way as to spend and live now without making due provision for the future? Unfortunately, the latter course has been pursued by successive Governments. I do not believe that we have made good use of the fruits of our economic growth and this can be demonstrated. For instance, on average over the last ten years we have used our economic growth to run a balance of payments deficit of 3½ per cent of GNP whereas the Germans have a balance of payments surplus of 1 per cent. We have been borrowing 9 per cent of our GNP whereas the Germans have been borrowing only 3 per cent of theirs. The results of this policy in an open economy of spending more than you are taking in have been that the jobs that should have been created by our economic growth in Ireland are being created outside Ireland because we are sending the money that is generated in the country out of the country too quickly. That is partly as a result of the fact that we are a small open economy. Quite clearly the traditional Keynesian method of boosting employment by demand stimulation works much less well in a small open economy than it does in a large closed economy. We have been acting in our demand management policies as if we were a large closed economy when in fact we are a small open economy.

Our policy of generalised undifferentiated demand stimulation as a means of creating more jobs has been in direct contrast to what has been the deliberate policy of successive Governments over the years. The deliberate policy of all Governments has been to make our economy more, not less, open. We entered into the Anglo-Irish Free Trade Agreement originally and we subsequently entered into the European Economic Community.

The thrust of all of these policies has been to make our economy more open. If £1 is spent in an Irish shop it is now more likely as a result of deliberate Government policy of opening our economy that that £ or a larger share of it will end up in Germany, France or somewhere else. Policies of generalised demand stimulation as a means to create employment might have made sense in the fifties or sixties when we were not as open an economy as we are now. They do not make sense at present unless careful preparation has been entered into to make sure that the demand stimulation is of such a character that its results stay in the country and that we have prepared our economy to make full use of it.

The results of our pursuing the wrong type of policy and the Germans pursuing the right type is that they have derived far greater benefits in terms of real income increases from a lesser rate of actual production growth than we have over the last ten years. The fact is that while wages here over the last ten years rose at an average rate of 16 per cent per annum, wages in Germany rose by 9 per cent per annum. However, prices here rose at an average rate of 12 per cent per annum while prices in Germany rose by only 4½ per cent per annum. To sum this up, wages have risen in this country by less than twice as fast as in Germany whereas prices in this country have risen three times as fast as those in Germany. The result is that real income increases in this country have been considerably less than in Germany notwithstanding the fact that we have had a slightly higher rate of growth of GNP. The reason for that is that we have dissipated, by means of excessive generalised demand stimulation in our economy under successive Governments, the results of economic growth whereas the Germans have conserved within Germany, by responsible financial policies, the results of a lesser economic growth. The significance of this is that they are now better off than we are relative to what they were ten years ago although their economic rate of growth has been less than ours.

The Government have actually exaggerated the underlying errors that have been made by successive Governments in relation to economic policy. Rather than reversing errors that might have been made in the past they have exaggerated them. They have gone on what was described by the Minister for Economic Planning and Development as one of the biggest gambles in our nation's history which involved for a period of a year-and-a-half a policy of high borrowing, high demand stimulation and high imports. This has dissipated still further and to an ever greater extent the results of underlying economic growth.

The high stimulus which took place in 1977 and 1978 was seriously mistimed. It took place at the wrong time. This stimulus, which we cannot now undertake because we have not got the resurces as we are now over-borrowed, should not have taken place in 1977 or 1978 but should be taking place now. There are two major admissions in the White Paper which demonstrate the fact that the Government realise that the stimulation of the economy at that time was mistimed. They admit that the "Buy Irish" campaign has only had a limited impact on imports of consumer goods in 1978. They further state that the growing proportion of personal spending devoted to imports is one illustration of a trend which requires corrective action. They go on to say that perhaps the "Buy Irish" compaign will have a greater effect in 1979. If it is the case that a growing proportion of any money spent in this country is going on imports, surely that is the wrong time to start pumping in money. The proper approach for the Government would have been to have launched the "Buy Irish" campaign in 1977 and 1978 and have the demand stimulus when that campaign was well established and the Government were satisfied that the results of such a stimulus would, as a result of the "Buy Irish" campaign, stay in this country. What the Government did was launch the stimulus first and it is only now when that stimulus is over and the Government are telling us they will have to reduce their borrowing requirement, that the stimulus will have to be withdrawn, that it was a once-off effort, that they believe that the "Buy Irish" campaign might begin to have an effect. It is only when that is happening in 1979 that they believe that the "Buy Irish" campaign might begin to have an effect.

Surely the proper way would have been to do it the other way round—have the "Buy Irish" campaign first and then the stimulus. Instead, the demand stimulus which took place in 1977-8 was mistimed and did not have the results sought and led to a dissipation of our resources. I think this can be clearly demonstrated by reference to figures that are publicly available. We have at present a rate of inflation of 7, 8 or 9 per cent—in that general area. Yet, in 1978 over 1979 our trade deficit increased not by 10 or even 20 per cent but by 24 per cent. It increased by almost three times as much as the rate of depreciation of money here. That is not a healthy situation and it is a direct result of a mistimed demand stimulus which is causing jobs to be created in Birmingham, Germany and Japan with Irish money provided by Irish taxpayers. That worsening situation accelerated throughout 1978.

For instance in the last quarter of that year exports rose by 3.4 per cent but imports of finished consumer goods increased by 5.5 per cent, more than one-third again as much. Imports of producers' capital goods actually fell by 2 per cent. So we are running a deficit and, if it is for consumer goods to be directly consumed, that deficit is being used to a decreasing extent to finance capital goods for further production. In the last quarter imports of producers capital goods fell by 2 per cent while consumer goods went up by 5½ per cent.

I believe that one of the reasons why, with a slightly better rate of growth and annual production over the last ten years than Germany, Ireland has done very much worse than Germany was because of the demand policy of successive Governments—the stimulus in our economy was dissipated abroad through imports. A second reason is that we failed to take action, in the way the Germans have done with their great emphasis on competition and mobility within their economy, in the area of skilled shortages. We have a very high rate of unemployment and yet the Government admit that there are many jobs that cannot be filled because those with the skills to fill them are not available. If you create a demand stimulus without the possibility of increased employment, of people with the right qualifications coming along to take up the jobs made available by this demand, the result of the stimulus obviously will be more imports or an increase in wage rates or an increase in speculation without any increase in employment. The bottle-neck in the labour market here should have been identified before the demand stimulus took place. Because that did not happen the result is that, notwithstanding the very high rate of unemployment, the Economic and Social Research Institute can tell us that 20 per cent of firms' returns to them have said that they cannot expand production because of labour shortages.

The Government admit there are substantial shortages of skilled labour in certain categories of the building industry—bricklayers and so on. We should be told and the Government should inquire as to why these skilled shortages can take place. Are there artificial barriers to the training of more bricklayers, more people with the particular skills that are scarce in the building industry? Is AnCO free to provide extra courses and extra places on courses in these skills? Are people already with those skills and represented in the unions for their particular crafts in a position to tell AnCO not to train any more than a particular number in these skills because they do not want extra competition? If that is not the case the Government should say so, but, if it is, they should do something about it because it is quite unacceptable that artificial skill shortages should be maintained in our economy by anybody in a position to do so.

We also need to look at the overall manpower preparation input from all arms of Government. In my view there is insufficient co-ordination between the educational system, the industrial training authority, AnCO, and those concerned with finding jobs for those already unemployed in relation to the needs of the labour market. Obviously, in a free economy the Government can never control and never should control the labour market, the supply of particular skills, and people should be always free to go into a particular profession although that profession may be oversupplied, but the Government can and should control what it does with its own money. It should not be using its money, as is the case at present, to train doctors when we are producing almost twice as many doctors as there are jobs for doctors in the health services here. We are training doctors for the Canadian health services and the health services of other countries abroad. I think that is not an acceptable use of taxpayers' money. I am sure that is not an isolated example of what can happen when you have the educational system, particularly higher education, going in one direction, secondary education going in another, the IDA in another and the National Manpower Service in yet another direction. All these agencies concerned with the creation or provision of people with the skills necessary to take the jobs that our economy needs must be properly coordinated by the Government.

I am glad that the Minister for Economic Planning and Development is present because I know he is aware of the suggestion I am about to make. Something along the lines of the National Board for Science and Technology should be established to coordinate all manpower preparation and preparation of persons for the labour market by a system which would integrate with the budget for secondary education, higher education, AnCO, the National Manpower Service and whatever new agencies will be set up in this area. These could be knitted together in a non-coercive way through such an agency concerned in the manpower field.

The unique characteristic of the National Board for Science and Technology in my opinion—and I had some part in steering that Bill through this House—is not that it compels individual Departments to do certain things with their budget but that it ensures that the Government is presented with one coherent picture when making decisions about the allocation of resources between different Departments and can consciously plan as a result of an agency such as this presenting them with such a picture. I hesitate to urge any Government to set up yet another agency because we have too many of them at present—indeed many that are being set up are set up to police other agencies—and it is a sort of never-ending Parkinsonian process.

Something along the lines I have suggested would have a very valuable effect and in bringing the necessary discipline into the overall training and education system would ensure that it takes account of the needs of the labour market. It would avoid the situation where demand stimulus does not result in the creation of Irish jobs because it is used for imports and to stimulate demand for certain types of employment, when the people to fill the jobs are not available because the training is not being provided due to the structural mess-up, which a board such as I have indicated could over time—not immediately—unscramble. I will be interested in the response of the Minister for Economic Planning and Development when he replies to the debate.

I turn now to agriculture which is my own area of responsibility. A lot of people do not realise the potential of agriculture to contribute to the creation of employment and to the overall objective, which this country and all parties share, of providing extra jobs for the people who are going to come on the labour market. As I have said, with the present trend we are going to create only one-third of the needed jobs by 1986 for people coming on the labour market by that time. It has been estimated by the NESC that if present economic agricultural trends continue—and these have been quite favourable—4,000 extra jobs could be created by 1986 in processing or supply industries directly related to agriculture. That is not to be deprecated. But they also estimate that if the right policies are pursued and if high agricultural growth takes place, we could create as many as 22,000 as against 4,000 extra jobs in processing. In other words, 18,000 jobs in processing could result from the right agricultural policies, from new improved agricultural policies, whereas only 4,000 jobs would result if the present policy options in agriculture are continued in the present trends. When I say that 18,000 extra jobs could be created by the right policies in agriculture, I should mention that 10,000 of those could be created in the dairying sector.

Agriculture can make another contribution to the provision of jobs. First of all, there is the much neglected possibility of the creation of jobs in agriculture itself, on the farm. There is far too ready an acceptance by economic planners generally that it is not possible to create new jobs in agriculture. Obviously it is not possible to create over all an increase in the number of people employed in agriculture, but many of the people in agriculture are of an age which will mean that they will not be in agriculture anyway in ten or 15 years' time, and that reduction is going to take place anyway. But there is a very strong possibility of increasing what one might describe as the active labour force in agriculture. There should be in projection age differentiation and we should concentrate, not solely on the overall number employed in agriculture, but on the number who could be employed in agriculture in what might be described as the active age groups. I will not put a figure on it, but most people will know the age group to which I refer.

The Government should realise that there are possibilities in this field, and they should look at the Farm Modernisation Scheme with a view not only to increasing production but also to increasing employment. Some of the grants perhaps could be altered in such a way as to give an employment creation emphasis as well as a capital creation emphasis which seems to be almost exclusively the matter which is grant-aided in the scheme at the moment. Furthermore, if agriculture grows fast, fewer people will leave the land, and this means that there will be less competition for jobs outside agriculture with people seeking non-agricultural occupations.

Processing, increased jobs on the land and reduced prices on the land are three ways whereby agriculture can contribute directly to the national effort to create jobs for people who will be seeking them between now and 1986. All policy-making in relation to agriculture should take cognisance of these three facts. People working in an urban environment, and particularly the trade unions who sometimes perhaps are overstrident in their criticism of increases in agricultural income, should realise that they are interdependent with agriculture and that prosperous agriculture can make a direct and immediate contribution to creating and preserving jobs for their members. This interdependence must be stressed increasingly by all sectors of our economy if we are to go forward on a proper basis. In this country one person in five is employed in agriculture. Agriculture is far more important in our economy than it is in the economy of any other member of the EEC by a long shot. We should realise this when we are talking about unemployment and employment creation.

It is against that background that I feel bound to express my disappointment with the sections of the White Paper which deal with agriculture. Indeed, they make quite pessimistic reading. The Government say with some pride that a rate of growth in agricultural production of 9.4 per cent was achieved in 1977, a year for which both sides of this House can share responsibility. Without being unfair, one could say that the majority of the stimulus for the entire growth throughout that year was created prior to July 1977, but that is a matter about which one would not wish to cavil. A rate of growth of 9½ per cent was achieved in agricultural production in 1977. One would have expected that the Government would hope to be able to maintain the rate of growth in agriculture that they inherited from their predecessors, but no. In the White Paper the Government say that they project a gross increase in agricultural production in 1979 and 1980 of 4 per cent—less than half the rate of growth achieved in 1977 as a result of the agricultural policies of their predecessors. If one adjusts that growth target of 4 per cent to a net figure, the Government are talking about an increase of only 3.3 per cent net agricultural product in 1979 and in 1980. That is a very pessimistic start to agricultural policy-making.

Furthermore, the global targets of 4 per cent a year for two years are not much use for economic planning to those engaged in agriculture in semi-State bodies and on the farm, wishing to see what the Government's view and intentions are, and making their own plans accordingly. A lot of people forget the purpose of economic planning. It is action by the Government to create a climate of certainty in which people can invest and take their own independent decisions, knowing what the Government are doing and what they intend. Merely setting a global target of 4 per cent in agriculture is no help to practical decision-making on the farm, in the factory or in the boardroom of a semi-State company concerned with agriculture. What would have been useful would have been sectoral targets for milk, beef, sheep and grain. If individual targets were set for the individual sectors then the people in Bord Gráin would know what to expect in their sector, and the people in the CBF would know what to expect in their sector, and likewise farmers engaged in other lines of production. Telling them that overall agricultural growth is going to increase by 4 per cent tells them really nothing. It is of interest to economists who are interested in comparing one paper with another and engaging in learned discussions about economic models and input and output. It is of no use whatever to practical men making practical decisions on the farm, in the factory or in the board room.

So far as economic planning is concerned, I believe that the targets set by the present Government are very weak and remiss indeed. I do not think in any real sense one can describe this White Paper as an economic plan at all because of the lack of precision in the economic projections in individual sectors of the economy. Certainly this plan would not be accepted in France as an economic plan within the concept of economic planning they have there, and it is a country with a free economy. In France the plans and targets are drawn up in immense detail. They are prepared in draft and consultations take place in depth with each sector of the economy. Then finally a target is produced that has been agreed with various sectors. That has not happened in this country.

I do not believe one can say that economic planning has taken place here under this Government at all, though I readily concede it did not take place under the previous Government. But the previous Government were honest about it. They said they were not engaging in economic planning. They said they believed that things were changing too fast for economic planning to take place. They may have been wrong but at least that is what they said and they were honest about it. But the present Government were telling the people that they were going to introduce economic planning and that this was one of the major ways in which they would create employment here. That is what they told the people before the election. Not only were they going to create jobs, not only would they engage in getting rid of car tax and do all sorts of other wonderful things, but they were going to engage in economic planning as well to make sure that that money was properly used. Quite clearly this is not an economic plan because its targets are so global as to be of little value to anybody.

There is another failing in relation specifically to agricultural targets in the White Paper: the targets are not broken down on a county by county basis. I believe that there should be county development teams set up in relation to agriculture in each county, that all the agencies—the ACC, the county committees of agriculture, processing industries and so on involved in a particular county—should be amalgamated into a team and that they should set targets for their own county. The fact is that there have been immense differences in the rate of agricultural progress in different parts of the country. To give an example of this, over the last five years, which have been five very good years for agriculture, production on the farm in the west and north-west has increased by only one-third the rate of other parts of the country. A realisation of that fact is not reflected in the White Paper, nor are there any measures proposed in the White Paper—there are some but not conscious measures—designed to eliminate that imbalance. Furthermore, as between farmers the results of economic progress have been unevenly distributed. There are some farmers whose incomes have shot ahead. But it should be remembered that one farmer in every ten—and I am speaking now about full-time farmers—had an income in 1978 below £1,000 a year. One farmer in every ten, a full-time farmer, perhaps with a family, was earning less than £1,000 a year and the proportion of farmers earning less than £1,000 a year in 1978 as against 1977 did not reduce, even though the proportion of farmers earning more than £3,000 a year in 1978 as against 1977 increased dramatically. Therefore, the results of progress are not being shared equally between farmers.

The Government must take conscious action to deal with that. What are they doing? They are proposing to remove the one means that one in ten full-time farmers has of making ends meet, namely, unemployment assistance, unless he is prepared to make a full declaration of his income. This is what, it appears, is going to come in the budget. That may sound very fair, but the fact is that these men probably are not prepared to make a full declaration of income because of the conservative positions they have about making any declaration of what they earn, their fear of inspectors, of Government and of anybody interfering with them.

We were told also that, to compensate for the removal of unemployment assistance or the reduction in its availability, improvements would be made in the disadvantaged areas scheme, and that these two schemes were interdependent. I ask then: why has the amount of money for the disadvantaged areas scheme in this year's Estimates been increased by 1.3 per cent only while the overall rate of increase in the budget for agriculture has been 9 per cent? This seems to indicate that not only are they cutting unemployment assistance but they are also cutting relatively on the disadvantaged areas scheme as well, which was supposed to be the scheme to be used to compensate.

Furthermore, I believe that the western drainage proposals will be used only to save money for the Irish Exchequer and that there will be no acceleration in actual drainage overall. There can be no assurance that that will not be the case unless the Government are prepared to account separately for EEC arterial drainage from money spent on drainage otherwise. There has been a serious underspending under the heading of arterial drainage in the Capital Budget of 1978. One million pounds voted by this House in 1978 for arterial drainage was not spent. Almost 30 per cent of the total sum voted in 1978 for arterial drainage was, because of inefficiency in the Board of Works, not spent. That is not a good platform from which to be launching what we are told is an EEC-aided accelerated arterial drainage programme.

I should like to refer also to the run-down in our beef herd. The beef cow herd in this country is now almost half what it was in 1974—in other words, the number of calves being produced for beef production is being rapidly reduced. I believe we should apply now for EEC aid for a calved heifer subsidy scheme to reverse that dangerous trend that will affect employment in the meat processing industry directly in coming years. I believe that EEC aid would be available on the grounds that it would be a diversion from milk production. The Government make no mention in their White Paper of making any application for this even though it is believed that the French Government will have it brought about anyway. It looks as if the Government will again be travelling on the coat tails of the French, just as they did in relation to western drainage, just as they did also in relation to the structural grants for the west of Ireland. They will be travelling along on the coat tails of the French and Italians. The French and Italians will get it. A year later the Irish Government will come up with the same scheme and pretend they got it all on their own efforts when in fact they got it only because of the efforts of other Ministers in other countries with different problems.

We are told also in relation to the beef industry that the role of the CBF— Córas Beostoic agus Feola Teo.—is to be expanded. Why then has the budget for CBF been increased by only 5 per cent when the overall budget for the Department of Agriculture has been increased by twice that amount? That does not look like an expanded role for the CBF; it looks like a reduced role. We are told also that the expected reduced slaughterings in meat plants could be offset by a shift to higher value-added forms of production within the meat plants. Why then has the marketing incentive scheme proposed by the National Economic and Social Council, which would have done precisely that, which would have led to increased value added, not been adopted? Why have the Government completely ignored that scheme in the White Paper? A serious proposal from the National Economic and Social Council, which would have had a direct effect in increasing employment in the meat processing industry, has not alone been rejected but has been ignored in the White Paper. I ask the Government to address themselves to that when they come round to their next paper, whatever colour that may be.

We have already had signs of a mini-budget for agriculture before any budget has been announced. The Estimates provide for £10 million extra to be collected in appropriations-in-aid from agriculture; presumably this is in respect of fees. We have already had the Government taking £2.3 million away from agriculture by the removal of the lime fertiliser transport subsidy. That will increase the price of lime by £1 per ton.

We have had no action on land purchase or reform. No extra money has been provided for the Land Commission this year for land purchase. The amount being provided for purchases under the farm retirement scheme has been reduced by 20 per cent and the amount for annuities under the same scheme has been reduced by 3½ per cent. In other words, the Government are opting out of the land market. They are washing their hands completely. They do not mind now who buys land. They are just standing back; they are not providing the Land Commission with the money to enable the Land Commission to intervene and maintain some sort of discipline and order in the land market. The Government, for economic and financial reasons, have opted out of the land market. They are not providing the Land Commission with the money to exercise their powers to do anything about it. They are not putting anything in its place. It is a very serious situation which generations of farmers in the years to come will regret.

If there is one single feature about this Government it is that they have planned well. When the Minister for Finance in the Coalition Government was saying that there was no point in planning because we did not know what was going to happen, even at that stage Fianna Fáil were getting ready for the time when they would be back in power and when they would be able to get the country on its feet again. Long before 1977 when the then Government were saying it was impossible to plan we were doing that.

In the past year the fruits of this planning are plain to see. We are going ahead step by step with an orderly, specific programme and so far each step has been successful. We have done exactly what we set out to do, and much more. In 1976 inflation was running at 20 per cent and I do not think anyone believed that we could reduce it, as we have done, to 7 per cent now.

During those years of inflation in my constituency the rate of price increases was the cause of much worry and distress to housewives. Prices were going sky-high. At that time in an evening newspaper there was a clock indicator that showed the rate of inflation each week and it was spinning around non-stop. That does not appear any more in the newspaper because inflation has slowed down. Now it is more or less under control although I hope to see it reduced even further in the coming year.

The national reconstruction is going ahead successfully but there will always be certain sections who do not appear to gain. In particular I am thinking of old age pensioners and widows. I realise it is difficult to give these people sufficient incomes until we get the unemployment situation under control. The country can become prosperous and we can look after these people adequately only when the workforce is employed. People must have jobs. It must be made possible for teenagers to get employment when they leave school. It is very sad to see young people answering advertisements over and over again and more often than not not even getting an acknowledgement. The single most important item Fianna Fáil have to tackle is to get people into employment. They are doing this and I hope they will be even more successful in the coming five years.

Nothing creates a better society than where the head of the household is working and where the teenage children have employment. Unemployment causes all kinds of social ills and unrest. The housewife is unhappy and the husband feels degraded because he has to sit at home, unable to get work. There are rows and friction in the home, the children are unhappy and often get into trouble. It is impossible for families to get decent housing accommodation because they cannot afford it. Our most important task is to have employment for all our people. When this is done we will be in a better position to look after our deprived citizens. We can increase social welfare so that people will not find it difficult to cope with everyday living.

In the past year we have been the envy of a number of EEC countries. The growth rate of the economy has doubled that of EEC countries and other countries outside the Community. When Fianna Fáil came back to office we had to do something drastic to get the country moving again. When we derated houses it gave people a little extra money to spend. This helped the economy.

Much has been said about the Buy Irish campaign. I do not think it is working. When I purchase goods it is only when I get home that I realise they are made in some other country. When they are shopping people do not look specifically to see if an article is made in Ireland. It is important that a person should be able to see immediately if an article is imported. Perhaps we could have some system where a tag or label with the word "imported" might be put on items. If this were clearly legible people would know immediately that the article in question was not Irish made. People must be made aware that by buying foreign-made goods they are doing harm to our industries.

When one asks in a shop if a certain article is made in Ireland it is deplorable to get the answer, "No, it would not sell". How can shopkeepers know it would not sell if it is not on their shelves? Irish people would be much more inclined to buy Irish goods if they were readily available on the shelves and if they could see straight away which articles were imported. There are a number of goods of foreign manufacture with the same kind of packaging as on Irish goods and it is not immediately obvious that they are not Irish made.

Much has been said recently about the removal of food subsidies. This concerns me a lot because the majority of people in my constituency benefited from these subsidies and they were perturbed because of the removal of the subsidies. I should like to point out that we have been subsidising food for people who did not need it, for those with good incomes who were well able to pay the cost. We have been subsidising food for our two million tourists. Why should we do this for people who have incomes of £10,000 per year? I am quite certain that the Government will reimburse the people who need it. It is better that we take the subsidies from the people who do not want them and give them to those in need. I am sure that those who have suffered because of the removal of subsidies will benefit even more than when the food subsidies were in existence.

It has been said that a lot of money is going out of the country and that we should have a tighter grip on what is happening. One industry that is of great economic benefit is the tourist industry which has gone ahead in leaps and bounds over the last two years. Extra funds have been allocated to CERT to train extra staff for the tourist industry. I understand that there are 1,000 vacancies in this industry which cannot be filled at the moment and I hope that the people trained by CERT will be recruited during the next tourist season.

I am glad to note that a temporary hire agency is to be set up under the National Manpower Service. This will be of tremendous advantage to the people who wish to work part-time. The people I have in mind are married women with growing families or retired people who still have active working years ahead of them. Part-time work is very hard to find at the moment and it is sad to see a person who did not wish to retire, with a number of good working years ahead of him, deteriorate because he has nothing to do. A lot of these people would really appreciate a part-time job which would keep their minds and bodies active and they should be encouraged to take up this type of employment if it becomes available. Over the last year or two AnCO have increased the places available for training and they are training many more people than before. This gives many young people an opportunity to take up training so as to be in a better position to obtain employment.

Much has been said about public transport. The needs of Dublin city at the moment are such that it is hard to know where to start when talking about them. Certain groups of people are against the improvement and the construction of new roadways. Surely, in the latter half of the 20th century the city needs new or improved roadways as well as roadways to circle the city so not to bring traffic into the city. We also need new roads from the city to the south, the west and the north. I do not advocate that we build huge roadways through the city but that we improve the roads and build roads where necessary. The city is choked with traffic. It takes one and a quarter hours for people from places like Blanchardstown and Tallaght to get into work in the morning. Recently on a television programme people who lived two, three or four miles away from the city were interviewed about how long it took them to get to town by various modes of transport. Trains apparently were the fastest method of transport and a rapid rail transport system from towns like Blanchardstown and Tallaght should be examined. The bicycle was the next most efficient mode of transport, running or walking was the next most efficient method of getting to town and the bus was the least efficient. It is a complete waste of time for people to be sitting for an hour and a quarter in a bus. People who have to sit in a bus for an hour or so every morning often feel like getting out and walking but many are middle-aged or elderly and cannot walk or run although if they did they would probably get there four times as quick.

The runner got there before the cyclist.

I must check that out. Something must be done about the traffic in the city so that people using the bus service will be able to get to town within a reasonable time. It is just not on for a person to have to leave Templeogue or Tallaght at 8.10 a.m. to arrive in Grafton Street at 9.30 a.m.

On the Adjournment I know Deputy Quinn will bring up the problem of traffic wardens in the city but if the law in relation to traffic were enforced in the city it would relieve some of the problems. Law enforcement in relation to traffic is non-existent. It is just ridiculous to have cars parked and double parked on both sides of Harcourt Street, for instance, so that traffic has to squeeze through. Whoever is responsible for law enforcement should tow away illegally parked cars all over the city. This would at least be a start in improving traffic conditions while we are planning to improve the roads in the city.

One campaign that has been successful is the campaign through the Health Education Bureau by the Minister for Health for the prevention of illness. People are becoming more aware that they can do a lot to prevent illness. I have noticed that a great many people who smoked are not now smoking. We have come to the conclusion that at committee meetings and in various places we should not smoke and this is a good thing. It is now the "in thing" not to smoke and this has been brought about by advertising.

In relation to education, my prime concern is with primary education. If a person gets through primary school, obtaining a reasonable level of education, he is on the road to being reasonably successful in life. It is important, if they want to go on to second-level education, that they have a good primary school background.

In my view we are not catering properly for those children regarded as slow learners. Too many children leave our schools without being able to read, spell or write properly. Special schools are needed for such children. A special programme of teaching is involved and it is not possible to give that in the ordinary primary schools. Very few seem to know much about the condition known as dyslexia but a considerable number of children suffer from it. We should set up special schools for such children or at least allocate a classroom in all schools for them. It is my hope that the Minister for Education will improve the extension of classrooms in the coming year and increase the capitation grant which is inadequate at present. I am aware that the Minister has already increased it, but it is still inadequate.

I was pleased to learn that it will be easier from now on to obtain a mortgage to purchase a house but I do not think the average young couple will benefit from this relaxation because many of them do not have money invested with building societies. Those fortunate enough to have money in building societies cannot afford the repayments on a loan of £15,000 or £16,000. Such people should be catered for in a special way. We could help them by increasing the income limit from £3,500 to £5,000 for SDA loans. If that income limit was increased more people could avail of the Dublin Corporation low mortgage scheme loan. I understand that 700 people availed of that scheme last year. The figure under that scheme was increased by the Government from £7,000 to £9,000, but even £9,000 is inadequate. The price of houses is increasing at such a pace that loan limits are out of date one month after they are increased. We must keep increasing such limits to keep pace with the increase in the cost of housing.

I hope our economy improves so that we will get more people back to work in the next two years. I would like to see old age pensioners and widows properly looked after. It is unbelievable that such people who have a small income are taxed. I would like to see those people exempt from tax. There is no point in taxing an old age pensioner or a widow on an income of £20 per week. It is not possible to live on £20 per week. We should have more thought for those who have large families and small incomes. It is sad to see a widow with three or four children unable to educate her children. In a lot of cases such people cannot afford to send their children to vocational schools. We must help those widows. The Government are facing the greatest challenge of any Government since the foundation of the State and, in my view, they are on their way to accomplishing their aims. I believe that before the five years have passed all our people anxious to get work will be in employment.

Firstly, I should like to reject in the most uncompromising language I can muster at least some of the assumptions that seem to underlie the section of the White Paper dealing with education, and with third-level education in particular. Acceptance of these assumptions is based on a belief and an approach to education that is as old-fashioned as the horse and cart in this technological age.

There is an assumption in the White Paper that third-level education, which, as we all know, is very expensive, is overwhelmingly a private benefit for the person who avails of it. This assumption is then used to underpin the argument that the pattern of third-level education might have to be reviewed and, more specifically, that the financing of third-level education might have to be reviewed. Paragraph 6.13 of the White Paper states:

the Government feel that third level institutions should be moving towards a situation where they would collect a greater proportion of their income in fees and that this movement should be accompanied by an appropriate improvement in the grants scheme for poorer students. On the second option they consider that the subsidy for board and accommodation for student teachers should be reduced, with a view to placing these students more on a par with other third level students.

In relation to the proposal to increase the level of third-level fees the White Paper was following a similar paragraph set out in the Green Paper, Development for Full Employment. In the White Paper the Government note that this suggestion met with a different fate from different organisations and bodies who made comments on it after the publication of the Green Paper. In particular they note that the National Economic and Social Council accepted the argumentation of the Green Paper, whereas the Higher Education Authority rejected it.

It is not often I find myself in major disagreement with the NESC but this particular section of the NESC's comments on the Green Paper was one of the weakest sections in that paper, because it seemed to accept holus-bolus the argument of the Green Paper in relation to third-level education, an argument which sees third-level education much more as a consumer good— something you buy like a lollipop in a shop—than as something which has to be integrated as fully as possible into not only the economic but the social development of all our people.

The Higher Education Authority on the other hand, who have had the advantage which the NESC so far have not, of actually carrying out a study in this area, have come to a diametrically opposite conclusion. It might be argued that the HEA represent to some extent a vested interest. They are the interests which look after education. They are the Minister for Education's advisory council on Higher Education and therefore might be expected to defend the status quo. But ultimately it does not matter to the HEA whether fees are raised or lowered in higher education, except in so far as such a policy affects access to higher education and the availability of higher education. They have a vested interest in promoting greater access to higher education and in promoting the spread of higher education, but they are not doing that as an isolated pressure group. They are doing it simply because the social and economic needs of the country demand it.

Their comment on the Green Paper which could be transferred in its entirety to the White Paper deserves the consideration of the House. Noting that the authority had recently completed a study of fees as a component of higher education financing, the observations of the Higher Education Authority published in November last stated:

This study shows that, if present fee levels were doubled, income from fees would still represent only about 33% of total recurrent expenditure. However, as this fee income would include fees paid out of higher education grants held by qualified students, the proportion of the total cost of higher education borne by the Exchequer would in fact be 75%, somewhat higher than the two-thirds suggested in paragraph 7.33

The conclusion which the Authority draws from these figures is that fee increases designed to transfer a significant proportion of the cost of higher education from the Exchequer to students and their families would have to be of such magnitude as would be beyond the means of the great majority of families, most especially those who do not reside within commuting distance of a higher education institution. The Authority is concerned that very large increases in fees would result in:

—real financial hardship to students and their families;

and

—significant reduction in demand for places in the institutions funded by the Authority;

That is as plain and outspoken a condemnation of the policies being advanced in this White Paper as is possible to get and it is one which is uttered by people who know, who have the technical expertise to advise the Government, through the Minister for Education, on this matter and whose advice in this matter patently is not being listened to.

It might be argued, given the results of certain international comparisons of different methods of student financing, that the way to make higher education more equitable and the way to make access to it more available, would not be by increasing fees for higher education but by introducing a further form of grant to enable those needy students who cannot at present do so, to bridge the gap between the end of compulsory education and the beginning of third-level education, because it is that gap—the gap between 15 and 17 or 18—which is impassable to students who cannot afford the opportunity cost of continuing in full-time education. As long as that gap continues to exist, all the grants in the world for third-level education will be of no use to the student who cannot afford to bridge it.

I would argue that a real development programme in education should avoid tampering in such a regressive and crude way with the mechanisms of financing the present higher education system and should concentrate on making higher education more genuinely accessible not just to those who have overcome all the obstacles in the post-primary hurdle race, but to those who are at present barred even from completing that hurdle race because they cannot afford the cost of doing so.

In relation to one or two other items in connection with education, the White Paper is more positive but its voice here is so faint as to be virtually meaningless. There is a reference, for example—and this is again an echo of something which found a place in the Green Paper—to the need to look at the curricula in second-level education in order to make them more relevant to the question of employment opportunities.

Before approaching that, I would like to go back very briefly to the second point mentioned in the White Paper, that is the question of reducing the amount of fee and grant subsidies to students in colleges of education to a level closer to that enjoyed, if that is the right word, by students in other third-level institutions. The thesis that students in the training colleges are very substantially better off in terms of grants and subsidies than students in other third-level institutions seems to be based largely on an article published in the Department of Education's magazine, Oideas, by a lecturer in the college of education in Carysfort and a former inspector in the Department.

It is fair to remark that the figures in that article have been very seriously challenged by the Union of Students in Ireland. I have gone to the trouble of forwarding a copy of their commentary on the figures to the author of the article concerned to ask him for his comments. I regret to state that I have not as yet received them.

Debate adjourned.
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