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Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 8 Feb 1979

Vol. 311 No. 5

Written Answers. - Semi-State Bodies' Powers.

138.

asked the Minister for Finance if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the Minister, accountability to the Oireachatas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing; (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government; (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue; (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

The following are the State-sponsored bodies under the aegis of the Department of Finance—the Agricultural Credit Corporation Limited, the central Bank, Comhlucht Siúicre Éireann Teoranta, Irish Life Assurance Company Limited, the Racing Board, the Industrial Credit Company Limited and Fóir Teoranta. In addition the Minister for Finance has certain limited statutory functions in relation to Ceimici Teoranta (e.g. appointment of directors, submission of annual report and accounts to the Oireachtas, approval of borrowing) although this company is under the aegis of the Department of Industry, Commerce and Energy, and Irish Shipping Limited (e.g. appointment of directors, approval of borrowing) although this company is under the aegis of the Department of Tourism and Transport.

The first five bodies referred to above as being under the aegis of the Department of Finance come at present under category (a) of the Deputy's question while the remaining two come under category (b). The extent of ministerial supervision, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow does not vary according to whether the bodies come within categories (a) or (b). There is no ministrial control over the employment of staff in the case of these bodies.

139.

asked the Minister for the Public Service if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the relevant Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing; (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government; (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue; (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

There are no State or semi-State bodies associated with my Department.

140.

asked the Minister for Health if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the relevant Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing, (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government, (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

The semi-State bodies under the aegis of the Department of Health in the categories requested by the Deputy are as follows:

(a) Wholly self-financing: Blood Transfusion Service Board; Hospitals Joint Services Board; Voluntary Health Insurance Board; Dental Board; An Bord Altranais; Bord na Radharcmhastóirí; Pharmaceutical Society of Ireland; Medical Registration Council.

(b) Otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market rates from the Government: None.

(c) In receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue: Health Boards; General Medical Services (Payments) Board; Dublin Dental Hospital Board; St. Luke's Hospital; National Rehabilitation Board; St. Laurence's Hospital Board; Board for the Employment of the Blind; Dublin Rheumatism Clinic; James Connolly Memorial Hospital Board; St. James's Hospital Board; Beaumont Hospital Board.

(d) Wholly State financed: National Health Council; Comhairle na nOspidéal; National Drugs Advisory Board; Council for Postgraduate Medical and Dental Education; Health Education Bureau; Comhairle na Nimheanna; Medico-Social Research Board; National Social Service Council; Hospitals Trust Board; Cork Regional Hospital Board; Dublin Regional Hospital Board; Galway Regional Hospital Board.

Supervision and accountability: The degree of supervision over and accountability of semi-State bodies under the Department's aegis depends largely on the sources of income of those bodies. There is no continuous ministerial involvement in the administrative and financial affairs of the bodies mentioned in category (a). The Minister has only occasional involvement in their case, being consulted, for example about matters such as increases in the prices to be charged for services. In the case of registration bodies in this category—for example, the Medical Registration Council—the amount of the fees charged by them are generally subject to the Minister's approval. All the bodies in categories (c) and (d) (with the exception of the Board for the Employment of the Blind) are subject to the normal budgetary etc. control arrangements operated by the Department such as allocation of budgets and on-going monitoring of expenditure, examination of audited accounts, and so on. In the case of the Board for the Employment of the Blind, control of expenditure is exercised by the fixing by the Minister for Health of an approved level of capitation rate payable by health boards for blind people employed by the board.

Accountability to Oireachtas: The audited accounts of health boards and of the Voluntary Health Insurance Board are required to be presented to both Houses of the Oireachtas.

Borrowing: The Minister's consent is necessary to levels of borrowing by the bodies in category (c) and by some of the bodies in category (a).

Employment of staff: The employment of additional staff by bodies in category (c) is in general subject to the approval of the Minister.

141.

asked the Minister for Social Welfare if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing; (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government; (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue; (d) wholly State financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

The only body under my aegis which might be regarded as coming within the terms of the question is the National Committee on Pilot Schemes to Combat Poverty.

Under its terms of reference the committee has authority to recruit staff subject to my prior approval as to numbers, rates of pay and conditions of service. It has no borrowing powers and must consult me before making any major commitment of resources. All the committee's funds are provided through Subhead K of the Vote for my Department which treats as appropriations-in-aid contributions from the EEC of part of the cost of projects undertaken by the committee. The amounts paid to the committee are accounted for in the Appropriation Account of the Vote for my Department which is subject to examination by the Committee of Public Accounts.

142.

asked the Minister for Fisheries and Forestry if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by him, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing; (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government; (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue; (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

The semi-State bodies under the aegis of the Minister for Fisheries and Forestry are: (i) An Bord Iascaigh Mhara; (ii) The Inland Fisheries Trust Incorporated. Both of these bodies are in category (c).

The only differences in the control of these bodies are: (a) A copy of the Report and Accounts of An Bord Iascaigh Mhara is required to be submitted annually to both Houses of the Oireachtas; this does not apply to The Inland Fisheries Trust Incorporated; (b) The Minister's approval is required for the employment of additional staff by The Inland Fisheries Trust Incorporated; employment of staff, apart from the chief executive, by An Bord Iascaigh Mhara is a matter for the board itself.

143.

asked the Minister for Tourism and Transport if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing, (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government, (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue, (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

The State-sponsored bodies under the aegis of my Department are as follows:—

(a)

(b)

(c)

Wholly self-financing, i.e. bodies which apart from loan or share capital, derive the major part of their revenues from the sale of products or services

In receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue

Wholly State-financed

Irish Shipping Ltd.

Córas Iompair Éireann

Bord Fáilte Éireann

B + I Steampacket Co. Ltd.

Shannon Free Airport Development Company Limited (tourism and aviation activities)

Aer Lingus Teo.

Aerlínte Éireann Teo.

Aer Rianta Teo.

My relationship with these bodies, including the degree of supervision and the extent of the bodies' accountability to the Oireachtas, is governed mainly by the legislation which set up the bodies or which provided for their establishment. The relationship is based on, firstly, the exercise of certain statutory Government/ministerial powers and secondly, autonomy in the day-to-day management of the enterprises. The precise statutory powers vary in detail to match the particular histories and circumstances of each concern, but the more important powers include the appointment of chairmen and directors, control of share capital, appraisal and sanction of short and long-term financing, control of borrowing subject to limits authorised by statute or otherwise, the requirement to submit audited annual accounts and reports, and approval of staff superannuation schemes. Matters such as manpower policies, including recruitment and internal organisation, are generally regarded as the responsibility of the bodies concerned.

In relation to the accountability of the bodies to the Oireachtas, a Joint Oireachtas Committee has been established to review the commercial operations of the larger and more important public enterprises including all of the bodies listed above, except those in category (c). The enactment of legislation relating to the bodies as well as the annual Estimates debate affords the Oireachtas an opportunity for wide-ranging discussion on policy in relation to the concerns and on the activities of the concerns themselves.

144.

asked the Minister for Posts and Telegraphs if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing; (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government; (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue; (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

RTE is the only State-sponsored body under the aegis of my Department. Apart from the income it derives from advertisements, and so on, it is in receipt of State grants equivalent to net receipts from television licence fees and cable licence fees.

145.

asked the Minister for Agriculture if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing; (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government; (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue; (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

Following is the information requested:

(a) Bodies which are wholly self-financing:

Body

Day-to-day supervision by Minister

Accountability to the Oireachtas

Freedom to borrow

Freedom to employ additional staff

Bord na gCon

None

Statutory requirement to present Annual Reports and audited accounts to both Houses of the Oireachtas

Such sums as may be required. Total amount outstanding at any time may not exceed £25,000 without approval of the Minister for Agriculture (or the Minister of State at the Department of Agriculture) and the Minister for Finance

No restriction

Dublin and Cork District Milk Boards

None

Statutory requirement to present Annual Reports to Dáil Éireann

No restriction

Boards are free to employ additional staff at salaries and conditions of service which are subject to Ministerial control

Irish Potato Marketing Co. Ltd.

None

None

No restriction

No restriction

Pigs and Bacon Commission (i)

None

Statutory requirement to present audited accounts to both Houses of the Oireachtas

To such extent as may be sanctioned by the Minister

No restriction

Irish National Stud Company Ltd (i)

None

Statutory requirement to present Annual Reports and audited accounts to both Houses of the Oireachtas

Up to £500,000 with approval of the Minister for Agriculculture (or the Minister of State at the Department of Agriculture) and the Minister for Finance

No restriction

(b) There is no semi-State body under the aegis of my Department in category (b)

(c) Bodies which receive State subsidy but which have other revenue:

Body

Day-to-day supervision by Minister

Accountability to the Oireachtas

Freedom to borrow

Freedom to employ additional staff

An Foras Talúntais

None

Statutory requirement to present Annual Reports and audited accounts to both Houses of the Oireachtas

None

No restriction

National Agricultural Authority (ii)

None

Statutory requirement to present Annual Reports and audited accounts to both Houses of the Oireachtas

To such extent as may be approved by the Ministers for Agriculture and Finance

No restriction

(d) Bodies which are wholly State-financed:

Body

Day-to-day supervision by Minister

Accountability to the Oireachtas

Freedom to borrow

Freedom to employ additional staff

Bord na gCapall

None

Statutory requirement to present Annual Reports and audited accounts to both Houses of the Oireachtas

To such extent as may be approved by the Minister for Agriculture (or the Minister of State at the Department of Agriculture)

An Bord is free to employ additional staff at salaries and conditions of service determined by the Minister for the Public Service

Coras Beostoic agus Feola

None

None

To such extent as may be approved by the Ministers for Agriculture and Finance

An Coras is free to employ additional staff at salaries and conditions of service determined by the Minister with the consent of the Minister for the Public Service

An Chomhairle Olla

None

Statutory requirement to present Annual Reports and audited accounts to both Houses of the Oireachtas

None

None(Staff of An Chomhairle are appointed by the Minister for Agriculture or the Minister of State at the Department of Agriculture)

(i) The Reports and Accounts and overall operational results of these bodies are subject to examination by the Joint Committee on State-sponsored bodies.

(ii) The Authority was established in 1977, but various sections of the National Agricultural, Advisory, Education and Research Act, 1977, which would enable it to operate have not been brought into effect.

146.

asked the Minister for Industry, Commerce and Energy if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing; (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government; (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue; (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

I have no function in the day-to-day administration of the State-sponsored bodies under my aegis. Neither do I have any function normally in relation to the employment of additional staff except to the extent that this is necessary from the point of view of the control of public expenditure.

The remainder of the information sought by the Deputy is included in the attached statement.

Following is the statement:

State-sponsored body

Category

Accountability to the Oireachtas

Freedom to borrow

ESB

(a)

The Report and Accounts are presented annually to the Houses of the Oireachtas.

The consent of the Minister and the Minister for Finance is required.

Nitrigin Eireann Teo.

(a)*

The Report and the Accounts as well as details of guarantees of borrowings are presented annually to the Houses of the Oireachtas.

The consent of the Minister for Finance is required.

Irish Steel Holdings Ltd.

(a)*

,,

,,

Ceimici Teo.

(a)*

Balance Sheet and Profit and Loss Account are presented annually to the Houses of the Oireachtas.

,,

Bord Gáis Éireann

(a)

The Report and Accounts as well as details of guarantees of borrowings are presented annually to both Houses of the Oireachtas.

The consent of the Minister and the Minister for Finance is required.

Min Fhéir Teo.

(a)*

The Report and Accounts are presented annually to the Houses of the Oireachtas.

,,

Bord na Móna

(b)

The Report and Accounts as well as details of guarantees of borrowings are presented annually to the Oireachtas.

The consent of the Minister and the Minister for Finance is required.

Córas Tráchtála

(c)

The Report and Accounts are presented annually to the Houses of the Oireachtas.

,,

Kilkenny Design Workshops

(c)

,,

,,

National Film Studios of Ireland Ltd.

(c)

,,

,,

Irish Goods Council

(c)

,,

No restriction.

Institute for Industrial Research and Standards

(c)

,,

No borrowing powers.

Industrial Development Authority

(c)

,,

The Report and Accounts are presented annually to the Houses of the Oireachtas.

The consent of the Minister and the Minister for Finance is required.

Shannon Free Airport Development Company Ltd.

(c)

,,

,,

Nuclear Energy Board

(d)

,,

No borrowing powers.

147.

asked the Minister for Defence if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing; (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government; (d) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue; (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

There are no semi-State bodies under the aegis of my Department.

148.

asked the Minister for Justice if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing; (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government; (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue; (d) wholly State-financed and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

There are no semi-State bodies under the aegis of my Department.

149.

asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the relevant Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing; (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government; (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue; (d) wholly State-financed and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

The question of comparison does not arise for my Department as there is only one semi-State body under my aegis, the Agency for Personal Service Overseas. This agency comes under category (d) of the question.

150.

asked the Minister for the Environment if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing, (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government, (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue, (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

The bodies under my aegis are listed below in the categories mentioned by the Deputy.

(a) The National Building Agency Ltd.; Local Government Computer Services Board; Local Government Staff Negotiations Board.

(b) Nil.

(c) An Foras Forbartha Teo.; An Chomhairle Leabharlanna; The National Road Safety Association; Fire Prevention Council; Irish Water Safety Association.

(d) Medical Bureau of Road Safety; An Bord Pleanála; Water pollution Advisory Council.

In the case of bodies listed at (d) there may be some minor items of non-State income, but for all practical purposes they can be regarded as financed by the State.

I do not exercise day-to-day supervision over the activities of any of the bodies listed. A copy of the audited accounts in respect of each body is laid before both Houses of the Oireachtas. The degree to which they may borrow or employ additional staff varies, not in relation to the categories mentioned, but in relation to the purpose for which the body was set up. With the exception of An Bord Pleanála, the Medical Bureau of Road Safety and the Irish Water Safety Association, all are empowered to borrow money subject to my approval together with, in certain cases, the consent of the Minister for Finance). The employment of additional staff is subject to the approval of the board in An Foras Forbartha and the National Building agency but in the case of the other bodies, the employment of staff is subject to my approval or else the staffing needs are supplied by my Department.

151.

asked the Minister for Labour if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing, (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government, (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue, (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

The two semi-State bodies under the aegis of my Department—An Chomhairle Oiliúna (AnCO) and the Council for Education, Recruitment and Training for the Hotel, Catering and Tourism Industries (CERT)—fall into category (c) of the Deputy's question. I do not exercise supervision over the day-to-day activities of these two bodies. Any differences in relation to other aspects of the question are described in the following information given separately for each body.

AnCO

AnCO is a statutory body set up under the Industrial Training Act, 1967. The chairman and members of the council of AnCO are appointed by me. AnCO is required to make an annual report to me and copies of that report are laid before each House of the Oireachtas. Annual accounts, prepared by AnCO, are audited by the Comptroller and Auditor General and copies are laid before each House of the Oireachtas. AnCO may, with my consent and the concurrence of the Minister for Finance, borrow temporarily for the purpose of providing for current expenditure. AnCO recruits its own staff but their remuneration is determined by me with the consent of the Minister for the Public Service.

CERT

CERT is a company limited by guarantee and not having a share capital. The council of CERT is appointed by me. The accounts of CERT are audited by auditors approved by me and presented to me annually. It is authorised to borrow money subject to my consent and to employ such personnel as it considers necessary. The directors, with my consent, fix the terms and conditions of employment of the staff.

152.

asked the Minister for the Gaeltacht if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing, (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government, (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue, (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

Is iad na comhlachtaí atá faoi mo scáth ná (a) Arramara Teoranta; (c) Gaeltarra Éireann agus (d) Bord na Gaeilge. Ní dhéanaimse maoirseacht ar a gcuid gnóthaí ó lá go lá. Leagtar a gcuntais iniúchta agus a dtuarascálacha bliantúla faoi bhráid gach Tí den Oireachtas.

In airteagail chomhlachais Arramara Teoranta tá foráil maidir le hairgead a fháil ar iasacht; níl aon fhoráil ar leith i dtaobh foireann a fhostú. San Acht um Thionscail na Gaeltachta, 1957, tá forálacha maidir le hiasachtaí (alt 30) agus foireann (alt 15) do Ghaeltarra Éireann. San Acht um Bord na Gaeilge, 1978, baineann alt 10 le foireann an Bhoird agus níl aon fhoráil d'iasachtaí don Bhord.

153.

asked the Minister for Education if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the relevant Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-State bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing; (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government; (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue; (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

There are no semi-State bodies operating under the aegis of my Department.

154.

asked the Minister for Economic Planning and Development if there is a difference in the degree of day-to-day supervision by the relevant Minister, accountability to the Oireachtas and freedom to borrow or employ additional staff of semi-state bodies under his aegis which are (a) wholly self-financing, (b) otherwise wholly self-financing but for the receipt of loans at terms more favourable than market-rates from the Government, (c) in receipt of a State subsidy but with other revenue, (d) wholly State-financed; and if he will give the names of the State bodies in each of the above categories.

There is only one semi-State body under the aegis of my Department—the National Board for Science and Technology—and, accordingly, the comparison in the Deputy's question does not arise. For the Deputy's information, this board would fall under category (d) as set out in the question.

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