asked the Minister for the Environment if he is aware of the serious concern of very many citizens in the greater Dublin area regarding the serious effects of Dublin city traffic congestion on the commercial, industrial and social life of the capital city, and the action, if any, the Government proposes to take on this matter.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Dublin City Traffic Congestion.
11.
I am aware that traffic congestion is a serious problem in the Dublin area generally, as it is in all major cities. Responsibility for the formulation of measures to relieve such congestion rests with the local authorities concerned, that is, Dublin Corporation, Dublin County Council and Dún Laoghaire Borough Council, acting in conjunction with the Garda Síochána where statutory controls are concerned. In general, action is proceeding by these authorities on a number of fronts. Inessential traffic, and in particular private car commuter traffic, is discouraged on major and central roads through the exercise of parking controls; the use of public transport is facilitated in consultation with CIE; use is made of traffic management measures to secure more effective use of existing streets; an expanding programme of road improvements and construction works is being implemented with the aim of providing improved and new facilities where required on major routes. In 1978, grant allocations in support of the road works programmes in the Dublin region amounted to £7.175 million, an increase of over £2 million on the figure for 1976. A number of expert studies on traffic congestion in the Dublin area have already been carried out over the years, and recently the Minister for Tourism and Transport has established the Transport Consultative Commission to investigate and report on transport generally and with initial consideration of the problems in the Dublin area. The Commission has issued a discussion paper setting out the many possible long-term solutions to the problems in the Dublin area and has invited submissions from interested parties.
Would the Minister not agree that his reply could be construed as misleading when he suggests that the local authorities have responsibility for alleviating traffic congestion?
I would not agree.
Would the Minister not agree that local authorities have no responsibility for traffic management, that being the function of the gardaí?
I said in conjunction with the gardaí.
If I heard the Minister properly he said they were primarily responsible for alleviating traffic congestion. Could the Minister indicate to me how a local authority, which has no statutory responsibility for traffic management—that being the function of the Garda Síochána—which has no responsibility for public transport, a more efficient way of transporting large numbers of people, and which can do nothing about the rail system, has in any way the primary responsibility for alleviating traffic congestion? If the Minister concedes that, would he indicate to the House whether he has any intention of conferring on local authorities overall responsibility for alleviating traffic congestion, a function they manifestly do not have at present?
As I have said already, responsibility for the formulation of measures to relieve such congestion rests with the local authorities—in this instance the three concerned, Dublin Corporation, Dublin County Council and Dún Laoghaire Borough Council, acting in conjunction with the Garda Síochána—where statutory controls are concerned.
I am grateful to the Minister for his clarification. However, could he state how a local authority could propose measures for the improvement of public transport in Dublin city or county at present; if, under the terms of reference of local authorities as he knows them, how Dublin Corporation, Dublin County Council and indeed Dún Laoghaire Borough Council could propose measures for the alleviation of traffic congestion vis-à-vis public transport?
My Department are receiving proposals all the time from all the roads authorities in the country.
The Minister has now shifted his position. Would he, as Minister for the Environment, be prepared to exercise his influence within the Cabinet in regard to proposals from local authorities in the Dublin region relating to the improvement of traffic conditions and having an impact on public transport whether it be for buses or for the rail system? If such proposals came from Dublin Corporation suggesting, for example, a transportation authority, would the Minister be prepared to back it and push it through the Cabinet?
I am prepared to consider any proposal on its merits.
What I would like to clarify is this. If a local authority make proposals that do not fall within their statutory responsibility—and public transport, the rail system, and enforcement with regard to parking come under this heading and we discussed it on the adjournment last week—will he, as the Minister responsible, take up such proposals from a local authority even though the local authority do not have the statutory responsibility for such proposals or will he throw it back at the local authority, as has happened in the past, saying that they do not have the responsibility in that area?
I am prepared to consider any proposals.
I would hope for that at least.
What does the Deputy expect me to say? I have said I am prepared to consider any proposals.
(Interruptions.)
To reverse engines a little bit and to talk about the inability of the Dublin Corporation or any other such local authority, but particularly Dublin Corporation, to make proposals to improve traffic and to relieve congestion is rather laughable when we look at the ridiculous situation that obtained here in this city yesterday with ample warning from two o'clock that it was freezing and the traffic comes to a standstill when all that was required was sand and salt and we could have avoided the chaos we had last night. Could the Minister do something about that and direct the corporation to do the job which is their job to do?
From a preliminary inquiry on this I understand that the trucks concerned could not travel on the ice——
They could not travel to-day either to collect bins in parts of the city. What is wrong?
Is the Minister aware that apparently outside of his Department there appears to be unanimous agreement that there is a need for a transportation authority of some kind?
They cannot even mind the streets they have without giving them any more control. They are being asked for the last 15 years to do something about it.
Has the Minister any views on the need to set up a transportation authority which would be able to act unilaterally in the various areas of responsibility which presently are fragmented between different groups? That is the basis of Deputy Quinn's concern. What is the Minister going to do about that? The difficulty is that different bodies have different responsibilities.
I am worried about getting into a long debate.
During the course of my reply I referred to the fact that the Minister for Tourism and Transport has established a transport consultative commission to investigate transport generally and various reports.
(Interruptions.)
Will the Minister accept that we have congestion of reports as well as traffic?
(Interruptions.)
Order, please.
Will the Minister research in his own Department, if that is even necessary, to find out the exhortations that have been made by his predecessors as long as 15 years ago to the same Dublin Corporation to do something before it was too late? Now it is too late.
They have no powers.
No powers, be damned. They would not do anything when they were given the power and the money.
(Interruptions.)
(Cavan-Monaghan): Arising out of Deputy Blaney's supplementary question is it not a fact that long since that one of the Deputy's predecessors in Fianna Fáil had charge of Dublin Corporation because they abolished the city council and took over control?
(Interruptions.)
Order, please.
The Minister referred to the transport council established by the Minister for Transport and Tourism. Have the terms of reference of that transport council anything to do with traffic congestion? Are they not purely concerned with the relationships in the volume of different types of transport?
This has nothing to do with the question.
The Minister is using this as a red herring.
I also said that the consultative commission was set up to investigate and report on transport generally and with initial consideration of the problems in the Dublin area.
That has nothing to do with traffic congestion.
Then what are we investigating?
(Interruptions.)