Skip to main content
Normal View

Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 27 Mar 1979

Vol. 313 No. 3

Adjournment Debate. - VAT on Furniture

(Cavan-Monaghan): On today's Order Paper Deputy Conlon and I tabled a question asking the Minister for Finance if he was aware that furniture manufacturers in County Monaghan were finding it difficult to compete with imports of second-hand furniture. We asked the Minister if he would reduce the rate of VAT from 20 per cent to 10 per cent and if the same favourable terms for payment of VAT might be applied here as in Northern Ireland. In the course of his reply the Minister appeared to appreciate the difficulties which such manufacturers in County Monaghan find themselves in. However, he could not see his way to help those manufacturers. It is a fact that that industry plays an important part, with the poultry industry, in the economy of County Monaghan. Those industries provide a lot of employment. The furniture industry has been built up over the years by small industries and now employs more than 800 people. That must be regarded as a worthwhile industry. In common with other Border counties, County Monaghan finds it a lot more difficult to attract industries than inland counties. For that reason it is important that existing industries in the county should not be exposed to unnecessary or unfair competition. The furniture manufacturing industry is being subjected to unfair competition and under severe pressure and that is why we want the Minister to come to its aid.

I have been informed that jobs are in danger in that industry because of the unfair competition in trading. If redundancies occurred on a big scale in it the Minister would be asked by all sides to come to its aid but it is more sensible and practical to protect the industry when it is healthy rather than spend considerable sums of money in trying to rehabilitate it or trying to do a fire brigade job on it when it has been forced into a difficult position. Due to its geographical situation the industry is open to a lot of pressure from competitors in the UK and Northern Ireland. That pressure is much greater because industries in Northern Ireland and the UK operate under more favourable conditions. For example, in the UK, VAT on new furniture is charged at the rate of 8 per cent. The Minister and I disagreed today about the terms available for the payment of VAT in the UK but my information is that there is a longer period allowed for the payment of it, interest free, than there is here. I have been informed that the interest-free period in the UK is six months because no penalties are extracted if the payment is made within six months. On that basis the effective time for payment of VAT in the UK is six months.

The situation here is that if VAT is not paid within two months interest is charged. As a result of the more favourable terms available in the UK, furniture manufacturers there can make greater profits on the home market and, consequently, export here under better circumstances. I accept that they are subject to our VAT rate but because of their profit situation at home they can be more competitive. Another important point is that as new furniture is cheaper in the UK second-hand furniture is much cheaper. We are all aware that vast quantities of second-hand furniture are being imported here from the UK at very low cost. That also puts a lot of pressure on the furniture manufacturers. A lot of second-hand furniture is brought through the Monaghan customs check point. I understand that at least one container load of second-hand furniture is brought through that checkpoint daily. That furniture is not over-valued and the amount of VAT paid on it is very little, even when it is imported in an orthodox way. People who live near the Border know that a lot of things which come across the Border do not travel by orthodox roads. They very often come by circuitous routes; in other words, they are smuggled. The Monaghan furniture manufacturers have to compete with that.

Furniture in the UK is subject to VAT at the rate of 8 per cent. Furniture here is subject to a VAT rate of 20 per cent, more than double the amount of VAT imposed in Northern Ireland. This means that furniture manufacturers here have to compete with secondhand furniture, imported from abroad, very often for little or nothing, which is subject to only 10 per cent VAT. This is very unfair to a home industry in a Border county, where we have a number of difficulties. It is quite legitimate for people to import furniture up to £50 value free of tax from Northern Ireland. It pays them to go the short journey there several times and bring in various items.

I believe that I am speaking to the converted when I tell the Minister that this industry in Monaghan is under pressure. I am sure I can also speak for the furniture industry in Navan and in other counties. The Minister in his reply today said that he appreciated the difficulties. What is he doing about it? I ask him to reduce VAT on Irish made furniture from 20 per cent to 10 per cent. In reply to representations made to him he stated it was not possible to do it, but he did not go that far in his reply today. I do not believe there is any legal or administrative difficulty in doing that. In this year's budget VAT on certain luxury equipment was reduced from 40 per cent to 20 per cent. If VAT can be reduced on luxury equipment surely it can be done on furniture. Furniture is basic equipment in our homes. We hear many people talking about how well off farmers are. It is only now that many farmers in my constituency are able to furnish their homes in a modern, comfortable way.

The Minister, in reply to the representations made to him, said that he could not remove VAT from furniture without removing it from a variety of goods. I would like him to spell out on what he bases that assertion. The Monaghan furniture manufacturers have an unanswerable argument that, due to their geographical location they are operating under unfavourable conditions. They are operating in a Border county where it is difficult to attract industry. The IDA readily admit that.

The Minister can compensate the people in that area by treating this industry as substantially a Border industry. If he says furniture manufacturing is not confined to County Monaghan he will have to admit that, if he takes the town of Navan with Monaghan, a substantial amount of our furniture is manufactured in those two locations. Navan is also under severe pressure from Northern Ireland furniture. I have no doubt that an excellent case can be made for giving special attention to this comparatively young industry. Preventive medicine is better than serious surgery at a later stage. I am calling for preventive finance from the Department of Finance to ensure that this industry, which has been built up over the years, is given a fair opportunity to operate and a chance to continue to progress and to increase employment. We know that secondhand furniture is much cheaper in England, Scotland and, presumably, in Northern Ireland. It is not fair that this furniture should be brought in here and allowed to compete with home-produced furniture. I appeal to the Minister to reconsider the matter.

As Deputy Fitzpatrick indicated, I appreciate some of the difficulties involved for the furniture manufacturers in Monaghan in particular and also in Navan. However, I do not think that is the whole story.

First, I should make it clear that when Deputy Fitzpatrick is talking about competition and the 8 per cent rate in the North, he is talking about the rate applied to furniture sold in the North. The rate applied to new furniture sold here is 20 per cent and it is 10 per cent on secondhand furniture. He also referred to competition from smuggled goods which is a separate problem from the main problem he raised. There are a few points to which I should like to draw his attention.

The Deputy seems to think there is no problem about reducing the rate on new furniture manufactured here to 10 per cent. If that were done it is inevitable that the case for applying the same rate to other household furnishings such as carpets and floor coverings would be irresistible. There would be no logical basis on which it could be resisted on household electrical goods and furnishings generally. The cost to the Exchequer would be very substantial. The cost to the Exchequer of reducing the rate of tax on new furniture from 20 per cent to 10 per cent would be of the order of £6 million in a full year and this is just on furniture, not on other items.

(Cavan-Monaghan): I understood it was £3 million.

That is the information I have. I should also point out that one of the consequences of lowering the rate to 10 per cent would be that under EEC competition rules this would have to apply to all new furniture, domestic and imported, and this might not be in the best interests of furniture manufacturers in Monaghan or in Navan.

I think the Deputy may be under a misapprehension in regard to an announcement I made in the budget concerning radios and gramophones. What was done there merely brought these items into line with the standard 20 per cent rate. The effective rate on the equipment had been substantially less than the 40 per cent which appeared to be the rate. This was because it was done in the way of a trapped rate of 30 per cent and then 10 per cent at the point of sale. It is estimated that the effective rate was about 28 per cent on average. The cost of what was done in regard to radios and gramophones was about £1 million in a full year.

(Cavan-Monaghan): Did that endanger any employment here?

It was done to save employment, not so much at the manufacturing end but at the retailing end. Prior to 1 March 1979 radios and gramophones were liable to an apparent 40 per cent rate and I have indicated how it was charged—a trapped rate of 30 per cent and an additional 10 per cent at importation or point of sale. With effect from 1 March that two-tier charge has been replaced by a single VAT charge of 20 per cent. Under the Value-Added Tax (Amendment) Act, 1978 registered traders without a fixed place of business will be required to pay VAT at the point of importation rather than at the point of sale which is the requirement for VAT registered traders with a fixed place of business. I cannot say with certainty what will be the consequences but they must be beneficial from the point of view of furniture manufacturers in Monaghan and Meath. They have complained about competition from VAT registered traders without a fixed place of business who heretofore were able to import furniture and not pay VAT until at the point of sale. That restriction is now applying as from 1 March and it should be of some assistance to furniture manufacturers.

It is open to furniture manufacturers in Monaghan, subject to other problems they may have, to export to Northern Ireland and to compete on exactly the same VAT terms in the North as apply to manufacturers and importers there, for instance importers from Britain. They can compete on equal terms and if they do this successfully they can get economies of scale. I want to stress that they are competing on equal terms so far as VAT is concerned.

I wish to point out that imported secondhand furniture, even if it is smuggled, is caught for VAT unless it is sold privately or by an unregistered trader. With regard to the question of people using their duty-free allowance to bring in furniture, that allowance is confined to non-commercial imports and the maximum for any one item is £52.

I have been able to do something to alleviate the position. At this stage I cannot say how valuable or valueless it is, although I am sure it has some value in regard to the restrictions applying from 1 March to traders with no fixed place of business. To go further and reduce the VAT rate from 20 per cent to 10 per cent inevitably would cost the Exchequer a great deal of money. Even if it could be confined solely to new furniture, it would cost £6 million but I do not believe it could be so confined and the cost would be very much greater. The consequences for the Exchequer would be great and while I appreciate the difficulties with which the furniture manufacturers in Monaghan are faced, I am afraid that the remedy is not one we can afford. I know something of the difficulties but I am not satisfied that the situation is quite as difficult as might appear from what Deputy Fitzpatrick said.

I must point out that while it is true that the VAT rate in the North is lower than here, as I indicated today there are differences that operate both ways. For example, the items that are zero-rated here are more extensive than they are in the North and a similar argument can be made in the North in relation to VAT. In practical terms, as of now at any rate I cannot do more to benefit the furniture manufacturers than I have done. However, I am prepared to indicate, as I have done already to them, that I will keep a close eye on the situation to see if an opportunity offers either to improve on what we have been able to do so far or if a real emergency arises to review the situation fundamentally again.

(Cavan-Monaghan): I do not think the Minister should wait until there is an emergency.

The Dáil adjourned at 9 p.m. until 10.30 a.m. on Wednesday, 28 March 1979.

Top
Share