Vol. 323 No. 4
asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs when he expects the Government to achieve the United Nations target of 0.7 per cent of GNP being expended on overseas development aid; and if he will indicate the incremental increases which the Government propose to make to achieve this target.
16.
asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs if Ireland has given a formal commitment to reach the United Nations overseas development aid target of 0.7 per cent of GNP by 1990; and, if so, the amount by which it is proposed to increase the level of overseas development aid moneys in the coming year.
17.
asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs the amount of money required for allocation in the 1981 Budget for overseas development aid in order to bring Ireland on target to meet the United Nations figure of 0.7 per cent of GNP for development aid.
: With the permission of the Ceann Comhairle, I propose to take Questions Nos. 15, 16 and 17 together.
In my statement during the General Debate at the Thirty-fifth Session of the UN General Assembly on 30 September 1980 I re-affirmed our commitment to progressing towards the 0.7 per cent target for Official Development Assistance (ODA) as rapidly as our resources allow. Between 1977 and 1979, we doubled our allocation for ODA in absolute terms. I hope that more favourable economic circumstances will allow us to continue to significantly increase our ODA allocations in coming years so as to reach if possible the UN target of 0.7 per cent of GNP by the end of this decade but we have not given a firm commitment in this regard. With regard to next year's allocation for ODA, the matter is under consideration at present.
: I do not wish to follow Deputy Kelly's description of the Minister for Foreign Affairs but am I right in assuming that the House has received a very diplomatic non-answer to these three specific questions and that we, as a nation, have absolutely no formal commitment to meeting this United Nations' aid in any foreseeable way or fashion?
: What I have given the Deputy is a formulation which was agreed upon at the recent meeting of the UN, when the overall international development strategy in regard to overseas development aid was devised and a formula reached by agreement, with acceptance of that formula by the Group of 77 who are the recipient countries in the UN. What I have spelled out to the Deputy is the formulation which has been agreed upon by the UN which will form the basis of a programme between donor and recipient countries throughout the next decade.
: Does the Minister not accept that the speech he gave to the UN on 30 September implied that, in fact, this country was progressing towards the .7 per cent target and that in fact, this is at variance with the facts because of the reduction in the percentage in the current year?
: There was a "best effort"—and I use that phrase in inverted commas—formulation devised by agreement amongst the donor and recipient countries as being the target for 1980. I might say that we are in excellent company, with far wealthier countries with a higher GNP——
: It is a league of shame.
: ——which are in that category as well. The 77 recipient countries were sensible enough to go along with this formulation. What has been agreed upon at this special conference—and it was a tremendous achievement to get this agreement within this meeting—was that there would be an agreement on all sides, by both donor and recipient countries that the "best effort" would be used to reach a formulation of achieving a certain percentage by 1980 and that only "best effort" would be the criterion involved and no other directive or ukase is involved in that. The .7 per cent target is the objective for all donor countries to achieve by the end of this decade.
: Can I take it then that the Minister for Foreign Affairs on behalf of the Government is formally renouncing the commitment given by his predecessor, Deputy O'Kennedy, when in opposition, in relation to meeting this target—that we are now promising merely to do our best instead of meeting the target?
: I would point out to the Deputy that this is a formulation reached unanimously in the United Nations by all the countries involved, donor and recipient.
: What does that mean?
: There is no reason for us to go further or less far than that. What I am saying is quite obvious.
: The Minister is trying to excuse his inertia.
: This was devised after weeks of intensive negotiation and discussion, when a sensible and achievable target was agreed upon between the donor and recipient countries.
: The .7 per cent would have been relevant 20 years ago.
: I am aware of the company in which the Minister has placed himself in relation to this matter. There are other right wing countries which have equally reneged on their commitments but are we and the recipient nations to understand now that the Fianna Fáil Government of which he is Minister for Foreign Affairs have gone back on the formal commitment given by a previous Fianna Fáil spokesperson for Foreign Affairs, Deputy O'Kennedy, in relation to this matter?
: The Deputy will appreciate that this was an agreement, an agreed formulation reached at the United Nations.
: Would the Minister answer the Deputy's questions?
: This was agreed between all the countries involved having regard to the economic and financial circumstances existing in the world of today. A realistic assessment was made of the position and this target figure was arrived at.
: What target figure?
: There is no target.
: Accepting the fact that the .7 per cent target was agreed by the United Nations years and years ago, would the Minister answer a direct question? How does he suggest to this House that he was telling the whole truth to the UN when he spoke of this country being committed to progressing towards the .7 per cent target when, in the same year, he presided over a situation where the percentage was cut back?
: The percentage was increased by 12 per cent and we quadrupled our allocation over the past four years and doubled our allocation after that.
: The percentage was related to GNP.
: Would the Deputy ask a final supplementary question on this, please?
: Could I ask the Minister whether, in regard to the provision of the necessary wherewithal to provide development aid and food aid, it should not be sought through the Minister for Finance and perhaps by agreement of all parties in the House that we should have an identifiable tax devoted entirely and solely to such matters? That is not talking about the Minister's .7 per cent or anything else.
: We generally subsume all Government expenditure in a general tax regime, as the Deputy is well aware. That has been the practice heretofore, but perhaps the Deputy's suggestion is worth examining. Certainly, as far as we are concerned, we are in line with all the other donor countries.
: Rubbish, utter rubbish.
: You are hiding behind your skirt.
: The Minister has not answered the question.
: He has said nothing on it.
18.
asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs if he proposes to publish a White Paper covering Ireland's official policy on overseas development aid; if so, if he will indicate the range which that paper would cover; and when it will be published.
: I do not believe that it is necessary at this stage for the Government to issue a White Paper on Official Development Assistance (ODA). The broad outlines of Government policy in relation to ODA have been set out in several statements over the past three years. These include my statement on the Estimates for my Department in June of this year, as well as the statements of my predecessor as Minister for Foreign Affairs on the Estimates in 1978 and 1979. The Government's policy on ODA was outlined also in my statement at the inaugural meeting of the new advisory Council on Development Co-operation on 21 March 1980, the text of which was issued as a press release and in the booklet entitled "Development Co-operation—Ireland's Bilateral Programme" issued by my Department last year.
19.
asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs if he is satisfied with the high cost of food aid from Ireland having regard to our efficiency as an agricultural producer; and if he has any proposals within the context of the EEC food programme and related national food programmes to improve the delivery of Irish food aid and reduce its cost to the recipients.
: The greater part of the food aid given by Ireland for the benefit of developing countries is given in the form of cash payments, to the World Food Programme (as a voluntary contribution to that body or to meet our obligations under the Food Aid Convention), and to the European Community budget in respect of Ireland's share of the food aid programmes of the Community.
In the case of our voluntary contribution to the World Food Programme, for which £650,000 has been budgeted in 1980, two-thirds is given in the form of food (in 1980 skim-milk powder).
I am aware that suggestions have been made that if, instead of receiving food aid in kind, either directly from Ireland or from the European Community, recipients were to be given the value of such aid in cash, they could buy considerably more food. The Deputy will appreciate that neither the constant availability nor cost of food products on the world market can be guaranteed. Consequently the supply of a certain quantity of food aid in kind is necessary. Given the continuing need of many developing countries for guaranteed supplies of food aid I am not satisfied that advantage would accrue from making our contribution to the World Food Programme entirely in cash.
20.
asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs if he proposes to establish a single comprehensive and easily accessible source of information regarding Irish expenditure on overseas development aid both in the bilateral side and through the EEC and international agencies.
: The Deputy will be aware that details of the annual allocation for Official Development Assistance (ODA) are provided in a press release issued each year by my Department when Estimates for the year in question have been decided. Information on ODA expenditure has not hitherto been made regularly available in a similar way, although this information is obtainable from a number of official sources. I can agree, therefore, with the suggestion that the break-down of expenditure on ODA should be available in one source and I would propose to do this by placing in the Library of the Houses of the Oireachtas each year a statement showing overall expenditure on ODA in the previous year and a break-down of the total out-turn under the various sub-heads. I cannot say when this could be done each year, as the final definitive figure of expenditure on one or two items in the multilateral area is usually not available for several months. I would expect, however, to be in a position to give the final out-turn on all items of expenditure as a rule before the summer Recess.
: I thank the Minister for his reply to that question which is welcome and I hope this will be done as soon as possible.
21.
asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs if an assessment has now been made of the benefit of the Irish bilateral aid programme to the Irish economy in terms of the procurement of Irish goods and services by recipient countries.
22.
asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs if his Department have assessed, or are in the process of assessing, or is prepared to assess, the real net cost to Ireland of overseas development aid having regard to returns of moneys to this country by way of commercial contracts for salaries to Irish personnel involved in multilateral or bilateral aid programmes.
: With the permission of the Ceann Comhairle, I propose to take Questions Nos. 21 and 22 together.
The objective of the bilateral aid programme is to channel resources in the most effective way possible to the poorer countries of the developing world and the poorer populations in them. Our approach has been to try to identify with the priority countries potential areas of co-operation. We have been concerned that the projects which are developed are seriously needed by these countries and are regarded as priorities by them. At this stage of our involvement it would seem to be preferable to allocate all available resources to improving the effectiveness of these aid projects in which we are involved rather than to examining the spin-off benefits to Ireland.
Contacts established with developing countries through the Official Development Assistance Programme can result in certain commercial advantages and opportunities. However, it would be very difficult to identify precisely the benefits which accrue from development work undertaken by an Irish body since in many cases projects are parts of larger schemes undertaken or financed by other donor countries or agencies.
An assessment of the nature suggested by the Deputy's two questions would be extremely complex and time-consuming. Moreover, it would be impossible to ensure that it was comprehensive. I would refer the Deputy also to information given in reply to Question No. 432 on 20 February 1980 with regard to payments to Irish bodies involved in projects under the bilateral aid programme.
: In relation to Question No. 22, is any assessment being made either by the Department or by any of the voluntary agencies, or will the Minister facilitate such a process? Will the Minister also accept in principle that once a measure of this return benefit of the development aid programme to Ireland has been assessed, it should be discounted from the total aid given in the first place when we are measuring how much aid we are actually giving to the Third World countries?
: I do not see why we should circumscribe ourselves in the manner suggested by the Deputy.
: Will the Minister agree that, if we stand up and make an attempt to meet our commitments to the Third World and offer aid the bulk of which in reality benefits us, we are not in reality helping the Third World countries at all and that we should at least discount a substantial if not a 100 per cent portion of it and increase it accordingly?
: It does not work out that way. We have tried to identify priority areas in the recipient countries where we can help in co-operation. We do not apply the commercial type criteria that the Deputy mentions. Inevitably there is some spin-off benefit but we do not look at the programme in that way.
: Since we do not know the extent to which we are benefiting from the bilateral aid programme will the Minister initiate a process to get a measure of the benefit?
: It is better to approach this matter in a pragmatic way on the ground after discussion with the recipient countries and to decide on the best way in which we can help. Sometimes there is a spin-off benefit and sometimes not, but our main criteria in assessing the project is how best we can help within the resources available.
: Is the Minister aware that an estimate has been made of the extent to which this aid benefits us and, while accepting that the primary motivation in the bulk of our aid is not that it should produce returns to this country, the fact remains that a great part of it does and that, in determining how much aid we should give, an account should be taken of the fact that the net cost to this country is so very small in view of the return we receive?
: We can have a sensible discussion on this.
: We will not have a sensible discussion on it now. This is the final question.
: I disagree with the Deputy in that respect. I do not see why we should tie ourselves unnecessarily. We discuss the project on the ground, we make a sensible decision with the recipient country and we decide to co-operate. If there is a spin-off benefit well and good, but that is not our primary motivation.
: The remaining questions will appear on tomorrow's Order Paper.
