asked the Minister for Health the cost in a full year to a worker with an income of £5,000, £10,000 and £15,000 per annum, of the 150 per cent increase in health contributions set out in the Government's programme and the removal of the present upper limit on contributions; and the increase in annual cash contributions that this will involve for each of these income groups.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Health Contributions.
7.
The relevant cost would be £75 for a worker with an income of £5,000, £165 for a worker with £10,000 and £290 for a worker with £15,000,
Would the Minister agree that this is an increase of £1.45 per week in the case of a worker with £5,000, £3.17 per week in the case of a worker with £10,000 and £5.57 per week for a worker with £15,000? Would the Minister further agree that this is in effect a cost of living increase of 1.5 per cent for the worker with £5,000?
I do not dispute the Deputy's figures. In view of the ever-increasing cost of health services I do not consider that an alarming increase.
Will the Minister not accept that an increase of 150 per cent in any area is an alarming increase? I wish to point out to the Minister that his party have calculated the increase at 1½ per cent but that is completely false. What is involved is an increase of 150 per cent on present health charges. Does the Minister not consider that an alarming increase for workers to pay?
For years there has been a rapid increase in the cost of health services. The Deputy asked me a specific question and I have given him the information available to me. The question he has asked now is a separate matter. If he puts down a question I will be glad to give him the information.
The Minister has said the cost of health charges has increased considerably. As I understand it, none of this money is to be used to defray the cost of health services or to improve existing services. I do not think that applies.
Some of it will be used to improve the health services generally. The Deputy is not correct in what he has said.
Mr. Doherty
Does the Minister consider an increase of 150 per cent to be an alarming increase?
That is the same question.
I have answered that question already.
8.
asked the Minister for Health the extra yield in a full year expected from the 150 per cent increase in health contributions which the Government is committed to as part of its Coalition programme.
9.
asked the Minister for Health the expected extra yield in a full year from the 150 per cent increase in health contributions for each of the following groups: (1) employees, (2) the self-employed and (3) farmers.
With the permission of the Ceann Comhairle, I propose to take Questions Nos. 8 and 9 together and to circulate the information in a tabular statement with the Official Report. Following is the statement:
Yields from Health Contributions on Proposed New Rates
Estimated extra yield in a full calendar year on the basis of the proposed new contribution rates and no upper income ceiling and income levels on which the estimate for 1981 was based.
|
(1) |
(2) |
(3) |
(4) |
|
Contributions collected through the PAYE system (mainly employees) |
Self-employed (including excepted farmers*) |
Farmers (including excepted farmers) |
Total |
|
£(m) |
£(m) |
£(m) |
£(m) |
|
76.4 |
5.2 |
5.4 |
87.0 |
* Farmers with other trades or professions.
The figures involved are quite simple and I am surprised the Minister has found it necessary to circulate them in a tabular statement. Will the Minister not agree that the present yield in the health charges is approximately £50 million per annum and that the plans put forward by the Coalition Government involve an increase of a further £89 million? I am not surprised the Minister wants to circulate that figure in a tabular statement. Will he confirm from the figures he has before him that this is the case?
I have not the information sought by the Deputy. However, I can confirm that the estimated total yield from health contributions at present rates and conditions for the calendar year 1981 is £48.6 million which is comprised as follows: employees and others whose health contributions are collected under the PAYE system such as non-salaried company directors, occupational pensioners and so on, £42.7 million; self-employed, that is those whose health contributions are assessed in connection with assessment for income tax under Schedule D, including excepted farmers, £2.9 million; farmers, other than excepted farmers, who are billed directly by the health board £3 million. I have no further information before me but if the Deputy puts down a question after he reads the tabular statement I shall be happy to supply it.
The Deputy may ask a final supplementary question.
I wish to point out that the Minister took two questions together. The Minister has highlighted the fact that in the present situation employees will pay £42.7 million, the self-employed will pay £2.9 million and farmers will pay £3 million. I ask the Minister to let us know what increase will arise in each of the sectors. The figures I have worked on are £44 million, £3 million and £3 million which are very close to the information given by the Minister. I ask him to confirm that the gross income will be £110 million, £7.5 million and £7.5 million. This means that the extra for the PAYE employees will be £66 million, for the self-employed, £4.5 million, and for farmers £4.5 million. There will also be further increases, due to the raising of the limit.
The Deputy is making a speech. He should ask a question.
The Deputy asked a question. He asked the Minister to confirm what he said.
I am not confirming or denying it. The Deputy will get the information in the form of a tabular statement. I have not the information requested by the Deputy on that matter.
I am calling Question No. 10.
Question No. 8 asked the Minister the extra yield in a full year but the Minister has not replied.
Deputies
Chair.
If the Deputy found the answer unsatisfactory he can seek to raise the matter on the Adjournment.
On a point of order, Question No. 8 asked for a specific figure but the Minister has said that he has not that information. It is totally unacceptable that a Minister should refuse to give a specific figure asked for in a Dáil question.
The Minister did not say he refused to give the figure. He said he did not have the figure.
In accordance with procedure in this House, I informed the Deputy that the information will be supplied in the form of a tabular statement that will be circulated with the Official Report. That is the normal procedure in this House. I cannot give any more information on it.
It is only one figure.
What I have done is the normal procedure of the House.
I am calling Question No. 10.
In view of the unsatisfactory nature of the reply given by the Minister, I wish to raise the matter on the Adjournment.
The Chair will communicate with the Deputy.
10.
asked the Minister for Health the increase that is proposed in the farming multiplier in respect of the 150 per cent increase in health contributions to which the Government is committed.
The Minister indicated in the House on 24 March 1981 — Official Report, Vol. 327, column 2110 — that there would be no change in the farming multiplier in the present year. No review of this decision is now proposed.
Is the Minister stating that there will be no additional contribution from the farming sector this year towards the additional funds to be raised in the area of health charges? Does this mean that the bulk of the charges will fall on employees?
That is not what I said. The question referred to the farming multiplier. I do not know if the Deputy is suggesting that there should be an increase in the farming multiplier. I have told him there will not be an increase in the present year and that a review of this decision is not proposed.
I am asking the Minister if any part of this extra tax which has been imposed by the Coalition Government will be collected from the farming sector or if all of it will fall on employees. With regard to the PRSI and health charges proposed, is it the situation that a PAYE employee under £8,500 will pay an additional 1.5 per cent while a PAYE employee over £8,500 will pay an additional 6.25 per cent? Will the Minister confirm if that is so?
I am only replying to the question I was asked. I have given the Deputy the reply. This is in connection with the multiplier and that is the question that appears on the Order Paper before me. I am anxious to facilitate the Deputy.
11.
asked the Minister for Health if the abolition of the upper income limit for health contributions will be accompanied by an increase in the health eligibility limit; and if those with incomes over £8,500 will be eligible for free consultancy services.
The eligibility limit for free hospital consultant services is fixed on an annual basis, taking into account movements in incomes. The current limit of £8,500 came into effect on 1 June 1981 and will remain in force until 31 May 1982. The limit would in the ordinary course be reviewed by that date. Some persons with incomes over £8,500 a year could than be expected to become eligible for free consultant services.
The question I asked is: will those with an income over £8,500 be eligible now for free consultative services? The Minister said they will be paying 150 per cent extra. Will they get extra services or not?
This will be reviewed on 31 May 1982.
The answer I take it is——
A question, please Deputy.
Is the Minister's answer "No"?
I am not giving my answer as such. It will be reviewed on 31 May 1982.
(Interruptions.)
12.
asked the Minister for Health the combined cash contribution in a full year as a result of the 150 per cent increase in health contributions for a married couple each of whom earns £8,000 per annum; and how much extra this will be above their present combined health contributions.
A married couple each earning £8,000 per annum, net of allowable superannuation deductions, would pay a combined health contribution of £400 in a full year if the rate of contribution is increased to 2½ per cent. This represents an increase of £240 over their combined contribution under the present contribution rate of 1 per cent.
I thank the Minister for being so informative. Does this mean they will pay an additional £4.50 per week?
I have given the information sought.
13.
asked the Minister for Health the administrative arrangements she intends to make to collect health contributions from employees, the self-employed and farmers with incomes in excess of £8,500.
It is intended that the administrative arrangements for the collection of health contributions will continue as at present.
Will the Minister say how the additional funds are to be collected from the self-employed and from the farming sector in this additional health charge?
I do not have that information but it is as easy to collect an increased amount as an existing amount. The same procedures will apply.
Not for the payee.
Will the Minister not be concerned that there will be administrative difficulty in having different rates applying under the PAYE system?
I accept that it will be necessary to occasionally review the system of collection. This will be done. I do not see the point made by the Deputy that it is more difficult to collect a larger sum than it is to collect a smaller one. The same machinery will be used.