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Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 13 Jul 1982

Vol. 337 No. 9

Gas Regulation Bill, 1982: Second Stage.

I move: "That the Bill be now read a Second Time".

The purpose of this Bill is to update some important aspects of the legislation concerning town gas companies. Over the years the existing legislation has served an essential purpose. It established and developed the fundamental obligations and rights of gas companies taking account of their specific obligation to provide gas as a service to the public. Stagnation in the town gas industry in more recent times, and lack of incentive for development and capital investment, meant that no strain was put on this rather antique legislative framework. But that is now in course of change. The supply of natural gas to Dublin and Cork and the possibilities of supplying natural gas to other existing town gas companies, where practicable, calls for legislative change. There is an urgent need to remedy at least the more serious deficiencies in present legislation to prepare for the new situation.

Gas companies need more modern laws to put them on a footing somewhat similar to the modern company. The longer-term solution will be to repeal all previous Acts and Orders and to have a single piece of legislation dealing with all gas companies. But in the meantime, the purpose of the proposals in the present Bill is to deal with those deficiencies which are seen as a hindrance to gas companies, such as Dublin and Cork. These companies have to take immediate measures to raise capital and borrowings and to take other appropriate steps for the distribution of natural gas.

The major features of this Bill, which I will deal with in more detail later, can be summarised as follows:—

(1) the introduction of the option for gas companies to have a memorandum and articles of association like any other modern company. This will remove the necessity for ministerial orders requiring Oireachtas approval for routine management matters while still retaining the more critical provisions of existing legislation. When a gas company does not opt to adopt a memorandum and articles this Bill will still dispense with the need for ministerial orders in specified routine matters

(2) the application to gas companies of provisions of the Companies Act in such matters as issue of a prospectus and allotment and issue of shares or stocks. The existing legislation either does not cover these events or is seriously deficient in relation to them.

The updating measures will allow gas utilities to operate in a modern, commercial company law framework consistent with the needs for any major developments related to the lay-on of natural gas.

Deputies will know that there are eight operational town gas companies. These are in Dublin, Cork, Limerick, Waterford, Clonmel, Kilkenny, Dundalk and Wexford. None of these is a company incorporated under the Companies Acts. With the exception of Clonmel and Limerick, which are part of their respective local authorities, all other town gas companies are privately owned. The gas companies were established about the middle of the last century. Each is subject to its own separate regime of special Acts of Parliament from which it derives its initial constitution, powers and duties.

For example, the present Alliance and Dublin Consumers Gas Company was incorporated for the purpose of supplying gas under the Alliance and Dublin Gas Act, 1866. The Act also defined the company's area of operation and regulated its capital and borrowing powers. Seven other special Acts concerning this company were subsequently enacted, the last one being the Alliance and Dublin Gas Act, 1909. A pattern of Special Acts for each of the other town gas companies developed in a similar, independent way.

The independent evolution of special Acts for individual gas companies resulted in a certain lack of cohesion in the law on such companies. It became obvious that there was a need for legislation which could have a common application and which could supplement the special Acts. Thus various Acts, suited to gas companies in general, were also enacted. For example, the Companies Clauses Consolidation Act, 1845, as amended and supplemented in a minor way by other Acts, contains comprehensive provisions for the internal regulation and management of public utilities such as gas companies. The provisions in these Acts are largely the forerunners of a kind which would be found in the articles of association of a modern company. Many of these Acts are deficient and outmoded in many respects.

The Gasworks Clauses Acts, 1847 and 1871, gave gas companies the right to open up public streets to lay, replace and repair gas mains. They contain provisions obliging a gas company to supply gas to a person located near a gas mains. They also contain provisions concerning use of meters and testing quality of gas. The Gas and Waterworks Facilities Acts, 1870 and 1873, were enacted to enable a gas company to construct gasworks and raise capital for that purpose; to amalgamate with another gas company and to do various other things. Various Acts which have application to gas companies were enacted over the years. The more important of these are listed in the Schedule to the Bill.

The Gas Regulation Act, 1920, deserves special mention. Prior to that Act gas companies were, as I have outlined, almost totally locked into a regime of Acts which extensively controlled their operation and regulation even in matters of a routine nature. Change, even minor change, could be achieved in most instances only by an amending Act. The significance of the Gas Regulation Act, 1920, was that it enabled a variety of changes to be made by ministerial order. In particular an order could be made to modify or amend the provisions of any special Act or other provision relating to a gas company which would help the company to operate more efficiently. It was a substantial improvement because it opened the way for some flexibility in effecting change. The need for a more flexible approach is reflected in the numerous orders which, at the request of individual gas companies, have been made in the intervening years. Most of these orders are still in force. They deal with a wide variety of things, such as increasing the number of directorships, determining the frequency of general meetings and evaluating stockholders' funds.

The 1920 Act did not, however, give gas companies the degree of flexibility which today's circumstances require. Before an order is made the draft must be laid before, and approved by resolution of, both Houses of the Oireachtas even though the draft order might relate only to some fairly simple aspect of day-to-day administration. In the case of an ordinary company such matters could be dealt with by resolution of the company. I think Deputies will agree that the procedures for making an order which I have described can therefore be regarded as unnecessarily cumbersome in many cases.

I have mentioned a few of the more important enactments to give Deputies some idea of the complex web of legislation which has become woven around gas companies over the years. This interweaving of special Acts, generally applicable Acts and various statutory orders made from time to time, has created a situation where functions and constitution of any gas company are contained in a confused statutory framework which is unnecessarily inflexible, outmoded in many respects and inadequate for an expanding gas industry.

The case of Dublin Gas Company is a prime example. Some 37 Acts, orders and amending orders have been made in relation to this company. Most, if not all, are still in operation. They interact with each other in a complex way which makes it extremely difficult to understand the constitution and laws of the company. It is for these reasons that I propose the measures contained in the Bill.

Section 2 of the Bill gives gas companies the option of adopting a memorandum and articles of association. This will enable them to adopt a modern constitution generally. In particular it will provide a flexible framework for raising the level of capital and borrowings required and for altering those levels to meet changing needs. In general a company which adopts a memorandum and articles will have a more modern alternative to the provisions enshrined, for example, in the Companies Clauses Acts which I mentioned earlier.

However, existing laws will be replaced only to the extent of the provisions of the memorandum and articles. In particular, those enactments or parts of enactments which give a gas company its fundamental powers and obligations as a gas utility will not be capable of dilution in the memorandum or articles. There is a safeguard against this in a provision in section 2 which provides that a memorandum and articles or any amendment must be confirmed by me as Minister. Of course, I have the option to waive the need for confirmation in appropriate circumstances and I will give maximum flexibility to gas companies in this respect.

Section 3 applies to gas companies, with necessary modifications, the provisions of the Companies Act, 1963, regarding the issue of a prospectus and related matters concerning the allotment and issue of shares or stock. The present laws on gas companies contain no provisions about a prospectus and are seriously deficient in other related matters. Section 4 gives a gas company general borrowing powers subject to the provisions of its memorandum.

Section 5 applies the provisions of the Companies Act, 1963, regarding appointment of auditors. This means in particular that an auditing firm may be appointed as auditor. Under present legislation at least some gas companies must appoint individuals.

Under sections 6, 7, 8, and 9 provisions similar to the Companies Act, 1963, are being introduced regarding the creation and registration of charges on the property of a gas company, appointment of a receiver over its property, security for debts and priority of debts. Existing creditors will not be prejudiced by these provisions.

Present legislation on gas companies does not cope adequately with such matters. Gas companies need to be on the same footing as ordinary companies when securing borrowings for the capital investment which will be necessary for the changeover to natural gas. The proposals in this Bill to apply provisions of the Companies Act could possibly give rise to doubts and difficulties about the scope and extent of the application of company law. Section 12 enables such difficulties to be resolved by order.

A town gas enterprise which is part of its local authority does not have a company structure. Local authority borrowings and other affairs are controlled by the Department of the Environment. It would not be appropriate to apply to a local authority which supplies town gas the provisions of sections 2 to 9 aforementioned. The effect would be to give the appearance of diluting the necessary controls which are the responsibility of the appropriate authorities.

Sections 10 and 11 replace subsection (2) of section 10 of the Gas Regulation Act, 1920, the repeal of which is provided for under section 15 of the Bill. The effect of section 10 is to empower the Minister to allow gas companies to do certain things of an administrative nature, such as giving a separate supply of gas for industrial purposes, which under section 10 (2) of the Gas Regulation Act, 1920, would have to be done by order. Section 11 retains the order procedure for important matters such as reduction of capital and alteration of the authorised limits of supply.

As I said earlier, these are interim measures. A more comprehensive Act to deal with all gas companies is planned. Such legislation will have to take account of an appropriate procedure for the incorporation of new gas companies. No such procedure is provided for in the present gas laws and it may be needed as the gas grid is extended. Preparation of new legislation will afford the opportunity not only to replace out-of-date provisions on the constitution, financing and management of gas undertakings but also to provide a broad framework within which expansion of the natural gas network can take place with due regard to commercial, technical and safety considerations appropriate to modern circumstances. I have instructed my Department to prepare as quickly as possible proposals for a comprehensive Act.

It has been considered necessary to have this Bill enacted during the present session because it will facilitate certain measures which must be taken by the Dublin Gas Company within the next couple of months in preparation for the receipt of natural gas around the end of this year. The Bill will also provide similar flexibility for Cork Gas Company in case special measures are needed by that company in the near future. As Deputies will know, the essential elements of the contract between BGE and the Dublin company have only recently been approved. Since then, a great deal of consultation, at administrative and legal levels, has been necessary in the course of drafting the Bill. In order to meet parliamentary deadlines, the text of the Bill was circulated while certain legal drafting points were still under review. This process has been completed and I am advised that a number of minor amendments are desirable, mainly in the interests of greater legal precision and clarity. I have circulated these amendments and I will deal with them at the appropriate stage.

I commend the Bill to the House.

This is a technical Bill. It is doubtful whether it should be sponsored by the Minister for Industry and Energy. It is perhaps more appropriate to the Minister for Justice. But I am interested to see it come before this House because I remember saying in 1975 or 1976 in relation to some Act that went through the House at that time that some updating of the gas regulations was urgently needed and that I was proposing to have a Bill drafted to bring us into the seventies because all the various Acts were constraining the expansion and development of the Dublin Gas Company at this time.

I am glad to see this measure before the House. But I am pretty certain that the Minister will be back here before Christmas looking for another amendment to this Bill because we are dealing with regulations and orders that are in operation since the middle of the last century. That is a pity. That it is a difficult piece of legislation to draft is shown by the fact that the Minister circulated a number of amendments to the Bill this morning even before it reached the floor of the House. So we can expect other deficiencies in the Bill which will show soon after it becomes law or when it is taken to pieces by the solicitors and lawyers acting as advisers not just to the Government and the Minister's Department but to the gas undertakings themselves.

When I spoke on the Second Stage of the previous Bill I suggested that BGE should consider taking equity in the companies responsible for the final distributors of natural gas. By that I meant the Dublin Gas Company and any other privately owned or quoted company in the State. The Minister said today that the decision had been made to do just that. I may be wrong but, to the best of my knowledge, this is the first time that this has been announced. That is the correct decision. When we are dealing with a national resource such as this we should see that the end uses of the product are controlled as much as possible. I am not an advocate of State participation in things. I think the further the State stays away from private enterprise the better chance private enterprise has of progressing and providing the jobs that are so necessary in this country. But I would make an exception in relation to this. I was a bit surprised to hear the Minister saying this so badly here today. But if this becomes public knowledge, I hope the Minister will ensure by regulations or whatever is necessary that a killing is not made on the stock market by people who fortuitously hold shares in the Dublin Gas Company. I would not like to see such people benefiting by a huge jump in the value of those shares purely because the Government were going to step in and take equity in the company. Some safeguard must be brought in to ensure that that does not happen.

Some years ago the Government underwrote some of the borrowings of the Dublin Gas Company in exchange for which they had the right to nominate members to the board of the Dublin Gas Company. That board may even be fully controlled by ministerial appointees at the moment. What is the present position with regard to the State's involvement in the Dublin Gas Company? If, as the Minister said when replying to the Second Stage of the previous Bill, the Gas (Amendment) Bill, 1982, An Bord Gáis Eireann or the Government intend to take a stake in the Dublin Gas Company, does that apply to the other listed private companies in the State, one of which has already got natural gas? Cork has a supply of natural gas. It is proposed that Dublin be given some in the very near future, and then Limerick, Waterford, Clonmel, Kilkenny, Dundalk and Wexford. Clonmel and Waterford Gas Companies are owned by the local authorities, but the others, Waterford, Kilkenny, Dundalk and Wexford are still in private hands. I would like to know what the Government's attitude to these companies is and if it is the intention of the Government to extend their interest to those companies.

At the end of his speech the Minister said that the preparation of new legislation would afford the opportunity not only to replace out-of-date provisions of the past on the constitution, financing and management of gas undertakings, but to provide a broad framework within which an expansion of the natural gas network could take place with due regard to commercial, technical and safety considerations appropriate to modern circumstances and that he would be instructing his Department to prepare proposals for a comprehensive Act as quickly as possible.

I am not sure if all those considerations, safety, technical and commercial, should be incorporated in the same Act. I would think that the safety consideration would deserve a separate Act dealing with safety in the handling of natural gas, town gas or liquid gas, when being moved by lorry or container or, as may well be in the future, by ships, or gas pipelines as I was suggesting earlier, tied into a European grid. The safety aspect of that would be more suitably contained in a separate Act. I am not sure what technical means in this regard or how it is separated from safety. The commercial theme should be left separate by an up-dating of the Gas Regulations Bill, 1982. Given the nature of what the Minister is trying to do in this Bill it is almost inevitable loopholes will be found and we will be back here again discussing amendments to this before next Christmas. I hope that will not be so but the possibility is there that it will be so.

This Bill is necessary. Indeed, this legislation was overdue and I myself may be culpable in not doing something when I had the opportunity. Indeed, this legislation was necessary right from the foundation of the State and comprehensive legislation should have been introduced in the twenties rather than 60 years later, legislation governing the sale and distribution of gas to bring it into line with modern concepts rather than continue what had been inherited from the last century.

Another point is the regulations controlling the sale of the product by certain undertakings. In the comprehensive legislation to be introduced later is it proposed to change these areas or wipe them out altogether? These undertakings are strictly controlled geographically. The Cork Gas Company has some problem because the area of development does not necessarily coincide with the area in which the company is allowed to sell gas. I cannot remember exactly where the divergence comes in their permitted area of activity. I think Little Island may be outside the area in which they are allowed to operate with the result that they were deprived of customers in the industrial estate there. Again many of the areas which might be described as satellites may be outside the area. I refer to areas like Blarney, Carrigaline and Ballincollig. These are outside the area served by the Cork Gas Company. They may have no wish to serve these areas or the people in them may not be willing to pay the price, but I would like to know whether it is proposed to make any changes in these areas which were probably drawn up for each gas undertaking as and when it was formed and have probably not been changed since then. They do not necessarily bear any relationship now to the contiguous areas which have developed since. Would the Minister indicate whether he will allow any change or whether the existing areas will be wiped out by this Bill?

The Labour Party support this measure. In many respects it is analogous to company law requirements relative to town gas companies. It is a complex field but the Labour Party support the degree of consolidation in this Bill. We support the necessary technical amendments. This measure will facilitate the Government in dealing with the companies concerned and we regard it as a useful measure at this juncture.

I understand this Bill is subject to the list of items contained in the Schedule. The Schedule lists a number of Acts and there is nothing in any of the memoranda made under this Bill which can dilute any of the provisions of those Acts. Does this Bill involve a blanket repeal of all legislation other than the Acts specifically mentioned? All that is done under the heading of repeal in section 15 is one subsection of a section of the Gas Regulation Act, 1920. I ask partly out of interest but also from the point of view that one does not want a conflict of interpretation — does the fact that this is the most recent legislation implicitly repeal all previous legislation?

I would also be interested to know if it would be appropriate to put in this or subsequent legislation provisions which would facilitate profit sharing by the employees and also perhaps involve the possibility of employees becoming shareholders on a preferential basis. Furthermore, will the legislation contain provisions to enable employees to get legitimate information about the way in which the company is operated and their job prospects? I am not very familiar with the debate going on between the trade unions and various Ministers but I know there is some dispute because employees feel they should be given more information about the way in which companies operate since certain operations might be to their detriment. To what extent has the Minister considered this aspect of general company law in relation to the operation of the Gas Company?

I thank the Deputies for their contribution to this debate. It is a very complicated exercise. This is an interim measure to deal with a specific situation. Work is starting on the consolidation of legislation dealing with gas supplies. Various points were raised relating to safety aspects and I agree that this matter must be dealt with.

Deputy Barry asked whether it is intended to change under this or subsequent legislation the existing scope for the development of gas companies to cover satellite towns. As the market develops it may be necessary from time to time to change limits of supply but this can be done by order under section 5 (11). Such development is not now envisaged but I agree that it may have to be considered in view of the expansion of satellite towns in the Dublin and Cork areas.

Deputy Barry asked when the announcement was made concerning the Government's taking an interest in the Dublin Gas Company. This was announced on 21 May but I cannot remember the extent of coverage. I believe this is the right course of action in the re-organisation of the Dublin Gas Company. There was reference also to the elements of that agreement.

When was the announcement made?

On 21 May.

I can see how it was submerged under other events.

This matter must go before the stockholders as this is a private company in which the Government do not have shares.

Deputy Bruton raised the matter of profit sharing. This Bill is neutral in respect of profit sharing by employees and it is a matter for the company. I welcome the idea, although it is not new. There is provision under the existing Companies Act for specific types of shares which can be distributed to employees on a profit-sharing basis. It is a progressive move on the part of companies to enable employees to share in profits and the Dublin Gas Company might consider this idea. Probably motivation could be increased by such a step.

There is nothing in this Bill to change the duty on gas companies to supply gas and nothing that can be done in their memorandum and articles of association can override that.

Deputy Bruton asked whether the Acts listed in the Schedule will remain in force. They will, except in so far as they are amended by the memorandum and articles of association. The basic obligations of a gas company remain and cannot be changed by the memorandum.

I repeat that this is an interim measure. There is a need for consolidation and the need for this legislation arises from the supply of natural gas to Cork and its expected arrival in Dublin by the end of the year. I agree that this is a very difficult legal area, as shown by amendments to be introduced later. The job had to be tackled and a start has been made.

Question put and agreed to.
Agreed to take remaining Stages today.
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