asked the Minister for the Gaeltacht if he will make a statement on the fraud squad investigations into companies grant aided by Údarás na Gaeltachta.
Ceisteanna — Questions. Oral Answers. - Údarás na Gaeltachta Grant Aid.
4.
D'eisigh mé ráiteas ar an 20 Eanáir agus cuirfear cóip de timpeall sa Tuairisc Oifigiúil.
Seo a leanas an ráiteas:—
Tuairisc ó na Gardaí ar Chomhlachtaí áirithe Gaeltachta
Tá tuairisc faighte ag an Uasal Pádraig Ó Tuathail TD, Aire na Gaeltachta, ar fhiosrúcháin a bhí ar siúl ag an Garda maidir le comhlachtaí áirithe ina raibh scaireanna ag Údarás na Gaeltachta agus a bhfuil a bhformhór imithe as gnó. Sa chuid is mó de na cásanna ba léir ó réamhfhiosrúcháin nach raibh aon bhunús ar a bhféadfaí eolas a chur le chéile lena chur ar aghaidh chuig an Stiúrthóir Ionchúiseamh Poiblí (DPP). Sa chuid eile cuireadh torthaí na bhfiosrúchán faoi bhráid an Stiúrthóra agus thug seisean treoir nach raibh aon ionchúiseamh le déanamh seachas i gcás amháin a bhain le fostaí de chuid comhlachta ar leith.
Is cúis sásaimh don Aire a fhógairt go poiblí gurb amhlaidh nach raibh aon fhianaise gur tharla caimiléireacht ó thaobh an Udaráis ná ó thaobh lucht bainistíochta na gcomhlachtaí sin. Tá dóchas aige go gcabhróidh an toradh sásúil seo chun deireadh a chur le drochphoiblíocht i gcaoi gur fearr a bheidh ar chumas an Údaráis brú ar aghaidh leis an obair mhór atá le déanamh ar mhaithe leis an nGaeltacht.
An bhfuil sé ráite sa ráiteas sin nach raibh aon rud mícheart ó thaobh bhord Údarás na Gaeltachta agus ó thaobh an Údaráis é féin, agus nach mbeidh aon chásanna dlí de bharr an scrúduithe a rinne an Garda?
Dúirt mé sa ráiteas gur chúis áthais dom go raibh sé seo amhlaidh.
The Minister will recall that in a debate in the Dáil on 8 November I stated it was known that the fraud squad investigation had shown there was no basis for any case against the Údarás. On that occasion the Minister called me a liar.
Ba mhaith liom a rá nach raibh eolas agamsa faoi sin, agus cibé eolas a chuir an Teachta i mo leith go raibh sé agamsa, sin é an fáth go ndúirt mé agus go ndéarfaidh mé anois go raibh an ceart agam a rá go raibh sé ag cur bréige i mo leith. Ní bhfuair mise an t-eolas go deimhin go dti an 15ú lá de Mhí na Nollag.
The fact remains that anyone interested in this case was well aware long before the Minister made that statement in the Dáil that the fraud squad investigation had not produced any evidence that would have justified any case being brought. Will the Minister state if the investigation established the background to the letter written by a former employee, since deceased, of Údarás na Gaeltachta? Did the investigation establish to whom that letter was handed by the deceased employee and what that person did with the letter? Is the Minister aware that the deceased employee stated he wrote the letter on the understanding that it was to be handed by Mr. Seán O Foghlú to the Minister for the Gaeltacht for Government information and that he was asked to write the letter at the request of the Minister for the Gaeltacht and the Government? Did the inquiry establish if that was factual?
Níor chuireadh aon sonraí chugamsa maidir leis an mionscrudú a rinne an Garda faoi seo. An méid a fuair mise ón Gharda ná go raibh siad sásta nach raibh tada acu le cur i leith na ndaoine agus na gcomhlachtaí a bhí ainmnithe sa litir sin agus ainmeacha eile a cuireadh chucu ina dhiaidh sin. Níor cuireadh aon sonraí ar fáil domsa faoi na mion phointí maidir leis an scrúdú a rinne an Garda ar an gceist sin.
Is the Minister stating he does not know any more than that the Garda have reported that as there was no fraud, no case would be brought and that no further details of this matter have been brought to his notice? Mr. Ó Foghlú claims he made the request on behalf of the Minister, and I ask the Minister if he is substantiating that. Would the Minister care to inform the House about Deputy Begley's part in this ugly affair?
Nil aon bhaint agamsa le haon rud a dúirt an tUasal Ó Foghlú. Má bhí sé ag labhairt ar mo shonsa ní raibh sé de cheart aige é sin a dhéanamh agus, mar a deirim, níl aon smacht agamsa céard a dúirt nó céard ná dúirt an fear sin. An méid eolais ata agamsa ná go bhfuil scrúdú déanta ag an Garda, go bhfuil siad san sásta nach bhfuil aon chás acu rud ar bith a chur i leith na ndaoine ná na gcomhlachtaí a ainmníodh agus chomh fada agus a bhaineann liomsa go mbeidh mé sásta glacadh le focail an Gharda maidir leis sin agus sin deireadh an scéil.
I am sure that the Minister is aware of these documents which were written by a deceased former employee of An tÚdarás. These are in his Department and confirm that this Mr. Ó Foghlú made this request on his behalf. Is the Minister not concerned that a Deputy of his party would have participated in such underhand work as Mr. Ó Foghlú and Deputy Begley were engaged in on this occasion which, unfortunately, has brought great discredit to the only industrial promoting authority in the Gaeltacht areas, Údarás na Gaeltachta?
A question, Deputy, please.
This has contributed to the death of that employee and also resulted in the firing of the chairman and two board members and the chief executive.
I am prepared to allow latitude here, but I cannot allow a long speech.
All this because of a hate campaign on the part of one member of the Minister's party based on false statements which are now confirmed by the Minister to be false.
I am aware of what Deputy Molloy is up to, but it has nothing whatsoever to do with the question. I am satisfied to accept the word of the Garda Síochána on this.
The Minister makes no reply to my allegations.
They are totally false.
Could the Minister say what is false about what I am saying? I shall come back to this matter on the Adjournment.
The Deputy will be very welcome.
Ó tharla go raibh go leor cainte agus conspóide faoi na ceisteanna seo ar fad sa Dáil, an n-aontódh an tAire gur náireach an rud é nár thug sé an t-eolas a bhí aige os comhair na Dála agus deis a thabhairt dúinne labhairt faoi anseo sa Dáil sular tugadh é go dtí na páipéir nó do áit ar bith eile?
Tugadh é i dtús báire do chomhaltaí bhoird Udarás na Gaeltachta agus is iad san a fuair an chéad léargas ar an toradh air a bhí ar siúl ag an nGarda agus an tráthnóna céanna chuir mise amach ráiteas poiblí mar cheap mé — agus ceapaim go fóill — gurb iad comhaltaí an bhoird a bhí i gceist agus go mba cheart go mbeadh an t-eolas acu san i dtús báire agus gan é a léamh sna páipéir.
Nach n-aontódh an tAire gur anseo a rinneadh an chaint go poiblí faoi agus go bhfuil dualgas aige san mar Aire nuair a ardaítear rud mar seo sa Dáil an t-eolas a thabhairt os comhair na Dála agus os comhair na mBall anseo sula dtugann sé do dhuine ar bith eile.
An bhfuil an Teachta ag rá nach raibh an ceart agamsa an t-eolas seo a thabhairt do chomhaltaí an bhoird i dtús báire?
Ceist 5.
The Minister has said that there is no truth in what I have said. Part of what I said was a question to the Minister as to whether he was aware that a document written by a deceased former employee of Údarás na Gaeltachta was available in his Department.
Of course, it is available in my Department.
The Minister is aware of the contents of this document, so why did he say that what I am saying is not correct?
Some of it is not correct.
He did not say "some".
Well the Deputy knows that if we want to deal in semantics we can do so.
I am not dealing in semantics.
Of course, the Deputy is.
Is the Minister not concerned at the activities of Deputy Begley in this vindictive campaign?
Deputy Begley is well able to look after himself, as Deputy Molloy knows.
Is the Minister satisfied that Deputy Begley's involvement in this was correct and something that the Minister would fully stand over?
I should like to explain to Deputy Molloy that I am sure, in the same way as he would not stand over or take responsibility for the activities of some of his colleagues across the House, I take Deputy Begley to be responsible for his own actions. I am not his keeper and neither is he mine.
The Minister is not prepared to stand over it.
Deputies, please, would you bear with the Chair for a moment. I have no desire to appear to curb the questions on this subject or to suppress any attempt to get information on it. However, the Deputies should appreciate that we cannot have a debate or a long Question Time and that is what we are having now. I think that I have been reasonable on this.
Deputy Begley accused me of telling lies in this House and said that there should be a lie detector when I spoke on these matters, which would show up whether or not I was telling the truth. Now the Minister has confirmed all that I said on that occasion.
That is not a question.
That is not a fact.
Deputies, please. I am going to be firm on this. I am now going to allow Deputy De Rossa to put one question and Deputy P. Gallagher to put another and that will be that.
The Minister should be ashamed of himself.
An bhfuil an tAire sásta nach mbeidh deireadh leis an gearán seo faoi Údarás na Gaeltachta go dtí go mbeidh fiosrúchán poiblí faoi ghnóthaí an Údaráis agus gur cóir an fiosrúchán poiblí sin a chur ar bun láithreach?
Ba mhaith liom a rá leis an Teachta go bhfuil fiosrúchán ar siúl faoi láthair. Tá coiste Dála ag phlé na ceiste seo agus beidh tuarascáil á foilsiú nuair a bheas an scrúdú sin críochnaithe.
Níor tosnaíodh an scrúdú sin go fóill.
In view of the fact that there is no substance in the allegations made in relation to Údarás na Gaeltachta, will the Minister now reinstate the board members who were sacked and also the chief executive?
Hear, hear.
Ba mhaith liom a rá nach bhfuil baint dá laghad, aon bhaint chor ar bith——
The Minister has lost all credibility.
A Cheann Comhairle, an bhfuil cead agamsa an cheist a fhreagairt? Nuair atá an fhírinne á chur i láthair na ndaoine seo tosnaíonn siad ag screadaíl. Níl baint dá laghad leis an fáth in ar bhriseadh triúr ball den bhord — agus ní mise a bhris an príomhfheidhmeannach; an bord a bhris an príomhfheidhmeannach — níl baint ar bith aige sin leis an gceist atá os comhair na Dála agus atá freagraithe agamsa anois.
Tá an bord briste.
Ceist a 5. Sin an méid.
He is Minister for the guns.
Ceist a 5.
The Minister does not use guns.
The Minister should at least apologise.
The Minister should take back that remark.
Sin an méid.
The Minister made a sly remark.
I said that the Minister does not use guns.
Ceist a 5, más é do thoil é.
The Minister made a denial. Why is he speaking about the guns? We are speaking about honourable people and now the Minister has a dictatorship in Galway.
Sin an méid ar Cheist a 4.
The Minister said in the House that there was a caseful of matters relating to Údarás na Gaeltachta which would shock this House. He has not produced one of them.
Hear, hear.
I have been more than reasonable on this. I am not allowing——
The Minister has lost all credibility.
Question 5, please.