Deputies Shatter and De Rossa have been given permission to put questions on private notice to the Minister for Foreign Affairs. I believe that both questions are being taken together. Will Deputy Shatter read his question, please?
Private Notice Questions. - Refusal of Entry to South Africa of Irish Group.
To ask the Minister for Foreign Affairs if he will make a statement on the manner in which the group of Dunnes Stores workers who left Ireland yesterday to visit South Africa have been treated by the South African authorities; if he will protest to and demand an explanation from the South African Government about the arbitrary and unacceptable imposition of a visa requirement to enter South Africa on Irish citizens at London Airport immediately prior to their boarding a plane to fly to South Africa; and if he will review this country's arrangements with South Africa whereby South African citizens visiting Ireland do not require an Irish visa.
Would Deputy De Rossa please read his question?
To ask the Minister for Foreign Affairs if he is aware of attempts by the South African authorities to obstruct the entry of a number of Irish citizens to South Africa; if he is aware that they were requested to complete visa formalities although visas were not previously required for Irish citizens entering South Africa; if he will indicate the steps the Government have taken to ensure the safety of the people concerned who are reported to have been confined to the airport in Johannesburg; if the Government have made any representation to the South African authorities on the matter; if the Government now intend to review the no visa entry arrangement for South African citizens coming to this country; if the Minister will make a statement on the matter.
I propose to take these questions together.
The Government have noted with concern the decision of the South African authorities to refuse entry to a group of Irish citizens. The group had travelled to South Africa at the invitation of Nobel laureate, Bishop Desmond Tutu, and other leaders of the South African Council of Churches. The purpose of their visit was entirely peaceful and open; to meet leaders of groups which oppose the apartheid system and victims of racial injustice. The Irish Embassy in London has on instructions raised with the South African Embassy the unilateral action of the South African Government in apparently introducing a visa requirement for travel between Ireland and South Africa, in view of the fact that on a reciprocal basis no such requirement has existed up to now, and their response is awaited.
The Government are seeking an explanation from the South African authorities for the arbitrary exclusion of the Dunnes Stores strikers. Our understanding is that the strikers are currently being confined to the transit area of Johannesburg airport pending their return to London; the issue of safety does not, therefore, appear to arise.
Visa arrangements are a matter in the first instance for the Minister for Justice. As I indicated in my reply to a parliamentary question on 7 May, my Department are currently studying the implications of any changes in the existing arrangements. On completion of this assessment and taking account of the most recent development I shall be in a position to make a recommendation on this matter.
Will the Minister make it clear to the South African authorities that it is totally unacceptable that 15 Irish citizens should be confined at the Johannesburg airport in the manner in which those concerned have been confined, including the Dunnes Stores workers? Would he agree that the arbitrary imposition of the visa requirement by the South African authorities effectively ends the rationale to the reciprocal arrangement of non-application of visa? Would he accordingly be in a position to confirm to this House today that his Department's view will be that we should now require all South African citizens entering this country to first seek a visa from here?
I consider it is unacceptable that this situation should have arisen in Johannesburg. As I mentioned in my reply, I have raised the matter through our embassy in London with the South African authorities and we are seeking an explanation from the South African authorities for the arbitrary exclusion of the Dunnes Stores workers.
With regard to the review which is at present under way in relation to visa arrangements, I cannot anticipate the result of that review. There are a number of aspects which must be considered. There is, for instance, the fact that we have a common passport area with the United Kingdom. There is also the fact that we have quite a number of aid workers in Lesotho, and, as the House will know, Lesotho is land-locked by South Africa and those travelling to Lesotho have to travel there via Johannesburg.
Would the Minister not agree that this action by the South African Government confirms — if such confirmation were ever required — that this Government must take a firmer line in relation to their dealings with South Africa and, in particular, that the Government should adopt a much stronger position in relation to the boycott of South African goods in Ireland?
The Deputy is, no doubt, aware that the Minister for Labour has circulated proposals about control of imports of South African produce. I should also point out to the House that Ireland has consistently supported the idea of UN sanctions against South Africa, provided that such sanctions were selective, graduated, mandatory and fully implemented. Government policy, in addition, requires the public sector to refrain from purchasing South African products.
Could the Minister confirm that the position is as stated on the 1.30 p.m. RTE News, that there is no possibility now of the 15 Irish citizens concerned being allowed to remain in South Africa? Could he indicate what representations he made to the South African Government to permit them to continue with the visit? Would he also agree that, in the event of the South African Government not allowing the visit to take place, adequate financial compensation, at the very least, should be paid to the 15 persons concerned for the manner in which they have been treated?
Could the Minister also indicate whether he is satisfied that the behaviour of the British Airport Authority in Heathrow was, in all senses of the term, proper and correct, or is he concerned at that behaviour, having regard to reports that British Airways have been suggested at some stage as having acted in unison with the South African authorities and having sought to prevent some of the passengers — in particular the Dunnes Stores strikers — from boarding the plane at Heathrow before it left for South Africa?
It does seem that there would not now appear to be a possibility that the group will be permitted to leave the transit lounge and enter South Africa. With regard to the response of the Government, I mentioned in my reply that the matter has been taken up with the South African authorities and that an explanation has been demanded.
In regard to the situation on the ground, I should mention that, as a matter of Government policy to show our opposition to apartheid, Ireland does not have full diplomatic representation in South Africa. The Irish Honorary Consul in Johannesburg has a function in relation only to consular matters. He travelled to Johannesburg airport to see what assistance he could render. He also contacted the South African authorities in Pretoria on the matter but formal representations are made through our embassy in London. On the question of adequate financial compensation that was raised by Deputy Shatter, that is a matter we can raise in the course of our discussions with the South African authorities but cannot anticipate their response at this stage. With regard to what happened at London Airport, my understanding is that British Airways have a regulation under which they do not permit passengers to travel on their flights unless their travel documents are fully in order.
With regard to an earlier answer by the Minister about his concern for our volunteers and workers in Lesotho, will he confirm that immediately he will enter into discussions with people in Lesotho and in other countries in Africa so that our experts and our volunteers will not run into problems when they have to fly via Johannesburg in future? That is the only way one can go to Lesotho and we want to ensure that our bilateral programme is not hampered.
So far as Ireland is concerned — I mention Ireland because the same may not apply to other countries operating in Lesotho — we have not had any difficulties with any of our aid workers going to Maseru via Johannesburg. I take the point raised by the Deputy that it would make the implementation of our aid programme more difficult if such difficulties arose.
Will the Minister of State accept that it is clear now that the boycott in which the young Irish workers have been involved in the past year is now seen to be very effective and has been of considerable concern to the South African authorities? For that reason, will he use his offices to ensure that Dunnes Stores management will lift the restrictions that have forced these young people out on the street? Will he ensure that no other Irish company can adopt the same tactics and that Irish workers will be allowed to refuse to handle South African goods?
I agree with Deputy De Rossa that the concern of the workers has been brought home to the authorities in Pretoria in that they have taken this arbitrary action. In relation to resolution of the dispute with the supermarket concerned, as the Deputy will be aware, there have been quite a number of discussions on the matter and my colleague, the Minister for Labour, has been involved in trying to find a formula for resolution. The matter has been referred to the Labour Court but I am not fully aware of the up-to-date state of negotiations. Certainly I hope that a resolution to the problem can be found in the near future.
Will the Minister of State agree that it is not acceptable that British Airways should seek to enforce arbitrary visa requirements imposed at the last minute by South Africa on Irish citizens?
Will he also agree that the internal regulations of British Airways say nothing about their enforcing such arbitrary requirements? Further, will he not agree that it is not acceptable for British Airways to have acted in the manner as reported prior to the departure of the flight to South Africa?
My understanding is that British Airways have a regulation whereby they do not permit passengers to travel unless their travel documents are in order. I will look into that aspect further. I am not aware of the details of such regulations. Beyond that, it is a matter for British Airways to deal with any complaints in that area. It would be outside my province.
Will the Minister of State inform the House of the name of the Irish Consul in Johannesburg? Will he state the number of occasions his Department have been in touch with him about the proposed visit of the Dunnes Stores group?
I have to confess I am speaking from memory here. As I recall it, his name is Mr. O'Connor but I will correct that for the Deputy if that is not the case.
I think the Minister of State is wrong. I think his name is Mr. Ryan.
I thank the Deputy for that information.
Obviously the Minister has not been in touch with him.
As I mentioned in my reply, my Department have been in contact. The honorary consul travelled to Johannesburg airport to see what assistance he could render and he was also in touch with the authorities in Pretoria. As I also mentioned, he is an honorary consul, not a diplomatic officer of the Department. Formal representations in this area are made through the South African embassy in London.
The Minister of State did not say the number of times he or his Department have been in touch with the Irish Consul in Johannesburg about this proposed visit of the group from Dunnes Stores.
The Department were not directly involved in this visit. However, officials from my Department met with representatives of the strikers last week to brief them on Government policy towards South Africa. The question of contact with the honorary consul did not arise at that stage and there was no formal request for assistance from him. My Department took the precaution of advising the honorary consul that the group intended to visit Johannesburg.
Is the Minister of State saying——
I have allowed almost 20 minutes for this question. I am moving to the Order of Business after this.
The Minister of State indicated in his reply that he was reviewing the reciprocal visa arrangements between Ireland and South Africa. Will he tell the House when he hopes the review will be completed and will he make a statement to the House then?
I cannot give an exact time limit. It would not be a matter for a statement to the House when the review has been completed. The question of visa arrangements is primarily a matter for the Minister for Justice. When the review is completed we give a recommendation on the matter to that Minister. As I said, this review is continuing and, of course, we will take into account the most recent development. I cannot say when the review will be completed.
I should like the Minister of State to clarify one point——
We have been on this question for the past 20 minutes.
The Minister of State made an extraordinary statement. Is he not aware that the matter of visas and the requirements for visas is a matter for negotiation between the Ministers for Foreign Affairs of the countries concerned? The role of the Minister for Justice is simply to implement what is decided. Surely the Minister is aware of that. The Minister does not seem to have been in contact with the Honorary Consul in South Africa. He does not even know the regulations.
It is not correct to suggest that visas are a matter for the Minister for Foreign Affairs in the first place. They are a matter for the Minister for Justice. My Department were in touch with the Honorary Consul in Johannesburg before the group left this country, advising them of the proposed arrangements. When the difficulties arose my Department were again in contact with the Honorary Consul who took the action I have outlined.
I wish to ask——
I am sorry Deputy. I must have regard to the fact that debates on other items are limited. I have been reasonable, even generous, as regards supplementaries on this question and I am now moving to the Order of Business.
I accept that the Ceann Comhairle has but——
The Deputy must resume his seat.
The South African Government have taken political action against 15 Irish citizens.
The Deputy will have to find another way to raise the matter.