Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 12 Dec 1985

Vol. 362 No. 11

Order of Business.

The Taoiseach

It is proposed to take No. 12. By agreement, the Supplementary Estimates being introduced today will be taken immediately after leave has been granted for their introduction and shall be brought to a conclusion forthwith and successively and decided without debate, with the exception of Votes Nos. 23, 25, 38, 41, 46 and 47. Also by agreement, the following arrangements shall apply: (1) The proceedings on Vote 46 shall be brought to a conclusion not later than 12.30 p.m. today; (2) The proceedings on Votes 23 and 25 shall be brought to a conclusion not later than 5 p.m. today.

Also by agreement, the Dáil shall meet at 10.30 a.m. tomorrow and shall adjourn not later than 4 p.m. and the business shall be confined to Supplementary Estimates and Statements on the Report of the Joint Committee on Marriage Breakdown. If a division is challenged on an Estimate it will be taken at 8.30 p.m. on Tuesday, 17 December 1985 in accordance with Standing Order No. 123.

An Ceann Comhairle

Are the arrangements for the introduction and the taking of Supplementary Estimates, including the provision for the taking of divisions should they arise, agreed?

Mr. Haughey

Before we give our agreement I want to be clear on the procedures. All of this business has been rather hurriedly arranged. No. 12 is described on my Order Paper as a motion for leave to introduce Supplementary Estimates. I take it that means the Minister for Finance will ask for leave to introduce all the Supplementary Estimates. When that leave has been granted, is it the position that the Minister for Finance, on behalf of all the Ministers, will move the Estimates or will the individual Ministers move their separate Estimates?

An Ceann Comhairle

The Chair understands that when leave has been given to introduce Supplementary Estimates all of them will be moved by a Minister——

Mr. Haughey

Formally?

An Ceann Comhairle

Yes, and will be taken and disposed of without debate with the exception of Votes 23, 25, 38, 41, 46 and 47, which will be taken as provided for today and tomorrow.

Mr. Haughey

In regard to Votes 23, 25, 38, 41, 46 and 47, I understand agreement has been reached between the Whips that Ministers introducing these Estimates will take a limited time in each case so that debate will be able to take place.

An Ceann Comhairle

That is an agreement between the Whips. It is not in the Order of Business. Are the arrangements for today and tomorrow agreed? Agreed.

Mr. Haughey

On the Order of Business, I wish to direct the attention of the House and the public to the fact that today and tomorrow at very short notice we will take Supplementary Estimates totalling £94 million. The Government's Estimates for 1985 were understated by an extent of £94 million. We are reluctantly agreeing to take these Supplementary Estimates at very short notice and with very abbreviated discussion on each heading. In fact, we are agreeing to allow through on the nod quite a number of Estimates because there is not time to discuss them. With regard to Votes 23, 25, 38, 41, 46 and 47, we have agreed to take them with a very short time to discuss them. This is very unsatisfactory and I wish to protest about it. There is nothing we can do about it at this stage because these moneys must be provided. Otherwise, a serious disruption of departmental activities will occur. A sum of £50 million extra is required for social welfare. If that were not approved here today, the unemployed could not be paid tomorrow. This is a very bad way to do business. We will agree to the Supplementary Estimates now because it is necessary in the public interest to do so, but we must ask the Government to arrange their business better in the future.

An Ceann Comhairle

This would have been in order if you had said it before the items were agreed. Now you are putting the Chair in an awkward position.

Mr. Haughey

I am raising it on the Order of Business.

An Ceann Comhairle

It is not the Order of Business.

Mr. Haughey

With the way you are running things——

An Ceann Comhairle

It would have been perfectly in order when I asked if the suggestion was agreed to. The Opposition need not have agreed to it and Deputy Haughey could have made then the speech he is making now. The business to be taken today and tomorrow was agreed. The order for today and tomorrow is agreed but you are now seeking to put the Chair in a very difficult position.

Mr. Haughey

It is the Government who are putting the Chair in that position, not I. I will conclude by saying that this procedure ill becomes the Government, who claimed such credit for improving our Parliamentary procedure.

Mr. O'Kennedy

Will the Taoiseach reply now? He has no answer.

The Taoiseach

On a point of order, Deputy Haughey knows the position well. If he had spoken earlier I would have been in a position to reply. I cannot reply now. I suggest that order should be maintained strictly in the House.

Mr. B. Ahern

I want to ask the Minister for Energy and the Minister for Labour to take some action today to try to de-escalate the CIE dispute. The other day when I was allowed to raise this matter——

An Ceann Comhairle

You cannot raise it now. The Deputy knows better than to put the Chair in this impossible position.

Proinsias De Rossa

I am now in the impossible position that I was about to ask if there would be Government intervention in the CIE dispute——

An Ceann Comhairle

That is not in order. I have just refused another Deputy. The Chair must be consistent. Having refused one Deputy I cannot allow another Deputy to try to raise the matter.

Mr. Leyden

I want to ask the Taoiseach if he will tell the House the reasons for not bringing forward the local radio Bill. In two days the Taoiseach will be in office three years. After three years we still have not got a local radio Bill and I doubt if we are any nearer to it now than we were three years ago. There is dissension in the Labour Party and Deputy Cluskey is dictating that the Bill will not be brought forward.

An Ceann Comhairle

The Deputy will be allowed to ask a question.

The Taoiseach

The Bill will be introduced early in the next session.

Mr. Leyden

I should like the Taoiseach to know that there is a Bill in the House, over here.

Mr. Wilson

I am a little hesitant about addressing you at all. If the Taoiseach thinks that the Tánaiste and the Minister for Labour have no interest in the CIE dispute, would he at least listen to the statement by Deputy Tunney, the Lord Mayor?

Mr. McGinley

I would like to draw the attention of the House to the contribution offered by the leader of the Fianna Fáil group in the European Parliament——

An Ceann Comhairle

This is not in order.

Mr. Reynolds

What about the mess made of the fish quotas in Europe?

Mr. McGinley

That was a disgraceful remark.

Mr. Reynolds

What about the fish?

Miss Flaherty

I want to raise on the Adjournment the deterioration of the bus services in Dublin.

An Ceann Comhairle

I will communicate with the Deputy.

Mr. E. O'Keeffe

Is the Taoiseach aware of the 1,500 tonnes of grain to be imported to Northern Ireland from the UK and the serious consequences that Irish farmers are suffering because of blunders by the Minister for Agriculture and his failure to assist the farmers——

An Ceann Comhairle

Will Deputy O'Keeffe resume his seat?

Mr. E. O'Keeffe

I have an obligation to raise this on behalf of the farming community.

An Ceann Comhairle

Will the Deputy resume his seat? Deputies must be presumed to be familiar with Standing Orders. They cannot but be familiar with the procedure on the Order of Business, with what is in order and what is not. Notwithstanding that, they come in here morning after morning and, in spite of the Chair, raise matters which are not in order.

Mr. O'Kennedy

I want to raise on the Adjournment the unfortunate sequence of liquidations here and the undermining of the rights of workers in these companies, about which the Minister for Labour is doing nothing. I refer particularly to Roscrea Meats.

An Ceann Comhairle

I will communicate with the Deputy.