Vol. 369 No. 7
I move:
That a supplementary sum not exceeding £12,156,000 be granted to defray the charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of December, 1986, for the salaries and expenses of the Office of Public Works; for certain domestic expenses; for expenditure in respect of public and certain other buildings; for the maintenance of certain parks and public works; for the execution and maintenance of drainage and other engineering works.
The Supplementary Estimate now sought for Vote 10 arises for a number of reasons. First there was the decision of the Oireachtas, with the passing of the Canals Act, 1986, to transfer responsibility for the Grand and Royal Canals from CIE to the Commissioners of Public Works. The sum of £650,000 included for the canals in the Supplementary Estimate is the unexpended balance of the 1986 allocation to CIE for that purpose. There will be a corresponding saving under that heading in the Vote for Communications, so no extra cost to the Exchequer arises from the transfer.
Just over half of the £650,000 is required for the salary and wages of the 78 canals staff transferred from CIE. The balance of the money is needed to cover some expenditure on works, services and supplies incurred by CIE but not paid for before the transfer, and also similar expenditure by the OPW since that date. Works undertaken by the OPW include replacement of some defective lock gates, major repairs to a breached weir on the Barrow navigation, repairs to and tidying up of sections of canal banks as well as routine day-to-day maintenance. Arrangements are also in hand for the purchase of essential transport vehicles, equipment and supplies.
I am glad to inform Deputies that a detailed engineering survey of the Grand Canal by the OPW engineers has commenced and consultants are engaged on a major study of the entire system, taking into account the vast amount of interest in and views on the canals manifested by local authorities and members of the public since the transfer. The consultants' report on the study, which will be available early in 1987, will provide advice and guidance to enable the OPW to formulate a programme for the future management and development of the canals as a public amenity in accordance with the terms of the Act.
Another reason for the Supplementary Estimate is the purchase of Agriculture House for a sum in the region of £7.9 million by the commissioners on behalf of the State. Agriculture House is a large modern office block fronting on to Kildare Street beside the Shelbourne Hotel. It houses the headquarters of the Department of Agriculture and has a total of 165,000 square feet of office space and forms an integral part of the Government Buildings complex. The building, which was held on a long term lease was due for rent review in the current year and the purchase price represents what would amount to about eight years rent following the review. Given the size, condition and prime location of Agriculture House the purchase is considered a sound economic investment. It is in the block broadly referred to as Government Buildings.
The additional provisions being made in subheads E, F.1, F.2, F.3 and F.4 are for certain works and charges which arose after the allocation for the subheads had been settled. There were identified savings in the Votes for the Departments for which the services in question were required. The Departments concerned will surrender amounts to the total involved, so that, again, there will be no extra cost to the Exchequer.
The additional sum required for subhead F.5 covers essential maintenance work at Galway Courthouse undertaken by the commissioners on behalf of the Minister for Justice. The cost of this work is recoverable from the local authority.
The reduction in Appropriations-in-Aid is to cover an expected shortfall in moneys due for the maintenance of completed drainage and coast protection schemes. The amount which had been budgeted for the current year was £5.5 million but the rate at which payments have been coming in does not hold out hope that the figure is going to be realised. It is, in fact, estimated that there will be a shortfall of £3 million. It is necessary to adjust the Appropriations-in-Aid provision downward by that amount to ensure that the commissioners are not deprived of funds which they need to discharge their functions.
There is a statutory obligation on county councils to meet the costs of maintaining drainage and coast protection schemes. The funding of county councils for this purpose is, of course, a matter for the Department of the Environment. The existing arrangements for funding and execution of drainage maintenance is one of the subjects covered in the Review of Arterial Drainage, which is being submitted to Government by the Minister for Finance.
Earlier this year, after the introduction of the budget, the Estimate for the Office of Public Works for the entire year including the Supplementary Estimate now before us in the sum of £12,156,000 amounted to £104,811,000. That is a sizeable amount of money and demonstrates the importance of the Office of Public Works and the finance they required in order to carry out the work they undertake each year. When I served as Minister of State in that office I often mentioned the fact that there were three or four other Departments which handled a lesser amount of money annually than did the Office of Public Works. That office should be well catered for by the Government and the Minister for Finance when the annual Estimates are being prepared.
The first matter with which I should like to deal is the purchase of Agriculture House, a fine building which encompasses all of the sections of the Department of Agriculture. When I first became a Member of this House the Department of Agriculture were located in Merrion Street. Because the various sections of that Department were located all over the city, Deputies, the farming community and others had to go to different office blocks to discuss their problems. We welcomed the fact that the various sections of the Department were brought under the one roof in Agriculture House in Kildare Street, convenient to Leinster House. It was my experience during my term of office in the Office of Public Works that all Government Departments were anxious to have their office space sited around St. Stephen's Green, near Leinster House, so that civil servants would be readily available for discussions in this House. The purchase of this building, costing £8,245,000, signals a change in policy on the part of this Government — to purchase buildings to house Government Departments.
Bearing in mind the present financial position of the country, when we hear daily of shortages of finance in all Departments, this is a refreshing change. I have always favoured the Office of Public Works purchasing sites within the vicinity of St. Stephen's Green to house as many civil servants as possible and that they own their own office space.
When last in Government the Fianna Fáil Party had embarked on a policy of decentralisation, transferring certain sections of Government Departments to provincial towns. At that time we purchased sites in 12 different locations and a 13th site in my own town of Tralee for a block of offices to house civil servants in County Kerry. At that time also we invited tenders and had discussions with the building construction industry and financial institutions about the erection of such buildings in different centres.
We also had those buildings designed by architects, some of them by architects from the Office of Public Works and some by private architects. At that time we had designs for 12 buildings for Civil Service Departments down the country in order to carry out our decentralisation programme. There was a great need for a boost in the building industry, as there is at present.
The debate on a Supplementary Estimate is not an open-ended debate on the Estimate itself, as you already indicated, but on the particular aspects of the moneys allocated in the Supplementary Estimate. That is according to Standing Orders.
First of all we are dealing with the purchase of Agriculture House.
You are in order on that, Deputy.
I am pointing out the alternative to purchasing Agriculture House. I am pointing to other ways in which the £8 million could be spent. That is why I am going back to the decentralisation programme.
It is a restricted debate.
I know that, but at the same time I should be allowed to make a comparison——
A passing reference.
——between decentralisation and the purchase of a Civil Service building here in the city. I will not dwell on it for very long. Our decentralisation programme at that time would have given much needed employment in the building industry. If the Government spent this £8 million on a decentralisation programme it would be much more beneficial and a much better investment than spending it on the purchase of a building when finances are so scarce. It would also afford an opportunity to many of our civil servants to get jobs in their own towns or in other cities rather than having them all housed in Dublin. We all notice the numbers of people who travel by private and public buses and by train with CIE each weekend, civil servants who are anxious to go down the country for the weekend. If the Government invested the £8 million on a decentralisation programme it would enable us to cope with the numbers of people in Dublin. The streets of Dublin would not be as crowded and it would ease traffic in the city. I always advocated that the Office of Public Works should own all their own property, whether in Dublin or in the country. At present the money would be better spent down the country.
There will be a tender for Tralee in the next few weeks, the Deputy will be glad to hear.
I will be talking about that in a couple of minutes. The towns we had selected for decentralisation were Killarney, for the Department of Justice; Cavan for the Department of Agriculture; Waterford the Department of Social Welfare; Limerick for the Revenue Commissioners; Nenagh for the Department of Posts and Telegraphs, the Leas-Cheann Comhairle's town — we allocated something else for Nenagh also — Galway for the Department of Defence; Sligo for the Department of Social Welfare; Ballina for the Department of the Environment; Athlone for the Department of Education; Letterkenny for the Department of Social Welfare; Dundalk for the Department of Posts and Telegraphs, now An Bord Post and An Bord Telecom; and Ennis for the Revenue Commissioners.
Wexford was left out.
Unfortunately, the Minister was not in the House at that time or we might have considered Wexford.
It is unlikely.
It had a better chance then than it has now.
In all we were going to transfer 3,210 civil servants to the country. That would have made 800,000 square feet of office space available in Dublin. It would be a much better investment for the Office of Public Works to spend that £8 million on decentralisation or by having portions of Departments transferred to the country which would bring Government to the people in the provinces. The Department of Agriculture could be transferred to County Cavan or some other county in the centre of Ireland rather than have it in Dublin where there is very little agriculture other than in rural Dublin.
Under subhead E — New Works — where there is an extra expenditure of £312,000 I would like to ask the Minister if a new Garda barracks for Ballyheigue, County Kerry, is included in that. A site was purchased in 1980 for a small Garda barracks. That area is very scenic in the summertime when there are about 5,000 to 6,000 extra people in the village. A new Garda barracks is very necessary in that village. An office block is also needed for civil servants in Tralee. This has been planned by the Office of Public Works. I wonder is it included in the £312,000. A site was purchased in Tralee, when I was in the Office of Public Works, with a view to housing all the civil servants in one office block. The Revenue Commissioners in Tralee have increased their staff considerably since 1980. They are housed in four prefabricated buildings in the town. The same pertains to the Department of Agriculture. They have a big number of people employed in Tralee. They moved into an office block about ten years ago — I cannot remember the exact date. When I served as Minister of State in the Office of Public Works we had to spend a considerable amount of money on the floors of that building because the weight of the files caused the floors to sink about six inches and they were in danger of collapsing.
That is the Tánaiste's town.
That is right. Since the Government came into power — I cannot blame the present Minister because she is not long in the Department — I have been imploring for that building to be advertised for tender. I ask the Minister to do so in the very near future. The people are crying out for a Civil Service building in Tralee where all the offices are fragmented. They are completely inadequate for the staff there and we have been waiting for that building since——
I agree with the Deputy and it is going for tender in the next few weeks.
I do not like to say I do not believe the Minister of State but her predecessor had been promising that since 1980. I know we were in Government for a short while in 1981. Since 1981 we have been promised that building. I have been promised on umpteen occasions that it was going to tender. I will accept the word of the Minister of State.
I thank the Deputy.
I hope she will honour her word but I assure her that I will be back to her in a very short time if it is not advertised before Christmas. The civil servants in Tralee are kicking up a hell of a row, especially the Revenue Commissioners and the Department of Agriculture officials, to have some proper space made available to them which will be as good as Agriculture House which was purchased recently. Civil servants in the Department of Agriculture in Tralee deserve the same type of office accommodation as they have in Dublin. We would welcome it down there.
Under this heading of £312,000, is there any allocation of money for the Land Commission offices in Merrion Street here in Dublin? There is a great deal of office space there. I do not know the square footage, but every public representative in the Dáil knows about this big building, known as the Land Commission building. This building has been almost closed. As far as I know only a skeleton staff operate in it. When in Opposition you have not the opportunity of checking those things, but I think it is the only other office block the Government own in Dublin city: I am open to contradiction on that and they may own a few more. Money should be allocated to have that office block renovated and made available for offices. It could not be nearer to Leinster House. Earlier this year there was an allocation of money for some renovation to the Department of Lands office block.
There is an allocation of £641,000 for waterways. The canals have been included in our inland waterways and have been taken over by the Office of Public Works to be looked after. I would like to pay a compliment to the OPW for the way they have handled the navigation of the Shannon for the past 18 years or so since I came into politics and I hope in the future they will handle the Grand Canal and the Royal Canal just as effectively. The Vote here is for £641,000. I understand from the Minister's speech this is mainly for wages and salaries. When the Royal Canal and Grand Canal were taken over by the OPW we were led to believe we would have a planned programme to develop those two canals into grand waterways. I know that will be a hefty job which will cost a great deal of finance and possibly will run over a ten year period. I am disappointed to see that there is no allocation of money for the development and improvement of the canals.
When I was coming to Dublin this week I came, as I usually come, by the Grand Canal. I noticed that somebody was putting down a pathway on the side of the canal and it was being tarmacadamed and rolled by a roller. Those pathways were used at one time when the barges which went up and down the canal were pulled by horses. The Office of Public Works might know this strip of land adjacent to canals and rivers as the mat road. The Ceann Comhairle, the Minister of State and some TDs probably know what I am talking about because the mat road area is the area near a river where arterial drainage has been carried out. The OPW have a certain authority over such pathways when arterial drainage has been done. I took it on myself to find out who had permission to have a roadway made adjoining the Grand Canal and I found out that the OPW did not know about it. Was permission given to Dublin County Council or Dublin Corporation? I do not know. I am not a member of those local authorities. It is important at this stage of development of the canals that at least the mat roads or pathways, whichever you want to call them, be preserved. We may need them in the future. The local authorities, the county and urban councils in the different counties, are anxious to co-operate with the OPW in the development of the canals as waterways and amenities. That will be very beneficial for the people of the towns through which the canals flow, especially the young people, and in the attraction of tourists to those areas. Those towns and Dublin itself could develop the canals for boating, walks and swimming and possibly have them stocked with fish. Studies will have to be done on that, but at least the OPW should have an allocation of money and a plan for the development and improvement of our canals. They should get suggestions and co-operation from the different local authorities through whose territory those canals flow. When we stand up here again to talk about the Estimates for the OPW — perhaps there will be a change of Government in the meantime — maybe some plan will have been prepared for an allocation of money for that purpose.
I refer the Deputy to my speech. The plan will be ready early in 1987. It is well under way.
I will keep the Minister of State to those promises.
That is all right.
In this Vote today there is no money for arterial drainage.
The amount of money in the Estimate for the OPW has been substantially reduced this year. A Cheann Comhairle, in case you say that I am deviating from the Vote, I raise this because we had two big floods during the year and promises were made. The Taoiseach and other members of the Government who visited flooded areas promised that they would step up the arterial drainage programme. Yet there is no provision in the Supplementary Estimate introduced here today for arterial drainage.
There is no extra expense. This is only a Supplementary Estimate. The arterial drainage is being done from internal resources. The design stage is well in hand.
What about the expenses arising from those commitments?
We have the engineers and all those necessary to do this design work and we are proceeding apace on it. They are already employees of the board.
They were not doing it up to this.
They have been taken off other jobs and put on to the drainage. We are talking here about a Supplementary Estimate.
I note also that there is an allocation of £10,000 for the repair and renovation of a courthouse in Galway. Presumably Galway County Council are not doing their duty.
On a point of order, the Minister seems to be contradicting herself. The Minister said earlier in regard to arterial drainage that the existing arrangements for funding and execution of drainage maintenance are covered in the review of arterial drainage which is being submitted to the Government by the Minister for Finance, and the Minister tells us it is being done under what is already there.
The design stage of the four rivers mentioned by the Cabinet recently is proceeding. No extra money is needed. The review of arterial drainage, which the Deputy's Government mentioned in October 1982 is being completed. We are talking about two different things altogether.
When Fianna Fáil were in power they had a progressive policy on arterial drainage. We did a cost analysis benefit on rivers that were to be dredged. That has been discontinued by the present Government. A cost analysis benefit must be done on every river before drainage takes place. We were doing this for each river which might be dredged in the near future. The Government discontinued it. We ask that it be started again, especially in the areas that experienced flooding this year. There is nothing in the Supplementary Estimate for it.
There is £10,000 for courthouses. The local authorities are responsible for the courthouses. It is only when they neglect their duty — and we in Kerry repaired our courthouse and did not neglect it — that the Government must step in. The Department of Justice, in co-operation with the Office of Public Works, should be responsible for the maintenance and provision of courthouses in every county. I know the Minister will probably say they are looking into this and that it will be done in the near future, but everything is being put on the long finger. Many of the courthouses are historic buildings with good architectural features and they should be preserved. The Office of Public Works are the office to do such work. I ask the Minister of State to ask the Government to ensure in future that maintenance and provision of courthouses will be a Government concern rather than a local authority concern.
I agree with that.
I note also that £10 million has been spent on the Royal Hospital in Kilmainham. It is only open two days a week because a board was put in charge of it. It would be much more beneficial if the Office of Public Works were in charge of it. Since £20 million has been spent on it, it would be more appropriate to have it open every day of the week, rather than just two days.
In regard to maintenance and supplies, it is important that the Office of Public Works should use Irish materials. We should be giving an example to the rest of the country. I know of several cases where Irish materials were not used by contractors who built buildings for the Office of Public Works. The Office of Public Works should note the condition of some of the buildings erected in recent times, particularly the Garda barracks in Tralee which was built of brick which has turned white. I questioned why our Irish brick was turning white. I got the answer from a builder recently who told me that, when the plastic was removed from those bricks and they are left out in the rain, the white would come out on the brick afterwards. I suggest that in future when the Office of Public Works are putting up public buildings they should insist that the contractor keeps the bricks covered until they are put up and then there would be no white on the building.
In regard to increases in salaries and wages, there was a vote of £9,000 for the Office of Public Works. I am surprised at that, in view of the fact that so many people have been laid off from other sections of the Office of Public Works to do arterial drainage. The number of people employed in arterial drainage has been cut by 50 per cent in recent times, so I would have thought there would be no demand for increased wages and salaries.
Some of our public buildings are in a bad state, for example, the Employment Exchange in Tralee and the Department of Agriculture in Tralee. It is the duty of the Office of Public Works to maintain these buildings and to provide the facilities that are required in them.
In regard to the purchase of Agriculture House, could the Minister tell me if all the sections of the Department of Agriculture are now housed in Agriculture House? I am not against the purchase of buildings for housing civil servants here in Dublin or against the erection of buildings here in Dublin. I have always advocated that sites should be purchased here in St. Stephen's Green. What I do question is the £8 million spent on the purchase of a building when it could be spent much more effectively and much more beneficially down the country on a decentralisation programme and would give much more employment in the various towns I have mentioned.
