Deputy Naughten gave me notice of his intention to raise on the Adjournment the subject matter of cuts in ACOT and An Foras Talúntais. The Deputy has five minutes to make his case and the Minister three minutes to reply. That is all we can afford tonight.
Adjournment Debate. - Agricultural Research and Development Cutbacks.
I thank you for the opportunity of speaking on the Adjournment on this very important subject.
First, I refer to the Official Report for Thursday, 12 November at column 579 when the Minister, replying to questions put by me and other Members of the House, stated in regard to redundancies:
The Estimates do not make any reference to a figure of 1,000. It is very important that that be put on the record of the House. I did not make any statement of that kind and the Estimate did not...
However, I have a press release here by the Minister for Agriculture, with his compliment slip clipped to it, that states that it was the Minister's intention to amalgamate AFT and ACOT, and that in this process the establishment of a new body would require legislation and would result in a substantial reduction in the order of 1,000 in the current staffing levels of 2,200.
I put it to the Minister that on that day he did mislead the House. I now ask him to put on the record precisely what the situation is. We are faced here with an unprecedented occurrence in that the major industry here is faced with a 44 per cent cut in its educational and advisory elements while the administrative section of the Department is only reduced by 2 per cent. It is extremely difficult to understand how the Minister can justify this.
I would ask the Minister to inform me and the other Members of this House, and of course the farming community, the advisory service and the staff of AFT whether he will accept that investment in agriculture, advice, research and development here is probably the lowest in Europe and would compare favourably with the Third World? Will the Minister explain how he could cut the productive side of the Department, namely, ACOT and AFT, by 44 per cent and retain the administrative side practically intact?
It is of vital importance for agriculture that we have research to keep the farming community up to date with new farming techniques and that we have advice to educate farmers and promote new advances in research and development. We are one of the best beef producing countries in the whole of Europe. At a time of massive unemployment, of unparalleled emigration, it is vitally important that we develop this major industry to create jobs for our young people. Instead, the Government have taken a retrograde step. They have cut the finance available to ACOT and AFT by 44 per cent.
What does the Minister propose to do with the 1,000 staff who will be redundant as a result of the cuts in this Vote? I understand that 400 of those have opted for the redundancy scheme, 250 in AFT and 150 in ACOT. What is the Minister going to do with the other 600 staff? Some have given a lifetime of service, others 14 or 15 years to the agricultural sector. What would they turn their hand to? What precisely does the Minister mean by redeployment? Does he mean transferring staff from the midlands down to Goleen or up to Achill or somewhere like that, or does he intend to retain them on the payroll of some Department as happened with the Irish Land Commission staff who, today, receive a monthly cheque, have not done any work since last April and are not even sure what Department they are employed in? Is this what the Minister means by redeployment? The Minister owes it to this House, to those people who have given a lifetime of service to agriculture, to the farming community, to specify precisely where ACOT/AFT or the combined new body are going. I appeal to the Minister to take this golden opportunity——
The Deputy appreciates that it is lights out at 12.30 and if he is hoping the Minister will throw some light on his problem——
I am very interested in what the Minister has to say and I certainly will listen with interest to his reply. I sincerely hope the Minister answers the questions I have asked, not as happened the last day. I certainly will allow the Minister to come in and I would ask him not to proceed along the road he is going, but to make additional money available to ACOT and AFT, to retain the excellent staff and research facilities so that agriculture can develop on into the next century.
The Minister has two and a half minutes.
Let the record show that the Deputy has allowed me two and a half minutes at after 27 minutes past midnight to respond to what he presents as being important issues. If he really wanted to have these matters debated seriously he would not present them at this hour of the night knowing that next week I will, as I indicated already today, be bringing the full legislation before the Dáil. This is a piece of play acting on the Deputy's part and must be exposed as such. I have two minutes to deal with all of the questions he has asked. I will deal with some of them.
On a point of order, I want to put it on record that I have raised this issue for the last month in this House and, at the request of the Minister's colleague, this matter was not taken last week. The Minister is being grossly unfair.
I personally asked the Deputy today, in view of the late hour, if he would postpone this because we know we would have no chance to talk about it. So let me deal with two or three points in a minute and a half now.
First, I want to give the lie to the statement that we have the lowest investment in agricultural research in Europe or anywhere else. The fact is that of our total investment programme over 30 per cent of our research and development programme in Government expenditure is devoted to agriculture. That is, the highest percentage in Europe of Government expenditure.
That is not true.
If the Deputy checks the records he will find that to be the case.
The second fact is that the Deputy's party, as in so many other areas for the last four years, sat back and looked at this and did nothing about it. Everyone recognises that it was time to integrate, in a very effective way the research, education and advisory services to ensure that there would be an immediate flow of information from the research to the primary producer in one intergrated authority which is what I am proposing to do.
What about 1977?
They sat and looked at it for four years like everything else, mesmerised by their own inactivity——
(Interruptions.)
——and all I get is this kind of bleating. I am afraid——
(Interruptions.)
Finally I would point out that the priorities of the new authority will be, first, education and training to enhance the knowledge base of young entrants to agriculture——
What about the 1,000 people? We know the priorities. They are already on the record.
Do the Deputies want answers or do they just want to interrupt?
(Interruptions.)
A Leas-Cheann Comhairle, in view of the fact that we have reached 12.30 and they are not treating this seriously I suggest that we take an opportunity next week——
The Deputy asked the Minister about the 1,000 people and he denied——
Deputy O'Keeffe will appreciate that we are into stolen time and he is not assisting his colleague by interrupting. In accordance with the Order of the House——
I regret this. We will have a full debate next week and, if the Deputy is serious he will not leave me with just two minutes to reply on such a serious issue. Perhaps he will get his name on the local paper.
The Dáil adjourned at 12.30 a.m. on Thursday, 3 December 1987 until 10.30 a.m.