asked the Minister for Energy when he expects that the ESB, Bord Gáis Éireann and their urban gas subsidiaries will supply energy to consumers at or below average EC levels.
Ceisteanna — Questions. Oral Answers. - Energy Prices.
58.
It is anticipated that when the latest material on electricity prices is published by the International Union of Produceres and Distributors of Electrical Energy, it will reveal that, on average, Irish electricity prices compare favourably with those in other European countries. Continued monitoring and continued pressure will be maintained in this area.
Natural gas will continue to be supplied at prices competitive with the cost of alternative fuels on the Irish market. Recent surveys have suggested that Irish industrial gas prices are now among the lowest in Europe. In relation to the domestic sector, the customer profile and appliance density is quite different from that in Europe and, accordingly, avearge European prices are not an appropriate yardstick for domestic gas prices here. However, I undestand that domestic gas customers with higher than average consumption, i.e., in the range of 600.- 1,000 therms per annum, are getting gas at approximately the European average price.
Is the Minister satisfied with the situation where the normal Dublin gas consumer is paying about £60 a year more for gas than he would pay in Europe? In relation to electricity prices, when the Minister mentions averages, does he mean that we will no longer have the situation that 99 per cent of industry is paying 13 per cent in excess of the European averages and only a very small proportion of large users are competitive?
As regards the fist part of the Deputy's question, I cannot say I would be happy with that situation. As I indicated, the customer profile here is very different from that in the United Kingdom. Looking at the figures here we see the average UK consumer uses as much as five times that of the Irish consumer. This in itself creates an economy of scale problem. Maybe that can be remedied in time but I am happy everything possible is being done to provide this service at an economic rate.
Looking at the position in Europe, we are about middle of the league. That is not the best position to be in, the charges in half the Community countries are higher, including Germany. We have made some improvement in this area but there is scope for further advancement.
Would the Minister look at the figures again because we are the second highest for domestic gas, 50 per cent dearer than other countries, third highest for electricity prices and the second highest for industrial prices. Does the Minister expect the House to believe he is happy that everything possible is being done when we look at these figures? Will he not set targets for parity to be achieved within a reasonable period by these two State companies?
The Government are continually monitoring the position. The ESB have a number of proposals for further rationalisation and ultimately they will have to be considered in the context of their impact on communities throughout the country. There has been a considerable reduction in ESB prices in recent years. Progress is being made. I am not saying it is entirely satisfactory but we will press to ensure that this downward trend in energy prices, in association with the drop in oil prices, will be reflected more and more as the services are rationalised and improved?
Would the Minister not agree that the Jacobsen report indicated there were excess costs in the ESB which had grown since 1979 that should not be there? Should he not therefore set the ESB a target of reverting to what was possible before, within an identified period? Surely that is the function of the Minister in this area, not to be saying he is happy or unhappy about things.
As I indicated, this matter is being constantly monitored. Substantial progress has been made in recent years and a number of decisions have to be taken by the ESB in relation to their rationalisation programme. Hopefully, as soon as all this is put into effect, substantial further progress can be made.