asked the Minister for Finance the annual outgoings of the Central Bank on wages and salaries, expenses, purchases, building maintenance costs and costs incurred in the production of currency.
18.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Central Bank Outgoings.
13.
asked the Minister for Finance the total number of persons employed by the Central Bank; their employment status by category and numbers; the total amounts paid by the Central Bank to its employees by way of wages or other remuneration; the amount of moneys paid by way of pensions and superannuation; whether the pensions of employees are unfunded; the extent to which they are funded; the total amounts expended by the Central Bank in travelling and other expenses; the total amount of educational or other grants to employees made by the bank; the facilities which are available for making of loans to Central Bank employees; the total amount of such loans; the rate of interest payable thereon; and the number of persons employed by the bank for each of the years 1975 to 1985 inclusive.
20.
asked the Minister for Finance the estimated annual costs of currency production including printing of notes and minting of coins; the number of persons employed in such activities; the costs of raw materials used; the cost of providing, maintaining and heating premises; the way in which the cost of currency production compare with the annual cost of having notes and coins manufactured by or printed by private printers; and in particular, the way in which the cost of printing notes compares with the annual cost of purchasing notes from a company (details supplied) when they acted as printers.
I propose to reply to Question Nos. 13, 18 and 20 together.
Under section 31 of the Currency Act, 1927 the staffing and remuneration of employees is a matter for the bank. I have no function in this. The issue of the currency is also a matter for the bank under section 45 of the Currency Act, 1927, as adapted.
The data which the bank is required to give by law is contained in the bank's annual accounts and its annual report which are presented to the Oireachtas. The Deputies should refer therefore to those reports and accounts.
I would regard it as excessively detailed to require the bank to publish the depth of information sought by the Deputies, the publication of some of which could be prejudicial to the operations of the bank.
The bank monitors closely the costs of currency production and has assured me that these are not out of line with commercial costs.
I must say I am stunned by that answer. A Member of this House asked the Minister for Finance a series of questions in relation to the expenses involved in running the Central Bank, the number of staff employed by the Central Bank, whether we are getting value for money, whether the 700 workers employed by the bank are giving the State a fair return for the amount of public resources they use and he has been told by the Minister for Finance that it is not his responsibility. Whose responsibility is it?
Theirs.
It is our money they are using. Is no Minister willing to accept responsibility for the outgoings of the Central Bank? Is no Minister willing to say whether we are getting good value or bad value for money in relation to currency production, whether we are wasting money producing our own coins and whether, as was asked in one of the questions, Thomas De La Rue and Company produced notes more cheaply when they supplied notes to the State? Am I to understand that no Minister will reply on behalf of the Central Bank and answer any detailed questions about their staffing, expenses, the cost of running their headquarters in Dame Street or any other details about that? It is a scandal that this House is not being told anything about the finances and costs of the Central Bank or any of its activities.
As I already said in my reply, under section 31 of the Currency Act, 1927, that is the position, and that was before the Deputy or I were born. I also said that the bank monitor closely the costs of currency production and have assured me that these are not out of line with commercial costs.
The Minister does not know——
That is what they have told me.
——and he is just accepting an assurance. The Minister is abdicating his role.
An Leas Cheann Comhairle
It is now 3.30 p.m. and Deputy Noonan has indicated that he wants to ask a very brief question.
(Limerick East): Would the Minister agree that the Central Bank are statutorily independent and that the kind of power which Deputy McDowell is advocating the Minister for Finance should have over the Central Bank would provide a Minister with the leverage which would interfere with the independence of the Central Bank? I am sure Deputy McDowell would not agree with that proposition either.
I can accept what the Deputy has said.
With the greatest of respect, the question did not ask the Minister to assume any powers whatsoever; it merely asked him how many people are employed in Dame Street, whether we need them and whether we are getting value for money.
We need them there.
Some Minister must be——
Deputy McDowell is not in the position as of now to answer for the Minister. The question was put to the Minister and Deputy McDowell should allow the Minister to answer it.
I have answered it.
Priority Question No. 40 in the name of Deputy Michael Noonan, Limerick East.