Thank you very much. In relation to agriculture I have to blame Teagasc nearly as much as anybody else. It is very dangerous to talk about percentages and averages. One could have one's nose in the furnace and one's feet in ice and so achieve an average body temperature, but that would not be satisfactory.
While the dairymen are certainly doing very well, and we do not begrudge them, the grim fact is that there are others who are going through a pretty thin time. They are still borrowing very heavily.
The tillage people in particular are having a very tough time. In all the EC negotiations we seem to have got the worst of both worlds. We have quotas in dairying where we would probably fare well in regard to prices. On the other hand, there are prices, and we would be better off being subject to quotas. We probably have enough grain acreage but we could not compete with the French in price. I am very much afraid that the super powers in Europe who are very substantial grain growers will try to persuade us to grow grain at £50 a tonne, and that is not on.
My suggestion is that as far as possible we should try to redress that. We are an island nation and we would be expected, in time of emergency, to be self-sufficient. We have people who cannot get milk quotas and the beef scene is so marginal that they would not even venture into it — and would not be financed to get into it anyway; we have substantial areas that are eminently suitable for grain, but unfortunately the margins are getting slimmer and slimmer.
It is with some horror that I notice we are now starting to chip away at our sugar beet acreage. We over-produced a few times and sooner or later we will arrive at a stage where it will not be worth talking about quotas. We need to keep making those points in the European Community.
The whole theory behind this much talked about regional plan is that the super powers say they will grant aid countries so that they will be in a position to help themselves; but I am very much afraid that that is just paying lip service. They might try to withhold grant aid from us if they thought we were not going down a particular road. They are quite ruthless when it comes to what I would consider a worthwhile concession to Ireland, that is, allowing us to work out our own tillage programme.
We hear a lot about the over-supply of food and agricultural produce. We are an agricultural nation and will never be anything else. We depend, by and large, on agri-exports of one sort or another. This whole surplus problem is a scandal and I often wonder why our MEPs do not make more of an issue of it. There are whole continents starving and we have to wait until it becomes a crisis before we move in to help. We hear stories from the various agencies that they do not have enough money to buy food. If the main participants in the EC withheld only 25 per cent of the money spent on armaments in any one year we could probably feed the bulk of the hungry nations in the third world. That is a frightening statistic if it is correct, and I am told it is. We would then be allowed to produce a lot more food which we could send to these continents. It is all very well talking about teaching people to fish so that they can fend for themselves but that is a long way off for most of these countries.
The advisory services are vital at present. A top class advisory service is needed in new areas such as flax, horticulture, onion growing and other worthy projects. It is a pity the advisory services are being decimated at present. I am glad the Government have woken up at last and are beginning to cop on. Talk of voluntary redundancies and so on sounds very smooth but it all adds up to a decimated service. I always remember Joe Rea when he was head of the IFA promising to lead everyone into the promised land but the only one who got there was himself.
I am very concerned about Teagasc. It is a great organisation and I fully agree with the amalgamation although I could quibble about the name. I have visited various stations, sheep breeding stations and so on, in the west where money was well spent. Some of the projects announced in the budget regarding embryo transplants and so on were being undertaken by An Foras Talúntais. That work was ongoing in Moorepark and also in the horse industry. Money should be put back into Teagasc. There were many good ideas in the budget but the one thing we are forgetting is that we still need a lot of guidance. Experiments need to be carried out but farmers cannot afford to experiment or to mess around with a particular variety of wheat or particular breeds of stock. That has to be done at a different level.
I am also peeved about the disadvantaged areas. The files for those areas have been lying on the Minister's desk for a couple of years and the Minister has yet to tell us that he has made the next move. I would like to hear from him or from any Minister that something is being done in this regard. I am glad of the Minister's affirmative response pleases me. This is one area where a small amount of money would do a lot of good. For some extraordinary reason vast areas of the country were omitted. Mountainous areas in the Cork region, extending practically into Limerick, should have been included. Much preliminary work has been done, a small amount of which I was involved in. We had arrived at a stage where we were ready to present our case in Brussels and I am glad to hear now that we are moving into that arena.
In regard to horticulture, which is of particular interest to me, I compliment the Minister, Deputy Kirk, on doing a good job in a difficult scene. I would have to warn him about An Bord Glas. I am not sure that that board is properly set up as yet. The Minister gave an undertaking that the board would be structured properly and that has yet to be done. There are very strong vested interests in private companies on this board. It is my view that members of the board are not working in the best interests of horticulture. It is time the Minister should take my advice seriously in regard to the construction of the board.
As everybody in the House will know the EC is in favour of producer groups. If we are to get any grant aid in the future we must set up producer groups and I am in favour of that. I know equally well that it is almost impossible to persuade farmers to join producer groups. If they have a good year they do not want to know about producer groups and if they have a bad year they all rush to the Minister to know what he is going to do about it. The answer is producer groups. Basically they are an escape for the Minister because he can tell the farmers to set up producer groups and then he will appoint people to help them to sell their goods.
As regards horticulture Colm Warren and the IFA have done tremendous work. They are making great progress and I would like to see that continued. I am afraid that An Bord Glas who promised so much are, if anything, hindering the progress of our producer groups. There are many other new ventures in agriculture such as flax growing on which a small experiment is taking place at present. That programme will have to go on for another two years. It is taking place in conjunction with a Northern Ireland flax processing firm in Sion Mills. That can only prosper and succeed if it gets support, which I do not think it is getting.
The Minister has just spoken on forestry. We are making progress in this area but we could make much more progress if a few matters were put right. I have always said that private and co-operative planting has a lot to offer. The terrible expression "set aside" is used in this regard. If the EC are anxious that bad land be set aside, if the aim is to have less grassland, certain areas in the country could be legitimately planted if — and it is a big if — the land could be retained in the ownership of the people who already have it and if a decent income could be paid to these people while the forests are maturing. In other words, they would be paid to look after their own 70 or 80 acres of forest and when it came to cutting the trees the State, a finance company or a co-op, would be involved. That is being done on a large scale at present. Credit must be given to people such as those in the south-west Cork cattle breeding station who have already planted several thousands of acres along those lines.
We have heard a lot of talk in the last week or so about industry and jobs. Certainly there is a crisis as far as jobs are concerned. Nobody can see the problems better than I can. I tried many remedies when I was Minister, some of which succeeded and some of which did not. People should not criticise the IDA or anybody else. It is very hard to create even one job, because for every job we try to create we will lose another due to technology.
I can quote one instance not very far from where I live where an industry expanded creating 30 jobs but in another industry about five miles down the road a machine was purchased which resulted in the laying off of 30 people because the machine was able to do the job of 30 people. That is a pity because the amount being paid to the people involved would not even pay the interest on the cost of the machine. That machine was used in the food industry and if there was any change in people's tastes that machine would be useless whereas the talents and skills of the 30 people could be changed to cater for that.
When it comes to industry I believe small is beautiful. Deputy Colley said this evening it would take a lot to create the jobs that are needed in small industries. It should not be very difficult. Our major co-operatives which are coming together should break into small groupings and get into the manufacture of cheese or a whole range of horticultural products. A rabbit industry has been set up in my own constituency, a project which I helped to start. I do not see any magical solution. Most of the big industries coming into Ireland have a lot of equipment and very few people. They do not measure up to job targets. I am glad the IDA are switching their emphasis at present to grant-aiding jobs rather than equipment and factory costs. That is very important. At present a meeting of the captains of industry is taking place — there are a few that I would not put in even as subs — but by and large those meetings are useful. The comment I did not fancy was that they felt that after all the grants they got they were not able to create jobs. They said something to the effect that it was a happy coincidence we have a few jobs. They have a big responsibility to create jobs and to maintain them at a fairly high level. After all they have got a large amount of State money, taxpayers' money, and concessions of one kind or another.
Many Deputies on both sides of the House, devoted a fair portion of their time to environment matters and to housing schemes. It is a pity that the Government got rid of the reconstruction grants. They were the best grants ever introduced. If they were still in existence not half the amount of money would be needed for the infill of houses. More work was done in the villages and towns through the reconstruction grants than by any other means. Paying somebody £5,000 to get out of a local authority house and allowing good quality local authority houses to be purchased for £8,000 or £9,000 was a great idea. These are schemes which the Government should consider and perhaps re-introduce. There is no doubt that there is a shortage of houses. All of us are inundated with people calling to us seeking better houses or seeking to have their existing houses repaired but we have nothing to offer in that regard.
Enough has been said about roads but I would like to say that in our area they are bad. It was just as well we did not have too many tourists last year because we would have been embarrassed by the State of our roads. We had umbelliferae, hedge parsleys and so on. They were like the cedars of Lebanon meeting in the middle of the roads. Our cars were not designed to cut hedges, much as that is what seems to be expected of them. I would hope that this year we will have proper hedge cutting and at the very minimum the filling of potholes to make the country what it used to be, a place to be proud of it, and so that when tourists come we can take them around and show them the highways and byways.
There is the sensitive problem in my area of pharmaceutical pollution. Some of the local authorities are the worst pollutors of all. Until such time as we take the whole area of treatment plants seriously we have to talk out of the one side of our mouth on pollution. Human effluent is going into estuaries. I am glad that the Minister responsible for fisheries is present. Urban and city effluent is doing infinitely more harm than any pharmaceutical industry. This is causing very serious pollution in Cork Harbour.
Everywhere around the coast you will see increasing evidence of damage to fish stocks and so on. There are about 50 pharmaceutical chemical industries in this country. Independently set standards would stop all the talk about the damage they may or may not do. We need also independent monitoring and totally independent people in charge. I would put a special group of graduates on the job and give them the brief to nail down a particular industry if it was causing a problem. I would insist that every pharmaceutical industry would have a fund set aside, to pay without quibble, so that unfortunate farmers, or anybody else would not be dragged through the courts because they would not be able to fight their case due to insufficient funds. On the basis that an independent monitor found that crops or stocks were damaged, the responsible party would have to pay up. As well as that the industry itself would be brought before the courts and would have to pay a hefty fine. If they insisted on their misdemeanour the State would have the right to turn the key on it because nobody wants that pollution.
I was concerned about one point made by the Minister for Industry and Commerce about connecting to the European grid so far as the ESB are concerned. I hope he is not thinking about connecting us into Sellafield or one of the other clapped out nuclear plants around Europe because I feel very strongly on that issue. When I was on the other side of the House I took a barrage of criticism from this side of the House and rightly so. The present Taoiseach questioned me about becquerel levels. Quite honestly I did not know but I gave him the official reply that 300 becquerels were safe. That was the official reply but the question is, are they safe? We are in real danger in the northern hemisphere. The entire southern hemisphere tomorrow morning becquerels as they do not have any nuclear plants. If I was selling food in the southern hemisphere to morrow morning I would make that point. I do not think we should have hand, act or part in these power plants, whether in terms of taking electricity or of any other involvement.
It is a disgrace that a sovereign super power like Russia would be allowed to operate a clapped out nuclear plant, the fallout from which destroyed our sheep flocks in Wicklow and along the east coast, not to mention the damage it wrought in other parts of the world. For example, along the whole of the Finnish-Norwegian seaboard, most of those involved in the production of deer meat are out of business because that was their livelihood.
Our strongest line into Europe is that we have clean food. I am delighted that both the Minister of State at the Department of Agriculture and Food, Deputy Walsh, and the Minister, Deputy O'Kennedy, are sticking strictly to the idea of no hormones. That might be all right in cattle but if the German housewife says she want meat without added hormones and if she is prepared to pay £6 per lb for it, we must give it to her. We should not apologise to Americans or to anybody else because meat is something we can produce better than anybody else. That is where our future and out market lies and we should defend and guard it in so far as we can.
In relation to difficulties with the planning laws, we blame the planning officers but these people are merely working under the planning laws and these laws badly need a shake up. We hear a great deal about ribbon planning. It is almost impossible to get a house built now because of all the difficulties that are put in the way. You are told, for instance, that you are upsetting the skyline — what nonsense — or that there is a problem of a proliferation of septic tanks and so on. We could have a proliferation of many other problems if people are lumped together as in the case of Ballymun and many other such places. I would much prefer to see people living in the place of their choice and being given an opportunity to go out into suburbs, into the rural areas where sites are cheap, where farmers are delighted to sell. If you had 20 acres of furzeland it is grand to get rid of it, to get money for it and keep the bank manager quiet. We are prevented from doing that because of planning laws. It is high time we had a second look at those laws and to think in terms of, perhaps, communal septic tanks. There are various items that could be looked at but for God's sake let us ease up so far as building houses is concerned and then jobs will be created. A lot more houses could be built then than are being built today.
Regarding health I am worried about one or two items. There is a certain type of old folk I am very concerned about and they are the people who are being put out of welfare homes, where those places are being closed. Those concerned are being sent home to empty, cold houses. They are told they can go to private nursing homes or hospitals. They cannot afford to do so. Most private establishments charge in the region of £150 per week, but these people have only £80 to £90 per week. The Minister for Health should show some concern for those people and try to ensure that we are not making their lives miserable during their last days and that they have some comfort such as they were used to in the welfare homes. I ask the Minister to look specifically at this issue.
We have just had a debate on the VHI. I do not believe there should be a cut off point for PRSI. Whatever a man's income is, he should pay PRSI on it and qualify for full medical treatment. I will explain why I think this should be so. I know somebody who joined the VHI recently because his income had gone over the £16,000 limit due to working overtime. One of his children had a problem and the VHI told him that, because the child had the problem before the family joined the VHI, the child was not covered. The husband had dermatitis before he joined and again he was told that as he had dermatitis before he joined, this condition also was not covered. What good is the VHI to that family? I would like to see a single system in which everybody paid irrespective of income and was covered for every illness. After all, £16,000 might be worth only £14,000 the following year. Many people on an income of £16,000 are not very well off.
Another total waste of funds is what I call the disability benefit scandal. A patient goes to his doctor and is examined, is then referred to a specialist who further examines him and agrees that the patient is unfit for work. However, that patient has then to go before a departmental medical referee, and the departmental doctor may tell him that he is fit for work. This to-ing and fro-ing goes on and that system is a little bit unfair. Basically it is just tying the matter up in knots.
I would like to comment very briefly on fisheries. The rod licence issue will have to be sorted out. We have created a problem where none existed. The matter will have to be sorted out, and sorted out very quickly. As somebody who lives beside the sea I have a personal view on monofilament nets. Monofilament nets will have to be taken seriously. They are being used. To say that a fisherman can use any other sort of a net except a monofilament net is like telling a farmer to go out ploughing with horses. Ways and means can be found to regulate the amount of fish caught and we are doing this in the case of herring. This issue must be taken seriously. A helicopter should be put on a protection vessel and left there, because that is the place for it. The fishermen would be on our side if the helicopter were put to effective use. The helicopter is made for the job of keeping our waters safe from intrusion.
I hope that my speech was constructive. My main point is that there is not a better way, as the only way is the hard way. We have a long way to go before we can be complacent. This Parliament was set up so that everybody could work together for the betterment of the country. That has been my view always and I would like to think that in my lifetime we will see this country begin to prosper.
