Vol. 405 No. 2
11 Mr. Deasy asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs if he will give a progress report on the movement towards European political union; when it is anticipated so that the union will be in place; and the benefits and commitments which arise from this country's point of view.
Following a preparatory phase under the Irish and Italian Presidencies last year, the European Council in Rome in December agreed on conclusions which form the basis for the work in progress on political union. These conclusions are in the Dáil Library. The Intergovernmental Conference (IGC) on Political Union opened in Rome on 15 December and meets monthly at Foreign Minister level. Meetings are prepared at official level by a group of personal representatives meeting weekly in Brussels.
Heads of Government have agreed that the conference will complete its work rapidly with a view to the ratification of the results by the member states before the end of 1992.
The conclusions of the Rome II European Council provide an outline of the range of issues which will be considered by the Intergovernmental Conference. These are grouped under four main headings. The competences of the union: this involves the areas to be brought within the Treaty and the question of new powers for the Community; Democratic legitimacy: this mainly concerns the role and powers of the European Parliament, the involvement of the national parliaments and Community citizenship; Efficiency and effectiveness of Community institutions and of Community action: this involves the functions and powers of the Community institutions and includes such issues as the role of the European Council and increased use of majority voting; Foreign and security policy: this concerns improving the effectiveness and potential of the Community's external policies by moving towards a common foreign and security policy, to be introduced and implemented under a new treaty. Negotiations are still at an early stage with delegations and the Commission putting forward a number of papers on specific issues. Ireland has tabled a paper on economic and social cohesion and has put forward draft Treaty articles on health and we may submit further papers as the conference progresses.
The Intergovernmental Conference can be expected to continue its work until next autumn. It will then be necessary for each of the twelve to ratify what is agreed and, in Ireland's case, if there are to be amendments to the Treaty, a referendum will be necessary in order to incorporate the amendments in the Irish Constitution.
I would be premature at this stage to discuss in any detail the benefits and commitments for this country arising out of the Intergovernmental Conference. However, I should like to recall the importance which the Government attach to the further integration of the Community. A strong and united Community will be better placed to protect the interests of its citizens and play an effective role in world affairs. For a country like Ireland, whose destiny is linked to that of its partners in the process of European integration, we have much to gain from a satisfactory outcome to both the Intergovernmental Conference on Political Union and that on economic and monetary union.
First, I would like to ask the Minister if it is his honest opinion that political union will take place at the end of 1992, or does he see any impediments to that union? Secondly, could he tell us in layman's language — I stress layman's — what it will mean, particularly for this country, if it takes place?
The first part of the question is best answered as follows. The areas being considered by the Inter-governmental Conference are very complex and difficult. They cause many problems for the different members of the European Community. Some matters that we would have little or no difficulty in accepting will cause difficulties for some of the other countries and some that may cause difficulties for us may not cause difficulties for some of the other countries. The conference has had only one meeting at ministerial level, that was about two weeks ago. At that meeting we considered only one of the four elements I mentioned in reply to the Deputy's question; the common foreign and security policy. We did not discuss any of the other three elements and, as I have said, there is quite a range of difficulties to be considered.
I believe that we were right in setting ourselves a deadline. It puts a degree of urgency into the negotiations. There is a great need — and this we subscribe to in principle — for political union within the European Community if we are to have an effective and efficient Community, first, to deal with the type of problems which face us within the Twelve and, secondly, having regard to our responsibilities for further expansion of the Community, which as we know is not too far down the road.
The Deputy will be aware that we have applications on hand from Austria, Turkey, Cyprus and Malta. He will be further aware that discussions are going on at present with the EFTA group of countries for a particular type of agreement, not full membership agreement but a special agreement which will give them the full rights of membership, as it were, without all the obligations of membership. It is genuinely believed by the European Twelve as of now that political union is something that requires top priority, first to run an effective and efficient Community and, secondly, to deal with obligations that are ahead of us.
The Deputy asked if I could give a guarantee that political union would be completed before the end of 1992. The view expressed by the Heads of Government, as recently as their last meeting at summit level in Rome just before Christmas, was that we would proceed quickly with our work. Obviously, they will have to review the progress of the Conference at the Luxembourg Presidency summit when that takes place during this semester.
The second part of the Deputy's question is more difficult to answer as of now but it must be answered very fully before the people of this country will be asked to declare their support for the end product of the negotiations by way of referendum when that time comes. As I have said, political union, as well as economic and monetary union — in this instance I will deal with political union — is urgently required for the deepening and strengthening of the Community in its present day operations, to make it more effective and more efficient and to see if the scope of the Twelve can be extended. There are those who believe it should be extended and that other areas should be brought within the scope of the union, and this will also be examined. The reason I have a certain difficulty in giving Deputy Deasy a precise answer to a very precise question in layman's language is that negotiations are at a very early stage. It is a question that will have to be asked time and time again, right up to the day the people will be asked to express their view on the outcome of the negotiations. They will not be asked to make a decision until they have the full answer.
Will the Minister accept that the people — and indeed this House — are entitled to specific answers to specific questions? Last Monday week a questionnaire was distributed by the President of the Intergovernmental Conference in which there were a number of specific questions. It is right and proper that the replies, if any, given by Ireland to those specific questions should be made available to the House and that we should have an opportunity of discussing the replies here. Apparently they form part of Government policy without the House or the people having an opportunity to express a view on them.
I very carefully note that Deputy O'Keeffe has broadened the scope of this question to try to bring in Question No. 5. I readily understand that; I would do the same if our positions were reversed. In my answer to Priority Question No. 5 in Deputy Jim O'Keeffe's name, which he will get, he will find a most comprehensive reply to all the points raised in his question. The answer runs to three or four pages which I cannot give him at this stage but it is there for him in the detail which the question merits, and that is as I would want it to be.
Will the Minister agree that one of the most important aspects of the proposed political union is the democratic accountability of any institutions which are newly established or maintained, particularly the importance of giving the European Parliament a greater role in the overseeing of the operation in the community? Will he indicate whether he is willing to publish the proposals which he said have been made to the personal representatives of the governments meeting to discuss the issue of political and monetary union and the proposals that have been made by the Government to these groups which regard to changes in the Treaty on the issue of economic and monetary union——
This is a very long question.
I am about to conclude. The document is available in Brussels but my office was informed in Dublin that it was unavailable from the Department here on the basis of confidentiality.
I agree with Deputy De Rossa when he says that an exceptionally important element of political union is the question of democratic accountability. Of equal importance is the role of the European Parliament in ensuring that we have democratic accountability. Within the Twelve — again it is necessary to preface my remarks by saying this — we have had no discussions at Council level on this aspect of political union. The Deputy will equally understand that it must be discussed at great length. A number of member states have a very strong concern about the need for much greater democratic accountability and a much greater role for the European Parliament. Some of the larger countries have that but some of the smaller countries are somewhat concerned that their best interests may not be served if the Parliament has too great a role. Others would be willing to fit in somewhere in between. It is very early days yet because we have not even begun to discuss it. Definite positions have not been arrived at at this stage because the principle on which the conference works is to try to negotiate, to arrive at a consensus and to try to find a middle way to meet the objective as best we can. I do not doubt that the European Parliament will have to play a fuller role, something which will have to be taken into account by national parliaments——
We badly need a committee on foreign affairs.
I am not talking about committees, I referred to national parliaments. I will be quite prepared, at the appropriate time, to come into this House to put all the facts at my disposal on the table for full discussion.
A single page reply would have been very welcome.
The Minister has not responded to the second part of my question with regard to the proposals made by the Government on the issue of political and economic union.
The time has come to deal with other questions.
Specifically, the Minister did not comment on the proposals made with regard to the amendments to the treaties which, as I said, are available in Brussels but not from the Department in Dublin.
Documents in Brussels are available only to the personal representatives of the Minister for Foreign Affairs who are negotiating on their behalf. They are not publicly available.
On a point of order, I have sat here with great patience for an hour and a quarter listening to long, irrelevant replies to some of these questions. I have been waiting to hear something about a matter which is extremely important to the Nationalist people in Northern Ireland. I protest in the strongest possible terms about the way this time has been abused.
I share the Deputy's anxiety in this matter. The Chair does his best to make progress at Question Time but I must admit that it was rather sluggish today, to say the least.
