Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 7 May 1992

Vol. 419 No. 3

Adjournment Debate. - Social Welfare and Justice Matters.

Mr. Connaughton

Thousands of Irish women are owed vast sums of money arising from an EC Court of Justice decision which compelled the Department of Social Welfare to pay arrears of social welfare to certain recipients during the period 1984 to 1986. The fact that the £22 million allocated in the 1992 budget has not featured in either the Social Welfare Bill or the Finance Bill that is currently before the House has caused great anxiety to thousands of women who have been waiting for payment for over six years.

I believe the Department of Social Welfare are unable to devise a scheme which will give every women concerned a chance to apply. I call on the Minister to state clearly the categories of women who are entitled to payment, the social welfare schemes involved and whether his Department have the necessary records either at local or national level to enable a decision to be made in each case. Finally, I ask him to state clearly when payments will commence and the section of his Department which will administer the scheme.

Minister for Social Welfare (Mr. McCreevy)

I am glad Deputy Connaughton is anxious to ensure that the retrospective payments are made speedily. However, it is about time the real facts which gave rise to the mess in which we now find ourselves were set out clearly. It is a pity the Deputy's party did not have similar concerns from 1982 onwards when they were in Government to implement the necessary provisions on time. Unfortunately they failed to do this.

Mr. Connaughton

Fianna Fáil have had ample time to rectify the problem since them.

Mr. McCreevy

The Fine Gael-Labour Coalition Government assumed office at the end of 1982 but did not enact the necessary legislation until July 1985.

Mr. Connaughton

Now the politics are starting.

An Ceann Comhairle

Please, Deputy.

Mr. McCreevy

They did not bring the provisions of the 1985 Act into force until May and November 1986——

Mr. Connaughton

Now the politics are starting.

Mr. McCreevy

——despite the fact that court proceedings arising from the delay were instituted by married women in January 1985. It is because of the failure of the Deputy's party to implement the provisions on time and the decision to defend the proceedings initiated by married women in January 1985 that we now have to deal with this problem.

It is scandalous that we have to allocate significant resources to meet retrospective payments which will amount to £22 million in the current year alone. The Exchequer would have saved money if the Deputy's party had implemented the necessary measures on time. Bearing in mind that they delayed implementing equal treatment for almost two years beyond the required deadline, Fine Gael's new-found concern for the entitlement of married women can only be described as amusing.

Mr. Connaughton

The Court of Justice——

Mr. McCreevy

These are the real facts which gave rise to the problem with which we now have to deal. I can assure Deputy Connaughton that the retrospective payments due to married women because of his party's inaction over a two-year period will be made in line with the decision announced in the budget.

The required legislation is already at a very advanced stage and I expect to be able to make the statutory instrument by the end of the month. The precise details of the package will be announced at that stage. As I have already stated in the House, the retrospective payments involved will be made on a phased basis over the period 1992 to 1994. Under the first phase, the increased rates of benefit and the extended duration of unemployment benefit will be paid this year. Payments in respect of increases for dependants and unemployment assistance will be made in two equal instalments in 1993 and 1994. Providing for equality of treatment in respect of the period of the delay has major administrative implications for my Department. Claims for retrospective payments will be processed in a new central unit which has already been set up in the Department. It is my intention that this new unit will become fully operational by the time the statutory instrument is made. This will ensure that potential beneficiaries will be able to make their claims once the details of the overall package are announced and that work on the processing of claims can be undertaken immediately.

Mr. McCormack

I raise the question of wandering horses and goats causing serious problems in Galway city. This problem is mainly concentrated in the Castlepark-Ballybane area which is located at the back of the new Corrib Great Southern Hotel, with which I am sure the Minister is familiar.

Approximately 20 years ago a pilot scheme of 22 houses was built in this area for travelling families. I believe this pilot scheme would have proved a great success if it had been given a chance to work. However, over the past few years a number of caravans have parked illegally in the area. The owners of those caravans have brought their goats and horses with them. The nuisance these animals are creating in the Castlepark-Ballybane area would have to be seen to be believed. These people have erected shanty-type buildings in which to house their horses. These animals are scaring the adults and children living in the area.

Galway Corporation have done their best to deal with this problem. Their record in housing itinerants and travelling people in the Galway area is second to none. They have provided four hard stands in the city and one on the outskirts, and have housed over 100 travelling families in the past few years. The corporation periodically gather up the horses and bring them to pounds. On one occasion five or six horses which had been brought to the pound in Portlaoise were back on the streets in the Castlepark area the next day having been released illegally. Even if these horses are not released illegally, an £18 fee will ensure their release, a sum which seems to be no problem to those people. If people want to come in to live in our city or to live illegally in caravans, they should conform to the way other people live in the city. There should not be one law for settled people and another law for travelling people. This problem should be seriously considered because it makes life intolerable for the people of Castlepark and Ballybane, whom I compliment on their restraint despite what they have had to put up with in the last ten years.

Mr. Flynn

At the outset, it is important that I outline to the House the extent of the responsibility of the Minister for Justice in relation to wandering animals, including horses. Primary responsibility for the impounding of wandering animals rests with the local authorities who maintain pounds for the purpose. The Garda are also authorised to impound wandering animals and to assist local authority officials responsible for the work. The Minister for Justice authorises the fees charged by local authorities for the use of their animal pounds. The Minister for Justice is also responsible for monitoring and, where necessary, updating the law on civil liability for damage caused by animals.

The law in relation to wandering animals was updated in recent years by the enactment of the Animals Act, 1985. That Act tackled the question of impounding in three ways: first, it give increased powers to the Garda and local authorities to impound animals; second, it improved the effectiveness of the impounding procedure by giving local authorities power to order the sale, disposal and destruction, where appropriate, of impounded animals and, third, it increased substantially the fines for turning animals loose, allowing them on the public road or for pound breaking. The 1985 Act also abolished the then immunity of occupiers of land adjoining the public road in relation to damage caused by animals straying from such lands onto the road. As a result, the ordinary laws of negligence now apply in such cases. Thanks to the Act local authorities and the Garda now have power to impound an animal wandering on the road, even where the owner is known. The authorities are also empowered to impound animals trespassing in public parks or other open spaces owned by a local or State authority.

I would like to turn to the local issue of wandering animals in Galway, as raised by the Deputy. Over the years there have been several incidents of wandering animals in Galway city. On all occasions the Garda have responded to requests for assistance from local residents and the local authority. I understand that the Garda authorities have dealt with numerous cases of wandering animals in the Hillside area of the city. My information is that the matter is at present under control. I can assure the House that where breaches of the law in this regard are detected or reported there will be an appropriate response from the Garda in Galway and in any other area in the jurisdiction.

Mr. McCormack

The position is out of control.

Mr. Flynn

Then the legislation should be used.

Mr. McCormack

I will talk to the Minister privately about the matter.

Mr. Rabbitte

The case I raise concerns an application for a visa to enter this country by an Iraqi national whose brother is an Irish citizen and whose family have suffered horribly under the Saddam Hussein regime. This person's father is dead, one brother was killed in the Iran-Iraq War after being conscripted, two other brothers were arrested by the secret police and have not been heard of since, and the fate of another brother is unknown. This person, Metham Muhssin, was forced to join the Iraqi army, deserted during the war as a result of leaflets dropped by the Americans and Saudis and gave himself up to the Americans. The leaflets assured him that he would be safe and treated as a guest in Saudi Arabia. Instead, he is now treated as a refugee and finds himself in a refugee camp.

This man's brother, residing in my constituency, is not permitted by the Saudis to visit him and he faces execution if he returns to Iraq. His brother is an Irish citizen with his own business in Ireland and he is prepared to give his brother employment and otherwise support him as necessary. I am appealing to the Minister on humanitarian grounds to reconsider the decision to refuse an entry visa in these especially tragic circumstances.

Finally, it is regrettable that the manner of dealing with this matter by the Department of Justice lacks sensitivity and compassion. The manner in which representations from the family have been received by the Department leaves a lot to be desired.

Mr. Flynn

In quick response to the last comment, I would be particularly interested to hear the detail of that last remark.

Mr. Rabbitte

I will provide that information.

Mr. Flynn

The position is that an application for a visa for Metham Sahib Muhssin was first made to my predecessor last year. The application was just one of a number of applications or visas in respect of people who are natives of Iraq and who have family or other connections with Ireland. Detailed consideration of the whole question of visas for those persons was given at the time by my predecessor. Having considered all aspects of the application, he decided to refuse to grant a visa in this particular case.

I have looked into the matter again with an open mind. I am satisfied that the original decision taken was the correct one and that it should stand. I am aware of all of the circumstances surrounding the application mentioned by the Deputy and I regret that I would not be justified in overturning the original decision.

It has been, and still is, the practice not to disclose the reason why particular visa applications are not granted. Generally speaking, this is the accepted international practice; so we are not alone in this regard. Accordingly, I am not in a position to explain my reasons for refusal in this case but I would conclude by saying that they are valid and justified. If the Deputy wishes to pursue the matter with me personally or if what I say seems to him inaccurate or not the full story, I shall be pleased to hear from him. I am also particularly anxious to know about the remarks he made concerning the treatment received by the applicant's friends or family.

Mr. Rabbitte

I shall give that information to the Minister.

The Dáil adjourned at 5.50 p.m. until 10.30 a.m. on Friday, 8 May 1992.