Gay Mitchell
Question:2 Mr. G. Mitchell asked the Minister for Justice the plans, if any, she has to take illegal drugs off the streets.
Ceisteanna — Questions. Oral Answers. - Sale of Illegal Drugs.
Tony Gregory
Question:5 Mr. Gregory asked the Minister for Justice her views on whether there has been a serious increase in the availability of heroin in Dublin city, and on whether this is now a major problem with open selling on city streets; and the steps, if any, she intends to take to deal with this problem.
I propose to take Priority Questions Nos. 2 and 5 together.
Several Deputies in this House — Deputies Gay Mitchell and Gregory being prominent amongst them — have on many occasions, voiced their concern concerning the problem of drugs, especially in Dublin city. I fully share their concern. I know they are talking on the basis of what they learn and what they see in their own constituencies and that they are speaking on behalf of the vast majority of law-abiding people in those constituencies who are very deeply worried and often quite frightened about the problem.
I am in the position, as Minister for Justice, of having to tackle the drugs problem. I regard it as a matter deserving the very highest priority. All we have to do is look at what is happening all over the western world to realise that one of the most serious threats to order within most societies is that posed by illegal drug use. It is a form of criminal activity which is highly organised and sophisticated on an international level. It is extremely difficult to control. Billions of pounds are made annually leaving behind a trail of broken lives, human misery and death.
As to the law and order response, I can assure the House that I have been devoting and will continue to devote more time to this problem as Minister for Justice than to most others.
I have met the Garda authorities on numerous occasions to discuss the matter, to ensure that they have what they need to tackle the problem, to assess whether new strategies — and what new strategies — may be called for, to consider responses made in other jurisdictions and so on. I will continue to do this and will continue to support whatever initiatives that they, in their professional judgment, deem best in order to cope with the situation.
I would simply draw attention to two matters. The first is that special units have been set up in areas of known drug activity which work closely with the Divisional Task Force and the local detective units. Secondly, and in my view, very importantly, a special task force has been established recently to combat the serious problem of drug abuse in the north inner city. This resulted directly from an unannounced visit by me to the area in question.
I will continue to stay in constant touch with the situation and in constant contact with the Garda to ensure that the situation is kept under control.
Before I conclude, I think I should say a word about heroin abuse in particular, because it is a subject which has been adverted to more than once by Deputy Gregory.
On 23 March 1993 in response to a parliamentary question I stated that more up-to-date provisional figures subsequently supplied to me by the Garda authorities indicated that the 1992 figures would be higher than previously anticipated and indicated by me on 17 February 1993. The reason for this was that the preliminary figures supplied to me in advance of my reply of 17 February did not include a substantial amount of heroin which was seized by the customs authorities in November 1992. Final figures for 1992 are now available. These show that there was a substantial increase in the amount of heroin seized in 1992 compared to 1991. Even though the 1991 figure was particularly low, being the second lowest level of heroin seized in the ten-year period 1983 to 1992, and even though 77 per cent of all drug seizures in this country are cannabis seizures, the 1992 heroin seizures indicate quite clearly that heroin abuse is a problem that needs to be carefully watched. I want to assure the House that I and the Garda authorities will be doing just that.
Is the Minister aware that the origin or source of all of these drugs is well established, for example, the golden crescent, places like Bolivia, Peru and Colombia, and that there are now indications that Colombia has moved from cocaine into heroin? When countries such as those are flooding the world with drugs, it is no wonder we have had the highest seizure of heroin on the streets since 1986, if the Garda statistics for 1992 are to be accepted. In that context will she agree there is need for a drugs enforcement agency, which would include the Garda, Customs and health authorities? Given that the source of these drugs is known, will the Minister agree there is need for a European drugs enforcement agency to take diplomatic action against those countries that continue to flood the world with these products?
In relation to the Deputy's first question about the establishment of an Irish drugs enforcement agency, he will be aware, as will other Members of the House, that recently I have been concerned about public reports that the level of co-operation between the two units charged with drug enforcement, the Garda and Customs, in the south-western part of the country has not been at the level it should be. As a result, I asked a senior official of my Department to undertake an investigation and I talked to the Garda Commissioner. A number of meetings have taken place between a senior official in my Department, the Customs section of the Department of Finance and the Garda Commissioner. Co-operation at that level is at its highest ever. The Garda and the Customs have two different functions. Customs must seize the product; the Garda want to get at the suppliers, the people who are causing misery among young people in particular. As a result of the preliminary investigation carried out I have been assured by the Customs authorities and by the Garda that the highest level of co-operation will continue to obtain in the enforcement area, particularly in the south-west.
As part of that investigation I have examined very seriously the possibility of setting up a drugs enforcement agency. While I might have personal views, obviously I must take into account the advice given by all of the people involved. I am examining that advice and hope to be in a position to take a definite decision shortly.
Regarding the establishment of a European drugs enforcement agency, Ministers for Justice in all of EC countries recently signed the EUROPOL Agreement. It is in recent years only that Ministers for Justice looked seriously at the threat posed by drug traffickers throughout the Community. People now realise that threat does not respect boundaries, that it travels from one country to anothere, whether part of mainland Europe or separated by sea. We have lodged a request with the EC, through the Department of Finance, for a substantial financial contribution by the European Community, on the basis that it is now a European problem. Money should be spent to support the drug enforcement agencies in the provision of equipment and resources.
Will the Minister accept that there must be something seriously wrong when she was told in February last by the Garda authorities there was no evidence to suggest any significant increase in the supply of heroin while the reality is that in 1992 the highest amount of heroin was seized since 1986 and heroin and other drugs are openly on sale in this city? Does the Minister accept that whole areas of this city are being subjected to intimidation by street gangs pushing drugs, that the drug treatment centres in those areas are being swamped by new addicts, that the problem is getting out of control? While accepting that the Minister has said the matter will receive the highest possible priority, will she accept that to date — and I mean up to this very day — it has not been accorded the highest possible priority? Will she outline the specific measures she is taking to deal with the problem?
Deputy Gregory made allegations in the House, probably on the last occasion on which we dealt with Justice questions, in relation to specific areas which he then brought to my attention personally where there was open drug dealing on the streets. As a result of that I made an unannounced visit to the areas in question. Having made that visit I spoke to the assistant commissioner of the Garda Síochána with responsibility for the Dublin Metropolitan Area and the superintendent in charge of that district. I voiced the concerns expressed in this House by Deputies Gregory and Gay Mitchell. I said I was unhappy that Members of the House, or indeed members of the public living in this area, felt that in some way the enforcement powers available to the Garda were not being used. As a result, a special task force was set up which now operates within the north inner city, the particular problem area Deputy Gregory brought to my attention. If Members know of other areas in the city where a similar attack on the problem could be brought to bear, I would appreciate it if they would bring them to my attention. No area within my deparmental responsibility receives greater attention from me than this because it constitutes the greatest challenge and problem facing not just the Garda authorities but other agencies.
A brief question from the two Deputies concerned. It is all the more important if I am to dispose of the remaining question and time is fast running out.
I will supply the Minister with the names of two locations before she leaves the House. Would the Minister agree that drugs are sold openly on the streets of Dublin and that there appears to be an attitude that this is acceptable in some areas whereas it is not acceptable in others?
Open dealing in drugs is not acceptable anywhere. It is not acceptable to the Garda Síochána or to Members of this House and it most definitely is not acceptable to me. I am glad the Deputy will supply me with names of areas where he feels this is happening.
I am calling Deputy Gregory for a brief question.
Does the Minister know or accept that 98 per cent of drug dealers, if not all of them, are known to the Garda and that the real problem is lack of resources — manpower resources, the technological surveillance equipment — to mount intensive operations to bring these people before the courts? Does the Minister accept that when they go before the courts many members of the Judiciary are totally out of touch with and do not realise the seriousness of the problem?
I deny the suggestion by Deputy Gregory that the Garda do not have the necessary resources — either manpower resources or technical surveillance equipment — to deal with this problem. The Garda authorities, from the Commissioner down, and most particularly the Assistant Commissioner dealing with the DMA, are aware of the highest priority that I as Minister for Justice have accorded to this. It is a matter for me to make policy in relation to the Garda Síochána and how they implement their drug enforcement powers. I have also told them there will be no shortage of financial resources to deal with this problem because we all agree it is of the utmost priority.
In relation to the courts, I cannot comment, as Deputy Gregory is well aware, on members of the Judiciary or on various decisions they may make. This issue has received enough publicity from the media for all members of the Judiciary to be aware of the concerns expressed not only by us in this House but by all members of the public and particularly those in Dublin city.
If Question No. 4 is responded to now I will hear it.