Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 21 Feb 1996

Vol. 461 No. 8

Johnstown Castle Agricultural College (Amendment) Bill, 1996 [ Seanad ]: Second and Subsequent Stages.

Minister for the Environment (Mr. Howlin)

I move "That the Bill be now read a Second Time."

I am pleased to bring this Bill before the House, following its passage last week in Seanad Éireann. It is a small but significant Bill, the primary purpose of which is to permit the Environmental Protection Agency to establish its permanent headquarters on a site at Johnstown Estate, Wexford. This estate is currently vested in Teagasc but, under existing legislation, a suitable site cannot be sold or leased to the Environmental Protection Agency. The Bill proposes to amend the legislation governing the use of the estate in order to give Teagasc the necessary powers to lease a site to the agency.

In association with the decentralisation programme announced in June 1991, the Government decided to locate the headquarters of the Environmental Protection Agency in Wexford. The possibility of using Johnstown Castle as the agency headquarters was considered by the Government but, following a detailed survey of the building by the Office of Public Works in 1993, it became clear that its internal dimensions would not accommodate the agency's requirements. The five directors of the agency and up to 80 staff will be based at headquarters, but the castle would only accommodate a maximum of 50 people. Having reviewed all the alternatives, the Government decided in June 1995 that new purpose-built accommodation on a site in Johnstown Estate was the best option.

Johnstown Estate is situated about four miles south west of Wexford town. It comprises the fine 19th century Gothic revival castle and a demesne of approximately 1,000 acres of land, including ornamental grounds, gardens, lakes and woodland. The estate, as we know it today, remained in private ownership up to 1944 when the then owners, Dorothy Violet Jefferies and Maurice Victor Larkin, made a gift of it to the nation. By any standards, this was a generous gift for which we are indebted to the donors and their family. The agreement under which the gift was accepted is incorporated in the Johnstown Castle Agricultural College Act, 1945. The property was to be used as a lay agricultural college; the ornamental nature of the gardens and pleasure ground were not to be altered; ornamental timber was not to be felled, and sporting rights and rights of way were reserved to the donors and their heirs.

In 1959, amending legislation was enacted to transfer ownership of the entire estate from the Minister for Agriculture to An Foras Talúntais and to extend its use as a lay agricultural college to include the conduct of agricultural research. The Johnstown Castle Agricultural College (Amendment) Act, 1959 also included a provision which precluded An Foras Talúntais from disposing of any part of the estate and introduced additional caveats regarding any proposed alteration, demolition or construction works in or around the castle. During the 1970s, it was recognised that this absolute statutory prohibition on any disposal had proved to be unduly restrictive and that no response could be made by An Foras Talúntais to locally desirable initiatives.

The Johnstown Castle Agricultural College (Amendment) Act, 1980 made provision for the disposal by An Foras Talúntais of a number of small, designated areas of land to meet requests from various local interests, including Wexford County Council. It also included a general provision for the leasing of part of the estate by the State. However, this general provision does not permit the leasing of a site to the Environmental Protection Agency nor can a valid sub-lease be provided from the State. Remaining areas from the land designated for disposal under the Act are not suitable for purposes of the agency headquarters.

In 1988, An Foras Talúntais was dissolved and Teagasc was established. Under the provisions of the Agriculture (Research, Training and Advice) Act, 1988, ownership of the Johnstown Estate transferred to Teagasc, subject to the same conditions of use and limitations on disposal. The estate is currently used by Teagasc as a research and development centre specialising in soils and environmental research. The environmental programme at Johnstown is concerned with the creation of a scientific and technical basis for good farm practice and is aimed at the protection and sustainable management of soil and water, two of our key natural resources. The work carried out by Teagasc at Johnstown and the functions of the Environmental Protection Agency will complement each other and confirm Johnstown as a centre of environmental and agricultural excellence.

This Bill is straightforward. It provides that the existing use of the estate may be extended to enable Teagasc to lease a site to the Environmental Protection Agency and to dispose of a limited area for use for environmental, heritage, amenity or recreational purposes. It also eases the restriction on Teagasc with regard to disposal of land under section 27 of the Agriculture (Research, Training and Advice) Act, 1988, to enable the extended uses to be undertaken. In preparing the legislation, the Attorney General has carefully considered the legal issues arising from the special status of Johnstown Estate and the special status afforded to it under various legislation since 1945. Both original donors are now dead, but I have notified the legal representatives of their heirs of the Government's proposals.

I wish to confirm to the House that the rights reserved to the donors in perpetuity in the original agreement, that is, the sporting rights and rights-of-way, have been recognised from the outset in preparing my proposals. These rights, and the additional caveats to which I referred, will be respected by Teagasc in any proposed sale or lease of part of the estate under the provisions of the Bill. I have assured the legal representatives of the donors' heirs that they will be consulted in appropriate cases.

Johnstown Estate is a prestigious and impressive setting and the unspoilt beauty and quality of its grounds is the epitome of environmental excellence. Location of the Environmental Protection Agency headquarters there will underpin the status and visibility of the agency as the guardian of our environment. The enactment of the Environmental Protection Agency Act, 1992, and the establishment of the agency in July 1993 are widely recognised as milestones in the development of our environmental management and protection capabilities.

A progressive build-up of its resources has ensured that after two and a half years in existence, it is fully operational in terms of the range of functions assigned to it under the 1992 Act. This year, the agency's overall budget will be almost £8 million. It will intensify its integrated pollution control licensing function, publish its first comprehensive state of the environment report and take on substantial new functions under the Waste Management Bill, when enacted. In addition, the agency is increasingly active in the monitoring of environmental quality, advising on environmental issues and sound practices, co-ordination of environmental research and supervision of the performance by local authorities of their environmental protection functions.

There are now regional environmental units of the Environmental Protection Agency in Castlebar, Cork, Dublin, Kilkenny and Monaghan, it is time to reinforce the overall development of the organisation by establishing prestigious permanent headquarters in Wexford. There is a strong association between the county and the agency, which has operated from temporary accommodation in Ardcavan, just outside Wexford town, since 1994, and I am satisfied this Bill will enable the right decision on the agency's permanent location to be implemented.

I am taking the opportunity presented by the Bill to propose a new provision to ease the statutory prohibition on the disposal of any part of the estate which was introduced in 1959. The limited disposal provision which was made in the 1980 amendment Act worked well in terms of a number of specific initiatives and requirements which were known when that legislation was drafted. However, other than by way of lease to the State, the existing provisions lack flexibility as was seen over time. There is no basis upon which Teagasc can accommodate locally desirable activities and proposals, which could bring the estate into a beneficial relationship with the local community. Teagasc has received requests from local interest groups — this will be known to the Deputy opposite — for some limited access to land in Johnstown, which would have broad public support in the locality, but, under existing legislation, it has had no option but to refuse.

To overcome this, a modest, more general disposal provision has been included in the Bill. This is purely an enabling measure and it will be a matter for Teagasc to determine individual cases. Disposals under the proposed provision will be restricted to environmental, heritage, recreational or amenity uses, and subject to an overall threshold of 5 per cent of the area of the estate at the commencement of the legislation. In addition to these specific conditions, Teagasc is required, under the Agriculture (Research, Training and Advice) Act, 1988, to obtain the approval of the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry for all disposals of land. This requirement will apply to any disposals at Johnstown under the provision now proposed.

The significance of the Bill should not be judged by its limited size. Its enactment is an important step in finalising the operational framework of one of the State's most important structures, the Environmental Protection Agency. The agency is entrusted with the protection of our natural environment, not only for our benefit, but for the benefit of future generations, and it is now widely recognised as one of our most important national bodies. As such, the House will agree with the provisions of the Bill which will provide suitable headquarters accommodation in the appropriate setting for the agency.

Enactment of the Bill is also important for Johnstown Estate and the people of Wexford. The existing and proposed new uses will complement each other and the enhanced use of the estate in the key areas of agricultural development and environmental protection will elevate the already high standing of Johnstown, both locally, nationally and internationally. I heartily commend the Bill to the House.

Mr. H. Byrne

I am delighted to contribute on what must be regarded as a happy day for County Wexford. It is interesting and coincidental that my constituency colleague is delivering the good news. Like everybody in County Wexford and beyond, I heartily welcome the Bill for the many reasons mentioned by the Minister.

The siting of the Environment Protection Agency in Johnstown Castle is not a coincidence for the many reasons outlined and others I will mention. Johnstown Castle and its grounds are beautiful and, without repeating the points made by the Minister, one would have to travel far to find a castle and grounds more beautiful. I also commend the owners, Dorothy Violet Jefferies and Maurice Victor Lakin, for their gift to the nation in the 1940s. I like to think their aims at that time have been achieved and that the Department has never gone overboard.

In common with my colleague. Deputy Browne, I welcome the Environmental Protection Agency to County Wexford. It is not a coincidence that it has remained in the county and will move to Johnstown Estate where it should have been sited in the first place. The suggestion at the time was that it should move to the castle but the cost of refurbishing it was approximately £5 million. This may not be an accurate figure, but it would not be much less and this would deter any Department from making an immediate move to it. The best possible use of the castle is as a tourist attraction. Under the agreement it was stipulated that the grounds would not be altered and would be maintained and I am happy to say that is the case. Each year approximately 1.5 million tourists pass by the gates of Johnstown Castle on the way to their destination but it has never been sold as a tourist attraction. Perhaps it should be.

I commend the Environmental Protection Agency for the work it has done to date and there is no finer place to continue this work than Johnstown Castle. Teagasc staff have been engaged in environmental research work and Marie Sherwood, a person before her time, has done absolutely wonderful work under Tom Walsh, Pierce Ryan and John Lee. Many people work in Johnstown Castle, including the Minister's brother who is now Mayor of Wexford.

Miss Quill

They have it all sewn up.

Mr. H. Byrne

The Minister cannot claim credit for getting him the job because he has been working there for quite some time. They do wonderful work at Johnstown Castle and as a farmer I have learned a great deal about soil tests. The proposed activities are complementary to the work already carried out and it is no coincidence that Johnstown Castle will house the Environmental Protection Agency.

The Bill was passed by the Seanad and I know it will have the full support of this side of the House. I too am anxious that the Environmental Protection Agency is established in Johnstown Castle as soon as possible. This will bring additional permanent employment to the area, which is most welcome. I am glad also that under the decentralisation programme officials from the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry will move to Wexford.

As the Johnstown Estate is so beautiful it is essential that any new buildings are in keeping with the grounds and the castle. Often the aesthetics are forgotten. When An Foras Talúntais was established in Johnstown Castle the same care was not taken with the building as I would have expected. It will, of course, cost a little extra but I ask the Minister to ensure that these buildings not alone complement the site but enhance it.

Great efforts are made to promote the heritage of County Wexford and Johnstown Castle should play a major role in that. Will the Minister take a more active role in the refurbishment of the castle? I accept that it will not all be done at one time but organisations in County Wexford are restoring other buildings and we could take a leaf out of their book as to how this might be achieved. The Department of the Environment and the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry should not be expected to pay the full cost of refurbishment of £5 million but work could be carried out on a phased basis with the support of voluntary bodies such as WORD — the Wexford Organisation for Rural Development — which is located near Johnstown Castle.

Tourism is essential to County Wexford because of the decline in agricultural employment. It has been said that 80 per cent of the country's heritage is in County Wexford and 80 per cent of Wexford's heritage is in South Wexford. Heritage is being taken very seriously. Hook lighthouse dating from the 14th century is the oldest in Europe and one of the four oldest in the world. It has been handed over to the local community and from April this year people will be able to go to the top of the lighthouse. One could not do this heretofore. The original tower dates from the 11th to the 14th century and prior to that monks lit bush fires there to warn ships. This is linked to the heritage of Johnstown Castle.

Provision is made in the Bill to allow part of the estate to be sold on to local interests. I too have been contacted by St. Martin's GAA club. The club does a good job — George O'Connor is a household name in County Wexford and in Ireland — and most of the people involved in it work in Johnstown Castle. I commend the Minister for making provision in the Bill to accommodate the wishes of local people.

The Opposition is expected to criticise the Government's proposed legislation but I have no criticism of this Bill. Will the Minister ensure that the buildings put in place to accommodate the Environmental Protection Agency will enhance the grounds and the buildings in the Johnstown Estate?

Miss Quill

This is simple, but highly significant enabling legislation to which for a number of reasons, my party and I give full and unqualified support. In locating the national headquarters of the Environmental Protection Agency outside the capital city, in County Wexford, the Minister is endorsing the principle of decentralisation which I support. For this reason alone he should be commended and applauded.

I agree with the previous speaker that Johnstown Castle is a suitable location for the headquarters of such a prestigious body. The agency has been of importance since its inception because of the tasks entrusted to it under the Act. Additional duties will be placed on it under the provisions of the waste management legislation. As it is the primary custodian of our natural environment, it is of fundamental importance that its headquarters be located in such a prestigious location as Johnstown Castle.

Listening to the dialogue across the floor between the two Deputies from Wexford I felt I was only an eavesdropper and was expecting it to be put to the music of "The Boys of Wexford" at any moment. I do not, however, consider myself to be an outsider so far as this matter is concerned. The Act under which the agency was established was steered through the House by the leader of my party, Deputy Mary Harney. While no member of my party had the unique privilege of being born in County Wexford we can claim credit for putting the legislation in place. In this connection Deputy Harney identified Johnstown Castle as a suitable location for the national headquarters of the agency.

I wish to express the gratitude of the people to the donors who left a significant gift to the nation. I have never visited the castle, but I am happy to hear that it is being well looked after both in law and practice. I support the request by Deputy Byrne that the architecture of the new purpose built building should not alone complement, but enhance, the existing buildings and add to the overall atmosphere of what appears to be a beautiful demesne. The Minister is well positioned to ensure this.

I also wish to express my appreciation of the work being done by the agency. While I acknowledge that it has a budget of £8 million this year the Minister should be constantly aware of the need to provide adequate and sufficient resources to enable it carry out all its functions fully. A range of additional functions will be placed on it under the Waste Management Bill. If the provisions of that legislation are to be implemented in full, it is of fundamental importance that the agency be adequately resourced to enable it carry out its duties in overseeing its objectives. That should be the primary objective not alone of the Minister but of successive Ministers. The agency is one of the most important public bodies to be established in my lifetime.

Currently, the agency has five regional units. This should be welcomed. The fact that we locate the national headquarters of a body outside the capital city does not necessarily mean that there is no scope for further decentralisation. I am glad that is happening in this case.

I am particularly pleased that a unit of the agency is located in Cork which has a mixed history of controversy in regard to economic development on the one hand and the preservation and protection of the environment on the other. It was a source of reassurance to those who were concerned about the environment to know that there was a unit of the agency in the area. This enabled further economic development to take place, once an assurance was given that it would not impinge on the quality of the environment, particularly air quality.

It is a happy coincidence that Teagasc and the Environmental Protection Agency will be located side by side, cheek by jowl. Teagasc plays an important role in providing information to the agricultural community. People have concerns and anxieties, particularly about water quality. In this connection Teagasc has provided good and solid advice to the agricultural community on best practice to ensure water quality is not endangered by agricultural practices. Teagasc and the Environmental Protection Agency are key Government agencies involved in environmental protection.

I give the Bill my unstinting approval and hope that it will pass through the House quickly. There is no legitimate reason for delaying its passage. The Minister can then proceed to provide for the relocation of the Environmental Protection Agency in Johnstown Castle.

Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry (Mr. Yates)

I commend the Minister for the Environment, Deputy Howlin, for ensuring that his Department would be in a position to introduce this legislation expeditiously. Considerable background work has been done in providing the legal basis for the utilisation in the public interest of the land at Johnstown Castle. Discussions have taken place with the Office of the Attorney General, departmental officials, the local authorities and many interested groups. I pay tribute to all concerned.

I am delighted to see Johnstown Castle becoming the focus of attention for major investment. The primary purpose of the Bill, as outlined by the Minister for the Environment, is to make provision for the Environmental Protection Agency to establish its permanent headquarters in Johnstown Castle. I welcome this provision. I also welcome the provision whereby Teagasc may dispose of part of the estate, not exceeding 5 per cent of the land comprised therein, for environmental, heritage, recreational or amenity uses. This is an important provision as Teagasc has during the years received requests from local interests for limited access to land in Johnstown. In addition to these specific conditions, under the Agriculture (Research, Training and Advice) Act, 1988, Teagasc is required to obtain my approval for all land disposals. This requirement will apply to disposals at Johnstown under the provision proposed in this amending Bill.

Johnstown Castle Estate will become the focus of attention with the establishment of the headquarters of the Environmental Protection Agency. A total of 350 staff from the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry will decentralise to Johnstown Castle in the summer of 1998. The Government made this decision last year and I am pleased to inform the House that this project is continuing apace. A site has been selected in Johnstown Castle Estate and the necessary tendering and planning process is under way. The Minister for the Environment, Deputy Howlin, and I met on the site last Saturday and I thank officials from the Office of Public Works, my Department and those managing the estate who attended at rather unsocial hours to select a suitable site. I am pleased we have short-circuited this process and an excellent 17 acre field site facing the lake and St. Martin's GAA club has been selected. It has all the necessary facets. It will have a separate independent access for the staff of the Department, spacious car parking facilities and will not interfere with the tourism aspects of the museum or castle. At the same time, it is ideally located to be part of the central campus. It is within walking distance of the castle and its beautiful and important features. The Minister, Deputy Howlin, and I are anxious that a campus-type development is put in place because between Teagasc, the Environmental Protection Agency and the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry the number of staff involved will be almost 500, one of the largest decentralisation units. This is a terrific example of the Government's commitment to decentralisation. Up to now Wexford was somewhat neglected in terms of the decentralisation programme. I thank officials for their help in selecting the site.

The technical phases will be dealt with next. This will mean assessment for drainage, discussions on a planning process with the local authority and so on. The Department's staff is due to move in autumn 1998. We have set out a provisional timetable for the design stage, the selection of tenders and construction phase which will suit staff relocation requirements. We have a blueprint in skeletal form which I hope our officials will be able to implement.

In accordance with the Johnstown Castle Agricultural College (Amendment) Act, 1980, from time to time land may be leased by Teagasc to the State. This provision will enable the Office of Public Works to proceed with the provision of purpose built accommodation for the 350 civil servants concerned.

Areas selected as locations for decentralisation benefit greatly from the programme. The local economy of Wexford and neighbouring towns and villages, such as Piercetown, Murntown, Rosslare, New Ross, Enniscorthy, Blackwater and so on will receive a considerable economic boost from the injection of 430 salaries, that is the wages of the 350 plus 80 staff that will be involved. It will have major spin-of effects for local business, shopkeepers, house builders and so on, but the benefits are not confined to economics.

Mr. Howlin

We are a great Government.

Mr. H. Byrne

There will be no votes left for us.

Mr. Yates

That goes without saying. There are also important social effects which will impact on the region. The influx of 350 people to an area will play an important role in the regeneration of the area and will contribute in no small way to the future development and vitality of the county. The McCarthy Cup could end up in Wexford as a result of this development.

Mr. H. Byrne

The sooner the better, perhaps it might also bring a few hurlers.

Mr. Yates

I will not claim that decentralisation to Johnstown Castle will guarantee that, given the efforts in that connection for umpteen years.

Mr. Browne

(Wexford): As the Minister is making claims about everything else, he may as well make one about that.

Mr. Yates

I am proud to be a member of a Government which selected Wexford as a location for decentralisation. As a rural Deputy I cannot place enough emphasis on the importance of the decentralisation programme. It gives a substantial number of people an opportunity to return permanently to their local areas. It also helps maintain and expand employment in the building industry, both in private housing and public buildings.

Implementation of the transfer to Johnstown Castle will mean that more than 82 per cent of the staff of the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry will be located outside Dublin. The bulk of the Department is already decentralised. Three-quarters of the Department's staff are already situated in some 30 locations throughout the country. Those offices provide a comprehensive range of services to farmers. Through the Charter of Rights for Farmers we are providing 27 district livestock and veterinary offices. I am confident this further decentralisation will not diminish the quality of service to farmers and industry. It will represent an opportunity for change within the Department which will involve reviewing and improving our methods of dealing with farmers, upgrading technology and seeking better ways of carrying out the many functions of the Department.

Following the Government's decision to decentralise 350 staff to Johnstown Castle, an initial survey of all officers in the Department was undertaken to ascertain the level of interest among staff in relocating to Wexford. Some 130 officers expressed an interest in transferring in their current grades. To achieve the Government's announced target of 350, I intend to request my colleague, the Minister for Finance, to issue a circular seeking further volunteers from other Government Departments and I am confident of a successful response. However, if the target is not met it may be necessary to arrange promotional competitions or to recruit direct through the Civil Service Commission to fill the remaining positions. A further number of people in my Department indicated they would be interested in moving to Wexford under those circumstances. I am confident that with the assistance of the Minister for Finance, the co-operation of staff and trade union agreement we will achieve our target in the time set out.

Johnstown Castle is approximately four miles from Wexford town. It comprises a fine 19th century gothic revival castle and a demesne of approximately 1,000 acres of land which includes ornamental grounds, gardens, lakes and woodland. The estate remained in private ownership until 1944 when the owners, Dorothy Violet Jefferies and Maurice Victor Larkin, made a gift of it to the nation. The nation will be always grateful for this generous gift which has been put to good use. In that regard credit is due to all political parties. In 1945 we lacked educational facilities for the agricultural community. Great progress has been made since then through the work of dedicated people in Johnstown Castle. That castle is an extremely valuable asset and 50 years later the wide and courageous programme of research and development undertaken at Johnstown stands as a monument to all those dedicated people, particularly the donors who had a vision for the estate.

The research programme is ongoing at Johnstown Castle through Teagasc and has rapidly developed as a world renowned soils research centre. In recent years it developed a strong environmental research programme, designed to ensure that modern farming developments are compatible with high standards of environmental care. It would be difficult to imagine a more suitable setting for this work and the location of the Environmental Protection Agency on the campus adds a further dimension. Each of the two institutions will gain from the presence of the other and together they will help create a strong focus on the scientific and environmental expertise.

The strategic goal of Teagasc Johnstown Castle Soils and Environmental Research Centre is to generate information that will enable preparation of codes of good practice for all aspects of farming to ensure that agriculture will not cause pollution of soil, water and air and a basis for cost effective fertiliser and trace element usage for crop and animal production. The programme of work at the centre encompasses sustainable farming systems, environmental impact of nitrogen, waste management, land use management, soil fertility and analytical services on a nation-wide basis.

Johnstown Castle Estate is also a major tourist attraction and more than 30,000 people visit the grounds every year. Twenty years ago the Irish Agricultural Museum was founded and registered as a non-trading co-operative. The general rules of the co-op were expanded to cover the specialised objective of an agricultural museum. This type of basic organisation was considered appropriate in a country where so many agricultural activities are cooperatively organised. The setting up of an organisation independent of the institute was deemed necessary for the rapid development of the museum and it enabled it to receive grant moneys which might otherwise have been denied it. I hope the Teagasc commemoration of the Famine will be displayed permanently in this museum. It may go on tour for a while and there was a reference to displaying it in the National Museum and Collins Barracks. Given that it has 30,000 visitors Johnstown Agricultural Museum is the fitting home for this commemoration. I am involved in discussions with interested parties to ensure this happens and I hope my officials can fully honour that commitment.

The museum, which was opened in June 1979 by President Hillery, is located in the old farmyard building complex within the ornamental grounds of the castle estate. It covers a timespan from the 1600s up to the last generation. This is being done by way of an informal arrangement with the heritage park at Ferrycarrig which focuses on earlier times. The museum contains the largest collection of restored farm tools, machines and house furnishings in the country. The display areas have been converted and restored from derelict farm buildings and the entire complex on display is a credit to all the dedicated staff and those people who lent and donated items to the museum.

Johnstown Castle, which is now the focus of attention, will be a hive of activity in the future. Enactment of the Bill will enable the Environmental Protection Agency to build on the Johnstown Castle estate and this, with the decentralisation of 350 staff from my Department, will enhance the standing of Johnstown locally, nationally and internationally. I am confident that the two projects will have shared facilities in many areas during and after construction of the buildings. County Wexford and the south east will benefit from these developments and I am satisfied that Wexford people will extend a warm and hearty welcome to all concerned.

Concern has been expressed within my Department about the decision to move out of Agriculture House and to relocate the offices in Dublin and Wexford. Senior management in the Department and I are anxious to ensure that there is minimum disruption and we have reached agreement with the Office of Public Works on sites in Dublin which will facilitate interaction with other Departments and the Parliament and retain as far as possible the homogenous working of the Department. I hope any difficulties can be dealt with satisfactorily through dialogue with the appropriate unions.

I congratulate the Minister for the Environment on the introduction of the Bill and thank him for his assistance in earmarking the site and ensuring that problems in regard to infrastructure etc., will be dealt with in co-operation with the local authorities. Many opportunities exist for a slip between cup and lip but the decision has been taken by the Government and the timeframe is set in stone. We are now seeking the co-operation of all officials to move ahead.

This will be the single biggest economic development in the history of County Wexford. By the turn of the century we will be talking about a permanent public facility which can generate £10 million in wages per annum and maintain ancillary services such as security guards, canteen facilities, etc. People as far away as Enniscorthy and New Ross will benefit from this development, the significance of which will only be seen in retrospect, as happened in the case of many of the developments put in place by Neil Blaney.

I hope these proposals will receive the support of everyone.

Mr. H. Byrne

We will build a monument to the Minister.

Mr. Yates

Tragically, we were neglected in the past but now that it has three Ministers the model county is getting its just deserts. I look forward to the support of my Oireachtas colleagues from Wexford for this development. I hope the legislation can be enacted within a few days so that the development can be proceeded with.

Mr. Browne

(Wexford): I welcome the introduction of the Bill and the proposed developments in Johnstown Castle. As usual, the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry, Deputy Yates, proclaimed himself as the saviour of County Wexford. However, this kind of statement is now wearing this among the public, particularly farmers, in that county.

It is obvious that the Minister for the Environment put much work into the preparation of the Bill. When I was in the Department in July 1993 I was very involved in setting up the Environmental Protection Agency on a temporary basis in Ardcavan. At that time it was intended to locate the Environmental Protection Agency in Johnstown Castle but in view of the exorbitant costs involved in renovating the castle the Cabinet decided not to proceed with the proposal. I discussed the matter on numerous occasions with the Minister. Deputy Howlin, who was also at the Cabinet table at that time in an effort to ensure that the Environmental Protection Agency would be located in Wexford. Some members of Fianna Fáil and Labour believed that the agency should be located in Dublin while many Fine Gael Deputies, including Deputy Barry, believed it should be located in Cork. Thankfully, it was eventually decided to locate the agency in Wexford.

As an independent body and custodian of the environment, the Environmental Protection Agency must have the confidence of the public. The fact that it has been able to achieve this in such a short time is due to the decision of the previous Government and this Government to allocate substantial funding to it. There was little point in setting up the agency if adequate finance was not made available. A significant number of staff are employed in Wexford while the five regional centres play a major part in the protection and enhancement of the environment.

Johnstown Castle has always been dear to the hearts of Wexford people and those involved in the agricultural industry. The late Dr. Tom Walsh pioneered agricultural research and development in the estate long before it was popular. Johnstown Castle, which is in the heart of agricultural Wexford, has played a significant role in the development of agriculture and it is only correct that the Environmental Protection Agency and the proposed developments should be located there permanently.

All too often in the past new developments took a long time to come on stream. However, the Office of Public Works, the Department of the Environment and the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry have clearly given priority to the new buildings. It is important that they fit in with the castle and the existing buildings. Johnstown Castle is a major tourism centre but it has not been fully exploited from the point of view of the tourism industry. The castle should be developed even further and I am sure the Ministers, Deputy Howlin and Deputy Yates, will ensure further tourism growth there. It was suggested some years ago that the castle should be developed as a rural heritage and tourism centre. The Office of Public Works looked into that possibility at one stage and it should be reconsidered. Perhaps the Minister could think about the further development of the castle. The attractions include the castle itself, the grounds and the lakes. There are currently 30,000 visitors a year and we should build on that tourism potential, not alone for Wexford but for the south-east region. We should ensure it is exploited to its full extent. The local authorities in Wexford have developed the heritage park, the Westgate heritage centre and other amenities. If the castle was blended into those developments it could become part of a tourist trail which could be expanded and encourage many more visitors to the south east. Currently 1 million people per year come through Rosslare, going to the west, the south and other areas. We need something to hold them for a night or two in Wexford. If the castle was developed along the lines of Bunratty we could keep them in Wexford for an extra few days to spend their money.

I am glad that for other purposes the Minister has included the development of the lands at Johnstown Castle. Like Deputy Byrne and himself. I was approached last year by St. Martin's GAA club and it is important that such community groups should be considered for extra land should it become available. That club has pioneered many ventures for young people, not alone in hurling and football but other sports, a community centre and further facilities. It needs extra lands for playing pitches. When the Bill passes, discussions can take place between the Department of the Environment, the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry and the club to ensure it is facilited as much as possible in land development.

It was important that the Minister, Deputy Yates, clarified the staffing of the new development. Many people working in Dublin in other Departments are under the impression they cannot go to Johnstown Castle. It should be spelled out that people in the Department of the Environment, the Department of Social Welfare and other Departments, especially those from Wexford, have the opportunity to apply and be selected to go to Wexford. The Minister will not get the numbers from the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry. Those from the south east, Wexford in particular, should be given a chance to return home.

When the Minister announced the plans for the castle and the transfer of the Department I welcomed them because any development of that magnitude has to be good for the overall economy of the county. It will generate extra expenditure in Wexford town and other towns in the hinterland. People will also be looking for houses. I am glad the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry is coming to Wexford and the Environmental Protection Agency will be centred on a permanent basis in Johnstown Castle. It is the pioneering centre of agricultural development and, having expanded into specific environmental areas, the Environmental Protection Agency will supplement and complement that development.

I welcome the Bill and hope it will be passed as quickly as possible. The Environmental Protection Agency and the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry will be building new offices at Johnstown Castle and I am sure both Ministers will insist that they blend in with the castle and other existing buildings. The Minister said it would be ready for opening in 1998.

Mr. Yates

A lot of sod will be turned by then. It will be well rotovated.

Mr. Browne

(Wexford): I am sure by that time Fianna Fáil will be back in Government and Deputy Byrne, as Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry, will have the opportunity to open the new buildings at Johnstown Castle.

Mr. H. Byrne

I will invite everyone.

Mr. Browne

(Wexford): Whatever about Deputy Howlin still being Minister, I doubt that Deputy Yates will be around to open it.

Mr. Browne

(Carlow-Kilkenny): Cuirim fáilte roimh an mBille seo ach caithfidh mé a rá i ndáiríre go gcuirfinn fáilte i gcealladh roimhe dá mbeadh an t-athrú seo ag teacht go Ceatharlach. Tá áit iontach againn i gCeatharlach freisin, Oakpark House, ina bhfuil taighde ar súil. Is áit deas é agus ba chóir go mbeadh chuid do Roinn éigin ag teacht go Ceatharlach. Tá súil agam go mbeadh “lá eile ag an bPaorach” agus béidh mé ag caint — leis an tAire ag éisteacht — chun é a thabhairt seans dúinn méidú i gCeatharlach.

Mr. Browne

(Wexford): We will invite Deputy Browne to Wexford.

Mr. Browne

(Carlow-Kilkenny): I do not want to go to Wexford for the cutting of the sods, I want it to be in Carlow.

Mr. H. Byrne

The Deputy's óráid as Gaeilge could be misconstrued.

Mr. Browne

(Carlow-Kilkenny): Perhaps the real John Browne will be a Minister at that stage and it would be a pleasure for me to turn the first sod. This is an important Bill for Wexford. I am here wearing the wrong jersey——

Minister for the Environment (Mr. Howlin)

The Deputy is a neighbour's child.

Mr. Browne

(Carlow-Kilkenny):—— as there are four Wexford Members in the House praising their county's success. I admit to some jealousy.

Mr. Howlin

The Deputy would not begrudge us.

Mr. Browne

(Carlow-Kilkenny): No, but I was worried when my colleague. the Minister, Deputy Yates, said there were three Ministers in Wexford; I thought he was going to say they would take everything they could. I had less hope for Carlow at that point but he stopped in time. I can share in the joy all Wexford Deputies experience because the Environmental Protection Agency is going to this marvellous facility. Nevertheless, it is with a certain amount of jealousy that I congratulate them and wish them well. Deputy Byrne said it was normal for the Opposition to oppose and criticise but he would not and Deputy Quill was fulsome in her praise for the Bill. It would be awful if I continued to worry about Carlow and not give the Bill the welcome it deserved.

Mr. Howlin

Other things go to Carlow.

Mr. Browne

(Carlow-Kilkenny): Very few. However, it has a direct train line and with the new by-pass it is only an hour from Dublin. Some drivers can get there in less than an hour although I am not one of them. It is safer to get there in just over an hour than have a problem. Carlow has a regional college, a swimming pool, Dr. Cullen Park, the rugby grounds and many other marvellous facilities.

Mr. H. Byrne

Do not forget Éire Óg.

Mr. Browne

(Carlow-Kilkenny): I hope Éire Óg will win the All-Ireland Club Championship on St. Patrick's Day. It would be no trouble to get people to come to Carlow. Oakpark research station is set in a lovely old house, with a similar history to Wexford. I am serious about bringing some section of Government to Carlow. I thought the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry might come. Unfortunately it has gone to the next county but we hope for the future.

This is important legislation because the Environmental Protection Agency should have proper facilities and a new building. For the sake of everyone, the best brains must be involved in the agency, they must have the best facilities and they should work in a nice environment. I have to admit Johnstown Castle is a lovely building in nice surroundings and anyone who is lucky enough to work there should live to a ripe old age, even after retirement. I was fascinated by the Minister's account of the history of Johnstown Castle and his description of the estate which comprises 1,000 acres including ornamental grounds etc. For many years it was undisturbed. Then, probably to take account of changing times, an Act was introduced in 1945 followed by other Acts in1959, 1980 and 1988. Now, in 1996, we have another.

Change is part and parcel of life, and this Bill is to meet the need to set up the Environmental Protection Agency at Johnstown Castle. The 1945 Act provided that the property was to be used as an agricultural college; the ornamental nature of the gardens and pleasure grounds were to be left as they were, and ornamental timber was not to be felled. One might have thought that in 1945 people would have taken the attitude that timber was there to be used, but credit is due to the legislators at the time who saw in advance the need to protect this beautiful demesne and provided for the preservation of the timber, sporting rights and rights of way.

An Foras Talúntais acquired Johnstown Castle in 1959. Permission had to be given for some of the land to be sold off. I note the present plan includes an amendment to allow the sale of certain parts. The representatives of football clubs in the area will arrive at politicians clinics in droves looking for a bit of land. It is as well that there is a 5 per cent limit on the amount that can be given away. Otherwise there would be applications to build all sorts of sports arenas and even, eventually, an Olympic stadium.

Mr. H. Byrne

If Deputy Gay Mitchell lived there, there probably would be.

Mr. Browne

(Carlow-Kilkenny): It is a pity he does not have facilities like these because he would use them well.

It is important that agencies like the Environmental Protection Agency should be decentralised, although some people complain that too many Departments are leaving Dublin — I am sure the civil servants who have set up home here would prefer to stay here. However, it is far better that independent sections of Departments should be located in the country where people can see that the people working in them are normal, rather than thinking that everybody in Dublin or in the Civil Service is out to touch with reality. Because people working in the Environmental Protection Agency at Johnstown Castle will be very much in touch with nature and their surroundings, they will know exactly what should be done. There is not enough decentralisation. That is why I said earlier that Carlow, which is so convenient to Dublin and has such modern facilities, should be seriously considered in the context of decentralisation, and that is something for which I will lobby.

It is important that the Bill provides for the transfer of land. The politicians must have had a great night when they arrived at unsocial hours, even after pub closing time, to mark out the site — I hope they were all perfectly sober when they marked out the site and they picked a spot that will afford a perfect view to everybody working there.

There is not much more one can say on the Bill without reading what has been said by many others. I genuinely welcome the Bill and congratulate the people of Wexford on this marvellous facility which will continue to expand. I welcome the setting up of the Environmental Protection Agency in a place as pleasant as this and wish every success to those who will work there. It is important from the nation's point of view to have the best facility available and to have the best brains available to run it.

Minister for the Environment (Mr. Howlin)

I thank all Deputies who contributed to the debate, particularly my Wexford colleagues. There is enthusiasm throughout the House for the Environmental Protection Agency, the concept for which took a long time to formulate. A very detailed Bill establishing the agency passed thorugh this House some years ago. The agency is now up and running as an important engine for environmental protection, and I am delighted to be in a position, as Minister for the Environment with responsibility for environmental protection, to propose such a beautiful, prestigious location for the permanent headquarters of this significant agency. That it is in my constituency makes it of double benefit to me. I cannot claim credit for the initial idea because I was not Minister for the Environment at the time it was suggested, but I will certainly claim credit for holding it at that location when others wanted to move it. It will be to the benefit of all concerned, those who work in the agency and those who visit our country to see the agency, that it is not in a building in the middle of a congested city but in a pristine beautiful environment that will inspire anyone who works there or visits.

Many comments have been made with which I will deal briefly. The future of the castle was mentioned by Deputy Hugh Byrne. It is an important issue. The agency will be on site in the demesne but not in the castle. The castle, historic buildings, and ornamental grounds will be untouched by this development or by the development proposed for the decentralisation of the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry. It is most important that that beautiful facility kept intact for the last 50 years remains so. That is my intention and the intention of this legislation.

For the information of the House the site immediately behind the existing car park has been chosen. It will look onto a lovely open area directly opposite the castle but sufficiently secluded from the castle not to impact on it. The building will also be constructed so as not to detract from the beautiful built environment currently in Johnstown. The location, heights etc, have been carefully taken into account.

A great deal of work went into the preparation of this short Bill not only in the context of consultations but also in the context of the legal advice, because I was aware there had been a number of Bills that amended the uses of this estate. It will be some time before there will be a requirement for a future Bill. Not only does this Bill provide a facility for the Environmental Protection Agency, it contains an enabling provision for the disposal of up to 5 per cent of the estate generally for other purposes. Future needs should, therefore, be accommodated without having to have recourse to further legislation. I am delighted that, with the help of the legal terms in the Attorney General's office I was able to do in this Bill what was not possible previously.

In terms of the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry and its decentralisation, my colleague, the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry, has given a detailed outline of that. I look forward to four or five years from now when up to 600 people will work on the Johnstown site. It will be a magnificent campus. I make no secret that it has been a passion of mine for many years to have the Environmental Protection Agency there as a centre of environmental excellence and research. The soil division of Teagasc will do superb work and will complement the Environmental Protection Agency in monitoring soil pollution, carrying out analyses and planning the way ahead. We will have a number of other initiatives in the environmental sphere. I will not spell them out as they sometimes evaporate when aired.

It is a major bonus not only for Wexford but the entire country to have such a synergy of environmental excellence. I will pay personal attention to the quality of the building.

I join Deputy Byrne in congratulating Teagasc on its work to date. There were dark days when there was rationalisation in Teagasc but Dr. John Lee and his staff endured those hard times and made progress. It is now established on a firm financial footing and has a secure future. I pay tribute to Dr. Austin O'Sullivan for the National Agricultural Museum. He created a magnificent museum virtually single handedly which attracts up to 30,000 people per year. There are plans for its future expansion and the Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry mentioned some of them. There is no room in the National Museum for some of the exhibitions and these will be decentralised to the National Agricultural Museum. It has great tourism potential.

Deputy Quill welcomed the Bill and spoke about decentralisation. We cannot allow the capital city, which has one-third of the population, to keep growing nor can we put more and more environmental pressure on it. It is important to decentralise State agencies to regional centres and this has been the policy of successive Governments. This Government is carrying out as much decentralisation as is proper.

She mentioned the role of the Environmental Protection Agency and the resources required. Some £8 million is available to the Environmental Protection Agency this year. I had discussions with the employees. The board of management and the five directors are excited by the plans to develop their functions. Under the waste Bill they will have a new function in monitoring land-fill and will also be involved when the integrated pollution control licensing process is extended to further activities.

The Minister for Agriculture, Food and Forestry outlined its importance for Wexford. Not only will it be of immense value in itself but will attract further development, research and education opportunities. This is an important time for Wexford. Deputy Browne who represents Carlow/Kilkenny will forgive us if we are delighted. I acknowledge the role played by my constituency colleague, Deputy Browne, who was Minister of State in the Department of the Environment. When we were in Government we were anxious to ensure that everything on the agency came to pass.

Senators dealt at some length with the historic role of Johnstown in the development of agriculture. Following the war and in the early 1950s when agricultural education was limited, places like Johnstown Castle provided farmers with skills that were not available elsewhere. It is important to recognise that as we map out a future role for the estate which will serve the nation into the next millennium. The future of the castle must be worked out in some detail. It will not be affected by the Environmental Protection Agency or decentralisation of the Department of Agriculture, Food and Forestry. It has great potential. We look to a new functional role for the castle in the campus we are creating on that site. Deputy Browne lamented the fact that this infrastructure is not going to his constituency. That is understandable but he will acknowledge that this will be an asset not only for Wexford and the south-east, including Carlow, but also for the nation.

I thank Deputies for giving such a warm welcome to the Bill. The Office of Public Works will issue tenders when the Bill is enacted.

Question put and agreed to.

Bill put through committee and reported without amendment.

Agreed to take Fifth Stage today.

Question proposed: "That the Bill do now pass".

Minister for the Environment (Mr. Howlin)

This is a short enabling Bill but even such Bills can take some time to pass through the House and I am most grateful that this important endeavour has been enthusiastically supported and given such a speedy passage.

Question put and agreed to.

Sitting suspended at 6.40 p.m. and resumed at 7 p.m.