Light Rail Project: Statements.

Minister for Public Enterprise (Mrs. O'Rourke)

This is the fourth occasion the House has considered this issue since we announced last month that the Government had decided to proceed with a larger and more ambitious light rail project comprising a surface line from Tallaght to Connolly Station, based on the CIE preferred surface alignment from Tallaght to O'Connell Street, and a line from Sandyford to Ballymun and Dublin Airport, using the Harcourt Street and Broadstone disused railway alignments and with an underground section in the city centre.

In the intervening period there has been widespread welcome for the Government's decision from many sections of the community and from members of parties in this House. There has been particular support for the wisdom of the Government in looking to the long term while at the same time ensuring there would be the earliest possible progress on the construction of a substantial proportion of the surface system already designed by CIE.

People have also welcomed the more integrated approach which the Government took by providing for links to Dublin Airport and Connolly Station. The key message I have been getting from people, whether they agree or disagree with the Government's decision, is to get on with the job. With that objective in mind, the Government set the CIE Light Rail Project Team the task of proceeding without delay with the construction of the Tallaght to Connolly Station and Sandyford to St. Stephen's Green sections.

Last month I provided a preliminary estimate of the timescales involved in implementing the Government's objective and it is useful to recap briefly. The objective is to begin construction work on the light rail network early in 2000. Completion of the Tallaght to Abbey Street section and the extension to Connolly Station is envisaged by the winter of 2002. The line from Sandyford to St. Stephen's Green should be completed by the summer of 2003. Those target dates are subject to satisfactory completion of the necessary statutory procedures and to the necessary technical evaluations.

Following the Government's decision, the CIE project team took legal advice on the most appropriate way to deal with the existing formal applications which have been submitted for light railway orders. The conclusion was that the speediest way forward for the project would be to withdraw the existing applications and to quickly submit fresh applications which take account of the revised situation arising from the Government's decision.

I agree with that assessment and I am pleased to say the CIE board passed the formal resolution, which I mentioned during yesterday's Question Time, deciding that the current applications be withdrawn and that new applications for light railway orders be made. I got a fax on that yesterday and a formal letter on it today. CIE formally communicated its decision to me today. I will now advise the inspector of its decision and formally withdraw his inquiry mandate. I know I said yesterday that I do not get in contact with judges, but I have formally written to the judge today.

Mr. Stagg

That could be described as a U-turn.

Mrs. O'Rourke

Yes, a massive one. I hope, pro bono publico, he will be able to agree to it. CIE will write to all those whom it served with formal notices when the original applications were lodged. It will also publish press notices informing the general public of the revised position. My Department will advise all those who made formal representations to me or the Department.

CIE will make a new application in respect of the Tallaght to Abbey Street line during the summer and for the Sandyford to St. Stephen's Green section before the end of the year. The application for the Abbey Street to Connolly Station section will be made next year in good time to enable the Tallaght to Connolly Station line to be completed as a single project.

In parallel with this process, I have asked CIE to proceed quickly with design and planning work on the St. Stephen's Green to Dublin Airport route. As some work has already been undertaken on the planning and design of a route to Ballymun, CIE expects to be in a position to commence public consultation on the BroadstoneBallymun-Dublin Airport section later this year. That consultation will invite views on the broad route options and I encourage people to participate fully in this process, as no doubt they will.

CIE will also go to tender in the next few days, I understand, to recruit consultants to undertake the detailed technical evaluation of the underground section from Broadstone to St. Stephen's Green. The physical evaluation work necessary, such as the drilling of trial boreholes, is expected to get under way early in 1999 and will take about nine months to complete.

The detailed results of this technical evaluation will provide the information necessary to determine the specification for the underground section. That will help to decide the precise route of the tunnel, the required gradients and the number and location of stations. It will also assist in determining a firm cost estimate for construction and, subject to the relevant statutory procedures, the likely implementation timetable for the underground section.

Sufficient provision has been made in the Vote of my Department, without requiring a Supplementary Estimate in that regard, to fund the planning and design work in 1998 and my Department had already sought expenditure projections from CIE for future years. I repeat my assurance to the House that appropriate funding arrangements will be put in place to deliver on the Government's commitment to this project. As is the usual practice, the precise funding commitments for the project will be addressed as part of the normal budgetary process when the Government is preparing its annual public capital programme. The light rail project will also be submitted for EU assistance under the next round of EU Structural and Cohesion funding.

The possibility of private financing for infrastructural projects, including the light rail project, is being addressed by the Department of Finance. An interdepartmental group has now been set up to develop criteria for and advise the Minister for Finance on the potential contribution of public-private partnership mechanisms to meeting future infrastructural investment needs.

The Community Support Framework monitoring committee will take decisions on the decommital and reallocation of Structural Fund assistance for the light rail project later this month, on 25 or 26 June. Some time ago my Department asked CIE to carry out reviews of public transport investment requirements across all the sectors. This meant that at the time of the Government decision, my Department and CIE were readily in a position to identify a range of potentially suitable public transport projects which could be contractually committed by the end of 1999 and on which work could be completed by 2001.

Since the Government decision there have been regular ongoing contacts at official level between my Department, the Department of Finance and the European Commission in relation to this matter. Senior officials of my Department have already been to Brussels to brief the Commission on the enhanced light rail project and to provide information on possible alternative public transport projects for EU assistance. I am confident that the twin aims of ensuring that Ireland does not lose EU funding and that a reasonable proportion of the Luas aid will be reallocated to other public transport projects will be shortly realised.

The Government has taken a realistic and farsighted decision to deal with the major issues which dogged the light rail project for so long, namely those of passenger capacity and disruption during construction. It has also set out a clear strategy for making parallel progress on the various elements of the project with a clear objective of starting construction early in 2000.

There is widespread support for the plan. It will deliver an integrated system which will finally provide a direct link between Heuston and Connolly Stations and a direct interchange between the light rail, DART and suburban rail systems at Connolly Station. Dublin Airport and Busaras will also be directly served by the new light rail network.

As I said previously, we now need to focus all our energies on delivering the light rail network to the citizens of Dublin who wish to use it. However, it is also important to acknowledge that this project on its own will not solve Dublin's transport problems. There is also a need to progress the other major infrastructural projects. We need to complete the quality bus corridor network as quickly as possible. Dublin Corporation's traffic management proposals must be implemented and the DTO is putting the finishing touches to a short-term action plan which I hope will re-energise the rest of the DTI strategy in the same way as the Government decision has done for the light rail project. I understand it will suggest measures to improve the capacity and quality of the public transport system as well as traffic, parking and demand management proposals. I hope all Members, regardless of party affiliation, can work together to make Dublin a more accessible city.

Mr. Yates

I wish to share my time with Deputy Olivia Mitchell.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

Is that agreed? Agreed.

Mr. Yates

I will not recite the arguments about the Luas and I appreciate that the Minister has subjected herself to questions and debate in various fora about the project. However, the time available for this debate is short.

Mrs. O'Rourke

I did not have anything to do with that.

Mr. Yates

I am aware of that but the arrangements are most unsatisfactory. I will not repeat all the problems I have with the Government decision, but the issue is its credibility. How far into the future will the revised and enhanced Luas proposal be operational? How much will it cost? How will it fare under the competitive public capital projects programme? How will it fare under successive Governments? My primary criticism is that the Minister is unable to answer these questions.

It transpires from the Minister's reply yesterday to my question about whether the design expenditure would be refunded to the Commission that the EU committed £12 million of aid for design work on the previous Luas project. The Minister said yesterday that on this basis the EU has been asked to confirm that the expenditure continues to be eligible for assistance. She also said a decision is expected shortly. We do not know if a miffed Commission will want the money back.

Mr. Stagg

It will want it back.

Mr. Yates

It is a serious issue for the taxpayer. The Minister said a decision is expected shortly. This means it could go either way.

The most incredible aspect of the Government decision is the fact that no geological work has been carried out and we do not know if there will be a massive hole in St. Stephen's Green. We do not know if the Luas will come up to the surface on O'Connell Street before it goes underground again and re-emerges at Broadstone. The Minister said yesterday that CIE will shortly go to tender to recruit consultants to undertake the detailed technical evaluation of the underground section. This study should have been done before the Government made a decision.

The time to commission consultants to undertake detailed technical evaluations, which will confirm whether it will be necessary to bore into sand, silt or rock, was before a decision was made. We do not know what will be found underground. If it emerges that the tunnel will cost £500 million to construct, where lies the Government decision? For example, if the cost is prohibitive, will it mean that all bets are off? We will not know where we stand until the study is completed.

The Minister has ducked and dived regarding the public inquiry. She intends to write to Judge Seán O'Leary.

Mrs. O'Rourke

I will convey the decision presented to me by CIE.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

Deputy Yates, without interruption.

Mr. Yates

The application for a light railway order, which was before Judge O'Leary, has been withdrawn by CIE.

Mrs. O'Rourke

Yes.

Mr. Yates

The judge could decide it is an aborted inquiry because the entire plans have been recast. The Minister does not know what Judge O'Leary will do and I have received legal advice that separate legislation may be required. The public inquiry could be in a cul-de-sac.

The Minister sold the plan on the basis that the Luas would be extended to Swords, Finglas, Cabinteely, Clondalkin and the docklands. However, it transpires that the Government decision on 5 May includes no commitment to those spurs. What is the position? The key selling point of a bigger, better, brighter Luas is not part of the Government decision.

Regarding the original blueprint and the £220 million that was available for the project, what will happen to the £114 million of EU funds? The Minister mentioned other transport projects and the House has called for the reallocation of the money to quality bus corridors, mainline rail services and other projects in Dublin. Can the Minister confirm it is a Government decision to reallocate the funds in that way? What is the position?

The real Government decision is to defer street disruption. Under the Freedom of Information Act, the Sunday Times asked what communications took place after 21 May between the Atkins team and the Secretary General of the Department. I have a copy of a fax sent by the Secretary General, Mr. John Loughrey, to Mr. Richard Cuthbert. It states: “Following our telephone conversation this morning, I have set out a number of comments which you might usefully take on board in finalising your draft summary.” We do not know what doctoring of the Atkins report took place. The fax also states: “The impact which either a surface or underground option will have in terms of disruption needs to be clearly brought out in the summary.” I intend to return to this matter during the time available for questions later. The £400 million plus will have been squared by the time this matter is over.

Mrs. O'Rourke

Does the Deputy not want money given to projects?

Ms O. Mitchell

As Deputy Yates said, there is little point in rehashing the arguments about whether Luas should be overground or underground. However, given that many public transport issues are unresolved, the Government's handling of the Luas project has been disastrous. It was wrong to waste a year on a report the Minister did not intend accepting. It was wrong to ask the consultants to change that report and to enhance the option they had already decided to reject.

Mrs. O'Rourke

I did not ask consultants to change the report. That is a slur on my character.

Mr. Yates

The Minister is very tetchy today.

Ms O. Mitchell

The wording of the letter makes the intention clear. I am sure it was preceded by many frantic telephone calls.

Mrs. O'Rourke

I must——

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

The Minister will have an opportunity to reply at 2.25 p.m. She should allow Deputy Mitchell to continue.

Mrs. O'Rourke

I did not write to anybody.

Ms O. Mitchell

Given the Government's record and the recommendations for the taxi industry, I hope the Government, and the Taoiseach in particular, will allow the matter to proceed. Those who are entitled to make decisions should be allowed to do so without interference from the Taoiseach.

It was wrong of the Minister to mislead the public with her timetable, which is unachievable, unrealistic and intended to deceive. It was wrong to describe the new Luas plan as an integrated approach. It has proved not to be integrated, and it has proved impossible to bring Luas to Connolly Station while serving the docklands at the same time. It is obvious that it will take ten to 15 years if it ever gets under way, to begin construction of the tunnel or black hole referred to by my colleague. As planning gets under way for this project, more and more problems and unresolved issues will present themselves.

The Tallaght line can go ahead if the political will is there and perhaps we will see the line to the airport in the future. However, I do not doubt that in future Deputies will debate why it was decided to bring millions of tourists to Broadstone and will wonder how those tourists might be brought to somewhere they might like to go.

The hugely problematic construction of the Harcourt Street line while we still subscribe to the myth of the tunnel being built is a more immediate issue. Only the Minister can change this myth by admitting that the tunnel is at best a long-term proposal. If the Minister allows the current situation to persist, we will find in two or three years that it is environmentally unacceptable to dig a tunnel from Stephen's Green. It will be pushed out to the suburbs and we will be back to the drawing board with the Harcourt Street line. That situation can be saved by the Minister having the courage to say that we will probably never build the tunnel and that we should get on with what we can do.

The Luas project has lost £114 million, and every Deputy and councillor in Ireland has a plan for it. However, there is no justification for spending that money on anything other than public transport in Dublin. Even if all aspects of the DTI strategy were in place, which they clearly are not, a huge deficit in the provision of public transport has emerged. This deficit must be addressed as possibly the single most important issue facing the economy and quality of life in Dublin, particularly in the suburbs where traffic congestion is now insupportable. The Minister, who is responsible for transport, must make those changes. I must also make a plea for Dublin Bus, which requires a massive investment in its fleet and a subvention to render its increased capacity viable in off-peak hours. We need more buses and more routes, particularly orbital routes to account for changed travel patterns.

Mr. Stagg

I welcome this debate. The provision of a high quality light rail system for Dublin is essential. The city cannot now cope with the volume of traffic flooding into it every day. The resulting gridlock and traffic mayhem costs the city millions of pounds every year in environmental, social and economic terms. It cannot be allowed to continue, and the ultimate responsibility for resolving this crisis rests with the Government.

It is a tragedy for Dublin that the Government is not prepared to implement the existing plans for light rail. These plans, and a large amount of preparatory work that went into their formulation, have been cast aside by this Minister and Government. This was done at the behest of the coalition partners and the large vested commercial interests in the city. The light rail plan scrapped by the Minister would have provided Dublin with an efficient light rail system, and every expert who has examined the project has said it was the best option. It would have reduced the gridlock that currently strangles the city and would have reduced the chronic pollution that is mostly caused by exhaust fumes which is a serious cause for concern and a threat to public health. The Minister decided to jettison these concrete proposals and replace them with mere aspiration — a wish list cobbled together in four days in opposition to the views of every expert who examined the issue. She has even ignored the advice of the consultants she charged with compiling an independent report, and has failed to honour numerous commitments to honour that report.

On 12 November 1997, the Minister said in the Dáil:

Regardless of the outcome of the consultancy study, we will engage in the project recommended by it.

On 16 December 1997, she said:

I have made it as plain as I can. If the study concludes in favour of the overground option, tight as the timetable may be the money earmarked for Luas will go to Luas.

During an adjournment debate on the matter on 30 September 1997, she said:

Whatever is the result of the independent consultants' report, I will go at it hell for leather and it will be implemented.

The Minister has attempted to sell the people of Dublin a non-existent plan to replace the concrete proposals by the previous Government and which the CIE's light rail project team proceeded with.

The Minister claims that her light rail plans are a victory for imagination and vision. I am impressed that she keeps a straight face when making these outrageous claims, as nothing could be further from the truth. Her plans are a victory for those who are opposed to public transport and for those who feel the historic fabric of Dublin should be sacrificed to accommodate car owners at every turn. This is a disgraceful way to appease a small number of vested interests which the Government and this Minister will not discommode.

The loss to Dublin and taxpayers arising from the Minister's decision is enormous. She spent £200,000 of taxpayers' money engaging consultants and effectively binned their report when it did not produce the result she wanted. However, this is only the start of her cavalier attitude to taxpayers' money. She has also put at risk the £12 million in EU aid already invested in the planning and design of the original Luas proposal. The Minister stated yesterday that the EU Commission will soon come to a decision on the validity of this funding. I am not a gambling man, but I bet the Commission will say that money cannot be spent on a project that will not be completed. The taxpayer will have to stump up to pay for the disastrous decision made on this issue. There is also £114 million in EU funding lost to Luas to be considered. Despite pressing the Minister on this issue in recent weeks, we still do not know if this funding can be salvaged. Even if it can be salvaged at this late date, we do not know if the Minister intends investing the money in measures specifically designed to relieve Dublin's chronic traffic and public transport problems. In common with her attitude to this whole affair, she is short on details and answers.

It is becoming increasingly clear that the Government and this Minister do not know what they are doing with regard to the light rail question. Their grand plan is no more than a fig leaf to cover their inaction. The Government has no intention of completing that grand plan and it will continue to procrastinate and delay until the public becomes convinced that the light rail proposal will never be implemented and the entire concept can be quietly dropped.

The Government does not really intend to construct a light rail system. That has been confirmed by the decision of the Minister for the Environment and Local Government to promote the construction of quality bus corridors along the proposed light rail route. Surely there is no need to provide bus corridors on these routes if a light rail is to be put in place. However, the Minister for the Environment and Local Government has indicated his intention to construct such corridors.

Dublin cannot afford a dereliction of duty of this magnitude. Every family in this city will be affected by the Minister's decision. Gridlock will continue to paralyse the city, air quality will continue to decline and respiratory and other health problems will become more serious. In addition, Dublin will continue to be a glorified car park and the interests of the city's inhabitants will continue to play second fiddle to the requirements of private motor cars. Plans to enhance Dublin as a living city and an urban space designed and developed for its citizens will come to naught.

If we are to proceed, there must be action on constructing a light rail system while studies are carried out into the proposed underground section of the Minister's route. To salvage some credibility the Government must proceed without delay with the construction of the Tallaght-Connolly, Sandyford-St. Stephen's Green and, when the relevant procedures are complete, the Ballymun-Broadstone lines. The geological and engineering studies required for the proposed underground section should proceed while this work is being done. We cannot allow the entire light rail project to be deferred so that the Tánaiste's pet project can be endlessly investigated.

Will the Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs, Deputy O'Donnell, who recently wrote letters to a number of newspapers on this matter — she could have spoken in the House just as easily — take note that I am in favour of the parts of the light rail system which have not been jettisoned proceeding as soon as possible? I am at one with my colleague Ms Eithne Fitzgerald in that.

The engineering difficulties in constructing the short tunnel proposed by the Minister for Public Enterprise, Deputy O'Rourke, are immense. Her plan involves tunnelling from the relative height of Harcourt Street to a depth of 100 metres under the city until the line re-emerges at Broadstone. Therefore, people exiting the line at O'Connell Street would be obliged to climb 100 metres to the surface. I have received professional advice that such a tunnel will have a rollercoaster effect on any train using the system and will pose serious implications for people's comfort and safety. It should also be noted that the Atkins' report specifically outlined that the underground option would not serve the needs of people with disabilities. The Minister's proposal must include measures that seek to rectify this serious problem.

Mrs. O'Rourke

I have been informed of the measures required.

Mr. Yates

People will need to wear crash helmets.

Mr. Stagg

They will also have to be strapped into their seats as is the case with rollercoasters.

Mrs. O'Rourke

The Deputies appear to have a number of phobias.

Mr. Stagg

If, as I suspect, the tunnel is shown to be the financial, technical and social nightmare predicted, the on-street connections can proceed and we can at last have an integrated light rail system for the capital.

I am convinced that the underground option proposed by the Minister will not be taken up. I am further convinced that the Government has decided to scuttle the light rail project and replace it with a wish list of pious aspirations that it has no intention of putting into practice. A plan, timescale or costing has not been provided and the Minister has no money because she has already given away the little she had in her possession. The Department of Finance must have been delighted with the Minister's nonsensical wish list which is merely designed to assuage the Tánaiste's wish to see the construction of a tunnel in Dublin.

The Minister for Public Enterprise and the Taoiseach did not have the courage to proceed with the Labour Party proposal they previously supported.

Mrs. O'Rourke

So it was not Deputy Yates' proposal.

Mr. Stagg

The Minister has failed to keep her promise to accept and implement the recommendations of the Atkins report. The hypocrisy of her decision and the lame excuses she offered are staggering in their audacity. The people of Dublin will not quickly forget the Government's lack of action.

Mr. Gilmore

Given that we have been discussing a light rail system for Dublin for more than ten years and that a metre of rail has yet to be laid or a single tram acquired, it is not surprising that scepticism among the people of Dublin city and county has increased with increasing numbers doubting that the project will ever proceed. The bungling, delays, rejection of consultants' reports and U-turns that have been a feature of the Government's handling of the issue have increased public scepticism against the background of a traffic problem of such magnitude that it is no exaggeration to state that Dublin city and county are grinding to a halt.

A month on from Government's decision to reject the consultants' report favouring the overground option, the Minister in reply to a question yesterday was unable to provide any further information on the cost of the Government's proposals other than that it will be £400 million plus. Whether that plus will be £10 million, £40 million or £400 million, the Minister is unable or unwilling to say. Her reply also contained a series of target dates for commencing and completing a number of phases of the plan, which, based on previous experience and the fact that we are virtually starting from scratch, seem wildly optimistic. It is interesting that no dates were given for commencement or completion of the northside elements of the plan. The completion date for the Sandyford-St. Stephen's Green line, which is largely on-street and for which land is already available, is set at summer 2003, while the Tallaght-Abbey Street phase, which faces major onroad construction problems, is due to be finished six months earlier.

Even if these wildly optimistic targets are met, it will still be the best part of five years before an operational light rail system is put in place in the city. What is clear is that we cannot allow the traffic problem to continue to deteriorate until light rail becomes available. Urgent remedial action is required. While the Minister has been dithering week by week, the situation has been growing worse. Traffic conditions which were once the norm for one hour at peak times in the morning and evening are now experienced throughout the day. Even relatively short journeys at peak time are taking on epic proportions.

The key to dealing with traffic problems in Dublin in the short term rests with the proper use of the £114 million of EU funding allocated to the Luas project which has now been lost to that project. As the Minister stated, a decision on the reallocation of that money will be made later in the month. There are many public transport projects in Dublin on which £114 million could usefully be spent. There is a need to upgrade the Dublin-Maynooth rail line to service the growing population in that area and there is scope for improvement in DART services. The building of quality bus corridors must be accelerated. A provision of £10 million would pay for ten new routes. Bus services will remain the only public transport option for the vast majority of Dublin people in the foreseeable future. However, contrary to public perception, the level of subvention for Dublin Bus at approximately 3.8p per passenger journey remains one of the lowest for any city of similar size in Europe.

A large proportion of the vehicles in the Dublin Bus fleet are clapped out, mechanically unreliable and unpleasant to travel in. Just £30 million, less than the cost of constructing an underground station, would allow Dublin Bus to acquire approximately 175 new buses which would make a major difference to the quality of public transport in the city and county. The combination of poor service, relatively high fares and chronic traffic problems is forcing increasing numbers of people to abandon public transport in favour of their cars. This in turn worsens traffic problems, slows down bus services and inconveniences people with no alternative to public transport.

The vicious circle must be broken. The key to doing so rests with the £114 million originally allocated to Luas. At Question Time, I intend to ask the Minister for the list of projects she indicated were identified by her Department and CIE as being suitable to receive funding from that £114 million and which she stated could be contractually committed by the end of 1999. The £114 million must be spent on public transport in Dublin. There is no point in spending it somewhere else because the traffic crisis exists in Dublin, which lost the £114 million because of the decision taken on Luas. The £114 million should be spent in Dublin. Any failure to do so will mean the Minister and the Government are turning their backs on the traffic chaos in the city.

Mr. Sargent

The Green Party is of the view that the on street option for Luas is preferable to the Minister's proposal in that it would secure EU funds and force radical change in city transport. It would have been a catalyst, even during the construction period, through park and ride facilities to address the traffic problems. Such a catalyst is needed because people are not easily tempted from their cars. We must face up to the necessary changes.

It is sad that the plan before us, although high on aspiration, is low on cost and timeframe information. The tunnelling will be a bottomless pit from a financial perspective. Three underground stations are planned and there is a question about where on St. Stephen's Green excavations will be carried out to build a station. People need information on such matters if they are to accept the project.

The cost issues are unresolved. There are questions about security at underground stations to which people are entitled to answers. We have had a discussion in the House previously on the geology issues and whether the underground option is feasible. Nobody knows the answer and the issue condemns the project to continuing uncertainty. There are also questions about the Finglas to Dublin Airport route. Will it go through a cemetery?

The £114 million of EU funds is a considerable sum and it should not be lost to Dublin. I am concerned that the Minister has not given guarantees on spending the funds on transport in Dublin and I urge her to do so. The operational programme for transport is road dominated with £1.655 billion to be spent on roads, £275 million on mainline rail and £356 million on other public transport projects. In that context, £114 million is a large sum. I urge the Minister to guarantee that it will be spent in Dublin because of the current congestion there.

Many schools face great problems with school transport and the safety of routes to schools. Many children no longer make their way to school independently, thus forcing their parents to drive them to school. It is an indication of the unsustainability and the lack of forethought of the Government's public transport policy. Car dependence is bad economics. The Minister should bear this in mind in the context of Government policy. If we import cars and depend on them we lose money in the long-term and benefit foreign as opposed to domestic interests.

With promises that have been made house prices will increase because people will expect the Luas to be built near them. However, there will be no change. It will exacerbate current problems.

Deputy Jim Mitchell rose.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

I must call the Minister to reply. The Deputy will have an opportunity to put questions to the Minister later.

Mrs. O'Rourke

The Deputy could take a minute or two of my time.

Mr. J. Mitchell

I am grateful. The biggest gap in transport policy is that there is not a Minister with sole responsibility for transport matters. It is a major problem that roads and related matters are not the responsibility of the Minister for Public Enterprise who has responsibility for other aspects of transport. We are unique in the EU in this respect. It should not be a surprise that there have been difficulties of co-ordination with transport. Responsibility for roads and related matters, including taxis and motor testing, which rests with the Department of the Environment and Local Government should be transferred to the Minister for Public Enterprise.

This is a crucial point in the context of the implementation of the Government's decision on Luas. If one Minister does not have overall responsibility for these matters there will be continuing difficulty. When I was Minister with responsibility for transport I made this proposal. However, the then Minister for the Environment resisted the proposals and was supported by the Minister for the Public Service. It is a structural problem in Government which has added greatly to transport problems.

With regard to the proposed tunnel from Harcourt Street to Broadstone, consideration should be given to including an underground road privately funded by way of tolls.

Mrs. O'Rourke

Alongside it?

Mr. J. Mitchell

Yes. Why not tunnel for a road at the same time? National Toll Roads made a proposal some years ago for an east to west toll tunnel and that might be reconsidered. The Arrow train services to Inchicore, Kylemore, Ballyfermot, Ashtown and Cabra should be developed rapidly.

The proposal to run the Luas through an established community, such as Arran Quay Terrace is madness.

Mrs. O'Rourke

This has been a good and interesting discussion and I thank those who spoke. There will be an opportunity for questions later. I take exception to Deputy Yates's remark that I am ready to "subject" myself to questions. I do not consider it subjection because I am glad to take questions. Subjection is a curiously servile concept, one which I would not use.

Dáil Éireann debate - Thursday, 4 Jun 1998

Light Rail Project: Statements.

Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 4 Jun 1998