Vol. 512 No. 3
39 Mr. Shatter asked the Minister for Public Enterprise if she has satisfied herself with the current controls in relation to overcrowding of public transport vehicles with particular reference to rail cars; and the proposals, if any, she has to introduce regulations in this regard to ensure commuter safety. [25937/99]
I advised the House previously that there are no safety standards in place in regard to the overcrowding of trains either in this country or at EU level. However, my Department's railway inspecting officers have been in contact with Iarnród Éireann on a number of occasions drawing their attention to the importance of keeping this matter under review. I understand from Iarnród Éireann that an independent appraisal of the carrying capacity of its rolling stock is to be undertaken. I am very much aware of the discomfort passengers have experience due to overcrowding on trains in recent times.
In relation to the question of safety regulations, the Deputy will be aware of the independent review of railway safety undertaken last year. The review identified a number of options for the future regulation of railway safety in Ireland. A specific question on the regulatory framework has been put down for answer today and I will deal in full with this issue in my response to it.
When I raised the question of an accident previously, the Minister said she could not give any guarantees that there will not be an accident even with the most sophisticated rail sys tem in the world. It is indisputable that if there is an accident, a crash or derailment, the level of overcrowding on some trains – I instance DART, some suburban services and the weekend intercity services – is such that the carnage will be worse unless some regulations on overcrowding are introduced. Rather than leave the matter to Iarnród Éireann, which obviously wants the maximum revenue, the Minister should get her inspectors to look at the situation at peak morning commuting times because I have been told it is very frightening. Elderly and disabled people are frightened by the way they are compressed into carriages. Given the way the doors close, people are unsure of whether they will squeeze on. In the interest of public safety, the Minister should commission a study on this matter immediately and perhaps take an initiative at the EU Council of Ministers.
I go to the Transport Council meeting on Thursday. This matter is not on the agenda but we will discuss railways. I intended informally to ask fellow Ministers their opinion. One has only to go on the tube in London to know what "squeezing" means. One is lucky to get one's skirt in before the doors close.
Or trousers.
I will ask the inspectors. I have spoken to the officials who, in turn, have spoken to the railway inspectors. They have visited but I will ask if they will do so again. At EU level, I will speak informally to other Ministers about rail overcrowding and how they cope with it in their respective countries. As the Deputy will know the agenda of the Council of Ministers is prepared but perhaps we could discuss the matter at the following meeting.
Does the Minister agree it is a good complaint that too many people are using our trains and buses and that an obvious way to avoid the added dangers is to provide additional carriages or buses? Does she agree that where there is such overcrowding, CIE, Iarnród Éireann and so on do not maximise their revenue because they are not capable of collecting the fares given the conditions that exist? That is true on the DART and the Arrow. Does the Minister agree with that and the fact we will see low returns from Iarnród Éireann when we get the figures?
People constantly write to me to say they did not pay on the DART or buses. I do not know why they tell me that, although they usually do not sign the letters. I agree with what the Deputy says, and that is what makes a nonsense of—
There was a dance band promoter from the Minister's part of the country not too long ago who never paid.
I guess Deputy Deasy is talk ing about Deputy Albert Reynolds. He is not from my part of the country but from an adjoining county. CIE resists the idea of integrated ticketing, although it sits on a committee dealing with integrated ticketing. We got £1 million in the budget for the hardware for integrated ticketing and we will introduce it. CIE's plea is that it will lose money if it introduces integrated ticketing but I believe it would do better. A person would pay and get such a ticket. Overcrowding renders it less easy to collect fares.
An nglacann an tAire leis go bhfuil daoine éirithe as busanna agus traenacha a úsáid mar go dtiteann daoine i laige orthu agus tá eagla orthu roimh busanna agus traenacha atá plódaithe? An féidir leis na traenacha agus na busanna rud éigin cosúil le criosanna a chur isteach chun gur féidir le daoine greim a fháil ar ruda éigin? Cuid den fhadhb ná nuair a stopann bus titeann daoine agus bíonn baol timpiste ann.
The Deputy said people are afraid to get on buses and trains because of overcrowding and asked if we should not have the strap arrangement which would allow people to cling on to something. We will put that point to them.
