I wish to share my time with Deputy McCormack.
Adjournment Debate. - Student Nurses.
As Deputy Michael D. Higgins's name is on the motion I will call Deputy McCormack after him. He can have the remainder of your time, Deputy.
Student nurses gathered outside the gates of Leinster House today to highlight their grievance that they are the only undergraduates in the country who have to pay university fees, despite the fact that third level fees have been abolished since 1997. They were angry and frustrated that they have been denied equity and fairness and they are determined to seek justice. I support their claim.
It is in the public interest that student nurses are provided with the highest possible level of education and training to enable them utilise their skills for the maximum benefit of patients under their care. It is only in recent years that the need to modernise and revitalise the training and education of student nurses has been addressed. The new diploma course was first introduced in Galway in 1994 and this model is now offered to up to 30 nursing schools nationally. The continuation degree course was introduced in 1998 in the NUI, Galway and since then, the students have had to pay the fees for this course.
It is unacceptable that nursing students must pay fees for their degree courses, unlike every other third level undergraduate. For too long the area of responsibility has been kicked back and forth between the Department of Health and Children and the Department of Education and Science. Neither has been willing to take responsibility for this injustice. It is unacceptable that these nursing students, mainly female, are being victimised and penalised while all other university students avail of free education. The Government is treating student nurses in a sexist manner. It is another example of its discrimination against young women and the nursing profession.
Some 107 nurses were registered for the Bachelor of Nursing Degree at NUI, Galway, at a cost of £2,317 each in terms of course fees. Between 40 and 60 students have refused to pay this unfair and unjust demand. This situation is not of the college authorities' making. As the closing date for the payment of fees, 17 January, has expired, it is unfortunate that the talks between the representatives of the student nurses, SIPTU, and the Department of Health and Children officials have not yet found a solution.
Is it the Minister's intention to push young people into debt? Why can they not receive the same benefits available to every other student nationally? It is time to stop interdepartmental games. The imposition of these fees amounts to an unjust financial penalty on young people. Student nurses must have their fees paid. Their wish to continue their studies to degree course standard is being denied. If this is his last day as Minister for Health and Children, it would be a magnanimous gesture for the Minister to finally decide to pay these fees.
I agree with other Deputies who said the issue on which the student nurses protested outside the gates of Leinster House needs to be urgently resolved. Time is of the essence. The date for registration is passed and technically some student nurses who protested this afternoon could have the services of the different colleges with which they wish to register withdrawn or refused to them because they have not paid their fees. The situation is outrageous. I and the Labour Party and the Union of Students in Ireland, SIPTU and many other members of the public support their very reasonable demand.
Student nurses are volunteering for a profession that is in grave shortage of skilled people. One cannot question the vocational motivation of those who have decided to choose nursing as a career. Such people are not in the same position as those who, say, volunteer for an MBA and who would afterwards seek to sell their services in the private sector, financial services or whatever. They are committed to nursing and the degree qualification they seek does not cover a range of subjects, but is specifically related to the vocational practice they have chosen. The public, therefore, benefits from their choice, their work and their qualification.
The fee of £2,317 per annum can only be understood in the context of people who, if their remuneration is averaged over a year, will only get between £60 and £65 per week. It has been suggested by those who consider this subject in bureaucratic terms that the student nurses are being maintained by the health boards. They only maintain those who are in permanent full-time employment for more than three years. Given this, the student nurses are in an anomalous relationship to every other student who has benefited from the abolition of fees. Many other students from the same parish will also be in receipt of a maintenance grant.
The recent nurses' dispute was complicated, but it gave people an opportunity to appreciate what happens within hospitals, the different levels of responsibility in nursing and how nursing has so radically changed. It is clear from this that we need more nurses in better conditions and with better remuneration. Most importantly, we need better morale. The present situation is damaging to morale, especially that of younger people. At a time when so many people are choosing, and are under pressure to choose, individual careers that will remunerate them and give them very high future income, it is important to appreciate that people are opting for the public service. I applaud that. I was in hospital recently and it was wonderful to see the dedication of these younger people who, acting out of character from the prevailing culture of individualism, are choosing to serve in such a dedicated way.
It is outrageous to suggest this matter cannot be resolved. It is possible for the Department of Education and Science to pay the college and to seek a complete refund from the Department of Health and Children. I was a Minister and I am aware of numerous examples of how an allocation from the Department of Health and Children to the Department of Education and Science could be ringfenced to ensure there are no knock-on effects on the funding of other degree courses.
Deputy Burke mentioned the equality dimension to this matter. It is most welcome that there are young men now volunteering for nursing but it is still overwhelmingly a female labour service. For all of these reasons I appeal to the outgoing Minister and the incoming Minister, whoever that may be, to simply resolve this issue equitably soon. It is worse for people to let this linger and do even further damage to morale that is already in short supply in so many places in a very important profession.
I hope the Minister of State is here with good news for us. He is aware, as we are, that there are up to 100 degree course nurses protesting outside the gates of Leinster House today. They have a legitimate complaint. The Government got away with this for the past two years. A degree course was set up in University College Galway three years ago whereby nurses who had completed the three year diploma course could then go on to obtain a nursing degree by a further year of study in University College Galway. On the surface this might seem all right, and similar to the position of other students who had completed their diploma course in a college of technology. The only difference is that the nursing student is being charged £2,317 in college fees for the privilege of the one year course while all other degree students are exempt from this fee and if living 15 miles away, they may also qualify for a maintenance grant as well.
This matter was raised to ask the Minister to correct this serious anomaly and discrimination against people doing a degree in nursing. For the first three years of training, student nurses on the wards earn about £60 a week which is less than the unemployment assistance rate. This does not even cover their accommodation and living expenses, so how can they afford £2,317 for the degree course? I appeal to the Minister to give them fair play and abolish the third level fees for all third level students. If this is done it will enable the nurses completing their training to have the choice of continuing to do the degree year and the option will not be prohibited by the cost of fees. About 1,000 people are undertaking the nursing diploma programme every year but only about 100 of them are going on to the degree course. This £2,317 fee should be abolished to give everybody fair play and eliminate this anomaly.
I thank Deputies Burke, Higgins and McCormack for raising this matter. There are two nursing degree courses on offer at the National University of Ireland, Galway: a one academic year course and a part-time course that can be undertaken over 18 or 24 months. Following the Government meeting in Ballaghaderreen last week, the Taoiseach and my colleague, the Minister for Health and Children, met a delegation of nursing students wishing to undertake the former course, who are seeking to have their fees paid. In response to representations made by the students, Deputy Cowen undertook to ask his officials to investigate whether anything could be done for them. The students concerned have successfully completed the three year nursing diploma programme and are entitled to register as nurses with An Bord Altranais. While undertaking the diploma programme, their third level fees were paid by the relevant health agency and they also received an annual non-means tested maintenance grant and other supports. The difficulty with the one academic year degree course is that it is outside the scope of the funding arrangements agreed between my Department and the Department of Finance in respect of pre-registration nursing education.
The Commission on Nursing has recommended that no third level institution should introduce a pre-registration nursing degree programme before the start of the academic year 2002-03. Since a degree in nursing is not at present a requirement for registration as a nurse and subsequent employment, it is regarded as an optional post-registration qualification.
Denying them further education.
Members of the nursing profession wishing to undertake a degree programme are, in the same way as any other public service workers, responsible for making their own arrangements, including the payment of course fees.
That is scandalous.
It is, however, open to nurses who are employed by health agencies to apply to their employers for financial support towards the cost of undertaking such courses. Most health agencies have a continuing nursing education budget and the funding from this budget is used to help nurses wishing to undertake further education. The Department of Health and Children has given further consideration to the position of the Galway students wishing to undertake the one academic year degree course. Unfortunately, it is simply not possible to ringfence any arrangements for these students.
That is not so.
There are currently some 3,100 nursing students participating in the nursing diploma programmes at various third level institutions around the country, and it is expected that there will be an additional 1,500 students next autumn. It would be inequitable to meet the fees of the students who have enrolled for the degree course being provided by NUI Galway but not make similar provisions for all the other nursing students.
The concession being sought by the Galway students, if granted, would also give rise to a legit imate expectation on the part of registered nurses undertaking degree and other courses on a part-time basis that they should also have their fees paid in full. It is important to remember that there are currently in the region of 1,000 nurses undertaking such courses. A further factor that must be taken into account is the importance of the newly qualified nurses who have successfully completed three year nursing diploma programmes, entering the workforce as soon as they are registered. If students were to delay their entry by a further year in order to undertake a degree course on a full-time basis, then this would exacerbate the difficulties that some hospitals are experiencing in recruiting nurses.
The Minister does not want them to undertake a degree course.
In all the circumstances, and having regard to the wider financial and other implications involved, the Department is not in a posi tion to meet the fees of those students wishing to undertake the degree course at NUI Galway. We are, however, anxious to ensure that flexible arrangements are in place so as to afford some choice to these students. The degree course in question is structured in such a way as to allow the students to undertake part-time nursing work. The Department understands from the Western Health Board that some of the students who did the course last year worked an average of 20-24 hours per week and earned between £150 and £300 per week. It further understands from the health board that part-time work can be offered to this year's students on a similarly flexible basis so as not to interfere with their attendance at the university. As has been said already, the Minister is looking for other ways around the problem but that is the present situation.
He is looking to escape.
The Dáil adjourned at 9.40 p.m. until 10.30 a.m. on Thursday, 27 January 2000.