Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 9 Feb 2000

Vol. 514 No. 1

Adjournment Debate. - National Disease Surveillance Centre.

Mr. Shatter

The National Disease Surveillance Centre was established in Sir Patrick Dun's Hospital in November 1998. The NDSC is being developed as a centre of excellence for the surveillance, prevention and control of infectious diseases. In the 12 months following its establishment, specialist trained staff to enable it fulfil its functions were head hunted and recruited. As part of the staffing process in recent weeks the Department of Health and Children approved the recruitment of a microbiologist jointly by the NDSC and by James Connolly Memorial Hospital.

The centre was set up on an interim basis pending the enactment of legislation to give it an independent statutory remit. It was proposed that its staff complement should ultimately expand to 20 and that it should be based permanently in Blanchardstown. Its work requires it to maintain close and frequent liaison with other national organisations such as the Royal College of Physicians, the Irish College of General Practitioners, the National Virus Reference Laboratory and also with academic libraries and university departments. The NDSC has been requested by the Department of Health and Children to develop guidelines on issues such as anti-microbial resistance, viral haemorrhage disease and has been asked to review infectious disease legislation.

The scientific advisory committee, through its sub-committees, has more than 50 professionals who have given their time freely to develop these guidelines. Membership of the sub-committees comprises professionals who voluntarily give their time and who are dependant on them meeting in Dublin. All of those head hunted and employed by the NDSC reside in Dublin and were recruited on the basis that it would be based there. One day prior to the appointment of Deputy Cowen as Minister for Foreign Affairs, the chairman of the board of the NDSC received a fax from the Department of Health and Children informing him that a decision had been made by the Minister to transfer the centre to Tullamore Hospital. A public announcement of the Minister's decision was not made, and an explanation has not been offered even since I first raised this matter a week ago.

There is no scientific, medical or rational basis for transferring the NDSC from Dublin to Tullamore. While the Government may lamely attempt to justify the proposed transfer on the basis of its commitment to decentralisation, it is clear that the only reason for the transfer ordered by Deputy Cowen derives from his perception that it will result in some political advantage both for him and Fianna Fáil. His decision is a classic example of the worst type of parish pump politics. Such conduct results in Ministers and politicians being held up to public ridicule. It is conduct that substantially undermines the Government's professed commitment to a new form of ethics in politics.

If the Government persists with implementing this proposal, it is likely that most, if not all, of the staff recruited to the NDSC over the past 12 months will seek other positions. Those who remain, instead of devoting all their time to the important work in which the centre is engaged, will regularly spend between three and four hours per day driving to and from Tullamore for the purpose of engaging with various institutions in Dublin which collaborate in the centre's work and in order to participate in essential committee meetings which will inevitably be held in Dublin and meetings with officials in the Department of Health and Children. Prior to making the decision to transfer the NDSC to Tullamore the previous Minister for Health and Children refused to meet those employed there. In recent days it has been reported in the newspapers that the new Minister is agreeable to meeting them and that is welcome. However, unquoted sources have also indicated that there is no question of changing Deputy Cowen's decision. I welcome the fact that the new Minister is present and I challenge him to explain what national benefit can result in implementing his predecessor's decision. I call on him to have the courage to reverse it.

Minister for Health and Children (Mr. Martin)

I am pleased to have this opportunity to clarify the position regarding the future location of the National Disease Surveillance Centre. In November 1997 the then Minister for Health and Children, Deputy Cowen, approved the establishment of such a centre, which was to provide a comprehensive broad-based approach to the prevention of disease. Initially, the centre is concentrating on the surveillance of communicable diseases, for example, meningitis, tuberculosis, food-borne diseases and MRSA.

The centre was established on a non-statutory basis for an interim three-year period under the aegis of the Eastern Health Board to enable it to get off the ground quickly. It is intended that the centre will become an independent statutory body once the necessary legislation has been enacted. The director of the centre took up her appointment on 19 October 1998 and a further eight staff have been recruited. All of the staff are employed on three year contracts and are on secondment from other health agencies. It is envisaged that the centre will employ 30 to 40 staff when fully operational.

The NDSC is currently located in Sir Patrick Dun's Hospital and it is accepted that the accommodation is inadequate. The centre submitted proposals to the Department of Health and Children to lease accommodation in Blanchardstown. The Department had concerns about the costs involved and the capacity of the centre's budget to absorb the costs. The total annual costs, which included rent of £176,000, would have been £380,000. Once-off costs were identified as £1.1 million. This included fit-out and furniture costs amounting to £700,000 and VAT on the lease totalling £400,000. VAT is payable up front on leases of more than ten years. Correspondence was exchanged between my Department and the NDSC and this continued up to October 1999.

During Private Members' business on 2 February, Deputy Shatter made some outrageous allegations about my predecessor's conduct prior to his departure from the Department. He implied that the decision to relocate the NDSC outside Dublin was first conveyed to it one day prior to Deputy Cowen's departure.

I will outline the sequence in which the matter evolved. On 29 October 1999 the matter was discussed by my predecessor and his officials. He expressed concern about the high costs of the proposed accommodation and decided that the centre should be relocated in the midlands as part of the decentralisation process. He also requested that his officials meet the chairman and director of the NDSC to convey his decision to them. Due to other commitments, the parties involved were unable to meet earlier than 12 November. At this meeting, it was explained that in line with the Government's commitment to decentralisation it was the Minister's intention to relocate the centre to the midlands. It was also pointed out that the high cost of accommodation was a factor in the Minister's thinking.

A further meeting took place between the Department and representatives of the NDSC on 30 November 1999, during which the centre's representatives outlined their views on why it should remain in Dublin. These related to personal inconvenience and the perceived difficulties in setting up a national centre of excellence outside the capital. The representatives indicated their intention to seek a meeting with the Minister to discuss their concerns with him. The NDSC wrote to the Minister on 9 December outlining its concerns about the proposed location but did not request a meeting. On 21 December the NDSC indicated to the Department that its chairman would write directly to the Minister as a follow up to the letter of 9 December and request a meeting as soon as possible. It was decided to postpone responding to the letter of 9 December pending receipt of this request. As no further letter was received the letter of 24 January was prepared and issued. The only new piece of information in this letter was where in the midlands the centre would be located.

I will outline the context in which the decision to relocate the NDSC to the midlands was taken. The national development plan, published in November 1999, recognised the need to achieve balanced regional development. In particular, the NDP recognised the Border, midlands and western region, BMW, as disadvantaged. It outlined Government policy to pursue a more balanced regional development to reduce the disparities between the BMW region and the southern and eastern region. In An Action Programme for the Millennium the Government reiterated its commitment to achieving balanced regional development and the provision of State services at local level through decentralisation. On 1 December 1999 the Minister for Finance outlined the State's role in the development of the BMW region in his Budget Statement. It is the Government's intention to transfer the maximum number of public service jobs from Dublin.

I am aware of the personal concerns of the director and staff of the NDSC about the proposed location. I acknowledge that individuals may not wish to relocate and, they will be accommodated. This has been conveyed to the NDSC. Other points have been made which are not insurmountable. Tullamore is only some 60 miles from Dublin. The development of the NDSC in Tullamore will not compromise the development of a first class centre, to which I am committed. If there are problems, the scientific advisory committee and its sub-committees can continue to meet in Dublin even with the headquarters located in Tullamore. The NDSC can develop as a centre of excellence in a location outside Dublin. I do not accept that the personal inconvenience of public servants should be allowed impede the implementation of Government policy in relation to decentralisation.

Mr. Shatter

The Minister has not given one health-related reason for doing this.

Mr. Martin

However, there may be other factors or implications which have not been considered to date. If that is the case I will be happy to consider them. I have already indicated to the NDSC that I am happy to meet the chairman and director regarding their concerns about the implications of the proposed relocation. I thank the Deputy for raising this issue and I am pleased to have had the opportunity to put on record the position regarding Deputy Cowen's decision to transfer the centre to the midlands in line with Government policy. I also assure the House of the Government's commitment to develop a national centre of excellence for disease surveillance.

Mr. Shatter

Not one health policy objective featured in the decision.