Vol. 520 No. 3
13 Mr. McGinley asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the plans if any he has to reform the composition and the operation of the Garda Complaints Board; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [15548/00]
19 Mr. Broughan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the plans, if any, he has for a review of the operation of the Garda Complaints Board in view of the long delay in hearing complaints and in the light of the serious criticism of the operations of the board expressed by a number of solicitors in the RTE "Primetime" programme of 23 May 2000; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [15420/00]
I propose to take Questions Nos. 13 and 19 together.
My Department is completing a review of the operation of the Garda Síochána Complaints Act, 1986, on the basis of recommendations for change made by the Garda Síochána Complaints Board in its reports and also on the basis of views expressed by the Council of Europe Committee on the Prevention of Torture and Inhuman or Degrading Treatment, Garda management and by the Garda representative associations. I would hope, as a result of this review, to be in a position shortly to bring proposals to Government for amendment of the Act. While it would not be appropriate for me to comment in detail on these proposals until Government has made a decision on them, their general thrust will be to enhance the role of the complaints board in investigating complaints.
I am aware that the Garda Síochána Complaints Board, in its recent publications, expressed the view that the resources at its disposal were of a level that has resulted in a significant increase in the time taken to finalise complaints. The complaints board, accordingly, made a submission to me seeking both an augmented staffing complement and an enhancement in the grading of staff with the board. The case made by the board was fully accepted by my colleague the Minister for Finance who recently sanctioned the additional staff requested by the board. These additional staff are being recruited and when in place, will lead to a significant reduction in the time taken by the board to deal with complaints.
(Mayo): Will the Minister accept there is no public confidence in the existing Garda complaints procedures and that lack of public confidence is increased when a senior official, an employee, puts a major question mark in the public media concerning its operations? Can the Minister continue to stand over a system where the initial investigation of Garda misdemeanours is carried out by members of the Garda, in other words, gardaí investigating gardaí? When the report gets to the Garda Complaints Board what one is talking about is a report from peers, fellow members of the Garda. Given that the lack of confidence in Garda procedures is rupturing the relationship between the Garda and the general public there is an urgent need to reorganise, restructure and reform the existing Garda complaints procedures.
I do not believe there is no public confidence in the Garda Síochána Complaints Board. I do not see why one television programme, if that is what the Deputy is referring to, should make up the minds of a mass of people that they should have no confidence in the Garda complaints board. There is every reason to have confidence in the Garda complaints board.
There is very little reason.
With regard to the question of the Garda investigating itself, I approached this matter with an open mind. It would probably be seen to enhance the independent status of the board if investigations into complaints were conducted by non-Garda personnel but that might be at the level of perception. I am not sure the introduction of non-Garda investigators, if that were to prove feasible, would make a substantive difference. It must be remembered that the gardaí are trained investigators and that members appointed to investigate complaints are of senior rank. They are as anxious any anybody else to see members who transgress properly disciplined. It is clear from the numerous conversations I have had with members of An Garda Síochána at every rank there is grave embarrassment when any one of their members lets them down.
Does the Minister accept that the Garda has complained in a recent Garda review that the delay in processing complaints to conclusion is delaying the administration of justice in many respects? There is an inordinate delay in finalising individual complaints. Long before any television programme I had been in receipt of complaints from the general public. Will he accept it is important for the maintenance of confidence in the Garda Síochána that the complaints procedure is transparent and that he has responsibility in that area?
The board accepts there is a need for improvement. There is no question about that. However, I would not accept the view of those who would like to see the representative of the commissioner removed from the board or who would wish to see alternative people investigate complaints. I have said repeatedly that the Garda itself is more embarrassed than anybody else when one of its number lets it down. Let there be no mistake about that. On the other hand, I am conscious of public perception in this respect and I am looking at the whole question of the operation of the board.
The complaints board has made a number of recommendations for legislative and procedural change as has the Council of Europe Committee on the Prevention of Torture and Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment. I will look at all the suggestions made. I have yet to reach conclusions on the wide-ranging review which my Department has conducted on the operation of the Garda Síochána Complaints Act. Also I have to obtain Government approval for whatever legislative changes I may propose. It would not be appropriate for me to comment on it in any detail at the moment.
With regard to the question of the Garda Commissioner's representative being on the board, I am prepared to listen to all-comers on it. It is, of course, a deliberate decision to have a representative of the commissioner on the board. The presence of a senior garda on the board gives access to the other members to a senior member of An Garda Síochána. However, there are counter arguments and I will examine them in the context of the review.
I tabled a written question on this matter some months ago and I was surprised that the board was so representative. There are solicitors and members of the public on it. The fact is the public has no confidence in the operation of the board. Statistics show that the number of complaints from the public which are upheld is ridiculously low. How can the Minister justify that? What changes does he intend to bring about to improve the situation? I know members of the public who would not dream of contacting the Garda Complaints Board to make a complaint against a garda. They say there is no point. The Minister must change that scenario.
The Garda Complaints Board is chaired by a very able senior counsel, Mr. McKenna. The board has a number of legal people on it and, as Deputy Deasy has said, its membership is broadly based. I am rather surprised to hear anybody say that there is no confidence in the Garda Complaints Board. I do not accept that there is no public confidence in the Garda Complaints Board. The board itself has come forward with certain recommendations and a review is ongoing. I have an open mind in relation to certain matters which I will definitely look at to see whether I can alleviate the concerns of what I consider to be a minority in relation to the board. Deputies Deasy, Howlin and Higgins have made their point. I assure them that what they said will be taken account of in the review. I cannot go into the minutiae of the proposal because I have to get Government approval. The Deputies have served in Government and they know what that means.
Written Answers follow Adjournment Debate.
